The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)
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Dr. Funkbot
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:04 am    Post subject: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/247446/14-NBA-Teams-Lost-Money-During-16-17-Season

How bad of a businessperson must you be in order to lose money while your team made it to the finals? Either that or Gilbert is using shady accounting. Also note that this report does not include non-basketball revenue.

This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:10 am    Post subject:

They paid about $26 mil in luxury tax, most in the league. That puts a dent in profits. Of course some losses are tax deductions.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:11 am    Post subject: Re: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/247446/14-NBA-Teams-Lost-Money-During-16-17-Season

How bad of a businessperson must you be in order to lose money while your team made it to the finals? Either that or Gilbert is using shady accounting. Also note that this report does not include non-basketball revenue.

This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.


Well, the Lakers related news is that they were the highest net profit team. Mostly because of their awesome deal with Time Warner at the time.

Note that the Cavs lost money partly due to the luxury tax.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:17 am    Post subject:

Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:19 am    Post subject:

20,000 wrote:
Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.


Agree 100%! They will come crying to the league and the Lakers will get screwed again.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:26 am    Post subject:

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
20,000 wrote:
Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.


Agree 100%! They will come crying to the league and the Lakers will get screwed again.


The Lakers aren't getting screwed, they agreed to share revenue. Dr. Buss understood that without the small market teams, there would be no NBA and no Lakers.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:36 am    Post subject:

understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:39 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Dr. Funkbot wrote:
20,000 wrote:
Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.


Agree 100%! They will come crying to the league and the Lakers will get screwed again.


The Lakers aren't getting screwed, they agreed to share revenue. Dr. Buss understood that without the small market teams, there would be no NBA and no Lakers.


Did they agree to it permanently?

Quote:
Still, some teams have bristled about the current scale of monetary redistribution. "The need for revenue sharing was supposed to be for special circumstances," one large-market owner told ESPN.com, "not permanent subsidies."

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:48 am    Post subject:

pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


Exactly. Poor small market owners decide to still own rather than sell. Makes you go hmm
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:57 am    Post subject:

LakerSD wrote:
pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


Exactly. Poor small market owners decide to still own rather than sell. Makes you go hmm


Yep. Not sure relative is the word.
But I believe the net profit is based on basketball operations only.
So the team can generate money on non-basketball operations?

One thing mentioned in the espn article is that the parent owners of the Nets own Barclays. So they generate money from the venue operations, such as have events like NXT Takeover.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:07 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


Exactly. Poor small market owners decide to still own rather than sell. Makes you go hmm


Yep. Not sure relative is the word.
But I believe the net profit is based on basketball operations only.
So the team can generate money on non-basketball operations?

One thing mentioned in the espn article is that the parent owners of the Nets own Barclays. So they generate money from the venue operations, such as have events like NXT Takeover.


And I guarantee those small market team owners are holding the citizens and governments of those small towns over the coals threatening relocation and demanding more and more from the towns that cannot afford them.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:07 pm    Post subject:

Do you want to be competitive or awful and make massive profits. The Clippers model works great, but I don't think most owners want to have a team that doesn't have any success. When the Lakers were winning championships they were barely eeking out a profit. The owners want a revenue model like the NFL but the players have too much power.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:08 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
LakerSD wrote:
pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


Exactly. Poor small market owners decide to still own rather than sell. Makes you go hmm


Yep. Not sure relative is the word.
But I believe the net profit is based on basketball operations only.
So the team can generate money on non-basketball operations?

One thing mentioned in the espn article is that the parent owners of the Nets own Barclays. So they generate money from the venue operations, such as have events like NXT Takeover.


They manipulate anyway they can. It's like when certain stores/retailers only accept cash so they can under report income on taxes.

Maybe if these owners legitimately invested in the right areas (scouting, coaching, nutrition/strength and conditioning) they would win more and have star players commitment. However, players aren't stupid. They know who cuts corners and pockets the $ and they know which places are about winning. The result ends up being loser organization that hide behind the "small market" excuse.

Small market San Antonio doesn't have an issue. Amazing what commitment to winning does.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:27 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Dr. Funkbot wrote:
20,000 wrote:
Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.


Agree 100%! They will come crying to the league and the Lakers will get screwed again.


The Lakers aren't getting screwed, they agreed to share revenue. Dr. Buss understood that without the small market teams, there would be no NBA and no Lakers.


Sorry I was not clear. By screwing I am not referring to the revenue sharing, I am talking about the the VETO and the tampering boondogle.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:34 pm    Post subject: Re: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.


And because you wanted to post it in the Lounge, rather than the existing thread in General.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:43 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Dr. Funkbot wrote:
20,000 wrote:
Quote:
"Teams in small markets are told we need to run our businesses better so we can make money," one ownership source told ESPN.com. "But teams in the largest markets can run their businesses poorly and still make money."


Well, duh. Real estate: location location location.

Business, location matters.

These owners want all the spoils of owning a business and a sports team but none of the risk and losses? And when they do, it's on everyone else to kick in and help them? And still want to cut taxes for themselves and cry at the mention of socialism.


Agree 100%! They will come crying to the league and the Lakers will get screwed again.


The Lakers aren't getting screwed, they agreed to share revenue. Dr. Buss understood that without the small market teams, there would be no NBA and no Lakers.


Jeanie also agrees with revenue sharing. I don't quite agree with it, but hey, it's not my money. $50m is a lot to be giving to small market teams that plot your demise at every turn. I can't disagree with the results though. The NBA's popularity is at an all time high and it seems to be surpassing football is many different aspects.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:52 pm    Post subject: Re: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Dr. Funkbot wrote:
This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.


And because you wanted to post it in the Lounge, rather than the existing thread in General.


Yup! No one ever goes into the general thread:)
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:57 pm    Post subject:

problem I have with Lakers having agreed with giving these teams $50 mil a year is the same teams crying and complaining when the Lakers do anything to try to improve their product on the floor
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:57 pm    Post subject:

pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


I disagree, unless you are including the increase in asset value....but beyond that balance sheet item, having an income statement with a net loss (before revenue sharing) is an operating loss.....they had less revenue than expenses.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:13 pm    Post subject:

pmacla wrote:
problem I have with Lakers having agreed with giving these teams $50 mil a year is the same teams crying and complaining when the Lakers do anything to try to improve their product on the floor


That's my main issue too. Dan Gilbert, Herb Simon, Mark Cuban, Michael Jordan, & god knows who else have all complained and plotted against the Lakers in the past.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


I disagree, unless you are including the increase in asset value....but beyond that balance sheet item, having an income statement with a net loss (before revenue sharing) is an operating loss.....they had less revenue than expenses.


how much of a salary are the owner and his family taking ? also, how many of the owners personal expenses are they funneling through the team ? there are alot of ways to make the teams look like tehy are taking a loss and cry wolf to get more money from the players, other teams and communities
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:38 pm    Post subject: Re: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/247446/14-NBA-Teams-Lost-Money-During-16-17-Season

How bad of a businessperson must you be in order to lose money while your team made it to the finals? Either that or Gilbert is using shady accounting. Also note that this report does not include non-basketball revenue.

This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.


The #2 reason for Dan G to cook the books this way is to make sure the next CBA he can get even more money from the larger market teams when it comes to profit sharing.

But the #1 reason for cooking the books, is so that when the new CBA pops up this is the excuse that will be used to shaft the player as usual."well we're not making any money so we need to do X."
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:48 pm    Post subject:

pmacla wrote:
adkindo wrote:
pmacla wrote:
understand all this "losing money" is a relative term, if they where actually losing money no one would want to own these teams


I disagree, unless you are including the increase in asset value....but beyond that balance sheet item, having an income statement with a net loss (before revenue sharing) is an operating loss.....they had less revenue than expenses.


how much of a salary are the owner and his family taking ? also, how many of the owners personal expenses are they funneling through the team ? there are alot of ways to make the teams look like tehy are taking a loss and cry wolf to get more money from the players, other teams and communities


They have to share their books with the players association to determine BRI. If they are found to be cooking their books the players will know. I believe there have been disputes about that previously.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:41 pm    Post subject:

Oh, the poor owners! The players should clearly give back some of their share of the revenue, don't want the owners going hungry.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:35 pm    Post subject: Re: The Cavs lost money last year? (Laker related)

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/247446/14-NBA-Teams-Lost-Money-During-16-17-Season

How bad of a businessperson must you be in order to lose money while your team made it to the finals? Either that or Gilbert is using shady accounting. Also note that this report does not include non-basketball revenue.

This is Laker related because you know all of these small market charlatans will be quoting this report while requesting that league hammer the Lakers whenever they can.


This just shows the impossibility of the Warriors sustaining their current roster. 100 million dollar tax bills have to come out of ownerships pockets, there's no team that can sustain that, that was the idea of it.

Ownership isn't making nearly as much as the players on a year to year basis, it's not even close. Ownership makes money on asset appreciation, but it doesn't pay the bills because they aren't allowed to borrow against it.
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