OFFICIAL LONZO BALL THREAD
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PHILosophize
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:31 pm    Post subject:

ChickenBeckerman wrote:
although he's throwing up bricks, I'm actually quite pleased that he's looking to take them, he's actually making good decisions when to take them, when to dish off and when to drive. That part of the equation was severely lacking. I'm gonna go out on a limb and say his shot will start to come around in a big way real soon. Gut feeling.


well let's just hope your eyes aren't bigger than your stomach
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:08 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
I'm on the side that wants to see Lonzo develop because I think he's got the smarts and instincts to be pretty good in this league. But I also understand that the Lakers have not been true contenders for nearly a decade, and now with Lebron here, fans would trade Lonzo for a more established player.

I just gotta hope Magic sees Lonzo the way I do.


How many years are the Lakers supposed to wait for Lonzo to develop into a worthwhile offensive player? We have one maybe two more years of Lebron still being good. Lonzo being good offensively may not coincide with Lebron's time on the team and Magic has to take that into consideration when thinking about trading or not trading Lonzo.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:10 pm    Post subject:

Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.

Everyone talks about Lonzo impacting winning, but Fox is leading a Sacramento team that everyone thought would be one of the worst teams in the NBA to the playoffs right now.

He even has his team competing with GS right now.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:20 pm    Post subject:

Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:22 pm    Post subject:

calistrtballr wrote:
Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!


I heard Lonzo does every single thing better than Fox but score. If Fox can't score, he can't impact the game like Lonzo.

I heard Fox has had one hot month, that's about it. I also heard if Fox was on the Lakers, LeBron and Luke would have him stand in one corner all game.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:24 pm    Post subject:

Rivershow wrote:
epak wrote:
I'm on the side that wants to see Lonzo develop because I think he's got the smarts and instincts to be pretty good in this league. But I also understand that the Lakers have not been true contenders for nearly a decade, and now with Lebron here, fans would trade Lonzo for a more established player.

I just gotta hope Magic sees Lonzo the way I do.


How many years are the Lakers supposed to wait for Lonzo to develop into a worthwhile offensive player? We have one maybe two more years of Lebron still being good. Lonzo being good offensively may not coincide with Lebron's time on the team and Magic has to take that into consideration when thinking about trading or not trading Lonzo.


One thing is for sure. We didn’t get a older Lebron to start competing with a bunch of 20 year olds. It doesn’t work that way. Tell me a single championship team that had 4 of its top 5 players be 23 or less. 21 is really young. Lebron knew what he signed up for. We will get another baller in the summer and maybe we’ll get lucky and it will be Durant. Cause I have news for us all, we ain’t beating the warriors with Lebron and some pimply faced kids.

If we get Durant next year and simultaneously get stronger and weaken the warriors then maybe. And just maybe in a few years when Lebron and Durant cant shoulder the burden anymore and a 25 year old Lonzo and a 25 year old Ingram and a 27 year old Kuz and a 27 year old Hart will be ready to take on the burden and let Lebron relax and score 10, grab 5 boards and dish 6 assists. Maybe Durant can relax score his 20 at age 35. That’s the dream anyway.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:32 pm    Post subject:

Rivershow wrote:
How many years are the Lakers supposed to wait for Lonzo to develop into a worthwhile offensive player? We have one maybe two more years of Lebron still being good. Lonzo being good offensively may not coincide with Lebron's time on the team and Magic has to take that into consideration when thinking about trading or not trading Lonzo.


Yeah, nothing to take into consideration really since Lonzo's trade value is really low right now. It's not really much of a decision to make. Either keep him or trade him for a low return.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:34 pm    Post subject:

kfkilla wrote:
One thing is for sure. We didn’t get a older Lebron to start competing with a bunch of 20 year olds. It doesn’t work that way. Tell me a single championship team that had 4 of its top 5 players be 23 or less. 21 is really young. Lebron knew what he signed up for. We will get another baller in the summer and maybe we’ll get lucky and it will be Durant. Cause I have news for us all, we ain’t beating the warriors with Lebron and some pimply faced kids.

If we get Durant next year and simultaneously get stronger and weaken the warriors then maybe. And just maybe in a few years when Lebron and Durant cant shoulder the burden anymore and a 25 year old Lonzo and a 25 year old Ingram and a 27 year old Kuz and a 27 year old Hart will be ready to take on the burden and let Lebron relax and score 10, grab 5 boards and dish 6 assists. Maybe Durant can relax score his 20 at age 35. That’s the dream anyway.


When OKC made it to the finals, I think KD, Westbrook, Harden, and Ibaka were 23 and less.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 9:43 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
kfkilla wrote:
One thing is for sure. We didn’t get a older Lebron to start competing with a bunch of 20 year olds. It doesn’t work that way. Tell me a single championship team that had 4 of its top 5 players be 23 or less. 21 is really young. Lebron knew what he signed up for. We will get another baller in the summer and maybe we’ll get lucky and it will be Durant. Cause I have news for us all, we ain’t beating the warriors with Lebron and some pimply faced kids.

If we get Durant next year and simultaneously get stronger and weaken the warriors then maybe. And just maybe in a few years when Lebron and Durant cant shoulder the burden anymore and a 25 year old Lonzo and a 25 year old Ingram and a 27 year old Kuz and a 27 year old Hart will be ready to take on the burden and let Lebron relax and score 10, grab 5 boards and dish 6 assists. Maybe Durant can relax score his 20 at age 35. That’s the dream anyway.


When OKC made it to the finals, I think KD, Westbrook, Harden, and Ibaka were 23 and less.


Durant can't win with those cats!
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:50 pm    Post subject:

calistrtballr wrote:
Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!


If Lonzo shot 35% from three next season would still take Fox over him?

LakerMindLA wrote:
Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.



If Magic wanted a guard like Fox he'd have kept Russell, drafted Tatum and sent Ingram to the Nets instead.

Fox would also likely be averaging 13 as the 3rd option on the Lakers next to LeBron who would be handling the ball the majority of the time while the 2nd option would be treated as Kuzma or Ingram and being bashed by Lakers fans for his lack of ability to contribute to the game if his shot isn't falling while Lonzo would be somewhere averaging 13/7/8 as their 2nd option with those same people going "when he has an off-season to work on his jump shot.. watch out." while actually caring about the fact that opposing guards shoot 32% against him.

I'm surprised people are talking so much about Fox vs Lonzo, when I'd have thought the more interesting debate was Hield vs Ingram.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:55 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
Rivershow wrote:
How many years are the Lakers supposed to wait for Lonzo to develop into a worthwhile offensive player? We have one maybe two more years of Lebron still being good. Lonzo being good offensively may not coincide with Lebron's time on the team and Magic has to take that into consideration when thinking about trading or not trading Lonzo.


Yeah, nothing to take into consideration really since Lonzo's trade value is really low right now. It's not really much of a decision to make. Either keep him or trade him for a low return.


Yeah, we're keeping him, and crossing our fingers, little else that can be done there.

I empathize with you Rivershow, and your concerns are duly noted. Its gonna take Zo a while unless he has the most productive offseason in history.
That said best to funnel all your hopes in us recruiting someone who can be significant on offense(& defense if we can be so lucky) in FA.
That's the bed we've made.

Personally however, I'd trade Zo for an expiring and a pick if I can get one. He's talented but its too circumstantial and he's not talented enough, in my estimation, for me to alter the circumstance to best suit his talents.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:05 pm    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
calistrtballr wrote:
Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!


If Lonzo shot 35% from three next season would still take Fox over him?

LakerMindLA wrote:
Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.



If Magic wanted a guard like Fox he'd have kept Russell, drafted Tatum and sent Ingram to the Nets instead.

Fox would also likely be averaging 13 as the 3rd option on the Lakers next to LeBron who would be handling the ball the majority of the time while the 2nd option would be treated as Kuzma or Ingram and being bashed by Lakers fans for his lack of ability to contribute to the game if his shot isn't falling while Lonzo would be somewhere averaging 13/7/8 as their 2nd option with those same people going "when he has an off-season to work on his jump shot.. watch out." while actually caring about the fact that opposing guards shoot 32% against him.


How many teams right now can you name where Lonzo would be the 2nd option.

If Fox (18ppg) would fall to (13ppg) on the Lakers, why would Ball (8ppg) increase to (13ppg) on another team?

Does playing w/ LeBron automatically take 5 ppg off of everyone’s avg?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:29 pm    Post subject:

LakerMindLA wrote:
Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.

Everyone talks about Lonzo impacting winning, but Fox is leading a Sacramento team that everyone thought would be one of the worst teams in the NBA to the playoffs right now.

He even has his team competing with GS right now.


Kings are in 9th place after starting the season hot. They probably won’t make the playoffs this year.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:32 pm    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
MJST wrote:
calistrtballr wrote:
Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!


If Lonzo shot 35% from three next season would still take Fox over him?

LakerMindLA wrote:
Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.



If Magic wanted a guard like Fox he'd have kept Russell, drafted Tatum and sent Ingram to the Nets instead.

Fox would also likely be averaging 13 as the 3rd option on the Lakers next to LeBron who would be handling the ball the majority of the time while the 2nd option would be treated as Kuzma or Ingram and being bashed by Lakers fans for his lack of ability to contribute to the game if his shot isn't falling while Lonzo would be somewhere averaging 13/7/8 as their 2nd option with those same people going "when he has an off-season to work on his jump shot.. watch out." while actually caring about the fact that opposing guards shoot 32% against him.


How many teams right now can you name where Lonzo would be the 2nd option.


Any of the other team's he would have went to had we drafted Tatum.

So anyone beneath Celtics, 76ers and Lakers

I'd assume the Suns would have drafted him to pair alongside Booker if the Lakers drafted Fox. And a back court of Booker with Lonzo's passing and fast pace of basketball with the Phoenix Suns offense would have had them thanking us.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:32 am    Post subject:

The God Particle wrote:
Vanquish wrote:

Username wrote:
It's because we are in a win-now spotlight with LBJ here that our fanbase is losing patience with its young guys. I mean look at the other bottom dwellers and fans are more patient with their top picks.

Because most of those other fanbases don't know any better. They're perennial losers who are programmed to accept it. The Lakers know greatness and have experienced it for decades, and if you've lived through that greatness and witnessed it first hand, it's pretty clear to see Lonzo ain't it.


As an aside, I don't think there are that many no 2 picks who actually proceed to be all stars let alone HOFs. The entire draft process is a crap shoot in my opinion, so I'm happy if we get a starting rotation player which I think Lonzo will be. I still consider Rondo to be the starter over Lonzo at this stage of their careers.



I'm not sure that's the point. The fact is with the #2 pick, we had the second best opportunity at selecting the player in the draft (sans 1 player) to select the all-star or HOF in the draft. Now if no player in his draft turns into all-stars or HOF then we can say "it wouldn't have mattered".

If drafting is a crapshoot, find me a HOF or All-star that was selected with let's say... hmm... with the 58th pick. Exactly.


On a 2015 article on nba.com, it has been stated that since 1980, the percentage of no 2 picks becoming all stars is around 33-34%

https://www.nba.com/magic/gallery/cohen-8ball-history-picking-1-8-nba-draft-percentage-all-stars-1980

That's 33% for an all star, not even a HOFer where the odds are way lower. Are the odds better at no 2 than at no 58 for drafting an all star? Sure, I will agree with you there.

However, I still stand by my initial point that it is actually much more likely to end up with a non all-star at no 2 than getting one (66% vs 34%). Consequently, I will be happy at getting a rotation level player though of course if we get an all star/HOF i'll be overjoyed. I'll be happy because getting all star at no 2 is a welcome deviation rather than the normal outcome aka we did better than we should have.

ETA: With respect to finding an all star selected at 58th, we had such a player who played for us last season though he was selected at 60th by the Kings. Isiah Thomas, 2 time all star (2016,2017) and one time all nba (2017). There's also Manu Ginobili, selected at 57th by the Spurs ( 2 time All Star, 2 time All NBA)


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:38 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:
LongBeachPoly wrote:
MJST wrote:
calistrtballr wrote:
Fox has that dog in him to be great. Couldn't shoot before...one offseason later, cant miss from 3. We screwed that pick badly!


If Lonzo shot 35% from three next season would still take Fox over him?

LakerMindLA wrote:
Imagine the Lakers with Fox right now.



If Magic wanted a guard like Fox he'd have kept Russell, drafted Tatum and sent Ingram to the Nets instead.

Fox would also likely be averaging 13 as the 3rd option on the Lakers next to LeBron who would be handling the ball the majority of the time while the 2nd option would be treated as Kuzma or Ingram and being bashed by Lakers fans for his lack of ability to contribute to the game if his shot isn't falling while Lonzo would be somewhere averaging 13/7/8 as their 2nd option with those same people going "when he has an off-season to work on his jump shot.. watch out." while actually caring about the fact that opposing guards shoot 32% against him.


How many teams right now can you name where Lonzo would be the 2nd option.


Any of the other team's he would have went to had we drafted Tatum.

So anyone beneath Celtics, 76ers and Lakers

I'd assume the Suns would have drafted him to pair alongside Booker if the Lakers drafted Fox. And a back court of Booker with Lonzo's passing and fast pace of basketball with the Phoenix Suns offense would have had them thanking us.


So could you name some teams today where Lonzo would be the no. 2 option
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:38 am    Post subject:

that logic is really flawed IMO.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:42 am    Post subject:

I am pulling for Lonzo but I am not loving the pick. He plays good D, has great court awareness but he is not someone you can depend on night after night. Right now he is an absolute liability on some nights. When he is off he keeps firing 3s it’s painful to watch. The team really needs a young D-fish type of PG. defense and spot up 3s. Lebron and BI can run the team.

Maybe Lonzo can figure it out but a third of the season and he is still the same player he was last year but less the playmaker due to LBJ.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 5:50 am    Post subject:

Lonzo is a bust. We should try to get a late first rounder for him
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 6:04 am    Post subject:

Lonzo made a mistake in going back to his old form.
He had it fixed where he was aiming straight at the basket.
And he just had to get used to it.

He went back to his old form and shooting from left to right doesn't seem right. Would recommend a shooting coach.

Right now Lonzo is aiming toward a bust 2 pick. If he was picked 30 and a project he would be more acceptable.

Hopefully, Ingram works out.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:23 am    Post subject:

LongBeachPoly wrote:
kfkilla wrote:
One thing is for sure. We didn’t get a older Lebron to start competing with a bunch of 20 year olds. It doesn’t work that way. Tell me a single championship team that had 4 of its top 5 players be 23 or less. 21 is really young. Lebron knew what he signed up for. We will get another baller in the summer and maybe we’ll get lucky and it will be Durant. Cause I have news for us all, we ain’t beating the warriors with Lebron and some pimply faced kids.

If we get Durant next year and simultaneously get stronger and weaken the warriors then maybe. And just maybe in a few years when Lebron and Durant cant shoulder the burden anymore and a 25 year old Lonzo and a 25 year old Ingram and a 27 year old Kuz and a 27 year old Hart will be ready to take on the burden and let Lebron relax and score 10, grab 5 boards and dish 6 assists. Maybe Durant can relax score his 20 at age 35. That’s the dream anyway.


When OKC made it to the finals, I think KD, Westbrook, Harden, and Ibaka were 23 and less.


Good point but they never won. Also 3 future MVPs. I think that’s an anomaly, not the norm. But it was a single team that I asked for LOL.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:36 am    Post subject:

Vanquish wrote:
The God Particle wrote:
Vanquish wrote:

Username wrote:
It's because we are in a win-now spotlight with LBJ here that our fanbase is losing patience with its young guys. I mean look at the other bottom dwellers and fans are more patient with their top picks.

Because most of those other fanbases don't know any better. They're perennial losers who are programmed to accept it. The Lakers know greatness and have experienced it for decades, and if you've lived through that greatness and witnessed it first hand, it's pretty clear to see Lonzo ain't it.


As an aside, I don't think there are that many no 2 picks who actually proceed to be all stars let alone HOFs. The entire draft process is a crap shoot in my opinion, so I'm happy if we get a starting rotation player which I think Lonzo will be. I still consider Rondo to be the starter over Lonzo at this stage of their careers.



I'm not sure that's the point. The fact is with the #2 pick, we had the second best opportunity at selecting the player in the draft (sans 1 player) to select the all-star or HOF in the draft. Now if no player in his draft turns into all-stars or HOF then we can say "it wouldn't have mattered".

If drafting is a crapshoot, find me a HOF or All-star that was selected with let's say... hmm... with the 58th pick. Exactly.


On a 2015 article on nba.com, it has been stated that since 1980, the percentage of no 2 picks becoming all stars is around 33-34%

https://www.nba.com/magic/gallery/cohen-8ball-history-picking-1-8-nba-draft-percentage-all-stars-1980

That's 33% for an all star, not even a HOFer where the odds are way lower. Are the odds better at no 2 than at no 58 for drafting an all star? Sure, I will agree with you there.

However, I still stand by my initial point that it is actually much more likely to end up with a non all-star at no 2 than getting one (66% vs 34%). Consequently, I will be happy at getting a rotation level player though of course if we get an all star/HOF i'll be overjoyed. I'll be happy because getting all star at no 2 is a welcome deviation rather than the normal outcome aka we did better than we should have.

ETA: With respect to finding an all star selected at 58th, we had such a player who played for us last season though he was selected at 60th by the Kings. Isiah Thomas, 2 time all star (2016,2017) and one time all nba (2017). There's also Manu Ginobili, selected at 57th by the Spurs ( 2 time All Star, 2 time All NBA)


#2 picks have on average, outperformed the average player at every other draft position except for one, that being the #1 pick.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 7:56 am    Post subject:

Vanquish wrote:
The God Particle wrote:
Vanquish wrote:

Username wrote:
It's because we are in a win-now spotlight with LBJ here that our fanbase is losing patience with its young guys. I mean look at the other bottom dwellers and fans are more patient with their top picks.

Because most of those other fanbases don't know any better. They're perennial losers who are programmed to accept it. The Lakers know greatness and have experienced it for decades, and if you've lived through that greatness and witnessed it first hand, it's pretty clear to see Lonzo ain't it.


As an aside, I don't think there are that many no 2 picks who actually proceed to be all stars let alone HOFs. The entire draft process is a crap shoot in my opinion, so I'm happy if we get a starting rotation player which I think Lonzo will be. I still consider Rondo to be the starter over Lonzo at this stage of their careers.



I'm not sure that's the point. The fact is with the #2 pick, we had the second best opportunity at selecting the player in the draft (sans 1 player) to select the all-star or HOF in the draft. Now if no player in his draft turns into all-stars or HOF then we can say "it wouldn't have mattered".

If drafting is a crapshoot, find me a HOF or All-star that was selected with let's say... hmm... with the 58th pick. Exactly.


On a 2015 article on nba.com, it has been stated that since 1980, the percentage of no 2 picks becoming all stars is around 33-34%

https://www.nba.com/magic/gallery/cohen-8ball-history-picking-1-8-nba-draft-percentage-all-stars-1980

That's 33% for an all star, not even a HOFer where the odds are way lower. Are the odds better at no 2 than at no 58 for drafting an all star? Sure, I will agree with you there.

However, I still stand by my initial point that it is actually much more likely to end up with a non all-star at no 2 than getting one (66% vs 34%). Consequently, I will be happy at getting a rotation level player though of course if we get an all star/HOF i'll be overjoyed. I'll be happy because getting all star at no 2 is a welcome deviation rather than the normal outcome aka we did better than we should have.

ETA: With respect to finding an all star selected at 58th, we had such a player who played for us last season though he was selected at 60th by the Kings. Isiah Thomas, 2 time all star (2016,2017) and one time all nba (2017). There's also Manu Ginobili, selected at 57th by the Spurs ( 2 time All Star, 2 time All NBA)


Point no. 1
If you go back to the draft discussion thread before the 2017 NBA Draft - I asked if people were willing to trade back - no. 2 for the Kings' 2 first rd picks (no. 5 and no. 10). Overwhelmingly, people said no way.

The rationale was that the player available at no. 2 was a once in a generation type player - and no. 5 and no. 10 were crapshoots.

Fast forward to today - and we have you trying to rationale how you're happy that Lonzo is a rotational player because only 33-34% become All Stars anyways.

So there's alot of rationalization going on around here.

Point no. 2
Never forget that our ultimate goal is to win a championship. In order to win a championship, you MUST hit on your free agent signings, trades and draft picks.

There's no ways around that. You can't win a championship if you continually miss on those. Everytime you miss, it's a major setback for your championship aspirations. So, no matter how much you want to console yourself with percentages and odds, don't forget the ultimate goal of the team.

Here are our hits so far:

1) LeBron - free agent signing
2) Kuzma - draft pick
3) Hart - draft pick
4) JaVale - free agent signing

Any others I'm forgetting? You see, this list is not enough. And we're starting to run out of bullets. We won't be bad enough to draft as high as no. 2 anymore. We have two major bullets to fire; the first is this coming free agent period and the second is trading our youngsters for a superstar veteran.

That's it. Two bullets left in the chamber. And if we missfire on those, then we are back to hoping that Lonzo and Ingram turn out to be superstars.

So yeah, don't forget what's our ultimate goal. It's not consoling ourselves into being happy with the return we got on drafting Lonzo; It's about winning championships.

Point no. 3

If you look at our draft history and our reason for success as a franchise - pretty much, we nail our lottery picks.

Magic - no. 1
Worthy - no. 1
Byron - no. 5
Eddie Jones - no. 10
Kobe - no. 13
Bynum - no. 10

Only lottery pick since Magic that we didn't hit out of the ballpark that I can think of is George Lynch - no. 12.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:05 am    Post subject:

As to point no 1:

I don't think I ever made a comment that the no 2 would net us a once in a generation player. Different people have different perspectives, but they're not mine. I would base mine on the probabilities which I have given. A rationalisation would imply that I initially thought we would be getting a once in a generation player, and then being disappointed try to frame Lonzo's talent in another way. I don't think I have done that as far as I can recall.

Also I agree in my previous point that no 2 picks are more likely to get all star than no 58 picks, but still the odds are only 34% ...

Which goes to my second point....

As to point no 2.

Lakers win championships, but the lakers have rarely done it with people we have drafted. We always done it through free agents because drafts are frankly a crap shoot. In fact, in the last championship run, we traded away all our young prospects save one, kobe bryant. Nick Van Exel, Vlade Divac and Eddie Jones were all traded away.

The drafted players that we kept, e.g. Derek Fisher, tended to be role players. Bynum did get one all star appearance but broke down soon after. I wouldn't consider him as important to our championships as it was getting Gasol through trade.

As to point no 3.

The draft successes you listed are mostly during the showtime era where rookies left after 3/4 years in college. As we saw from Kuzma and Josh Hart, that kind of preparation in college makes it easier for scouts to predict their performance in the nba. The current draft takes in 18/19 year olds at the very top, that makes a super crap shoot. There's more than a fair share of busts at the top of the draft in recent years, because its hard to envision how these young players will develop being so raw.


Last edited by Vanquish on Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total
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LongBeachPoly
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:15 am    Post subject:

Vanquish wrote:
As to point no 1:

I don't think I ever made a comment that the no 2 would net us a once in a generation player. Different people have different perspectives, but they're not mine. I would base mine on the probabilities which I have given. A rationalisation would imply that I initially thought we would be getting a once in a generation player, and then being disappointed try to frame Lonzo's talent in another way. I don't think I have done that as far as I can recall.


Whether you've done it or not, only you would know what you were hoping for when we had the no. 2 pick. Now if you honestly were only hoping for a rotational player for the no. 2 pick - then you were aiming quite low. But, only you would know. I don't know what you were thinking, and you don't have to share. But if you were only hoping for a rotational player - I'm going to guess that you were the only one in all of Laker Nation.

Vanquish wrote:
As to point no 2.

Lakers win championships, but the lakers have rarely done it with people we have drafted. In fact, in the last championship run, we traded away all our young prospects save one, kobe bryant. Nick Van Exel, Vlade Divac and Eddie Jones were all traded away.

It goes to my personal opinion that the draft is a crap shoot. We could get a kobe bryant, but its just more of a sure thing to sign free agents and we already gotten one, Lebron James.


Saying save one (Kobe Bryant) is a pretty disingenuous point.

But yeah - if you feel the draft is not that important, that's on you. No problem there. But it makes building a contender that much harder. And throughout history - pretty much all championship teams had at least 1 superstar that they drafted. Am I wrong on that?

SA - Duncan
Lakers - Kobe, Magic
Pistons - Isiah
Celtics - Bird
Warriors - Curry
Heat - Wade
Rockets - Hakeem
Bulls - Jordan, Pippen

Can you find one championship squad that didn't draft at least one of their superstars?

Look at my point no. 3 -

Quote:
Point no. 3
If you look at our draft history and our reason for success as a franchise - pretty much, we nail our lottery picks.

Magic - no. 1
Worthy - no. 1
Byron - no. 5
Eddie Jones - no. 10
Kobe - no. 13
Bynum - no. 10

Only lottery pick since Magic that we didn't hit out of the ballpark that I can think of is George Lynch - no. 12.


Last edited by LongBeachPoly on Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:21 am; edited 1 time in total
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