OFFICIAL KYLE KUZMANIA THREAD (lakers filmroom p403)
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lonzobryant
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:41 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
defense wrote:
I like kuzma too but you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves


I think fans are getting way ahead of themselves with every sophomore besides Don and Ben.


Compared to Lonzo and BI...Kuz is super underrated around here.
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Killakobe81
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 11:50 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
defense wrote:
I like kuzma too but you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves


I think fans are getting way ahead of themselves with every sophomore besides Don and Ben.


Ben is not a sophomore...
And yes the Don hype is unreal...
I see elements of a poor man's Wade... People act like he is prime Wade vs Mavs in the Finals already.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:43 am    Post subject:

Annihilator wrote:
Megaton wrote:
My feeling is Kuzma will be Lebron’s new BFF. Guys like Kuzma fit on any lineup with his size, skill set and play style, and a total upgrade over most if not all off ball players Lebron has ever had in his career.

Wade? Bosh?


“Off ball player”

Neither of those guys were or ever off ball players. Guys like JR Smith, Ray Allen, Mike Miller, Kyle Korver, etc are.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:49 am    Post subject:

Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 5:23 am    Post subject:

I'm not into the "Twilight" like saga of who I "love" more, BI or Kuzma. I'm glad we have BOTH players, and I hope they become very good starters for our team, and both get the opportunity to win rings here.

Kuzma is my favorite, if for no other reason than he played in college 4 years, didn't play for a big time school like Duke, North Carolina, Kansas, etc. He wasn't a lottery pick, but has worked his tail off, shows a lot of offensive skill for a young player, but also seems humble about it. He has already far exceeded his draft value projection in only his first year.

I think I would like BI as much IF his first year in the league was as good as Kuzma's. I basically see Kuzma being about a full year ahead of BI professionally, because he came into the league ready to exceed what he did in college.

I worry though that Lebron is going to eat to much into Kuzma's playing time, and unless Kuzma is playing the bulk of the backup SF/PF minutes, I don't think he will produce enough of the stats to win the 6th man award.

With BI starting next to Lebron, this is the year he should really exceed Kuzma, and prove that #2 pick was worth it.
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epak
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:22 am    Post subject:

lonzobryant wrote:
epak wrote:
defense wrote:
I like kuzma too but you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves


I think fans are getting way ahead of themselves with every sophomore besides Don and Ben.


Compared to Lonzo and BI...Kuz is super underrated around here.


Considering age I think Kuz is rated pretty well here.
Some have him high, some have him low, but I believe most see him as a quality starter (not that he would start on this team at this time).
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Last edited by epak on Fri Jan 31, 1946 3:51 pm; edited 123,425 times in total
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:27 am    Post subject:

PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.


Interesting, this confirms what I’ve thought all along.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:27 am    Post subject:

1ngr4m wrote:
24Legend007 wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
He feels like not just a good, but a GREAT fit with LeBron.

I love his 3 pt shooting and ability to make plays off the dribble or finish on the break.

His D is not as bad as advertised either.


I think he probably was just as good a defender as BI anyway.


no he wasn't


True, and Ingram wasn’t impressive defensively. Against smaller players they did decent but both got bullied by bigs. That will be an issue the FO will need to fix next offseason.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:28 am    Post subject:

lonzobryant wrote:
epak wrote:
defense wrote:
I like kuzma too but you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves


I think fans are getting way ahead of themselves with every sophomore besides Don and Ben.


Compared to Lonzo and BI...Kuz is super underrated around here.


He’s also 3 years older.
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epak
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:30 am    Post subject:

PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.


Are those numbers right?
Played less than 30 mins 35 times but scored less than 20 52 of those 35 times? What sort of wizardry is this?
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Last edited by epak on Fri Jan 31, 1946 3:51 pm; edited 123,425 times in total
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:35 am    Post subject:

That people here are underestimating Kuz is an understatement. Here are 2 of the most common comps for Kuz.

Danilo Gallinari 22 yrs old. 3rd year in the league, starter:

15.6 ppg, 4.9 rebs, 1.7 apg, 33.9 mpg
FG 41%, 3pt 35%, FT 86%

Antawn Jamison 23 yrs old. Sophomore, starter:

19.6 ppg, 8.3 rebs, 2.3 apg, 36.2 mpg
FG 47%, 3pt 28.6%, FT 61%

Kyle Kuzma 22 yrs old. Rookie, off the bench:

16.1 ppg, 6.3 rebs, 1.8 apg, 31.2 mpg
FG 45%, 3pt 36.6%, FT 70%

Kuz as a starter:

18.8 ppg, 7.2 rebs, 1.9 apg, 36.5 mpg
FG 44.6%, 3pt 39%, FT 72.5%

He's already better than Gallinari and Jamison at the same age as a rookie while those 2 already had a couple of NBA seasons and NBA training under their belt.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:16 am    Post subject:

Killakobe81 wrote:
epak wrote:
defense wrote:
I like kuzma too but you guys are getting way ahead of yourselves


I think fans are getting way ahead of themselves with every sophomore besides Don and Ben.


Ben is not a sophomore...
And yes the Don hype is unreal...
I see elements of a poor man's Wade... People act like he is prime Wade vs Mavs in the Finals already.

I mean the man went nuclear against OKC and plays fearless. But I see more Iverson in him than I do Wade.
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1ngr4m
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:22 am    Post subject:

PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.


Ingram is the better overall player, and no it's not hard to tell. Your data is just simple counting numbers, not accounting for the two years gap in age and Kuzma being much closer to his offensive ceiling.

THere's a reason you'll see Ingram starting and Kuzma coming off the bench.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 10:37 am    Post subject:

1ngr4m wrote:
PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.


Ingram is the better overall player, and no it's not hard to tell. Your data is just simple counting numbers, not accounting for the two years gap in age and Kuzma being much closer to his offensive ceiling.

THere's a reason you'll see Ingram starting and Kuzma coming off the bench.


Kuzma closer to his offensive ceiling? Quite frankly I don’t see him having a ceiling based on what he showed his first season.

I mean what he did vs grown ass men last season doesn’t happen often. Rookies don’t take over games. You simply don’t see that type of performance.

Kuzma simply needs to physically mature and get more muscle on his frame to take his game to the next level. He’s made progress from last season based on photos, but he’s still probably two years from really reaching his peak.

Lastly is his mentality. That’s something he was born with. He’s fought adversity his entire childhood. You can tell he’s hungry and he won’t be denied.
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PauPau
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:33 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.



Are those numbers right?
Played less than 30 mins 35 times but scored less than 20 52 of those 35 times? What sort of wizardry is this?


Kuzma played 77 games.
Its impossible to play more and less than 30 mins per game during the same game ie if he played less than 30mins 35 times that means he played more than 30mins 43(77-35) times.

Im trying to average it, notice how the 'times' add up... its not meant to be conclusive, just an observation. Remember, there where games he played less than 30mins but still scored 20+ points and games where he played a lot of mins and bricked his way to the bench.
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Lakers great32
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:25 pm    Post subject:

PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.

Good point also considering they really don't run many plays for Kuzma like they do for Ingram that's impressive.
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Lakers great32
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 4:33 pm    Post subject:

Doc JC wrote:
1ngr4m wrote:
PauPau wrote:
Kuzma
Greater than 30mins - 42 times & Scored 20+ points 25 times.
Less than 30mins - 35 times & Scored less than 20 points 52 times.

BI
Greater than 30mins - 43 times & Scored 20+ points 16 times.
Less than 30mins - 16 times & Scored less than 20 points 43 times.

What im getting at here is Kuzma is the better scorer. Who the better player will be overall is hard to tell.


Ingram is the better overall player, and no it's not hard to tell. Your data is just simple counting numbers, not accounting for the two years gap in age and Kuzma being much closer to his offensive ceiling.

THere's a reason you'll see Ingram starting and Kuzma coming off the bench.


Kuzma closer to his offensive ceiling? Quite frankly I don’t see him having a ceiling based on what he showed his first season.

I mean what he did vs grown ass men last season doesn’t happen often. Rookies don’t take over games. You simply don’t see that type of performance.

Kuzma simply needs to physically mature and get more muscle on his frame to take his game to the next level. He’s made progress from last season based on photos, but he’s still probably two years from really reaching his peak.

Lastly is his mentality. That’s something he was born with. He’s fought adversity his entire childhood. You can tell he’s hungry and he won’t be denied.


Exactly lol His offensive ceiling lol he's shown already he has one of the most versatile skill sets in the NBA as a rookie!!!!!!!I agree That Brandon is a better all around player but he's not on Kuzma level on offensive skill set IJS. Also B.I and Kuzma are 2 different types of players and every team needs these 2 type of players Kuzma can be an elite scorer in this league and he has shown flashes of being a good passer as well as a decent defender (albeit not enough to call him decent yet but who really plays defense in the nba now anyway other than a select few)I will never under estimate a player with Kuzma work ethic and mindset he wants to be the best and he's willing to work and asked the right questions to get there.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject:

Brandon Ingram at 22 will likely have a better offensive skill set then Kuzma ever will in his career.

Kuzma had 16.1 points on 13.5 shots

Ingram had 16.1 points on 12.9 shots

Brandon Ingram with a jump shot is a much better offensive player then Kuzma can become.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:01 pm    Post subject:

1ngr4m wrote:
Brandon Ingram at 22 will likely have a better offensive skill set then Kuzma ever will in his career.

Kuzma had 16.1 points on 13.5 shots

Ingram had 16.1 points on 12.9 shots

Brandon Ingram with a jump shot is a much better offensive player then Kuzma can become.


Misleading. They have similar PPG despite Kuz having a slight edge in FGA because BI had 4.8 FTA per game to Kuz's 2.7 FTA.

Kuz was 36.6% from 3pts, 51% from 2pts wth 52% eFG
BI was 39% from 3pts, 48.3% from 2pts with 49.7% eFG

But BI only had 105 attempts at 3pts to Kuz's 434. With volume, you can expect his 39% to dip a little bit. BI was also the number one option and was prominently featured on the starting lineup last season, while Kuz had to come off the bench and play with the Julius-JC 2 man show for majority of the season.

If Kuz had started the whole season on any other lottery team last year, he would easily have been a 20+ppg scorer as a rookie.

There's really no need to put down Kuz if you want to fanboy over BI. We're lucky to have both on the team. Kuz has shown potential to be an elite offensive player. If he can be a remotely decent defender in the future, he will be an all-star. BI has potential to be a good if not great 2-way player and will also be an all-star if he lives up to his potential.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:04 pm    Post subject:

3baller wrote:
1ngr4m wrote:
Brandon Ingram at 22 will likely have a better offensive skill set then Kuzma ever will in his career.

Kuzma had 16.1 points on 13.5 shots

Ingram had 16.1 points on 12.9 shots

Brandon Ingram with a jump shot is a much better offensive player then Kuzma can become.


Misleading. They have similar PPG despite Kuz having a slight edge in FGA because BI had 4.8 FTA per game to Kuz's 2.7 FTA.

Kuz was 36.6% from 3pts, 51% from 2pts wth 52% eFG
BI was 39% from 3pts, 48.3% from 2pts with 49.7% eFG

But BI only had 105 attempts at 3pts to Kuz's 434. With volume, you can expect his 39% to dip a little bit. BI was also the number one option and was prominently featured on the starting lineup last season, while Kuz had to come off the bench and play with the Julius-JC 2 man show for majority of the season.

If Kuz had started the whole season on any other lottery team last year, he would easily have been a 20+ppg scorer as a rookie.

There's really no need to put down Kuz if you want to fanboy over BI. We're lucky to have both on the team. Kuz has shown potential to be an elite offensive player. If he can be a remotely decent defender in the future, he will be an all-star. BI has potential to be a good if not great 2-way player and will also be an all-star if he lives up to his potential.


It's not about putting Kyle Kuzma down, it's about knowing that Brandon Ingram is a different tier of a prospect. I don't know why that's so hard to grasp for some people, Brandon Ingram was also handling playmaking duties while Kyle Kuzma looked for his shot 1st, 2nd and third.

Kyle Kuzma being the second main ball handler and playmaker would have seen dips in all his stats even if he got the minutes and role Brandon Ingram did despite having two years of age on him.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:22 pm    Post subject:

1ngr4m wrote:
3baller wrote:
1ngr4m wrote:
Brandon Ingram at 22 will likely have a better offensive skill set then Kuzma ever will in his career.

Kuzma had 16.1 points on 13.5 shots

Ingram had 16.1 points on 12.9 shots

Brandon Ingram with a jump shot is a much better offensive player then Kuzma can become.


Misleading. They have similar PPG despite Kuz having a slight edge in FGA because BI had 4.8 FTA per game to Kuz's 2.7 FTA.

Kuz was 36.6% from 3pts, 51% from 2pts wth 52% eFG
BI was 39% from 3pts, 48.3% from 2pts with 49.7% eFG

But BI only had 105 attempts at 3pts to Kuz's 434. With volume, you can expect his 39% to dip a little bit. BI was also the number one option and was prominently featured on the starting lineup last season, while Kuz had to come off the bench and play with the Julius-JC 2 man show for majority of the season.

If Kuz had started the whole season on any other lottery team last year, he would easily have been a 20+ppg scorer as a rookie.

There's really no need to put down Kuz if you want to fanboy over BI. We're lucky to have both on the team. Kuz has shown potential to be an elite offensive player. If he can be a remotely decent defender in the future, he will be an all-star. BI has potential to be a good if not great 2-way player and will also be an all-star if he lives up to his potential.


It's not about putting Kyle Kuzma down, it's about knowing that Brandon Ingram is a different tier of a prospect. I don't know why that's so hard to grasp for some people, Brandon Ingram was also handling playmaking duties while Kyle Kuzma looked for his shot 1st, 2nd and third.

Kyle Kuzma being the second main ball handler and playmaker would have seen dips in all his stats even if he got the minutes and role Brandon Ingram did despite having two years of age on him.


What I have a firm grasp on are cold hard facts. Kuz was simply the better offensive player last year despite not being the number 1 option on the starting lineup. BI was the better overall player but you have to accept the fact that Kuz was at least the better offensive player. But I do have to apologize that I can't see 2 years into the future like you can and say for certain that one player would be better than the other.

It is also a fact that there has been a number of players drafted late and guys who started their careers a little older who later blossomed into all-stars. So saying that Kuz can never reach a high level or any level that BI can reach because of his age and draft position is simply false. They may not have the same skillset but both have all-star potential.

All I know is that while BI is still trying to fulfill expectations, Kuz has already exceeded his and will continue to do so as it is apparent that a lot of people here and in the media that are still sleeping on him.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:54 pm    Post subject:

Kuzam and BI played different roles last season. BI spent more time handling the ball than Kuzam. I would love to see the balance attacks from this new team.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:17 am    Post subject:

1ngr4m wrote:
Brandon Ingram at 22 will likely have a better offensive skill set then Kuzma ever will in his career.

Kuzma had 16.1 points on 13.5 shots

Ingram had 16.1 points on 12.9 shots

Brandon Ingram with a jump shot is a much better offensive player then Kuzma can become.
You don't know sway (in my Kanye voice)How can this remotely be true?only thing Kuzma needs to work on on offense is his ball handling lol He has every trick in the book .

Sky hooks
jump hooks
Fade aways
step backs
Euro steps
floaters
runners
spin moves
up and unders
shimmy shake
pick and rolls and pop
moves with out the ball very well
run the court
can post up albeit I think he should do more.
can score with ether hand
can score from the post mid range and to the three point line .

So yo say Brandon in 2 years will be a better scorer than Kuzma ever can be is straight blasphemy (in my Steve a Smith voice)

Now with that said I don't think there needs to be an comparison IJS they are 2 different type of players that is need on any team.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:32 am    Post subject:

Out of all of our young guys, I see Kuz’ game as most compatible with Bron, and think he needs to play the most minutes with him 🤞🏽
He could be a sharpshooter in any situation, transition, halfcourt..he can attack a closeout..attack in transition.. these things are invaluable for a bigman next to Lebron. Kuz could have Kevin Love type production next to Bron.....
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 12, 2018 7:36 am    Post subject:

KeepItRealOrElse wrote:
Out of all of our young guys, I see Kuz’ game as most compatible with Bron, and think he needs to play the most minutes with him 🤞🏽
He could be a sharpshooter in any situation, transition, halfcourt..he can attack a closeout..attack in transition.. these things are invaluable for a bigman next to Lebron. Kuz could have Kevin Love type production next to Bron.....


I've been preaching this since we got LA Bron.
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