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LakerSD
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:15 am    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy. Solid move in hindsight.

Oh and to the dudes saying Russell was fracturing our team? Damn you believe what the tabloid press puts out WAYYY too much.

Nobody has to make up tabloid style crap about DLO to justify this trade, or act as though DLO doesn't have the talent to drop 30 on a team while moving the ball and showing creativity. I'd say the people who are insecure and have an inferiority complex are the people who can't admit we traded a good player away to facilitate a specific strategy that also has plenty of merit.

One thing I will agree with on that front is we can't keep pining away for DLO forever. Gotta move on folks. BI, Kuzma, Lopez, Lonzo hitting their outside shots will heal those wounds pretty quickly, because we know what this team is capable of with Lonzo's court vision once those shots start falling for us consistently.


Perfectly said. The only slight thing that imo is tbd is the bolded. If they donít land the 2 max star FAs, the trade is likely going to look disastrous and set the franchise back a couple of years.
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christopherorman
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:42 am    Post subject:

I have read LG.net since it started; back to the day of Sky and such. I won't go into my backstory, but after about 15+ years, I decided to register and start posting (I will only say its because of my job and I fly fish too damn much). What I have seen the last two or three games with Lonzo has me worried about Walton, and I think they are warranted. Here is what I notice:
1. Pace is down. I'm guessing the reason is to slow the game so the defense is "set." The result has been less opportunities in the offense.
2. Players, after rebounding are not immediately getting the ball to Lonzo. In the preseason, Walton said he wanted the ball in Lonzo's hand right after a rebound. I am seeing that not happening. In fact, I saw KCP rebound, dribble the ball up, and take a 3 last night. No ball movement.
3. The players are not letting Lonzo get the rebound and running out. I am seeing more and more players all grouping for the rebound. So there is no space in the open floor. Look at his rebounding numbers. Notice how there aren't those quick backcourt into the offense passes like the previous games. Everything feels slowed down; all about half court sets.
4. In the half court, except with Randle and JC, I have not seen very many cuts, I've seen awful spacing, and slow passing. If you watch Ingram, he will receive the ball, and dribble into a tight cluster of defenders. At that point, he should be passing to the top of the 3, where the ball will rotate to take advantage of the imbalance. You know who is on that imbalanced side, right? Lonzo. And I've seen him with his hand up and waving multiple times. As a result, Lonzo and the rest of the team aren't getting easy opportunities. At all. If you watch DS Jr or even Fox, the ball movement lets the ball come back and they can attack. That's not happening right now like it should. It all feels (and looks to my eyes), like ISOs being run.
5. I'm seeing frustration from Lonzo. Lonzo started jump passing and forcing passes. Why? Because the pace has slowed, his opportunities are less, and he is trying to make up for the fewer opportunities. Turnovers are up the last two games, which should make it clear.
6. The offense looks the best when Lonzo runs pick and roll. I don't know why Walton doesn't do it, but it should start with a Lonzo pick and roll. This creates an imbalance which then can lead to better ball movement and better shots.
7. The team is not taking shots in rhythm.

In the end, I don't know what Walton wants to run. They mentioned in an article where they researched Kidd and the offense he ran for ideas. These last two games, I'm seeing none of it. I see the team running rudimentary, non-complete offense sets. Why not play like they did before and let those sets be secondary? Furthermore, why not have the team learn a few sets completely and use those as secondary and when they work, then make them primary? Why use incomplete and not fully practiced sets as the primary? All it does is result in confusion (as we've seen), inconsistency, and reducing the teams best attributes. I mean, the team went from scoring 130 and 112 in two games to the following three games (after a few days of practices) of scoring 102, then 92, then 81. The shooting percentages are down as well, and I'm guessing they're contested shots mostly now too. The point? It's a small, small sample size, but the trend is not looking good and I put it on Walton.
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venturalakersfan
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:48 am    Post subject:

The roster is poorly constructed. As with 4 of the past 5 seasons, we are sacrificing today for the next big thing. Only our dreams far exceed our plans. Last season was the one time that we looked to win today. One step forward and two steps back.
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pio2u
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 8:54 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
The roster is poorly constructed. As with 4 of the past 5 seasons, we are sacrificing today for the next big thing. Only our dreams far exceed our plans. Last season was the one time that we looked to win today. One step forward and two steps back.
Again
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mookielala
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:24 pm    Post subject:

About 75% of current posts should be moved to this thread.
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pio2u
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 12:51 pm    Post subject:

mookielala wrote:
About 75% of current posts should be moved to this thread.



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pio2u
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 2:05 pm    Post subject:

The Lakersí Lack Of Shooting Is Causing Them Huge Problems Offensively, And Things Could Get Worse
Quote:
Itís on the other end where the Lakers have been awful. Their offensive rating (how many points a team scores per 100 possessions) sits at 94.5, worse than every team in the league not named the Chicago Bulls (who are barely a professional basketball team this season).



http://www.lakersnation.com/the-lakers-lack-of-shooting-not-lack-of-pace-is-killing-their-offense/2017/10/29/
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 2:27 pm    Post subject:

pio2u wrote:
The Lakersí Lack Of Shooting Is Causing Them Huge Problems Offensively, And Things Could Get Worse
Quote:
Itís on the other end where the Lakers have been awful. Their offensive rating (how many points a team scores per 100 possessions) sits at 94.5, worse than every team in the league not named the Chicago Bulls (who are barely a professional basketball team this season).



http://www.lakersnation.com/the-lakers-lack-of-shooting-not-lack-of-pace-is-killing-their-offense/2017/10/29/

On a non P&M note, really happy to see Harrison at LN - he really ups the caliber of writing and analysis there.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:52 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
pio2u wrote:
The Lakersí Lack Of Shooting Is Causing Them Huge Problems Offensively, And Things Could Get Worse
Quote:
Itís on the other end where the Lakers have been awful. Their offensive rating (how many points a team scores per 100 possessions) sits at 94.5, worse than every team in the league not named the Chicago Bulls (who are barely a professional basketball team this season).



http://www.lakersnation.com/the-lakers-lack-of-shooting-not-lack-of-pace-is-killing-their-offense/2017/10/29/

On a non P&M note, really happy to see Harrison at LN - he really ups the caliber of writing and analysis there.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:43 am    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy.

No this is incorrect.

"With the 27th pick, Brooklyn Nets select Kyle Kuzma".--NBA commissioner Adam Silver

The Nets later traded Kuzma to the Lakers, to complete the D'Angelo Russell trade.

This is how it is recorded and will forever be in the history books.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 8:51 am    Post subject:

The only thing that is "correct" is that Kuz was the 27th pick.

It is not "incorrect" to say that Kuz would likely have been available at 28.
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warrenpeace
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:18 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
The only thing that is "correct" is that Kuz was the 27th pick.

It is not "incorrect" to say that Kuz would likely have been available at 28.
Are you saying that those words didn't come out of NBA Commissioner Adam Silver's mouth?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:21 am    Post subject:

warrenpeace wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
The only thing that is "correct" is that Kuz was the 27th pick.

It is not "incorrect" to say that Kuz would likely have been available at 28.
Are you saying that those words didn't come out of NBA Commissioner Adam Silver's mouth?


LOL. Did you even read my post?
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:23 am    Post subject:

warrenpeace wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy.

No this is incorrect.

"With the 27th pick, Brooklyn Nets select Kyle Kuzma".--NBA commissioner Adam Silver

The Nets later traded Kuzma to the Lakers, to complete the D'Angelo Russell trade.

This is how it is recorded and will forever be in the history books.


Now you're just trolling. Knock it off
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:25 am    Post subject:

warrenpeace wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy.

No this is incorrect.

"With the 27th pick, Brooklyn Nets select Kyle Kuzma".--NBA commissioner Adam Silver

The Nets later traded Kuzma to the Lakers, to complete the D'Angelo Russell trade.

This is how it is recorded and will forever be in the history books.


Which means nothing when it comes to relevance. Lakers had Kuzma ranked above Hart on their board. The Lakers had Kuzma ranked in the teens on their board, in fact. Had the Lakers only had the 28 pick, they would have used it on Kuzma, not Hart. Which is a reason the Lakers selected Kuzma and Hart in that order. Hart was the extra pickup. You have to assume the Nets would have taken Kuzma at 27 to say the Lakers would not have taken him at 28. Big assumption.

So Hart is the extra pickup. I like Hart. I think he's a keeper. Wouldn't take him over DLO, but he definitely counts as partial compensation.

FA 2018 will be the best indicator of whether this trade was good or not.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:30 am    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
warrenpeace wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy.

No this is incorrect.

"With the 27th pick, Brooklyn Nets select Kyle Kuzma".--NBA commissioner Adam Silver

The Nets later traded Kuzma to the Lakers, to complete the D'Angelo Russell trade.

This is how it is recorded and will forever be in the history books.


Which means nothing when it comes to relevance. Lakers had Kuzma ranked above Hart on their board. The Lakers had Kuzma ranked in the teens on their board, in fact. Had the Lakers only had the 28 pick, they would have used it on Kuzma, not Hart. Which is a reason the Lakers selected Kuzma and Hart in that order. Hart was the extra pickup. You have to assume the Nets would have taken Kuzma at 27 to say the Lakers would not have taken him at 28. Big assumption.

So Hart is the extra pickup. I like Hart. I think he's a keeper. Wouldn't take him over DLO, but he definitely counts as partial compensation.

FA 2018 will be the best indicator of whether this trade was good or not.


Exactly. It all boils down to something that hasn't happened yet. The Kuz/Brook arguments are irrelevant right now as they are ancillary components of the trade (with kuz likely a Laker at #28 regardless).

So why don't we wait until 2018? If we get PG13/LBJ then of course it was worth it. IF we don't, and we fail to sign a top FA, then it's an unmitigated disaster. Pretty simple. And I'm obviously hoping that we get our 2 max guys.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:34 am    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
warrenpeace wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy.

No this is incorrect.

"With the 27th pick, Brooklyn Nets select Kyle Kuzma".--NBA commissioner Adam Silver

The Nets later traded Kuzma to the Lakers, to complete the D'Angelo Russell trade.

This is how it is recorded and will forever be in the history books.


Which means nothing when it comes to relevance. Lakers had Kuzma ranked above Hart on their board. The Lakers had Kuzma ranked in the teens on their board, in fact. Had the Lakers only had the 28 pick, they would have used it on Kuzma, not Hart. Which is a reason the Lakers selected Kuzma and Hart in that order. Hart was the extra pickup. You have to assume the Nets would have taken Kuzma at 27 to say the Lakers would not have taken him at 28. Big assumption.

So Hart is the extra pickup. I like Hart. I think he's a keeper. Wouldn't take him over DLO, but he definitely counts as partial compensation.

FA 2018 will be the best indicator of whether this trade was good or not.


It will be half the story.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 9:46 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:
Kuzma would have been there at 28, he wasn't that highly regarded before Summer League. We traded DLO for Hart and Lopez, with a lot more salary cap flexibility in the process, in order to facilitate a strategy. Solid move in hindsight.

Oh and to the dudes saying Russell was fracturing our team? Damn you believe what the tabloid press puts out WAYYY too much.

Nobody has to make up tabloid style crap about DLO to justify this trade, or act as though DLO doesn't have the talent to drop 30 on a team while moving the ball and showing creativity. I'd say the people who are insecure and have an inferiority complex are the people who can't admit we traded a good player away to facilitate a specific strategy that also has plenty of merit.

One thing I will agree with on that front is we can't keep pining away for DLO forever. Gotta move on folks. BI, Kuzma, Lopez, Lonzo hitting their outside shots will heal those wounds pretty quickly, because we know what this team is capable of with Lonzo's court vision once those shots start falling for us consistently.


Perfectly said. The only slight thing that imo is tbd is the bolded. If they donít land the 2 max star FAs, the trade is likely going to look disastrous and set the franchise back a couple of years.


I agree with your caveat LakersSD. I should have clarified. In terms of their strategy this was consistent and therefore a solid move, but in order for this to be good for the Lakers they absolutely must execute on their strategy between now and next summer.

My opinion - if we land:

2 Max Star FA's who's games fit each other - bold move and good trade

1 Max Star FA and 1 good solid potential all-star who isn't old - I'd still be OK. Not thrilled but OK wait and see, as tired as I am of wait and see.

No Max Star FA's - the trade was a failure and set the Laker franchise back a couple years.

Worst case scenario - overpaid has-beens who can no longer carry a team, but who still can pose as Max Star FA's. I wouldn't put LeBron in that category, he's still just too good to ignore, but I won't be cheering if someone like Carmelo Anthony were to become one of our supposed pillars to build a title team upon.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2017 10:50 am    Post subject:

TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:

I agree with your caveat LakersSD. I should have clarified. In terms of their strategy this was consistent and therefore a solid move, but in order for this to be good for the Lakers they absolutely must execute on their strategy between now and next summer.

My opinion - if we land:

2 Max Star FA's who's games fit each other - bold move and good trade

1 Max Star FA and 1 good solid potential all-star who isn't old - I'd still be OK. Not thrilled but OK wait and see, as tired as I am of wait and see.

No Max Star FA's - the trade was a failure and set the Laker franchise back a couple years.

Worst case scenario - overpaid has-beens who can no longer carry a team, but who still can pose as Max Star FA's. I wouldn't put LeBron in that category, he's still just too good to ignore, but I won't be cheering if someone like Carmelo Anthony were to become one of our supposed pillars to build a title team upon.


thatís pretty much exactly how I see it too.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:20 am    Post subject:

1. Its nice that Lopez can shoot threes, but our center shouldnt be our go-to three point shooter, which he seems to be.

2. Randle and Clarkson need to be traded ASAP while their value is up.

3. Kuzma needs to start at power forward.

4. We need to acquire a pure three point shooter to be our go-to three point shooter. Even if this guy needs to take KCP's spot at starting shooting guard.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:42 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:

I agree with your caveat LakersSD. I should have clarified. In terms of their strategy this was consistent and therefore a solid move, but in order for this to be good for the Lakers they absolutely must execute on their strategy between now and next summer.

My opinion - if we land:

2 Max Star FA's who's games fit each other - bold move and good trade

1 Max Star FA and 1 good solid potential all-star who isn't old - I'd still be OK. Not thrilled but OK wait and see, as tired as I am of wait and see.

No Max Star FA's - the trade was a failure and set the Laker franchise back a couple years.

Worst case scenario - overpaid has-beens who can no longer carry a team, but who still can pose as Max Star FA's. I wouldn't put LeBron in that category, he's still just too good to ignore, but I won't be cheering if someone like Carmelo Anthony were to become one of our supposed pillars to build a title team upon.


thatís pretty much exactly how I see it too.


What if we make the playoffs this year?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 12:11 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
TooMuchMajicBuss wrote:

I agree with your caveat LakersSD. I should have clarified. In terms of their strategy this was consistent and therefore a solid move, but in order for this to be good for the Lakers they absolutely must execute on their strategy between now and next summer.

My opinion - if we land:

2 Max Star FA's who's games fit each other - bold move and good trade

1 Max Star FA and 1 good solid potential all-star who isn't old - I'd still be OK. Not thrilled but OK wait and see, as tired as I am of wait and see.

No Max Star FA's - the trade was a failure and set the Laker franchise back a couple years.

Worst case scenario - overpaid has-beens who can no longer carry a team, but who still can pose as Max Star FA's. I wouldn't put LeBron in that category, he's still just too good to ignore, but I won't be cheering if someone like Carmelo Anthony were to become one of our supposed pillars to build a title team upon.


thatís pretty much exactly how I see it too.


What if we make the playoffs this year?


Then you tell Lebron, PG13 and Boogie to all take less than max at the oppotunity to ring chase with the new kids on the block lakers (Zo, Ingram, Kuz, Randle and crew) or risk being in purgatory with their loser franchises

(Magic dances in the background )
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:34 pm    Post subject:

They should have seen that Lonzo didn't have it. Magic should be fired
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:42 pm    Post subject:

If Lonzo wants to play like this he's a bust
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 11:44 pm    Post subject:



This is the right thread for it, Rich. If Lonzo's a bust, the Lakers are f'd.
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