Lakers Nation: Do you want LeBron?
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Do you support LeBron's potential arrival in 2018
Yes
49%
 49%  [ 67 ]
No
40%
 40%  [ 55 ]
Undecided
10%
 10%  [ 14 ]
Total Votes : 136

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:32 am    Post subject:

No doubt James is a great player but some of you keep insisting on making it seem like there is no risk or downside. There are legitimate reasons to say "no". And when adding them to the equation there are very real reasons not to make the move.

I agree the Lakers FO would do it in a heartbeat. That is their goal. But it is not as simple as signing a free agent to blend in with the team and suddenly compete for Championships.

It is not his age that concerns it is his career mins played. Over 50 thousand and counting as he climbs the all time rankings. As he continues to decline his salary continues to escalate. So $36m -40m+ over 3 years.

Still not understanding how a James led team with another max player is competing immediately. Especially with 20 year olds in their 2nd and 3rd seasons as major contributors. Fair to consider what moves will be needed to satisfy James' whims. How far will the FO go to make him happy?

What would your expectations be if after his 1st season the Lakers are a 50 win team and a first round exit? His Finals streak broken. What player moves to improve would be acceptable by FO or fans after already committing to this path?

As he declines he will need more help not less. Are the Lakers capable of fielding a team better then this years Cavs in one free agency? In two? In the deep and competitive West. Nights off are not realistic when battling for playoff positioning.

Is signing James a true run at competing or simply a PR stunt to give the illusion of competing and satisfy the FO's (and some fans) need to become relevant again as quickly as possible?

Simply not seeing the timeline for James with this team unless dramatic changes are made. I personally am invested in the development of young players over the next five years then a quick fix all in James philosophy for "maybe" 3 years then rebuilding from how he left the roster.

It does sound crazy to say "no" to signing James. But that is exactly what I continue to say.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject:

^ You just answered one of your own questions. As he declines those "20-year olds" (I love how we categorize them as if they're all of the same talent and intelligence) should pick up the slack and improve to provide that help.

And no, signing the best player in the league, and someone who based on job performance is actually worth far more than his capped salary, is not a hindrance or a PR stunt. It's the smart, prudent thing to do.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
All those players (including Aldridge) would be the best player on our team right now (if they were here).

I think it would be a little more palatable if the poll was more specific. Like if it costs us X, Y, and Z. Do you want Lebron in P&G?
But the fact that it's just a general question. And over half of LG doesn't want a top 2 player in the league. When we can barely win 30 games right now. It's a headscratcher.


On Aldridge: What you're saying is a trap that a lot of front offices fall into. Yes, Aldridge would be the best player on our team. We still wouldn't be a playoff team, though, and I don't think you could win a title if Aldridge was your best or second best player. Aldridge is the basketball equivalent of empty calories.

On Lebron: You can't separate the different issues that go with Lebron. Lebron does not just go to a team and play. Lebron is going to want a roster molded to fit him and designed to win a championship now. However, (1) I don't think you could construct a team that would satisfy Lebron without dumping the young assets, and (2) for as much of a physical marvel as Lebron has been, he is due to fall off the cliff. Basically, I think you would be looking at the '99 Rockets.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:53 am    Post subject:

So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:56 am    Post subject:

The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:58 am    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


So Lopez+Randle equals Lebron? Wow.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:58 am    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


And that team is going to win something?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 8:58 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


So Lopez+Randle equals Lebron? Wow.


My next thought...
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:02 am    Post subject:

I think what some people are willfully overlooking is that those of us that don't want Lebron would prefer a more long term plan of developing the young players.

Once you sign Lebron you're in "Win now" mode, and even with Lebron and Paul George there's no guarantee the Lakers make it to the conference finals let alone win an NBA title.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:04 am    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


George, Lopez and Randle is actually not a bad haul

George, LeBron +/- Randle is an even better haul
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:10 am    Post subject:

Truck Turner wrote:
I think what some people are willfully overlooking is that those of us that don't want Lebron would prefer a more long term plan of developing the young players.

Once you sign Lebron you're in "Win now" mode, and even with Lebron and Paul George there's no guarantee the Lakers make it to the conference finals let alone win an NBA title.


As there's a guarantee your "long term plan" (basically just Randle) will turn out a player as good as even three years of Lebron? Seriously, what's the more likely outcome?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:11 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
we have been one of the worst teams in the league for the last four years, and pretty much an embarrassment to the Lakers brand/legacy.....and 53% of the voters either do not want or are unsure if they would desire the best player on the planet to join the team.....geez.


What would be the expectations? Say we lose Randle, Deng and JC for this fantasy and end up with Lebron and a re-signed Lopez or KCP. First round playoff exit? Second round? We aren't better than Houston or OKC. Maybe not even the Spurs. Definitely not GS. So we win a playoff series or two while hoping Ingram and Ball develop into star players. Versus keeping role players close to BI and LB's age while hoping they develop into stars. I get the financial benefits and would expect Jeanie to choose that over team development because she has proven over and over that she doesn't care about winning.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:12 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


So Lopez+Randle equals Lebron? Wow.


basketball is not math
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:14 am    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


So Lopez+Randle equals Lebron? Wow.


basketball is not math


It's pretty close to being in the way it's played and approached now. The only real variable is injuries.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:17 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Chronicle wrote:
The Lebrons wrote:
So for the people that don't want to sign Lebron, what's your plan?
George Lopez and Randle


So Lopez+Randle equals Lebron? Wow.


What does "equals" mean? Player for player not even close. If it were that simple there would not even be a conversation. But it is not that simple despite the insistence of some commenting.

You have no questions of James' durability or impact as he ages? Or the necessity to surround him with "his players" to be competitive? How his max contract effects the overall roster? No doubts the overall results are disappointing? Or simply - "James equals Championship"

There are legitimate downsides with signing James. Including the predicted success and the timeline. We disagree on how important they are.

Luckily there is another season to play and evaluate the Laker roster. How are individual players progressing? How is the overall team chemistry and development? Will James or any of the other free agency favorites actually be on the market?

I am intrigued to see how this roster plays together. To see if players have breakout seasons or continue to be limited. To see how the new additions like Lopez and Pope fit into the mix. I'm optimistic about how this roster fits together.

It could continue to develop with one free agent addition (prefer George) and continuity in Walton's system for a five year span with this core. Different path to consider at least.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:17 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Truck Turner wrote:
I think what some people are willfully overlooking is that those of us that don't want Lebron would prefer a more long term plan of developing the young players.

Once you sign Lebron you're in "Win now" mode, and even with Lebron and Paul George there's no guarantee the Lakers make it to the conference finals let alone win an NBA title.


As there's a guarantee your "long term plan" (basically just Randle) will turn out a player as good as even three years of Lebron? Seriously, what's the more likely outcome?


The most likely outcome is that GS wins the next 3 titles. It would be good to peak sometime after that.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:24 am    Post subject:

We don't have the type of team where you can add two stars and contend. Its very hard to do that unless you have vets coming together.

We really need, at some point and hopefully that point is now, to start building some continuity. Our starting lineup has 3 or more players changing every year.

I'd much rather identify the mainstays, solidify roles, and plug gaps.

Lebron would net us wins, but not continuity, and for me, the latter is more critical given our roster construction today.

And I love James, and have been a defender of his on here for a while now.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject:

If you're going to make the "you don't want to win" argument, how can you justify not moving Ingram/Ball to get pieces to win now?

We need to pick a strategy and stay the course. We playing the long game or not?
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:31 am    Post subject:

Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:

You have no questions of James' durability or impact as he ages? [None because he's already so far ahead of the pack] Or the necessity to surround him with "his players" to be competitive? [If you mean the laughable assertion of trading Lonzo, none] How his max contract effects the overall roster? [If you mean losing Randle, none] No doubts the overall results are disappointing? Or simply - "James equals Championship" [instant playoff experience for Lonzo, and a shot at a championship are enough]

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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:36 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
If you're going to make the "you don't want to win" argument, how can you justify not moving Ingram/Ball to get pieces to win now?

We need to pick a strategy and stay the course. We playing the long game or not?


do combo of both, develop BI/Lonzo and try to compete now with the 2 max FA. The growth would be accelerated with the playoffs experiences. Plus having a LeBron and a say PG13 might not make the team the favorite but they'll be contender and have a chance vs no chance with the current team. The price to pay would be Randle and JC (maybe KCP also)


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:39 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Truck Turner wrote:
I think what some people are willfully overlooking is that those of us that don't want Lebron would prefer a more long term plan of developing the young players.

Once you sign Lebron you're in "Win now" mode, and even with Lebron and Paul George there's no guarantee the Lakers make it to the conference finals let alone win an NBA title.


As there's a guarantee your "long term plan" (basically just Randle) will turn out a player as good as even three years of Lebron? Seriously, what's the more likely outcome?


That depends on how good you think three years of Lebron would be when he is 34, 35, and 36. How confident do you feel about that?

I don't view it as Lebron vs. Randle. I view it as Lebron vs. using the cap space/assets on a different option. What's the different option? We'll find out next summer. It might be Randle. It might be Casey P. It might be someone who isn't even on our radar right now. It might be standing pat and waiting for a better option. But if you go with Lebron, you are committing to a course that doesn't look very appealing, at least to me.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:40 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
adkindo wrote:
we have been one of the worst teams in the league for the last four years, and pretty much an embarrassment to the Lakers brand/legacy.....and 53% of the voters either do not want or are unsure if they would desire the best player on the planet to join the team.....geez.


What would be the expectations? Say we lose Randle, Deng and JC for this fantasy and end up with Lebron and a re-signed Lopez or KCP. First round playoff exit? Second round? We aren't better than Houston or OKC. Maybe not even the Spurs. Definitely not GS. So we win a playoff series or two while hoping Ingram and Ball develop into star players. Versus keeping role players close to BI and LB's age while hoping they develop into stars. I get the financial benefits and would expect Jeanie to choose that over team development because she has proven over and over that she doesn't care about winning.


The plan is 2 (two) max guys. LeBron + PG then Magic and Rob try and convince Lopez into taking the exception and then paying him the next summer. If their plan works, Lopez/LeBron/George/Ingram/Lonzo. No basketball reason anyone should dislike that team and that team is easily a close 2nd behind GS.

LeBron will age well at PF and even if he slows down, we'd have fire power other places, great young talent, good young guys off the bench, and then vet ring chasers.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:46 am    Post subject:

Lebron loves holding his teams hostage to get what he wants. I think he'd pressure the org to trade Ingram in a second for one of his buddies or another "win now" veteran.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:50 am    Post subject:

2019 wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
adkindo wrote:
we have been one of the worst teams in the league for the last four years, and pretty much an embarrassment to the Lakers brand/legacy.....and 53% of the voters either do not want or are unsure if they would desire the best player on the planet to join the team.....geez.


What would be the expectations? Say we lose Randle, Deng and JC for this fantasy and end up with Lebron and a re-signed Lopez or KCP. First round playoff exit? Second round? We aren't better than Houston or OKC. Maybe not even the Spurs. Definitely not GS. So we win a playoff series or two while hoping Ingram and Ball develop into star players. Versus keeping role players close to BI and LB's age while hoping they develop into stars. I get the financial benefits and would expect Jeanie to choose that over team development because she has proven over and over that she doesn't care about winning.


The plan is 2 (two) max guys. LeBron + PG then Magic and Rob try and convince Lopez into taking the exception and then paying him the next summer. If their plan works, Lopez/LeBron/George/Ingram/Lonzo. No basketball reason anyone should dislike that team and that team is easily a close 2nd behind GS.

LeBron will age well at PF and even if he slows down, we'd have fire power other places, great young talent, good young guys off the bench, and then vet ring chasers.


There are plans and then there is reality. Getting one max FA would be a great offseason.
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:50 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Truck Turner wrote:
I think what some people are willfully overlooking is that those of us that don't want Lebron would prefer a more long term plan of developing the young players.

Once you sign Lebron you're in "Win now" mode, and even with Lebron and Paul George there's no guarantee the Lakers make it to the conference finals let alone win an NBA title.


As there's a guarantee your "long term plan" (basically just Randle) will turn out a player as good as even three years of Lebron? Seriously, what's the more likely outcome?


The long term plan is Randle, Ingram, and Ball....

If Lebron were to sign with the Lakers I'm confident that Ingram and Randle's days would be numbered because Lebron would be pushing for the front office to bring in another established superstar.

And NOBODY is saying that any of our players will be as good as Lebron, not sure why people keep going there.

The point people are making is that Lebron is not an instant cure all nor is he a long term solution.
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