OFFICIAL KYLE KUZMANIA THREAD (joining team USA in august, p519, recruiting kawhi?, p524)
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Staccatos
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject:

3baller wrote:
Right. Siakam at 23 yrs of age on his sophomore year, same as Kuz this year, was averaging 7.3ppg 4.5rebs and 2.0apg shooting just 22% from 3.

Wonder what the reaction would've been if Kuz had Siakam's sophomore numbers in his own 2nd season


Yup. Cumulative stats:

Kuzma (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 17.3ppg, 5.9rpg, 2.2apg, 45.3% FG, 33.5 % 3P, 73.1% FT
Siakam (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 6.0ppg, 4.0rpg, 1.3apg, 50.6% FG, 21.6% 3P, 69.9% FT
Siakam (through 3 seasons - Age 24): 10.1ppg, 5.1rpg, 2.0apg, 53.1% FG, 30.9% 3P, 74.3% FT

Siakam pulled his numbers up significantly at age 24 in his 3rd year. Who knows where Kuzma will be. But he's held up more than his own through his first 2 years.
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kobe_4_mvp
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:32 am    Post subject:

Siakam was drafted by a 50 win team and had to improve and earn his current role.
Kuzma came to one of the (bleep) teams in the league where winning is an afterthought and has been given a no consequence green light to chuck.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:35 am    Post subject:

Kuzma and Siakam are totally different players.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:39 am    Post subject:

Woot! Go Kuz!
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The Lebrons
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:51 am    Post subject:

Staccatos wrote:
3baller wrote:
Right. Siakam at 23 yrs of age on his sophomore year, same as Kuz this year, was averaging 7.3ppg 4.5rebs and 2.0apg shooting just 22% from 3.

Wonder what the reaction would've been if Kuz had Siakam's sophomore numbers in his own 2nd season


Yup. Cumulative stats:

Kuzma (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 17.3ppg, 5.9rpg, 2.2apg, 45.3% FG, 33.5 % 3P, 73.1% FT
Siakam (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 6.0ppg, 4.0rpg, 1.3apg, 50.6% FG, 21.6% 3P, 69.9% FT
Siakam (through 3 seasons - Age 24): 10.1ppg, 5.1rpg, 2.0apg, 53.1% FG, 30.9% 3P, 74.3% FT

Siakam pulled his numbers up significantly at age 24 in his 3rd year. Who knows where Kuzma will be. But he's held up more than his own through his first 2 years.


Context matters. Doing what Siakam did this year on a 58-win team is not comparable to what Kuzma has done on tanking teams, or did this year on a team trying to contend.

And on top of that, Siakam is showing he can be the 2nd best player on a title team. Siakam is significantly better than Kuzma right now.
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3baller
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:04 am    Post subject:

kobe_4_mvp wrote:
Siakam was drafted by a 50 win team and had to improve and earn his current role.
Kuzma came to one of the (bleep) teams in the league where winning is an afterthought and has been given a no consequence green light to chuck.


He got the green light by turning in a great rookie season starting from his workout, summer league and going on to break and tie a few franchise records through his 1st season.

Speaking of 50 win teams, unlike Siakam, Kuz has never had the luxury of playing under a good coach yet with an actual offensive system where he can be maximized offensively.
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3baller
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:17 am    Post subject:

The Lebrons wrote:
Staccatos wrote:
3baller wrote:
Right. Siakam at 23 yrs of age on his sophomore year, same as Kuz this year, was averaging 7.3ppg 4.5rebs and 2.0apg shooting just 22% from 3.

Wonder what the reaction would've been if Kuz had Siakam's sophomore numbers in his own 2nd season


Yup. Cumulative stats:

Kuzma (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 17.3ppg, 5.9rpg, 2.2apg, 45.3% FG, 33.5 % 3P, 73.1% FT
Siakam (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 6.0ppg, 4.0rpg, 1.3apg, 50.6% FG, 21.6% 3P, 69.9% FT
Siakam (through 3 seasons - Age 24): 10.1ppg, 5.1rpg, 2.0apg, 53.1% FG, 30.9% 3P, 74.3% FT

Siakam pulled his numbers up significantly at age 24 in his 3rd year. Who knows where Kuzma will be. But he's held up more than his own through his first 2 years.


Context matters. Doing what Siakam did this year on a 58-win team is not comparable to what Kuzma has done on tanking teams, or did this year on a team trying to contend.

And on top of that, Siakam is showing he can be the 2nd best player on a title team. Siakam is significantly better than Kuzma right now.


Kuz was the 2nd/3rd option when we were still in the playoff hunt.

And who can say how Kuz would perform in the playoffs? He shows up on big games. I remember him balling out vs Houston, Celtics and the Spurs in his rookie season
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Chick's Magic Johnson
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:27 am    Post subject:

Staccatos wrote:
3baller wrote:
Right. Siakam at 23 yrs of age on his sophomore year, same as Kuz this year, was averaging 7.3ppg 4.5rebs and 2.0apg shooting just 22% from 3.

Wonder what the reaction would've been if Kuz had Siakam's sophomore numbers in his own 2nd season


Yup. Cumulative stats:

Kuzma (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 17.3ppg, 5.9rpg, 2.2apg, 45.3% FG, 33.5 % 3P, 73.1% FT
Siakam (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 6.0ppg, 4.0rpg, 1.3apg, 50.6% FG, 21.6% 3P, 69.9% FT
Siakam (through 3 seasons - Age 24): 10.1ppg, 5.1rpg, 2.0apg, 53.1% FG, 30.9% 3P, 74.3% FT

Siakam pulled his numbers up significantly at age 24 in his 3rd year. Who knows where Kuzma will be. But he's held up more than his own through his first 2 years.


The blog boys always have their darling. Last year it was Tatum, this year they pivoted seamlessly to Siakam. He's a good player, no doubt, but he's being made into a future all-NBA type and that path is not certain. It's funny how much "potential for improvement" Siakam has, when he's 25 and already three years into the league, but Ingram (21), Ball (21) and Kuzma (23) are all busts.
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LKA
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:07 am    Post subject:

No one posted this?

https://youtu.be/rk-If8455-o
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kenkoy
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:25 am    Post subject:

Hey at least Kuz is getting compared to Siakam instead of guys like Kennard, etc...We're making progress here...
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Car54
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:57 am    Post subject:

Chick's Magic Johnson wrote:
Staccatos wrote:
3baller wrote:
Right. Siakam at 23 yrs of age on his sophomore year, same as Kuz this year, was averaging 7.3ppg 4.5rebs and 2.0apg shooting just 22% from 3.

Wonder what the reaction would've been if Kuz had Siakam's sophomore numbers in his own 2nd season


Yup. Cumulative stats:

Kuzma (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 17.3ppg, 5.9rpg, 2.2apg, 45.3% FG, 33.5 % 3P, 73.1% FT
Siakam (through 2 seasons - Age 23): 6.0ppg, 4.0rpg, 1.3apg, 50.6% FG, 21.6% 3P, 69.9% FT
Siakam (through 3 seasons - Age 24): 10.1ppg, 5.1rpg, 2.0apg, 53.1% FG, 30.9% 3P, 74.3% FT

Siakam pulled his numbers up significantly at age 24 in his 3rd year. Who knows where Kuzma will be. But he's held up more than his own through his first 2 years.


The blog boys always have their darling. Last year it was Tatum, this year they pivoted seamlessly to Siakam. He's a good player, no doubt, but he's being made into a future all-NBA type and that path is not certain. It's funny how much "potential for improvement" Siakam has, when he's 25 and already three years into the league, but Ingram (21), Ball (21) and Kuzma (23) are all busts.


Yup Yup
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epak
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:58 am    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Kuzma and Siakam are totally different players.

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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:55 am    Post subject:

Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma
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Car54
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:15 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.
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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:17 pm    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


You don't think at all. That's your problem, Nancy
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epak
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:18 pm    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.

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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:07 pm    Post subject:

Siakam's better than Ingram. BI would be much better if he tried to emulate Siakam and his role on Toronto instead of trying to be something he's not
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Chick's Magic Johnson
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:09 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam's better than Ingram. BI would be much better if he tried to emulate Siakam and his role on Toronto instead of trying to be something he's not


Siakam is FOUR YEARS OLDER, dude.
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CervantesRises
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:13 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


You don't think at all. That's your problem, Nancy


Stop.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:13 pm    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.
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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:18 pm    Post subject:

SocalDevin wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.


Watch them play. Siakam has many similarities with BI. I think if BI focused on being the Siakam for us we would become a much better team. BI has potential still to be an even better Siakam if he accepts that role.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:23 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.


Watch them play. Siakam has many similarities with BI. I think if BI focused on being the Siakam for us we would become a much better team. BI has potential still to be an even better Siakam if he accepts that role.


This is the thing that I find peculiar when some make statements about Ingram.

Do you really think he's out there just winging it, and doing whatever he feels like doing?

He fills whatever role he's given. When he was told to play point, he played point and focused on facilitating. When he was told to play off guard, he played off guard. He will do what he's told to do. So if there's an issue with what he does on the court it needs to be addressed to the coaching staff. He will do what he's instructed to do.
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The Juggernaut
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:26 pm    Post subject:

SocalDevin wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.


Watch them play. Siakam has many similarities with BI. I think if BI focused on being the Siakam for us we would become a much better team. BI has potential still to be an even better Siakam if he accepts that role.


This is the thing that I find peculiar when some make statements about Ingram.

Do you really think he's out there just winging it, and doing whatever he feels like doing?

He fills whatever role he's given. When he was told to play point, he played point and focused on facilitating. When he was told to play off guard, he played off guard. He will do what he's told to do. So if there's an issue with what he does on the court it needs to be addressed to the coaching staff. He will do what he's instructed to do.


He admitted multiple times during the season to forcing things and playing outside of himself. Only for the last 10 games of his season did he start to play a more controlled game. A lot of that blame goes to Luke and his staff. They didn't put him in the best spots to excel. I am hoping Vogel will establish a better role for BI that will maximize his talents and allow him to grow as a player.
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SocalDevin
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:30 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.


Watch them play. Siakam has many similarities with BI. I think if BI focused on being the Siakam for us we would become a much better team. BI has potential still to be an even better Siakam if he accepts that role.


This is the thing that I find peculiar when some make statements about Ingram.

Do you really think he's out there just winging it, and doing whatever he feels like doing?

He fills whatever role he's given. When he was told to play point, he played point and focused on facilitating. When he was told to play off guard, he played off guard. He will do what he's told to do. So if there's an issue with what he does on the court it needs to be addressed to the coaching staff. He will do what he's instructed to do.


He admitted multiple times during the season to forcing things and playing outside of himself. Only for the last 10 games of his season did he start to play a more controlled game. A lot of that blame goes to Luke and his staff. They didn't put him in the best spots to excel. I am hoping Vogel will establish a better role for BI that will maximize his talents and allow him to grow as a player.


I agree with that.. you give him a clearly defined role and he will play within the confines of that role.

I don't agree with the take that he was just playing outside of whatever system Luke implemented, to do his own thing. I can say this while acknowledging that he did force shots on occasion.

He's a young player, he will do what he's told.
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LuciusAllen
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:35 pm    Post subject:

The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
SocalDevin wrote:
Car54 wrote:
The Juggernaut wrote:
Siakam plays more like Ingram than Kuzma


Get the (bleep) outta here!! Like Ingram? Hell nah I don’t think he plays like either guy.


I think he just means that Siakam generates most of his opportunities on his own. Where as Kuz may be more reliant on someone finding him on the move.


Watch them play. Siakam has many similarities with BI. I think if BI focused on being the Siakam for us we would become a much better team. BI has potential still to be an even better Siakam if he accepts that role.


This is the thing that I find peculiar when some make statements about Ingram.

Do you really think he's out there just winging it, and doing whatever he feels like doing?

He fills whatever role he's given. When he was told to play point, he played point and focused on facilitating. When he was told to play off guard, he played off guard. He will do what he's told to do. So if there's an issue with what he does on the court it needs to be addressed to the coaching staff. He will do what he's instructed to do.


He admitted multiple times during the season to forcing things and playing outside of himself. Only for the last 10 games of his season did he start to play a more controlled game. A lot of that blame goes to Luke and his staff. They didn't put him in the best spots to excel. I am hoping Vogel will establish a better role for BI that will maximize his talents and allow him to grow as a player.

I actually like that BI has had to play multiple positions and styles in his first few seasons. He's really talented and he's had the opportunity to explore and learn what works best for him and what does not.

I also think that BI (if still on the team) is going to have to start next season the same way. Lots of new players, one or maybe 2 new star players. There would definitely be a lot of overlap with guys like Kawhi, Butler, Middleton, and guys like Culver and Hunter in the draft. Vogel won't be able to figure out any roles until after the draft and free agency have wound down.
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