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Lakerz113
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Joined: 15 Mar 2015
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 Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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So Irving told them a week ago and then LBJ goes to LA vs Phi summer league..  |
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DangeRuss
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Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 1418
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| Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:50 pm Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | It is hilarious how the narrative has changed. A month ago, Irving was the second coming of MJ and how could Lebron fail with such a godsend.
Now we wouldn't even trade Ball for Irving?
Not that I was ever that high on Irving, so I wouldnt do it, just funny how the perspective on how good Irving is changes when the proverbial money is on the table. |
Well Kyrie did carry the cavs through a lot of the playoffs the past few years and the cavs wouldn't have won 2 years ago or got as far last year without him...but to be fair, I wouldn't trade ball straight up for Lebron neither. |
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adkindo
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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| DangeRuss wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | It is hilarious how the narrative has changed. A month ago, Irving was the second coming of MJ and how could Lebron fail with such a godsend.
Now we wouldn't even trade Ball for Irving?
Not that I was ever that high on Irving, so I wouldnt do it, just funny how the perspective on how good Irving is changes when the proverbial money is on the table. |
Well Kyrie did carry the cavs through a lot of the playoffs the past few years and the cavs wouldn't have won 2 years ago or got as far last year without him...but to be fair, I wouldn't trade ball straight up for Lebron neither. |
the Cavs are not even competitive without Lebron....Kyrie has had some big games as the #2...as in when most of the attention is on Lebron, but he has never carried the Cavs as the primary #1. |
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DangeRuss
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Joined: 10 Feb 2016
Posts: 1418
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| Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | DangeRuss wrote: | | ringfinger wrote: | It is hilarious how the narrative has changed. A month ago, Irving was the second coming of MJ and how could Lebron fail with such a godsend.
Now we wouldn't even trade Ball for Irving?
Not that I was ever that high on Irving, so I wouldnt do it, just funny how the perspective on how good Irving is changes when the proverbial money is on the table. |
Well Kyrie did carry the cavs through a lot of the playoffs the past few years and the cavs wouldn't have won 2 years ago or got as far last year without him...but to be fair, I wouldn't trade ball straight up for Lebron neither. |
the Cavs are not even competitive without Lebron....Kyrie has had some big games as the #2...as in when most of the attention is on Lebron, but he has never carried the Cavs as the primary #1. |
By carried I meant led them in scoring through multiple playoff series, and is their closer especially since bron gets gassed by the third quarters. Obviously Lebron is still their most important player though and the team revolves and is built around him. |
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ChickenStu
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Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 31924
Location: Anaheim, CA
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:01 am Post subject: |
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Current feelings:
--We will not be, and should not be, in the potential trade market for acquiring Kyrie. We are in the LeBron business, and I think that's abundantly clear.
--We are not trading Lonzo or Ingram, for anyone. I mean, I could sit here and try to rationalize an Ingram-for-Anthony Davis trade or something, but let's be real...these 2 guys are untouchable for us, and Magic has said as much. He's not bluffing with that. He never said Dlo was untouchable and he got shipped out. Ingram and Lonzo are not getting shipped out.
--I do agree with other posters in previous pages of this thread who have said that it wouldn't be out of the logical realm of possibility that the Cavs could entertain the thought of building around Kyrie going forward and actually considering cutting the cord on LeBron now, especially if they are certain that he's leaving anyway next summer. Sure, they could try to make one more Finals run this season, but with an unhappy Kyrie-and-LeBron pairing, how is that going to work, especially if one or both of them don't have their hearts in it? And if they do choose to trade Kyrie and keep LeBron for a try at one more run at it, number one, they simply may not be as good, number two, LeBron's heart simply may not be in it at this point and they have to at least consider that, and number three, they have to know that they would be facing the very real possibility that they would then lose both Kyrie and LeBron by the end of next summer and then the franchise is horrifically damaged and starting at square one.
--So, in the event that the Cavs pull a 2004 Lakers and decide to choose Kyrie, where Kyrie agrees to the DPE "supermax" and they decide to make the stunning decision to get what they can for LeBron, and if LeBron wanted to try to come to the Lakers right now with his no-trade clause...I'm offering Deng and JC (both would have to go for salary reasons anyway) and then anything from the following list: Randle, Nance, Zubac, Bryant. They can also get the following draft picks: 2018 DEN 2nd, 2019 CHI 2nd, 2020 top-10 protected 1st.
--In a theoretical LeBron trade, I would not be willing to include Kuzma under any circumstances. LeBron would have the no-trade so he has some leverage, Kuzma looks like he could be the second-coming of Robert Horry or maybe better, and I am simply not willing to include him since I am in lust with his upside. So along with taking the Deng salary, the Cavs would get up to 5 players for LeBron and 3 draft picks, 1 of which was a first rounder. As for the Lakers, we get LeBron now while shedding the salary that we needed to shed in Deng/JC. The salary cap space would still be outstanding for next summer, and as for the draft picks we give up, we were going to give that up in a Deng salary dump anyway. We'd lose some other players, but as long as we still have Ball and Ingram and Kuzma and Hart and likely one of Zu/Bryant, we still have quite a young stable of talent to go along with LeBron and Lopez and KCP (and possibly Rose) this season, and then next year we likely get Paul George and whatever else we can with the cap space. |
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KingKobe20
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Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 18678
Location: L.A County, 26 miles away from Staples Center
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markjay
Star Player
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 3924
Location: O.C.
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:27 am Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | Current feelings:
--We will not be, and should not be, in the potential trade market for acquiring Kyrie. We are in the LeBron business, and I think that's abundantly clear.
--We are not trading Lonzo or Ingram, for anyone. I mean, I could sit here and try to rationalize an Ingram-for-Anthony Davis trade or something, but let's be real...these 2 guys are untouchable for us, and Magic has said as much. He's not bluffing with that. He never said Dlo was untouchable and he got shipped out. Ingram and Lonzo are not getting shipped out.
--I do agree with other posters in previous pages of this thread who have said that it wouldn't be out of the logical realm of possibility that the Cavs could entertain the thought of building around Kyrie going forward and actually considering cutting the cord on LeBron now, especially if they are certain that he's leaving anyway next summer. Sure, they could try to make one more Finals run this season, but with an unhappy Kyrie-and-LeBron pairing, how is that going to work, especially if one or both of them don't have their hearts in it? And if they do choose to trade Kyrie and keep LeBron for a try at one more run at it, number one, they simply may not be as good, number two, LeBron's heart simply may not be in it at this point and they have to at least consider that, and number three, they have to know that they would be facing the very real possibility that they would then lose both Kyrie and LeBron by the end of next summer and then the franchise is horrifically damaged and starting at square one.
--So, in the event that the Cavs pull a 2004 Lakers and decide to choose Kyrie, where Kyrie agrees to the DPE "supermax" and they decide to make the stunning decision to get what they can for LeBron, and if LeBron wanted to try to come to the Lakers right now with his no-trade clause...I'm offering Deng and JC (both would have to go for salary reasons anyway) and then anything from the following list: Randle, Nance, Zubac, Bryant. They can also get the following draft picks: 2018 DEN 2nd, 2019 CHI 2nd, 2020 top-10 protected 1st.
--In a theoretical LeBron trade, I would not be willing to include Kuzma under any circumstances. LeBron would have the no-trade so he has some leverage, Kuzma looks like he could be the second-coming of Robert Horry or maybe better, and I am simply not willing to include him since I am in lust with his upside. So along with taking the Deng salary, the Cavs would get up to 5 players for LeBron and 3 draft picks, 1 of which was a first rounder. As for the Lakers, we get LeBron now while shedding the salary that we needed to shed in Deng/JC. The salary cap space would still be outstanding for next summer, and as for the draft picks we give up, we were going to give that up in a Deng salary dump anyway. We'd lose some other players, but as long as we still have Ball and Ingram and Kuzma and Hart and likely one of Zu/Bryant, we still have quite a young stable of talent to go along with LeBron and Lopez and KCP (and possibly Rose) this season, and then next year we likely get Paul George and whatever else we can with the cap space. |
I agree 100%. Ball, Ingram, and Kuzma are untouchable. Those three can form the core of a dominating team a few years down the road. |
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ringfinger
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Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| KingKobe20 wrote: | I know this is wishful thinking but if we'd be so fortunate to get Lebron via trade I'd really hope we keep Larry Nance.
Super athletic high flying duo from Akron.
That's right Larry is also born and raised in Akron, Ohio.
https://media.giphy.com/media/5aLrlDiJPMPFS/giphy.gif |
I think Nance, other than Ball, is the guy most likely to be kept if we land Lebron. The one I worry about most is Ingram tbh. |
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fansincemagic
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Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 11076
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:58 am Post subject: |
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I don't know that James wants traded even now. He can just sign with LA or Philly, rather than get dealt to a young team he'd have to carry just to be a team outside the top 8 teams. More likely he's stuck in whatever is left of Cleveland for a year.
It would take a very specific demand from him and say Cousins that they absolutely will sign with the Lakers (with George) even if it be for less money next year. They may not mean it, but if NO and Cleveland think they will lose them for nothing and will be distractions maybe something is done. Has to be both, can't see James demanding being here without another ace this year.
I still think the Cavs don't blink on James and hope say Dragic replaces most of Kyries production and Winslow improves enough to help them take the East again at least. I don't know that NO and Cleveland take packages where LA is left with Ingram and without Deng in the end, but if they can find a way then you can fit George and massacre even GS.
Ball
George
Ingram
James
Cousins |
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Gatekeeper
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Flatlyner
Starting Rotation
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 518
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:34 am Post subject: |
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My main fear is that if Kyrie leaves Cleveland, does that open the door for the celts to win the east?  |
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Chronicle
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Joined: 21 Jul 2012
Posts: 31935
Location: Manhattan
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:36 am Post subject: |
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| Flatlyner wrote: | | My main fear is that if Kyrie leaves Cleveland, does that open the door for the celts to win the east? |
Washington's right there with them
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unleasHell
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Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 11591
Location: Stay Thirsty my Friends
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:00 am Post subject: |
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Perhaps this is diabolical plan, by LeBron and Irving..
Irving demands a trade and the Cav's trade him here for Ball + Deng.
Then Lebron comes here after next season,
Along with Paul George,
Lopez, decides to stay for less money and here is your 2018 - 2019 Lakers:
PG: Irving
SG: Ingram
SF: George
PF: Lebron
C: Lopez
Second best team in the West (minimum...)
(Nice to dream..huh?)
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RG73
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Joined: 14 Jul 2001
Posts: 11508
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:04 am Post subject: |
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| Flatlyner wrote: | | My main fear is that if Kyrie leaves Cleveland, does that open the door for the celts to win the east? :thumbsdown: |
Who cares? It isn't as if they have the slightest chance against any team out of the West. And they deserve to taste bitter defeat after bitter defeat in the Finals. The best possible outcome is for the Celtics to make it to three or four straight Finals and lose every one of them.
Ok, the best possible outcome is for us to beat them over and over again. The second best outcome is for them to lose to anyone. |
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RI Laker
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7158
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:14 am Post subject: |
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| Cleveland will get a big haul for Irving. The Cavs would never trade the Queen. Gilbert is going to let it go into next year and let him leave under his own will so that the queen looks like the villain and not Gilbert. Magic has already proved that he is astute and there is no way that we trade for either of them. The last thing we need is to make a trade for anybody. Lets keep the queen far away and I wouldn't sign him when he is a free agent because of age, attitude, and impact on our kids. |
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PayasoLoco
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Joined: 07 Jul 2001
Posts: 16663
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:31 am Post subject: |
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| Knowing Bronx personality and mindset he's not coming west. Too much competition and wear n tear for a full season |
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The Lebrons
Star Player
Joined: 30 Mar 2009
Posts: 4778
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:44 am Post subject: |
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| Flatlyner wrote: | | My main fear is that if Kyrie leaves Cleveland, does that open the door for the celts to win the east? |
Enjoy going to the Finals and losing. Then everyone bashing on them for not trading their picks to get stars as the reason they got smashed. Everyone always holds a Finals loss over your head more anyway. |
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KingKobe20
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Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 18678
Location: L.A County, 26 miles away from Staples Center
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:35 am Post subject: |
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| ringfinger wrote: | | KingKobe20 wrote: | I know this is wishful thinking but if we'd be so fortunate to get Lebron via trade I'd really hope we keep Larry Nance.
Super athletic high flying duo from Akron.
That's right Larry is also born and raised in Akron, Ohio.
https://media.giphy.com/media/5aLrlDiJPMPFS/giphy.gif |
I think Nance, other than Ball, is the guy most likely to be kept if we land Lebron. The one I worry about most is Ingram tbh. |
I feel B.I and Lonzo are untouchable in Magic's eyes. But you really never know what's gonna happen or what deals will be on the table.
Best to wait it out imo and let Lebron come here on his own when he's a free agent next summer.
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aka ILLWiLL20
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22
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Joined: 05 Apr 2013
Posts: 17063
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:23 am Post subject: |
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| I firmly believe that if Lebron becomes available for trade, Magic will make everyone available outside of Lonzo |
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Hellspawn
Starting Rotation
Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 193
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:32 am Post subject: |
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Am I wrong in not wanting LJ on the Lakers regardless, even at the cost of a championship or two?
I like his game like everyone else, but have never been able to stand the guy.
Who's with me in hoping PG13 and Westbrook bond, but have an underwhelming team performance next year, PG13 then brings Westbrook back home with him to join our young core instead of an aging "Chosen One" who believes the coach, GM, and owner of every team he plays on exist only to serve him??? |
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Blackhart217
Starting Rotation
Joined: 03 Jul 2016
Posts: 171
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:32 am Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | Current feelings:
--We will not be, and should not be, in the potential trade market for acquiring Kyrie. We are in the LeBron business, and I think that's abundantly clear.
--We are not trading Lonzo or Ingram, for anyone. I mean, I could sit here and try to rationalize an Ingram-for-Anthony Davis trade or something, but let's be real...these 2 guys are untouchable for us, and Magic has said as much. He's not bluffing with that. He never said Dlo was untouchable and he got shipped out. Ingram and Lonzo are not getting shipped out.
--I do agree with other posters in previous pages of this thread who have said that it wouldn't be out of the logical realm of possibility that the Cavs could entertain the thought of building around Kyrie going forward and actually considering cutting the cord on LeBron now, especially if they are certain that he's leaving anyway next summer. Sure, they could try to make one more Finals run this season, but with an unhappy Kyrie-and-LeBron pairing, how is that going to work, especially if one or both of them don't have their hearts in it? And if they do choose to trade Kyrie and keep LeBron for a try at one more run at it, number one, they simply may not be as good, number two, LeBron's heart simply may not be in it at this point and they have to at least consider that, and number three, they have to know that they would be facing the very real possibility that they would then lose both Kyrie and LeBron by the end of next summer and then the franchise is horrifically damaged and starting at square one.
--So, in the event that the Cavs pull a 2004 Lakers and decide to choose Kyrie, where Kyrie agrees to the DPE "supermax" and they decide to make the stunning decision to get what they can for LeBron, and if LeBron wanted to try to come to the Lakers right now with his no-trade clause...I'm offering Deng and JC (both would have to go for salary reasons anyway) and then anything from the following list: Randle, Nance, Zubac, Bryant. They can also get the following draft picks: 2018 DEN 2nd, 2019 CHI 2nd, 2020 top-10 protected 1st.
--In a theoretical LeBron trade, I would not be willing to include Kuzma under any circumstances. LeBron would have the no-trade so he has some leverage, Kuzma looks like he could be the second-coming of Robert Horry or maybe better, and I am simply not willing to include him since I am in lust with his upside. So along with taking the Deng salary, the Cavs would get up to 5 players for LeBron and 3 draft picks, 1 of which was a first rounder. As for the Lakers, we get LeBron now while shedding the salary that we needed to shed in Deng/JC. The salary cap space would still be outstanding for next summer, and as for the draft picks we give up, we were going to give that up in a Deng salary dump anyway. We'd lose some other players, but as long as we still have Ball and Ingram and Kuzma and Hart and likely one of Zu/Bryant, we still have quite a young stable of talent to go along with LeBron and Lopez and KCP (and possibly Rose) this season, and then next year we likely get Paul George and whatever else we can with the cap space. |
Gotta say that I like most of your potential trade proposals in the FA thread.
Agree that the Lakers have no business even thinking about trading for Kyrie. But also, I don't want any part of Free Agent Lebron (though most would seem to take him regardless).
Seems to be clear that Brandon and Ball are (and better be) untouchable.
I think if the Cavs find a great deal for Kyrie, they should take it, especially with plenty of time left on his deal. Don't get Pritchard'd. But if not, they could ride it out 1 last time, but either way they have no shot vs. healthy Durant Warriors.
As for Lebron, the only way I'd take him is if he broke his no-trade and agreed to come here by trade that includes Deng and whatever else besides (Ball, Brandon, Brook, Kuzma, KCP and 2019 1st (can't be dealt yet anyway, I don't think).
If Gilbert has to trade Lebron to us, then have to trade Kyrie away too, then go into the cellar for another entirety, that would about cover his payback for "Basketball Reasons".
Cuban hasn't even won a playoff series since their title and giving away all his vets besides Dirk. Plus the D. Jordan FA embarrassment, covers his debt.
Getting Ingram, Lonzo and hopefully a big FA next summer will finally start our rise and hopefully payback the league for smacking us around the last few years. |
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fansincemagic
Franchise Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005
Posts: 11076
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:46 am Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | Current feelings:
--We will not be, and should not be, in the potential trade market for acquiring Kyrie. We are in the LeBron business, and I think that's abundantly clear.
--We are not trading Lonzo or Ingram, for anyone. I mean, I could sit here and try to rationalize an Ingram-for-Anthony Davis trade or something, but let's be real...these 2 guys are untouchable for us, and Magic has said as much. He's not bluffing with that. He never said Dlo was untouchable and he got shipped out. Ingram and Lonzo are not getting shipped out.
--I do agree with other posters in previous pages of this thread who have said that it wouldn't be out of the logical realm of possibility that the Cavs could entertain the thought of building around Kyrie going forward and actually considering cutting the cord on LeBron now, especially if they are certain that he's leaving anyway next summer. Sure, they could try to make one more Finals run this season, but with an unhappy Kyrie-and-LeBron pairing, how is that going to work, especially if one or both of them don't have their hearts in it? And if they do choose to trade Kyrie and keep LeBron for a try at one more run at it, number one, they simply may not be as good, number two, LeBron's heart simply may not be in it at this point and they have to at least consider that, and number three, they have to know that they would be facing the very real possibility that they would then lose both Kyrie and LeBron by the end of next summer and then the franchise is horrifically damaged and starting at square one.
--So, in the event that the Cavs pull a 2004 Lakers and decide to choose Kyrie, where Kyrie agrees to the DPE "supermax" and they decide to make the stunning decision to get what they can for LeBron, and if LeBron wanted to try to come to the Lakers right now with his no-trade clause...I'm offering Deng and JC (both would have to go for salary reasons anyway) and then anything from the following list: Randle, Nance, Zubac, Bryant. They can also get the following draft picks: 2018 DEN 2nd, 2019 CHI 2nd, 2020 top-10 protected 1st.
--In a theoretical LeBron trade, I would not be willing to include Kuzma under any circumstances. LeBron would have the no-trade so he has some leverage, Kuzma looks like he could be the second-coming of Robert Horry or maybe better, and I am simply not willing to include him since I am in lust with his upside. So along with taking the Deng salary, the Cavs would get up to 5 players for LeBron and 3 draft picks, 1 of which was a first rounder. As for the Lakers, we get LeBron now while shedding the salary that we needed to shed in Deng/JC. The salary cap space would still be outstanding for next summer, and as for the draft picks we give up, we were going to give that up in a Deng salary dump anyway. We'd lose some other players, but as long as we still have Ball and Ingram and Kuzma and Hart and likely one of Zu/Bryant, we still have quite a young stable of talent to go along with LeBron and Lopez and KCP (and possibly Rose) this season, and then next year we likely get Paul George and whatever else we can with the cap space. |
This is a thoughtful post I could highlight but it's mint other than the Kuzma take. Yes he has high upside and chemistry with Ball but even for a year of LBJ I'd happily throw him in with Deng and a protected first, or Clarkson and Brewer. He could be the PF of the future and has a cheap deal, but getting James opens the door for Cousins (for Randle) types to demand deals to LA now to further cement contention...not just Showtime 2.0.
You may lust over Kuzma's upside, but whatever locks in Ball, Ingram, James, George and a 5th stud trumps even Kuzma. |
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balltheo
Rookie
Joined: 02 Jul 2017
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| Kyrie demand is the sign that CAVS should start trading Lebron to Lakers! There is no way CAVS will win this year and almost sure that he is going to LAKERS so why not get some assets now that will fit Kyrie. Lakers can send anybody including future drafts except BALL, BI and KUZMA. Rich Paul would prefer Lebron plays with KCP next year. KCP can still play with LAKERS by signing non-bird exception (120%) and still get $50m capspace for Lebron and one superstar if we can dispose DENG, Clarkson and RANDLE. Deng and Clarkson can be traded to BULLS for Wade and a signed one year contract Niko; we can even return the 2 2nd rounders to BULLS as sweetener. |
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focus
Star Player
Joined: 23 May 2012
Posts: 2526
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| So, guess Lebron is scaring players away. Tsk tsk. |
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greenfrog
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Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 36081
Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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| Posted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| 22 wrote: | | I firmly believe that if Lebron becomes available for trade, Magic will make everyone available outside of Lonzo |
Good one. |
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