OFFICIAL LONZO BALL THREAD
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Megaton
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:08 pm    Post subject:

So that means Caruso starts...

(bleep).
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:18 pm    Post subject:

lordtrapula wrote:
TheBlackMamba wrote:
ocho wrote:
Bummer.


Yeah, but at least he ended SL on a pretty great note. And it's really not worth the risk in the big picture anyway. Hopefully we're surprised tonight by Kuz or Caruso or some other random stepping up and leading us to the championship anyway.


Yup, he has showed more then enough then any other rookie in the SL besides maybe DSJ. Time to shut it down and take him back home.


I actually like what I've seen from Caruso. He seems to be of the same mold as Lonzo in the fact that he looks to pass and is pretty gifted at it (albeit, obviously, not of the same caliber). He also has shown me that he is gritty... fighting on D. I'd like to see what he can do with the lights on tonight. Also, I want to see if Thomas and Blue make the team have to put some serious thought into their possible future with the team. Also, I want to see Zu and Bryant step up. Let's go!
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:22 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
My apologies if this was already posted:
Quote:

The Good and Bad of Lonzo Ball

“[Ball is] already one of the best passers I’ve seen at this level. [Those are] kind of big words, but he can really pass the ball,” Lakers summer league head coach Jud Buechler said last week. “He just gets the ball, looks up, and has that incredible natural ability to put that ball right on the money.” Buechler’s words are big, but they’re not an overreaction. Call it hyperbole or say “it’s only summer league” if you’d like, but Ball is one of the best pure passers I’ve ever seen. His court awareness, recognition, and accuracy on everything from outlet to entry to swing passes is surreal. As is the fact that he almost always puts the right amount of velocity on his passes. We’ll never have a league filled with transcendent passers, but I guess it’s their rarity, like precious metals, that makes them so special.

That doesn’t absolve him from what he hasn’t shown, though. Anyone who watched Ball at UCLA or Chino Hills knows the type of passer he is. But in the NBA, more goes into passing than just the lone act of delivering the ball to another player. As a point guard, Ball’s weaknesses on offense have been on full display as much as his prominent strength. He has not shown the ability to use his dribble to manipulate the defense. He’s struggled to create in the half court. His shot has not fallen. If you’re a Ball stan, you’re now saying “it’s only summer league,” and you’re right. But there are endless examples this summer of Ball struggling to create space off the dribble against a set defense; [...]

Caris LeVert and Spencer Dinwiddie are not high-level defenders, but they bottled Ball up. Rondae Hollis-Jefferson looked more like DeAndre Jordan deterring Ball at the rim. Ball’s weak handle is nothing new, but it would’ve been nice to see some progress since the end of the college season. As of Sunday morning, he’s scoring just 0.66 points per possession in the half court in summer league play, per Synergy. We’re talking about small samples here, so don’t panic too much. The list of guards drafted in the first round to log at least 60 possessions and score around the same efficiency in the summer league includes: John Wall, D’Angelo Russell, Dion Waiters, and Dennis Schröder.

But for Ball’s passing ability to carry as much gravity as it has the potential to, he’ll have to become a more reliable scorer and improve both his handle and first step. Ball is at his best in transition. He’ll always be a stud in the open floor, where he has the space to fully leverage his unpredictability. Does he see a pass the defender can’t? Does he pull up from 30 feet? Does he weasel his way to the rim? But there will come a time that Ball will need to create against a set defense, and right now he’s nowhere close to ready. For Ball to elevate his play, he’ll need to prove he can create in the half court against an NBA defense.

It’d help Ball’s cause if his shot started falling. Through Sunday, he missed 38 of 50 jumpers, per data derived from Synergy. Lonzo’s dreadful percentage could just be bad luck on a small sample size. If summer league lasted longer, maybe he’d make 38 of his next 50. But it’s also possible, as detailed in March, that he’s simply had trouble finding comfort releasing his shot using his quirky mechanics against NBA-caliber defenders. Or it’s possible that he’s slow to adjust to the Spalding ball (at UCLA, Ball shot noticeably better using Wilson balls than he did other brands like Nike or Adidas).

Someday we might look back and chuckle at the micro-analysis of Ball’s game, but a prospect like him is deserving of it. I’ve never been more fascinated by a player. From the offbeat shooting mechanics to his outspoken father, Ball holds our attention. Las Vegas had its best summer league attendance ever this year. Ball not only makes his teammates better with his slick passing, but he’s raised interest in the league as a whole for us fans in the crowd and watching from home.

Link: Six Takeaways from the 2017 NBA Summer League

Note: this comes from not-so-closet Celtics homer, Kevin O'Connor, but an interesting read nonetheless.


these were always 2 of the 3 major red flags on him going into the draft....he had not demonstrated the ability to run an offense in the half court, would his irregular shot translate, and the 3rd thing is his defense/lack of lateral quickness. it is not just him, I think all the top picks "red flags" have been highlighted in SL.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:23 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
My apologies if this was already posted:
Quote:

The Good and Bad of Lonzo Ball

“[Ball is] already one of the best passers I’ve seen at this level. [Those are] kind of big words, but he can really pass the ball,” Lakers summer league head coach Jud Buechler said last week. “He just gets the ball, looks up, and has that incredible natural ability to put that ball right on the money.” Buechler’s words are big, but they’re not an overreaction. Call it hyperbole or say “it’s only summer league” if you’d like, but Ball is one of the best pure passers I’ve ever seen. His court awareness, recognition, and accuracy on everything from outlet to entry to swing passes is surreal. As is the fact that he almost always puts the right amount of velocity on his passes. We’ll never have a league filled with transcendent passers, but I guess it’s their rarity, like precious metals, that makes them so special.

That doesn’t absolve him from what he hasn’t shown, though. Anyone who watched Ball at UCLA or Chino Hills knows the type of passer he is. But in the NBA, more goes into passing than just the lone act of delivering the ball to another player. As a point guard, Ball’s weaknesses on offense have been on full display as much as his prominent strength. He has not shown the ability to use his dribble to manipulate the defense. He’s struggled to create in the half court. His shot has not fallen. If you’re a Ball stan, you’re now saying “it’s only summer league,” and you’re right. But there are endless examples this summer of Ball struggling to create space off the dribble against a set defense; [...]

Caris LeVert and Spencer Dinwiddie are not high-level defenders, but they bottled Ball up. Rondae Hollis-Jefferson looked more like DeAndre Jordan deterring Ball at the rim. Ball’s weak handle is nothing new, but it would’ve been nice to see some progress since the end of the college season. As of Sunday morning, he’s scoring just 0.66 points per possession in the half court in summer league play, per Synergy. We’re talking about small samples here, so don’t panic too much. The list of guards drafted in the first round to log at least 60 possessions and score around the same efficiency in the summer league includes: John Wall, D’Angelo Russell, Dion Waiters, and Dennis Schröder.

But for Ball’s passing ability to carry as much gravity as it has the potential to, he’ll have to become a more reliable scorer and improve both his handle and first step. Ball is at his best in transition. He’ll always be a stud in the open floor, where he has the space to fully leverage his unpredictability. Does he see a pass the defender can’t? Does he pull up from 30 feet? Does he weasel his way to the rim? But there will come a time that Ball will need to create against a set defense, and right now he’s nowhere close to ready. For Ball to elevate his play, he’ll need to prove he can create in the half court against an NBA defense.

It’d help Ball’s cause if his shot started falling. Through Sunday, he missed 38 of 50 jumpers, per data derived from Synergy. Lonzo’s dreadful percentage could just be bad luck on a small sample size. If summer league lasted longer, maybe he’d make 38 of his next 50. But it’s also possible, as detailed in March, that he’s simply had trouble finding comfort releasing his shot using his quirky mechanics against NBA-caliber defenders. Or it’s possible that he’s slow to adjust to the Spalding ball (at UCLA, Ball shot noticeably better using Wilson balls than he did other brands like Nike or Adidas).

Someday we might look back and chuckle at the micro-analysis of Ball’s game, but a prospect like him is deserving of it. I’ve never been more fascinated by a player. From the offbeat shooting mechanics to his outspoken father, Ball holds our attention. Las Vegas had its best summer league attendance ever this year. Ball not only makes his teammates better with his slick passing, but he’s raised interest in the league as a whole for us fans in the crowd and watching from home.

Link: Six Takeaways from the 2017 NBA Summer League

Note: this comes from not-so-closet Celtics homer, Kevin O'Connor, but an interesting read nonetheless.


these were always 2 of the 3 major red flags on him going into the draft....he had not demonstrated the ability to run an offense in the half court, would his irregular shot translate, and the 3rd thing is his defense/lack of lateral quickness. it is not just him, I think all the top picks "red flags" have been highlighted in SL.


Except, at least to my eyes, our half court offense has not struggled.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:35 pm    Post subject:

Alpha wrote:
lordtrapula wrote:
TheBlackMamba wrote:
ocho wrote:
Bummer.


Yeah, but at least he ended SL on a pretty great note. And it's really not worth the risk in the big picture anyway. Hopefully we're surprised tonight by Kuz or Caruso or some other random stepping up and leading us to the championship anyway.


Yup, he has showed more then enough then any other rookie in the SL besides maybe DSJ. Time to shut it down and take him back home.


I actually like what I've seen from Caruso. He seems to be of the same mold as Lonzo in the fact that he looks to pass and is pretty gifted at it (albeit, obviously, not of the same caliber). He also has shown me that he is gritty... fighting on D. I'd like to see what he can do with the lights on tonight. Also, I want to see if Thomas and Blue make the team have to put some serious thought into their possible future with the team. Also, I want to see Zu and Bryant step up. Let's go!


Thomas and Vander deserved a training camp invitation. I think that's the time that the Lakers should give those 2 Way contracts.

I can't wait to see Zo with better athletes, shooters, slashers and gazelles. We would be running ang gunning teams to the ground for 48 minutes of Hell. Players need to be in a world class basketball shape or they will get left behind.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:41 pm    Post subject:



lonzo highlights already out
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:58 pm    Post subject:

Lonzo has surprisingly been better at PnR and half court offense than I expected based on all the scouting on him before the draft and the lack of exp of running that at UCLA.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:02 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
My apologies if this was already posted:
Quote:

The Good and Bad of Lonzo Ball

“[Ball is] already one of the best passers I’ve seen at this level. [Those are] kind of big words, but he can really pass the ball,” Lakers summer league head coach Jud Buechler said last week. “He just gets the ball, looks up, and has that incredible natural ability to put that ball right on the money.” Buechler’s words are big, but they’re not an overreaction. Call it hyperbole or say “it’s only summer league” if you’d like, but Ball is one of the best pure passers I’ve ever seen. His court awareness, recognition, and accuracy on everything from outlet to entry to swing passes is surreal. As is the fact that he almost always puts the right amount of velocity on his passes. We’ll never have a league filled with transcendent passers, but I guess it’s their rarity, like precious metals, that makes them so special.

That doesn’t absolve him from what he hasn’t shown, though. Anyone who watched Ball at UCLA or Chino Hills knows the type of passer he is. But in the NBA, more goes into passing than just the lone act of delivering the ball to another player. As a point guard, Ball’s weaknesses on offense have been on full display as much as his prominent strength. He has not shown the ability to use his dribble to manipulate the defense. He’s struggled to create in the half court. His shot has not fallen. If you’re a Ball stan, you’re now saying “it’s only summer league,” and you’re right. But there are endless examples this summer of Ball struggling to create space off the dribble against a set defense; [...]

Caris LeVert and Spencer Dinwiddie are not high-level defenders, but they bottled Ball up. Rondae Hollis-Jefferson looked more like DeAndre Jordan deterring Ball at the rim. Ball’s weak handle is nothing new, but it would’ve been nice to see some progress since the end of the college season. As of Sunday morning, he’s scoring just 0.66 points per possession in the half court in summer league play, per Synergy. We’re talking about small samples here, so don’t panic too much. The list of guards drafted in the first round to log at least 60 possessions and score around the same efficiency in the summer league includes: John Wall, D’Angelo Russell, Dion Waiters, and Dennis Schröder.

But for Ball’s passing ability to carry as much gravity as it has the potential to, he’ll have to become a more reliable scorer and improve both his handle and first step. Ball is at his best in transition. He’ll always be a stud in the open floor, where he has the space to fully leverage his unpredictability. Does he see a pass the defender can’t? Does he pull up from 30 feet? Does he weasel his way to the rim? But there will come a time that Ball will need to create against a set defense, and right now he’s nowhere close to ready. For Ball to elevate his play, he’ll need to prove he can create in the half court against an NBA defense.

It’d help Ball’s cause if his shot started falling. Through Sunday, he missed 38 of 50 jumpers, per data derived from Synergy. Lonzo’s dreadful percentage could just be bad luck on a small sample size. If summer league lasted longer, maybe he’d make 38 of his next 50. But it’s also possible, as detailed in March, that he’s simply had trouble finding comfort releasing his shot using his quirky mechanics against NBA-caliber defenders. Or it’s possible that he’s slow to adjust to the Spalding ball (at UCLA, Ball shot noticeably better using Wilson balls than he did other brands like Nike or Adidas).

Someday we might look back and chuckle at the micro-analysis of Ball’s game, but a prospect like him is deserving of it. I’ve never been more fascinated by a player. From the offbeat shooting mechanics to his outspoken father, Ball holds our attention. Las Vegas had its best summer league attendance ever this year. Ball not only makes his teammates better with his slick passing, but he’s raised interest in the league as a whole for us fans in the crowd and watching from home.

Link: Six Takeaways from the 2017 NBA Summer League

Note: this comes from not-so-closet Celtics homer, Kevin O'Connor, but an interesting read nonetheless.


Ball is special because he is a pass first PG who isn't ball dominant. The league is full of slashers and/or players who hold the rock a little too long. San Antonio has made the playoffs year in and year out because they move the ball better than the rest of the league.
So when I read the underlined I just face palm. It's akin to saying DeAndre Jordan doesn't have a fadeaway. Or Lebron James is an average 3PT shooter.
I know, I know. DJ and Lebron's strengths on the floor are on another level than Ball's strengths. But that is to be expected with Ball's young age and inexperience.
I believe Luke's offense and Ball's skillset is a great fit. So I'm optomistic. And some Celtics fanboy isn't gonna change that. Enjoy Tatum! Great job drafting another wing on a roster with Hayward and Jaylen Brown. They lost a defender and floor spacer (Bradley) and still don't have a rim protector (what you need against Lebron). They may regret passing on Fultz in a year or 2 as well. We'll see what happens with IT in 2018 free agency.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:13 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
My apologies if this was already posted:

Note: this comes from not-so-closet Celtics homer, Kevin O'Connor, but an interesting read nonetheless.


Ball is special because he is a pass first PG who isn't ball dominant. The league is full of slashers and/or players who hold the rock a little too long. San Antonio has made the playoffs year in and year out because they move the ball better than the rest of the league.
So when I read the underlined I just face palm. It's akin to saying DeAndre Jordan doesn't have a fadeaway. Or Lebron James is an average 3PT shooter.
I know, I know. DJ and Lebron's strengths on the floor are on another level than Ball's strengths. But that is to be expected with Ball's young age and inexperience.
I believe Luke's offense and Ball's skillset is a great fit. So I'm optomistic. And some Celtics fanboy isn't gonna change that. Enjoy Tatum! Great job drafting another wing on a roster with Hayward and Jaylen Brown.


This is where the proverbial eye test comes in. Lonzo made this team look like a team of sharpshooters and scorers, essentially a GSW lite. He has the highest individual score in a single game this summer league, most assists in history (I think) in the summer league, 2 triple doubles, and made this team look exciting.

That is all you need to know about him. What he does in the league in his rookie year is the second chapter in an already fascinating story for LA basketball.

I don't care if he doesn't win the rookie of the year, if he does even a tenth of what he did with the summer league squad (sans Ingram and Hart) with the NBA squad, in the words of GT, he is the one.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:15 pm    Post subject:

Regarding the article, I used to read/listen to Kevin O'Connor until I heard him on a podcast until I heard him say that the legacies of Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing are not tarnished by the fact that they did not win a title. He was trying to make an argument for Lebron as the GOAT by saying titles don't mean that much. Whether titles are too highly regarded is another matter, but the biggest blemishes on the careers of Ewing and Malone are their lack of rings.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:18 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
My apologies if this was already posted:
Quote:

The Good and Bad of Lonzo Ball

“[Ball is] already one of the best passers I’ve seen at this level. [Those are] kind of big words, but he can really pass the ball,” Lakers summer league head coach Jud Buechler said last week. “He just gets the ball, looks up, and has that incredible natural ability to put that ball right on the money.” Buechler’s words are big, but they’re not an overreaction. Call it hyperbole or say “it’s only summer league” if you’d like, but Ball is one of the best pure passers I’ve ever seen. His court awareness, recognition, and accuracy on everything from outlet to entry to swing passes is surreal. As is the fact that he almost always puts the right amount of velocity on his passes. We’ll never have a league filled with transcendent passers, but I guess it’s their rarity, like precious metals, that makes them so special.

That doesn’t absolve him from what he hasn’t shown, though. Anyone who watched Ball at UCLA or Chino Hills knows the type of passer he is. But in the NBA, more goes into passing than just the lone act of delivering the ball to another player. As a point guard, Ball’s weaknesses on offense have been on full display as much as his prominent strength. He has not shown the ability to use his dribble to manipulate the defense. He’s struggled to create in the half court. His shot has not fallen. If you’re a Ball stan, you’re now saying “it’s only summer league,” and you’re right. But there are endless examples this summer of Ball struggling to create space off the dribble against a set defense; [...]

Caris LeVert and Spencer Dinwiddie are not high-level defenders, but they bottled Ball up. Rondae Hollis-Jefferson looked more like DeAndre Jordan deterring Ball at the rim. Ball’s weak handle is nothing new, but it would’ve been nice to see some progress since the end of the college season. As of Sunday morning, he’s scoring just 0.66 points per possession in the half court in summer league play, per Synergy. We’re talking about small samples here, so don’t panic too much. The list of guards drafted in the first round to log at least 60 possessions and score around the same efficiency in the summer league includes: John Wall, D’Angelo Russell, Dion Waiters, and Dennis Schröder.

But for Ball’s passing ability to carry as much gravity as it has the potential to, he’ll have to become a more reliable scorer and improve both his handle and first step. Ball is at his best in transition. He’ll always be a stud in the open floor, where he has the space to fully leverage his unpredictability. Does he see a pass the defender can’t? Does he pull up from 30 feet? Does he weasel his way to the rim? But there will come a time that Ball will need to create against a set defense, and right now he’s nowhere close to ready. For Ball to elevate his play, he’ll need to prove he can create in the half court against an NBA defense.

It’d help Ball’s cause if his shot started falling. Through Sunday, he missed 38 of 50 jumpers, per data derived from Synergy. Lonzo’s dreadful percentage could just be bad luck on a small sample size. If summer league lasted longer, maybe he’d make 38 of his next 50. But it’s also possible, as detailed in March, that he’s simply had trouble finding comfort releasing his shot using his quirky mechanics against NBA-caliber defenders. Or it’s possible that he’s slow to adjust to the Spalding ball (at UCLA, Ball shot noticeably better using Wilson balls than he did other brands like Nike or Adidas).

Someday we might look back and chuckle at the micro-analysis of Ball’s game, but a prospect like him is deserving of it. I’ve never been more fascinated by a player. From the offbeat shooting mechanics to his outspoken father, Ball holds our attention. Las Vegas had its best summer league attendance ever this year. Ball not only makes his teammates better with his slick passing, but he’s raised interest in the league as a whole for us fans in the crowd and watching from home.

Link: Six Takeaways from the 2017 NBA Summer League

Note: this comes from not-so-closet Celtics homer, Kevin O'Connor, but an interesting read nonetheless.


Ball is special because he is a pass first PG who isn't ball dominant. The league is full of slashers and/or players who hold the rock a little too long. San Antonio has made the playoffs year in and year out because they move the ball better than the rest of the league.
So when I read the underlined I just face palm. It's akin to saying DeAndre Jordan doesn't have a fadeaway. Or Lebron James is an average 3PT shooter.
I know, I know. DJ and Lebron's strengths on the floor are on another level than Ball's strengths. But that is to be expected with Ball's young age and inexperience.
I believe Luke's offense and Ball's skillset is a great fit. So I'm optomistic. And some Celtics fanboy isn't gonna change that. Enjoy Tatum! Great job drafting another wing on a roster with Hayward and Jaylen Brown. They lost a defender and floor spacer (Bradley) and still don't have a rim protector (what you need against Lebron). They may regret passing on Fultz in a year or 2 as well. We'll see what happens with IT in 2018 free agency.


I've actually come to appreciate the "bad" about Ball. Reason? He's such a transcendent talent that he's got to work on some things other than transforming an entire team, creating a style that will probably be copied, and a playing style that gives us a chance to win, even against superior talent.

It's like when Shaq couldn't hit his ft's. Great ones gotta have something to work on
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:20 pm    Post subject:

Vishnu wrote:
Regarding the article, I used to read/listen to Kevin O'Connor until I heard him on a podcast until I heard him say that the legacies of Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing are not tarnished by the fact that they did not win a title. He was trying to make an argument for Lebron as the GOAT by saying titles don't mean that much. Whether titles are too highly regarded is another matter, but the biggest blemishes on the careers of Ewing and Malone are their lack of rings.


It's hilarious to me that Celtics media and fans keep their lips firmly planted on Lebron's butt. But still go out of their way to hate on us.
We aren't the ones preventing you from making the finals! Lebron is!
But I guess by making Lebron a basketball god. It gives them an excuse for constantly losing to him.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:20 pm    Post subject:

Shots come and go. We can't judge his shooting yet based upon a tiny sample size. What we do know is that he could do virtually everything else including blocking shots. We know shooting the ball has a random element to it so we can't count on having good shooting night every game. Good passing, however, can be achieved on a consistent basis, just like defense and rebounding. Ball can bring these every game if he puts in the effort.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:21 pm    Post subject:

Vishnu wrote:
Regarding the article, I used to read/listen to Kevin O'Connor until I heard him on a podcast until I heard him say that the legacies of Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing are not tarnished by the fact that they did not win a title. He was trying to make an argument for Lebron as the GOAT by saying titles don't mean that much. Whether titles are too highly regarded is another matter, but the biggest blemishes on the careers of Ewing and Malone are their lack of rings.


I agree with him from the perspective of nobody that shared a prime with Jordan won titles except Hakeem while MJ was playing baseball. It would be like claiming every player in the 60's that did not play for Boston has a blemished record.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:23 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Vadorojo wrote:
One interesting storyline this coming season will be seeing Lonzo's unselfish style of ball contrasted with the ball-dominant style of Westbrook. Even though Westbrook piles up assists, his style may be far less appealing for PG13 than Lonzo's low usage rate.


The Thunder were one of the worst passing teams in the league despite Westbrook's career year.

Westbrook passes to get assists for himself. Lonzo passes to get others to score. There is a difference.


Big difference. Excellent distinction.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:26 pm    Post subject:

LakerDYnasty72 wrote:

I've actually come to appreciate the "bad" about Ball. Reason? He's such a transcendent talent that he's got to work on some things other than transforming an entire team, creating a style that will probably be copied, and a playing style that gives us a chance to win, even against superior talent.

It's like when Shaq couldn't hit his ft's. Great ones gotta have something to work on

That's true.
I think Ball will struggle his rookie season. I'm not expecting him to dominate the game much. I'm sure he'll go through a shooting slump. And opposing NBA scouts and players will pick up on his tendencies.
But when a player's whole shtick is passing in situations when other players would pound the rock. And then someone complains about him not pounding the rock. I smell a hater.
It's like me saying, "Shaq can't spread the floor out to the 3pt line!". The appropriate answer to that complaint is, "Duh!"
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:29 pm    Post subject:

Travis Bickle wrote:
HumanVictoryCigar wrote:
The_Dynasty24 wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Honestly glad he's sitting it out. No reason to risk an injury for summer league. Also, we've kinda seen what we've needed to see out of him
What risk is there really, when he was essentially cramping right? Am I missing something? How would playing him today be risking anything?


I thought it was a strain not a cramp. A strain can linger, not worth aggravating. A cramp, drink some gatorade, wait a day and you're fine.


I agree, no point in risking it. We need him healthly so he can workout all summer and get stronger.


That's why I was mad at the overuse, he's got to really go hard in the weight room and improve this summer..
hopefully it's a very mild strain man. Smh. We overused and banged up our stud for effing summer league, how dumb is that
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:30 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Vadorojo wrote:
One interesting storyline this coming season will be seeing Lonzo's unselfish style of ball contrasted with the ball-dominant style of Westbrook. Even though Westbrook piles up assists, his style may be far less appealing for PG13 than Lonzo's low usage rate.


The Thunder were one of the worst passing teams in the league despite Westbrook's career year.

Westbrook passes to get assists for himself. Lonzo passes to get others to score. There is a difference.


You're right. But the bolded isn't all on Westbrook. I read some stats today that showed OKC and HOU turned the ball over MORE when WB and Harden weren't in the game.
So the bolded is somewhat affected by the composition of the team as a whole. Not alot of shot creators on those teams. Well... now HOU has CP3 so that's changed.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:31 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
LakerDYnasty72 wrote:

I've actually come to appreciate the "bad" about Ball. Reason? He's such a transcendent talent that he's got to work on some things other than transforming an entire team, creating a style that will probably be copied, and a playing style that gives us a chance to win, even against superior talent.

It's like when Shaq couldn't hit his ft's. Great ones gotta have something to work on

That's true.
I think Ball will struggle his rookie season. I'm not expecting him to dominate the game much. I'm sure he'll go through a shooting slump. And opposing NBA scouts and players will pick up on his tendencies.
But when a player's whole shtick is passing in situations when other players would pound the rock. And then someone complains about him not pounding the rock. I smell a hater.
It's like me saying, "Shaq can't spread the floor out to the 3pt line!". The appropriate answer to that complaint is, "Duh!"


I can live with all the offensive deficiencies because every rookie has a lot to work on....but the kid has to start at least trying on defense. I get he will not have the lateral quickness to stay in front of a lot of guys, but he needs to at least be like Clarkson and appear to be giving effort.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:32 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Vishnu wrote:
Regarding the article, I used to read/listen to Kevin O'Connor until I heard him on a podcast until I heard him say that the legacies of Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing are not tarnished by the fact that they did not win a title. He was trying to make an argument for Lebron as the GOAT by saying titles don't mean that much. Whether titles are too highly regarded is another matter, but the biggest blemishes on the careers of Ewing and Malone are their lack of rings.


I agree with him from the perspective of nobody that shared a prime with Jordan won titles except Hakeem while MJ was playing baseball. It would be like claiming every player in the 60's that did not play for Boston has a blemished record.


The point is he thought they are not perceived differently because they didn't win. They most definitely are thought less of because of that. Whether they should be is another matter.


Last edited by Vishnu on Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:08 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:34 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Travis Bickle wrote:
HumanVictoryCigar wrote:
The_Dynasty24 wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Honestly glad he's sitting it out. No reason to risk an injury for summer league. Also, we've kinda seen what we've needed to see out of him
What risk is there really, when he was essentially cramping right? Am I missing something? How would playing him today be risking anything?


I thought it was a strain not a cramp. A strain can linger, not worth aggravating. A cramp, drink some gatorade, wait a day and you're fine.


I agree, no point in risking it. We need him healthly so he can workout all summer and get stronger.


That's why I was mad at the overuse, he's got to really go hard in the weight room and improve this summer..
hopefully it's a very mild strain man. Smh. We overused and banged up our stud for effing summer league, how dumb is that


I completely respect, and to an extent agree with, your sentiments, but I just could not get enough of watching the kid, and I think the coaching staff, fans, and everybody felt the same.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:37 pm    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Travis Bickle wrote:
HumanVictoryCigar wrote:
The_Dynasty24 wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Honestly glad he's sitting it out. No reason to risk an injury for summer league. Also, we've kinda seen what we've needed to see out of him
What risk is there really, when he was essentially cramping right? Am I missing something? How would playing him today be risking anything?


I thought it was a strain not a cramp. A strain can linger, not worth aggravating. A cramp, drink some gatorade, wait a day and you're fine.


I agree, no point in risking it. We need him healthly so he can workout all summer and get stronger.


That's why I was mad at the overuse, he's got to really go hard in the weight room and improve this summer..
hopefully it's a very mild strain man. Smh. We overused and banged up our stud for effing summer league, how dumb is that


Eh, he could just as easily mildly strain a calf doing that training you're talking about.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:45 pm    Post subject:

I didn't expect him to play today, but I was still hoping since he been a revelation in the summer league. I'm still going to tune in to see Kuz, Zu, Blue, and Caruso play and to see if Thomas and the others can keep throwing flames like they were with Lonzo. The Kings game with Lonzo out was one of the more entertaining games in the summer league, so I'm hoping the Lakers can duplicate it.

Can't wait for preseason and I hope everyone is healthy so they can train to improve as much as they can.
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KeepItRealOrElse
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:46 pm    Post subject:

LakerDYnasty72 wrote:
KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Travis Bickle wrote:
HumanVictoryCigar wrote:
The_Dynasty24 wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Honestly glad he's sitting it out. No reason to risk an injury for summer league. Also, we've kinda seen what we've needed to see out of him
What risk is there really, when he was essentially cramping right? Am I missing something? How would playing him today be risking anything?


I thought it was a strain not a cramp. A strain can linger, not worth aggravating. A cramp, drink some gatorade, wait a day and you're fine.


I agree, no point in risking it. We need him healthly so he can workout all summer and get stronger.


That's why I was mad at the overuse, he's got to really go hard in the weight room and improve this summer..
hopefully it's a very mild strain man. Smh. We overused and banged up our stud for effing summer league, how dumb is that


I completely respect, and to an extent agree with, your sentiments, but I just could not get enough of watching the kid, and I think the coaching staff, fans, and everybody felt the same.


We should have played him in as many games as we did, but the minutes load, 10 minutes less per game would have still quenched people's thirst to see him
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KindCrippler2000
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 2:48 pm    Post subject:

Like JVG said during the broadcast, don't mess around with calf injuries. I'm okay with sitting him out. We get to see what Kuz is really capable of now, although the whole team will have no legs
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