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Goldenwest
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject:

Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:41 am    Post subject:

Tragic. Still pales in comparison to the number of civilians killed in the Middle East by both the allied coalition and terror groups. This is the new milieu we live in.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:44 am    Post subject:

Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:21 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:32 am    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:42 am    Post subject:

Real hero.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 3:16 pm    Post subject:

rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 5:38 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 5:45 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:30 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.


Thank you for saying so much with so few words.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 7:55 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.


No. But imperialism that reaches back sure did. To the current generations, the distinction is minimal.

That's why we have to find new policies that go beyond simply stopping the bombers.
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He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
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Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:21 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.


No. But imperialism that reaches back sure did. To the current generations, the distinction is minimal.

That's why we have to find new policies that go beyond simply stopping the bombers.


I agree. My point above that they don't hate us simply because we exist. That's the simple idea I was getting at.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:21 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Its revenge; (bleep)-for-tat. Nothing else, this is not really complicated. Where were the middle eastern terrorist bombings before we got involved in that part of the world? Exactly.

We continue to bomb Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, and the terrorist acts grow in number. you would think maybe backing off on dropping bombs on towns or villages (or wedding ceremonies) in the middle east; and negotiating more might be worth a try.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 9:39 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.


No. But imperialism that reaches back sure did. To the current generations, the distinction is minimal.

That's why we have to find new policies that go beyond simply stopping the bombers.


$1,000,000,000,000 dollars spent on communication between the cultures and healing the extremism within?

Our cultures will be here forever on this one planet for which there is no other alternate planet.

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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:01 pm    Post subject:

Goldenwest wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Its revenge; (bleep)-for-tat. Nothing else, this is not really complicated. Where were the middle eastern terrorist bombings before we got involved in that part of the world? Exactly.

We continue to bomb Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, and the terrorist acts grow in number. you would think maybe backing off on dropping bombs on towns or villages (or wedding ceremonies) in the middle east; and negotiating more might be worth a try.


Seems like you only paid attention to the last 20 years of history. Terrorism extends far beyond whatever conflicts the US has been involved in. The tactics have from decade to decade. Back then it used to be shootings, kidnappings and hijackings. And the people committing the acts have evolved with it. Heck, a lot of these people committing the acts now aren't even from those countries, they are home grown and been inspired over the internet. A lot of these guys doing the act are barely out of high school and weren't even old enough to understand the specifics of the US involvement in those countries. They just know that if they get rid of some infidels they will go to heaven and out of their miserable existence.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:13 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Simply stopping bombing won't fix it, any more than us merely existing started it.


These are nutjobs who want to force their beliefs on us (see ISIS). That there are people who are different than them exists is all the rationale they have needed to commit acts of terror. It doesn't matter if they're ISIS or the KKK, violence like this occurs when people disagree with your way of life.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
rwongega wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Goldenwest wrote:
Britain as part of the coalition bombs various ares of the Middle East to kingdom come. And we're surprised when these attacks happen. Maybe stopping the bombings is a good place to start.


Doubtful


Especially when people have been killing each other under the guise of religion for millenniums. They won't stop until humans cease to exist. These battles have been fought under different empires and nations flags ever since the dawn of mankind.


Yep. Stopping the bombings in fact gives the terrorists what they want. They attack us because we exist. Simple as that.


That's simple, I will give you that...


Simple or not, he's not wrong.

If anyone thinks that a cessation of bombing is going to suddenly change anything, they are grossly mistaken. What is going on is more than half a century in development. The US and it's allies could ground every bomber and drone tonight and the sentiments that drive anti-western terrorism would not disappear, not over night nor for years.

That's not to say I support the bombings. But saying that stopping the bombings is going to stop terrorism is every bit as dismissive


Its revenge; (bleep)-for-tat. Nothing else, this is not really complicated. Where were the middle eastern terrorist bombings before we got involved in that part of the world? Exactly.

We continue to bomb Iraq, Afghanistan, Yemen, Syria, and the terrorist acts grow in number. you would think maybe backing off on dropping bombs on towns or villages (or wedding ceremonies) in the middle east; and negotiating more might be worth a try.


Seems like you only paid attention to the last 20 years of history. Terrorism extends far beyond whatever conflicts the US has been involved in. The tactics have from decade to decade. Back then it used to be shootings, kidnappings and hijackings. And the people committing the acts have evolved with it. Heck, a lot of these people committing the acts now aren't even from those countries, they are home grown and been inspired over the internet. A lot of these guys doing the act are barely out of high school and weren't even old enough to understand the specifics of the US involvement in those countries. They just know that if they get rid of some infidels they will go to heaven and out of their miserable existence.


I'm gong back to after World War II, Terrorist attacks from the middles east started after we got involved there.

these young people you mentioned are lost kids who are trained and fed information by people who have a hate against the west. you tell me, where does this hate come from? they didn't start taking about the 'evil Crusaders' until we started messing with them again, by invading and bombing.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 10:39 pm    Post subject:

Ever heard of the Barbary Wars?
Ever heard of the US Marines motto to the shores of Tripoli?
The conflict with the middle east goes back way before World War II. It has been a clash of differing cultures and religions.
This is why I always laugh when certain posters have a defined demarcation point that if didn't get involved in this particular conflict after WW2 everything would be fine and dandy and they would not hate us. Sorry, but a portion of the populace will always hate you because you represent elements which they see at odds with their culture and religion.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:07 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
Ever heard of the Barbary Wars?
Ever heard of the US Marines motto to the shores of Tripoli?
The conflict with the middle east goes back way before World War II. It has been a clash of differing cultures and religions.
This is why I always laugh when certain posters have a defined demarcation point that if didn't get involved in this particular conflict after WW2 everything would be fine and dandy and they would not hate us. Sorry, but a portion of the populace will always hate you because you represent elements which they see at odds with their culture and religion.


that's about combating piracy. Did the pirates turn around and suicide-bomb Paris or New York because of the barbary wars? Sorry, but i don't buy the notion that middle eastern/islamic countries have a natural, un-instigated inclination to cause havoc and destruction on the west. Its simply revenge.

if we didn't get involved in the middles east, from over throwing Mousadeh, to Beirut, Iraq, and Syria, (among one or two other issues) we wouldn't have these problems now. If YOU, don't believe that, then maybe you have some inherent disdain for that region.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:23 pm    Post subject:

It would be hard to suicide bomb people in the 1700's and 1800's considering the technology wasn't available at the time. Back then they performed kidnappings to achieve their goals.

Quote:
In March 1786, Thomas Jefferson and John Adams went to London to negotiate with Tripoli's envoy, ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman (or Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja). When they enquired "concerning the ground of the pretensions to make war upon nations who had done them no injury", the ambassador replied:

"It was written in their Koran, that all nations which had not acknowledged the Prophet were sinners, whom it was the right and duty of the faithful to plunder and enslave; and that every mussulman who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise. He said, also, that the man who was the first to board a vessel had one slave over and above his share, and that when they sprang to the deck of an enemy's ship, every sailor held a dagger in each hand and a third in his mouth; which usually struck such terror into the foe that they cried out for quarter at once."


My issue is that we have been in conflict with that region back way prior to World War II. Your assumption is that if we didn't get involved in that region, we wouldn't have these problems. Sorry, I don't buy into that notion.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:38 pm    Post subject:

Goldenwest wrote:
lakersken80 wrote:
Ever heard of the Barbary Wars?
Ever heard of the US Marines motto to the shores of Tripoli?
The conflict with the middle east goes back way before World War II. It has been a clash of differing cultures and religions.
This is why I always laugh when certain posters have a defined demarcation point that if didn't get involved in this particular conflict after WW2 everything would be fine and dandy and they would not hate us. Sorry, but a portion of the populace will always hate you because you represent elements which they see at odds with their culture and religion.


that's about combating piracy. Did the pirates turn around and suicide-bomb Paris or New York because of the barbary wars? Sorry, but i don't buy the notion that middle eastern/islamic countries have a natural, un-instigated inclination to cause havoc and destruction on the west. Its simply revenge.

if we didn't get involved in the middles east, from over throwing Mousadeh, to Beirut, Iraq, and Syria, (among one or two other issues) we wouldn't have these problems now. If YOU, don't believe that, then maybe you have some inherent disdain for that region.


But if it's simply revenge against the west then why are the majority of terrorists' murder victims Muslim middle-easterners?
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 12:11 am    Post subject:

If it was a problem with just westerners getting involved in the middle east then why do the following countries have a terrorism problem
Thailand
Philippines
India
China
Russia
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 4:51 am    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
If it was a problem with just westerners getting involved in the middle east then why do the following countries have a terrorism problem
Thailand
Philippines
India
China
Russia


Indonesia
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 6:09 am    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
It would be hard to suicide bomb people in the 1700's and 1800's considering the technology wasn't available at the time. Back then they performed kidnappings to achieve their goals.

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In March 1786, Thomas Jefferson and John Adams went to London to negotiate with Tripoli's envoy, ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman (or Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja). When they enquired "concerning the ground of the pretensions to make war upon nations who had done them no injury", the ambassador replied:

"It was written in their Koran, that all nations which had not acknowledged the Prophet were sinners, whom it was the right and duty of the faithful to plunder and enslave; and that every mussulman who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise. He said, also, that the man who was the first to board a vessel had one slave over and above his share, and that when they sprang to the deck of an enemy's ship, every sailor held a dagger in each hand and a third in his mouth; which usually struck such terror into the foe that they cried out for quarter at once."


My issue is that we have been in conflict with that region back way prior to World War II. Your assumption is that if we didn't get involved in that region, we wouldn't have these problems. Sorry, I don't buy into that notion.


You're right, of course, as long as you don't take the argument to the opposite extreme. Many of our policies since WW2 (and British policies post-WW1) did a great deal to exacerbate the current situation.
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jodeke
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 05, 2017 11:58 am    Post subject:

I suspect maybe strict gun laws in the UK was partially responsible for the use of a car as a weapon and knives.
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