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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:23 am Post subject: |
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Wino wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Wino wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | If you are playing better than both guards on your team, I think it is natural to want to start. I'm pretty sure most of his career, IT has played behind guards who were worse than him, but because he's short he's had to take a back seat.
Season 1
Tyreke and John Salmons (began as bench and played himself to starter)
Anyone argue that John Salmons is better than IT?
Season 2
Tyreke and IT
Season 3
Got benched behind Greivis Vasquez and Ben McLemore
What's better about Greivis Vasquez? Nothing, except he's tall.
Any wonder why he'd want to leave Sacramento? I'd be pretty bitter if I were IT too.
Season 4 (Phoenix)
Had to play behind Dragic and Bledsoe. At least these are both decent players... but none have had the season IT had in Boston.
Season 5 (Boston)
Had to play behind Avery Bradley and Marcus Smart
Eventually worked his way into position as a starter.
Season 6 (Boston)
Has all star/MVP quality season averaging 29 points a game.
Season 7 (Cleveland)
Due to hip injury aggravated by playing through pain in the playoffs... he is unable to play. Plays poorly during 15 game spell... traded to Lakers
Season 7 (Lakers)
Agrees to play behind KCP and Josh Hart (rookie)
Finally starts when Hart and Kuzma are injured and KCP is moved to small forward.
The poor man has been pushed behind John Salmons, Greivis Vasquez, and Marcus Smart... also Bledsoe who you can at least understand but I still think IT is better than him. And some of you call him a cancer because he wants to start?
Every place he's ever played at except a bad Sacramento team... he's had to start from scratch... play on the bench behind inferior players... patiently outplay the starter and regain his position.
And for no other reason than because he's short.
If we don't resign him and sign the journeyman trash I see listed above, we deserve the karma we get for letting prejudice get in the way.
Every other GM has done it so far... why should some of you be any different? |
Look man, say what you want but in the end, if you can't play defense, you aren't starting for a a championship team. As good as he is, and he does have skills, he also has deficiencies. |
I've suggested him in a three man platoon with Lonzo and Hart where you'd play him when you needed offense and you'd play Lonzo and Hart when you were protecting a lead down the stretch.
This is also my plan B if and only if we don't sign LBJ and PG13
Lonzo isn't quite ready yet either physically or mentally to deal with a serious playoff challenge, so IT would provide a good backup in case he got hurt or went into a bad slump.
IT may not want to accept anything less than guaranteed starter... if so, we part ways... he might not accept anything less than a long term contract... if so, we also part ways. But if he's willing to accept a more modest role to play for a future contender... then we should sign him.
But only if the PG/LBJ dream falls through. |
Well, I agree that he could be a valuable part of this team if he can accept coming off the bench. He is capable of providing a spark on offense. And signing him and even Lopez to expensive one year deals, should we be unable to land two FA's this off season, would be fine. Apparently we have to spend that money anyhow. It might entice them enough to stick around one more year. Although I suspect if we do sign Lebron, that he might not want IT around and he will be let go. |
If we sign LeBron, we no longer need IT... so that question becomes moot.
Although I have a feeling the bad blood is overblown, and if it was in LBJ's best interest he would still happily play with IT if he felt it would help him win. |
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ahaider Star Player
Joined: 21 Feb 2012 Posts: 3501
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:32 am Post subject: |
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I don't see Lebron or PG-13 resolving the issues that we lose with IT.
IT is a great shooter, he can run the pick and roll. He's an elite backup PG and we will certainly need a PG who can run the pick and roll and shoot (mid & 3) as a backup.
It cannot be Caruso or Ennis _________________ Author of James Harden and the Strip Club
"The key to good decision making is not knowledge. It is understanding. We are swimming in the former. We are desperately lacking in the latter." - Malcom Gladwell |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:33 am Post subject: |
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ahaider wrote: | I don't see Lebron or PG-13 resolving the issues that we lose with IT.
IT is a great shooter, he can run the pick and roll. He's an elite backup PG and we will certainly need a PG who can run the pick and roll and shoot (mid & 3) as a backup.
It cannot be Caruso or Ennis |
Those aren’t our only options, just the options that the FO chose. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:34 am Post subject: |
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ahaider wrote: | I don't see Lebron or PG-13 resolving the issues that we lose with IT.
IT is a great shooter, he can run the pick and roll. He's an elite backup PG and we will certainly need a PG who can run the pick and roll and shoot (mid & 3) as a backup.
It cannot be Caruso or Ennis |
It's not a zero sum issue. You lose that with IT, but you gain fricking LBJ/PG13! So many positives from getting two stars with versatile and elite traits. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73040
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:34 am Post subject: |
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Omar Little wrote: | 32 wrote: | So how was Jim fired? |
I can't give you the exact mechanism, but i do know fairly certainly that a majority of the siblings approved. |
Thanks Omar. _________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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watchME Star Player
Joined: 06 May 2011 Posts: 3384
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:37 am Post subject: |
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if we have lbj and pg13 would u trade randle + ball for davis?
G.Hart
SG.PG13
SF.Ingram
PF.Lebron
C.Davis
GSW would have nothing on that team. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:38 am Post subject: |
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watchME wrote: | if we have lbj and pg13 would u trade randle + ball for davis?
G.Hart
SG.PG13
SF.Ingram
PF.Lebron
C.Davis
GSW would have nothing on that team. |
Jules/Lonzo aren't getting you Davis. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144432 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:53 am Post subject: |
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watchME wrote: | if we have lbj and pg13 would u trade randle + ball for davis?
G.Hart
SG.PG13
SF.Ingram
PF.Lebron
C.Davis
GSW would have nothing on that team. |
NO isn’t doing that.
And since Jim brought it up a couple of days ago, the Pelicans are now the second NBA franchise with a female majority owner. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
Last edited by venturalakersfan on Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:55 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46492
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 10:54 am Post subject: |
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watchME wrote: | if we have lbj and pg13 would u trade randle + ball for davis?
G.Hart
SG.PG13
SF.Ingram
PF.Lebron
C.Davis
GSW would have nothing on that team. |
If we wanted a 3rd star the likely target would be Kwahi Leonard |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46492
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:23 am Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:26 am Post subject: |
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Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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ToastedMuffins Starting Rotation
Joined: 14 Apr 2016 Posts: 589
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:37 am Post subject: |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
Where's DJ going to go? Is he going to try a mulligan with the Mavs? |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:39 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:42 am Post subject: |
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Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
Eh. Pelinka has earned my trust that he would (assuming no max FAs): 1) field a competitive team for 2018-19 that would compete for the playoffs; 2) still maintain cap flexibility going forward. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Roon Star Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2012 Posts: 1816
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:42 am Post subject: |
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ahaider wrote: | I don't see Lebron or PG-13 resolving the issues that we lose with IT.
IT is a great shooter, he can run the pick and roll. He's an elite backup PG and we will certainly need a PG who can run the pick and roll and shoot (mid & 3) as a backup.
It cannot be Caruso or Ennis |
Lebron is 90th percetile as the ball hanlder in PNR. Shooting 38% from 3, and 44% from midrange. I don't know what a solid midrange number is.
I think we'd be okay if he replaced IT.
I'd like to see a Lebron/Randle PNR. I think that would be fun. |
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Roon Star Player
Joined: 29 Sep 2012 Posts: 1816
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:45 am Post subject: |
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Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
Regardless of who we sign in the offseason, we're set to have an above average defense next season. Ball/Hart/Ingram/Randle/Lopez are a good defense this year, and will be better next year. George/James(when he's trying) will only help. |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:49 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
Eh. Pelinka has earned my trust that he would (assuming no max FAs): 1) field a competitive team for 2018-19 that would compete for the playoffs; 2) still maintain cap flexibility going forward. |
Competitive in the current league requires good 3 point shooting and solid contributions from the point guard position. I'm not saying it can't be found elsewhere but we already have a lot of long bodies who can play defense... what we don't have is reliable cover for Zo if he gets either injured nor great 3 point shooters that have proven themselves over a long period of time.
I will be very disappointed if we don't sign the two elites and we let IT go to the Clippers of all people.
Last edited by Sentient Meat on Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:57 am; edited 1 time in total |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:51 am Post subject: |
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Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
Eh. Pelinka has earned my trust that he would (assuming no max FAs): 1) field a competitive team for 2018-19 that would compete for the playoffs; 2) still maintain cap flexibility going forward. |
Competitive in the current league requires good 3 point shooting and solid contributions from the point guard position. I'm not saying it can't be found elsewhere but we already have a lot of long bodies who can play defense... what we don't have is reliable cover for Zo if he gets either injured or in a shooting nor great 3 point shooters that have proven themselves over a long period of time.
I will be very disappointed if we don't sign the two elites and we let IT go to the Clippers of all people. |
Honestly doesn't bother me at all, b/c he's already shown by his "not a 6th man" comment that he's unlikely to return here anyways. I'm actually glad he came out and said that so at least folks are transparent about intentions and such. However, not sure it was wise to do so publicly but at least for the fanbase, now we know (if you haven't already). _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46492
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:54 am Post subject: |
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So I read a interesting scenario on another forum...
What if LeBron commits to the Lakers but Paul George decides to stay in OKC what are some possible options after that?
Trade for Leonard?
Trade for Walker? |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:55 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | yinoma2001 wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
It's not crazy if you don't sign PG or LeBron... Don't come crying to me if IT, Lou and Tobias Harris are dropping bombs on us next season. That's some potent firepower. |
Yes. With 0 defense. |
If we sign both the FAs... we will be fine. If we don't and we treat IT like an after thought we may suffer at least into 2019. |
Eh. Pelinka has earned my trust that he would (assuming no max FAs): 1) field a competitive team for 2018-19 that would compete for the playoffs; 2) still maintain cap flexibility going forward. |
Competitive in the current league requires good 3 point shooting and solid contributions from the point guard position. I'm not saying it can't be found elsewhere but we already have a lot of long bodies who can play defense... what we don't have is reliable cover for Zo if he gets either injured or in a shooting nor great 3 point shooters that have proven themselves over a long period of time.
I will be very disappointed if we don't sign the two elites and we let IT go to the Clippers of all people. |
Honestly doesn't bother me at all, b/c he's already shown by his "not a 6th man" comment that he's unlikely to return here anyways. I'm actually glad he came out and said that so at least folks are transparent about intentions and such. However, not sure it was wise to do so publicly but at least for the fanbase, now we know (if you haven't already). |
I already said in an earlier post that IT is only keeping it real and saying what all competitors think in their minds publicly. Do you really want floating players with Sacre's mentality who are just happy to be on the bench?
Any player worth their salt wants to start. Julius was pissed when he was benched... he just looked annoyed and didn't say it out loud.
I have no problem with IT wanting to start as long as he doesn't actively sabotage the team, which so far it seems like he hasn't |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46492
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:57 am Post subject: |
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ToastedMuffins wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Don’t be surprised if the Clippers pursue IT in FA.. Clippers might be crazy enough to pay IT good money if Jerry can’t get Paul George or LeBron... DJ is done as a Clipper after this year, so there gonna want some sort of star on there team. |
Where's DJ going to go? Is he going to try a mulligan with the Mavs? |
Sacramento should try getting DJ |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:58 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | I already said in an earlier post that IT is only keeping it real and saying what all competitors think in their minds publicly. Do you really want floating players with Sacre's mentality who are just happy to be on the bench?
Any player worth their salt wants to start. Julius was pissed when he was benched... he just looked annoyed and didn't say it out loud.
I have no problem with IT wanting to start as long as he doesn't actively sabotage the team, which so far it seems like he hasn't |
It's pretty self-defeating to say that you're preemptively not happy about the only role that would be available for you on the Lakers. It reveals a lot about the kind of expectations he has and would have on the team.
This is less than 10 games in that he's already signaled that he's not going to be a 6th man. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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"Hi, I'm applying for the job of Assistant Store Manager. But I want to tell you beforehand there's no way in hell I'm going to be an "ASSISTANT" Store Manager. I'm a CEO. Did I get the job?" _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Quote: | I already said in an earlier post that IT is only keeping it real and saying what all competitors think in their minds publicly. Do you really want floating players with Sacre's mentality who are just happy to be on the bench?
Any player worth their salt wants to start. Julius was pissed when he was benched... he just looked annoyed and didn't say it out loud.
I have no problem with IT wanting to start as long as he doesn't actively sabotage the team, which so far it seems like he hasn't |
It's pretty self-defeating to say that you're preemptively not happy about the only role that would be available for you on the Lakers. It reveals a lot about the kind of expectations he has and would have on the team.
This is less than 10 games in that he's already signaled that he's not going to be a 6th man. |
Do you deny that most all star caliber players would want to start even though they don't have the balls to be honest and say it publicly?
It's pretty simple really... either he accepts the role available and signs the contract or he doesn't. But I think you are exaggerating the impact of a player being honest for a change vs. simply giving the traditional politically correct answer. |
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