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LakerSanity
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Joined: 30 Nov 2006
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Location: Long Beach, California
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 Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:02 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerMindLA wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | | I think obtaining the #39 pick this is all about collecting assets to move Deng in a salary dump. That's the Lakers' priority. The bench can be filled with veteran free agents who would not only flock to LA if Lebron/PG come, but would be way more valuable to a contending team vs. some 2nd round rookies. I dont loke that Marks guy. He isnt smart. More I hear him speak, more I see why he was a terrible NBA executive. |
This is an asset neutral trade.
We traded a likely very high 2nd rounder in 2019 for one this year. |
That's not true. First, if you were right, the Lakers wouldnt have had to include cash too nor would they bother trading for it. They trade for it because it isnt neutral but more valuable to them now than a pick next year. Otherwise, no reason to do the trade. Teams dont do trades that leave them in the same position (which is what a neutral trade would look like).
Second, the 39th pick in some years is worth more in other years depending on who is in the draft that year, so different teams will value that pick differently depending the year and who they want to draft. For the Lakers, it is all about finding that team.
Third, the market always values a current pick more than a future pick (because a bird in the hand is better than two in the bush and GMs dont know if they will be around a year from now).
Fourth, because people know who is in this draft (but dont know yet next year), have scouted players in this draft, know their current roster/cap situation (as opposed to what that might look like next year) and know the current state of league (vs. what it may look like next year), it is easier to find buyers for current assets than assets next year due to urgency and the certainty that today presents versus the uncertainty of tomorrow.
This pick is more valuable than next years pick and is easier to sell than next years pick, which is why one would expect another deal using it to come (whether for Deng or to move up in the draft).
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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | epak wrote: | | PRLakeShow wrote: | | epak wrote: | | PRLakeShow wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | | epak wrote: | Is there an OKC to Indy for SAS?
I'd think Toronto or Miami should just go for it.
If he leaves, rebuild. |
I was thinking about this last night and I cannot think of any. I went down the entire NBA roster and nothing jumps out. I guess the Knicks are the one team that worry me but they don't have much to offer outside KP. |
No team in their right mind would give up something more valuable than BI for a rental. If the Spurs don't deal with us it would be out of pettiness and someone in the Spurs FO should be fired for it. Malpractice. |
What was the offer the Lakers made to Indy?
One of Julius and JC + ? |
Not sure. Russell? In hindsight it worked out for Indy but at the time everyone knew they got fleeced. It's like revisiting the Pau trade. In hindsight... |
I'm trying to recall L.A.s best offer for PG at the time.
Interested to see if L.A. stays the course for KL. although the circumstances will be different with the roster. |
there was a couple different rumors...but I think the Lakers claimed they never went higher than Randle or Clarkson, Brewer and maybe the #28? It was a pretty crappy offer....we would not even offer Randle and Clarkson.  |
Hindsight: Julius + Kuz + Corey... It's not that bad compared to sabonis and oladipo? Thanks for the info reminder. |
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scoobs
Star Player
Joined: 19 Aug 2005
Posts: 4746
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Here2Party wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: |
Hopefully Clippers give up both of there picks so they can be out of the running for KL. |
What if the Spurs felt that their guy at 4 would be better than anyone they can get in a trade? |
They might be interested in somebody in the top 5. |
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adkindo
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005
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Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
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CamReddish
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 7916
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol
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Kookie Monster
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Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Johnny Cage wrote: | The Spurs are simply not going to trade Kawhi, a top 4 player in the league who will instantly make us a playoff team and is guaranteed to re-sign with us, to LA unless we give up top assets. Everyone suggesting BI + Hart + 25 or something similar is kidding themselves. Any considerable package will have to center around BI + Kuzma + a pick or two. Guarantee it. And even then, the Spurs could easily just say no Bc it's the Lakers. They really don't want to trade him here unless it's the absolute best package they can get. Otherwise, they'll just take the Clippers' package and call it a day.
RC and Jerry West know each other well and I could easily see them getting something done tomorrow night. That's why I don't want Magic farting around on this. Just pull the trigger and get it done, or we're going to blow it and let him go to the Clippers. That could also cost us Lebron and/or Paul George. Getting Kawhi likely means we get both of them. So it's time to stop messing around and trying to call everyone's bluff. Offer BI + Kuzma + Hart and/or 25 and call it day. Lock up Kawhi, dump Deng, sign Lebron & PG, sign a couple of cheap vets like Jamal Crawford and call it an offseason (an incredible one at that). Suddenly the Lakers are legitimate contenders for years to come. Otherwise, we risk losing them all for nothing. |
Word.
We need to be aggressive and shrewd. Can't rely on getting Kawhi next summer. The time is now. No messing around. Bring Kawhi home. |
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VanderBlue'sJersey
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Joined: 24 Apr 2015
Posts: 233
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
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DancingBarry
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Joined: 07 Sep 2001
Posts: 40202
Location: O.C.
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:23 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: |
…This pick is more valuable than next years pick and is easier to sell than next years pick, which is why one would expect another deal using it to come (whether for Deng or to move up in the draft). |
Definitely more valuable. Teams don't mind losing a few positions in a future draft for a pick today. What's also interesting is that we did it now vs. letting it be known tomorrow. Usually, teams hold the cards close as an advantage. Just seems to me like we needed to get move A done to cut down on the moving parts and help set up move B. |
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epak
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Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| VanderBlue'sJersey wrote: | | PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
My faves were Magic and Kobe. With NVE in between. |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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| I just remembered that the Clippers like Doncic, so it could be them just trying to get him. |
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Fortysixn2
Star Player
Joined: 22 Jun 2016
Posts: 2849
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:40 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | VanderBlue'sJersey wrote: | | PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
My faves were Magic and Kobe. With NVE in between. |
I’ve always been a fan of amazing defensive players and although george is a really good defender, Kawhi is one of the best to ever do it...so as long as he’s healthy he’d get my vote.
My favorite laker growing up was Michael Cooper. Kobe and Metta round out my favorite lakers of all time. To me defense is all about effort and will, i’ll Take that any day over flash and empty scoring stats. That’s why Kobe/Jordan are far and away 1/2 of all time, they could do everything including being amazing defenders at a tough position to guard. |
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RestEasyBlackMamba
Star Player
Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 3061
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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| I just wanna wake up in a month from today and see who the Lakers have or haven’t acquired |
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CamReddish
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 7916
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | VanderBlue'sJersey wrote: | | PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
My faves were Magic and Kobe. With NVE in between. |
Love NVE. Met a friend of his during the NCAA tournament 1st round last year in Sacramento. I went to watch Lonzo. Cincinnati was also here. I met him at a bar after and he recorded me talking about NVE and even the 123 Cancun. Lol. Told him we shouldn't have traded him
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CamReddish
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 7916
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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| 24ways2die wrote: | | I just wanna wake up in a month from today and see who the Lakers have or haven’t acquired |
Long time to sleep. We will know in a little over 2 weeks
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adkindo
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Kawhi....he is probably my favorite non-Laker player in the NBA. |
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Johnny Cage
Starting Rotation
Joined: 12 Jan 2016
Posts: 270
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I just remembered that the Clippers like Doncic, so it could be them just trying to get him. |
All reports today have said that Doncic isn’t making it past ATL at 3. They’re really high on him apparently. |
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adkindo
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | VanderBlue'sJersey wrote: | | PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
My faves were Magic and Kobe. With NVE in between. |
it is weird, but Nick probably gave me as much real joy as anyone that ever wore the PnG.....outside of Kobe. Nick was fearless. |
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CamReddish
Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015
Posts: 7916
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | | epak wrote: | | VanderBlue'sJersey wrote: | | PG13 wrote: | | adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Who would you pick? I would go Paul George. He would be my Lamar Odom. I always love the 3rd guy. Lol |
Same. My fave players have always guys like Mychal Thompson, AC/Rambis, Vlade, Fish/Fox, etc. Plus, I went to Fresno State, so I have to pick for Paul George! |
My faves were Magic and Kobe. With NVE in between. |
it is weird, but Nick probably gave me as much real joy as anyone that ever wore the PnG.....outside of Kobe. Nick was fearless. |
I was so upset when he got traded.
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watchME
Star Player
Joined: 06 May 2011
Posts: 3384
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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cmon grizz let us get that 4th pick.. kuzma + hart + 1st would fit nicely with gasol
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JeezyXVII
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jul 2014
Posts: 1835
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I just remembered that the Clippers like Doncic, so it could be them just trying to get him. |
JWest will be trying to acquire talent and build a competitive roster, especially with the picks and players they have, they are going to make some nice, smart moves with him pulling the strings. |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46681
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| JeezyXVII wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | I just remembered that the Clippers like Doncic, so it could be them just trying to get him. |
JWest will be trying to acquire talent and build a competitive roster, especially with the picks and players they have, they are going to make some nice, smart moves with him pulling the strings. |
They will, but so will the Lakers, as we saw the Lakers already made a move and that should signal that the Lakers might be super active tomorrow, so the Lakers and Clippers and 28 other teams will try to add something to there team tomorrow. |
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kawhileonard
Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Jun 2018
Posts: 599
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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| adkindo wrote: | hoping by mid July there is a LG Poll....
Who is your favorite Laker?
- Lebron James
- Kawhi Leonard
- Paul George
- Other
I will be a happy fan. |
Me |
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Johnny Cage
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Joined: 12 Jan 2016
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Arbitrary
Star Player
Joined: 01 Feb 2009
Posts: 5788
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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Didn't he wait for about 8 days before returning to Cleveland? I think we're on a clock with regards to keeping Randle.
Still hoping for PG + LBJ + Randle. I think Kawhi isn't coming (I hope I'm wrong on this).
I wonder if someone takes Deng and our future picks later today. |
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lakersfan8
Star Player
Joined: 27 May 2014
Posts: 2993
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| Posted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:18 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | LakerMindLA wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | | I think obtaining the #39 pick this is all about collecting assets to move Deng in a salary dump. That's the Lakers' priority. The bench can be filled with veteran free agents who would not only flock to LA if Lebron/PG come, but would be way more valuable to a contending team vs. some 2nd round rookies. I dont loke that Marks guy. He isnt smart. More I hear him speak, more I see why he was a terrible NBA executive. |
This is an asset neutral trade.
We traded a likely very high 2nd rounder in 2019 for one this year. |
That's not true. First, if you were right, the Lakers wouldnt have had to include cash too nor would they bother trading for it. They trade for it because it isnt neutral but more valuable to them now than a pick next year. Otherwise, no reason to do the trade. Teams dont do trades that leave them in the same position (which is what a neutral trade would look like).
Second, the 39th pick in some years is worth more in other years depending on who is in the draft that year, so different teams will value that pick differently depending the year and who they want to draft. For the Lakers, it is all about finding that team.
Third, the market always values a current pick more than a future pick (because a bird in the hand is better than two in the bush and GMs dont know if they will be around a year from now).
Fourth, because people know who is in this draft (but dont know yet next year), have scouted players in this draft, know their current roster/cap situation (as opposed to what that might look like next year) and know the current state of league (vs. what it may look like next year), it is easier to find buyers for current assets than assets next year due to urgency and the certainty that today presents versus the uncertainty of tomorrow.
This pick is more valuable than next years pick and is easier to sell than next years pick, which is why one would expect another deal using it to come (whether for Deng or to move up in the draft). |
Great analysis.
Also, this kind of trade doesn't usually happen until during the draft when teams see their targeted player falls to that draft range. It is also unrealistic to project a 2nd round rookie can have any meaningful immediate contribution to the team.
So this move is most likely for a trade purposes. Other than facilitating a trade involving Deng, this could also be moving up to 23rd or 22nd pick. |
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