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PHILosophize
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Joined: 05 Nov 2012
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 Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:47 am Post subject: |
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My plan:
Lonzo
Evans
PG
BI
Randle
JC
Belly
Nance
Kooz
Noel
Hart
Zubat
Bryant
Caruso
Draft pick
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PHILosophize
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2012
Posts: 10758
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:47 am Post subject: |
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| AFireInside619 wrote: | | PHILosophize wrote: | | AFireInside619 wrote: | | Hope I'm wrong but Bron's not coming. Paul George plus roll players/shooters is the most likely scenario. Cousins seems to have found a home in NOLA. |
eggzactly |
Hey Phil. Are you gonna ask for another 3-day ban if we win any of the next three games? 😂😂😂 |
The mods wouldn't ban me last time so no 
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Laker's Fan
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Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12861
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:48 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | How many years will this team have punted cap space then? This constant roster turnover can't be good for building up institutional foundations on this team. |
The Bryant cap space punt years were a very different animal. That was about ownership making money while they tanked and pretended to be saving a bullet for Kobe. At that point they had little to no young talent and couldn't get a respectable coach to take the job.
Now they have lots of young talent (including their coach) but none of them are ready. Magic trying to work the grand slam but Pelinka has situated them well to grow more organically. A lot of fans will ask why not keep Russell then but that is moot now and one of the upshots is it extended the cap flexibility.
They have a lot of cap space in a year where that is a high value asset. If they don't get max guys they're still in a good position to get quality players on good deals. Will continue the march upward and leave options going forward.
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RI Laker
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7158
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:49 am Post subject: |
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Everyone who thinks we are getting Lebron is setting themselves up for failure. We are not getting him, and quite frankly, he doesn't fit into what we are trying to do (unless you think we can dethrone the Warriors in the next year or two). Some are speculating that our team should or will be finalized this off season (in all likelihood the process will take two years or longer). I do not see the FO getting impatient or immediately shooting their load this off season (unless the opportunity presents itself).
We will be in a VASTLY IMPROVED position this off season then we were during our worst off season in team history. First off, we do have a solid young nucleus (BI, Ball,and Kuz). Secondly, Jimmy the dunce (and Chad) are gone. Finally, Magic and Rob (I know some do not like them and I do not understand why) add credibility to the free agent process as they are more attractive to potential free agents than our previous FO. This is a work in process and we are moving in the right direction. |
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Laker's Fan
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Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12861
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:52 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | So what are the best PG13 + teams?
1. do you punt the other cap space to 2019?
2. do you sign tier 2-beyond guys to suit the personnel, but eat up 2019 cap space?
3. keep both JC/Jules (and extend the latter eating into 2019 cap space)?
It gets a bit dicey, and PG13 + might not be enough to guarantee even the playoffs. |
I try to deal Deng+Asset for George Hill. Would be the vet guard next to/behind Lonzo that we need, he's tight with PG and his 19-20 salary is only $1M guaranteed. He's also reportedly not happy in Sacramento and spent time with Maginka this summer as a free agent target.
Fills a roster need, would make PG happy, punts cap space to 2019.
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | How many years will this team have punted cap space then? This constant roster turnover can't be good for building up institutional foundations on this team. |
The Bryant cap space punt years were a very different animal. That was about ownership making money while they tanked and pretended to be saving a bullet for Kobe. At that point they had little to no young talent and couldn't get a respectable coach to take the job.
Now they have lots of young talent (including their coach) but none of them are ready. Magic trying to work the grand slam but Pelinka has situated them well to grow more organically. A lot of fans will ask why not keep Russell then but that is moot now and one of the upshots is it extended the cap flexibility.
They have a lot of cap space in a year where that is a high value asset. If they don't get max guys they're still in a good position to get quality players on good deals. Will continue the march upward and leave options going forward. |
So what do they do about Jules? Trade him (and he's been indispensable towards to the Lakers "success" this year in wins). Does he get 18m/year?
Who are the 2019 FAs that are even remotely realistic? Doubt Klay leaves the Warriors. Butler (who will be put through 2 more years of Thibs in Minny)?
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:56 am Post subject: |
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| RI Laker wrote: | Everyone who thinks we are getting Lebron is setting themselves up for failure. We are not getting him, and quite frankly, he doesn't fit into what we are trying to do (unless you think we can dethrone the Warriors in the next year or two). Some are speculating that our team should or will be finalized this off season (in all likelihood the process will take two years or longer). I do not see the FO getting impatient or immediately shooting their load this off season (unless the opportunity presents itself).
We will be in a VASTLY IMPROVED position this off season then we were during our worst off season in team history. First off, we do have a solid young nucleus (BI, Ball,and Kuz). Secondly, Jimmy the dunce (and Chad) are gone. Finally, Magic and Rob (I know some do not like them and I do not understand why) add credibility to the free agent process as they are more attractive to potential free agents than our previous FO. This is a work in process and we are moving in the right direction. |
But who are they going to add if they miss on the 1 or 2 max plan? Another summer of pure punt moves?
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32
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:56 am Post subject: |
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We are in a good place right now. There are a lot of moving parts and lots of opportunities to improve the team.
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:56 am Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | So what are the best PG13 + teams?
1. do you punt the other cap space to 2019?
2. do you sign tier 2-beyond guys to suit the personnel, but eat up 2019 cap space?
3. keep both JC/Jules (and extend the latter eating into 2019 cap space)?
It gets a bit dicey, and PG13 + might not be enough to guarantee even the playoffs. |
I try to deal Deng+Asset for George Hill. Would be the vet guard next to/behind Lonzo that we need, he's tight with PG and his 19-20 salary is only $1M guaranteed. He's also reportedly not happy in Sacramento and spent time with Maginka this summer as a free agent target.
Fills a roster need, would make PG happy, punts cap space to 2019. |
That works. Combo guard who will get PT. How about JC? Keep him? Jules?
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46684
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 11:58 am Post subject: |
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| 32 wrote: | | We are in a good place right now. There are a lot of moving parts and lots of opportunities to improve the team. |
So your expecting a trade this season? |
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RI Laker
Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7158
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | Everyone who thinks we are getting Lebron is setting themselves up for failure. We are not getting him, and quite frankly, he doesn't fit into what we are trying to do (unless you think we can dethrone the Warriors in the next year or two). Some are speculating that our team should or will be finalized this off season (in all likelihood the process will take two years or longer). I do not see the FO getting impatient or immediately shooting their load this off season (unless the opportunity presents itself).
We will be in a VASTLY IMPROVED position this off season then we were during our worst off season in team history. First off, we do have a solid young nucleus (BI, Ball,and Kuz). Secondly, Jimmy the dunce (and Chad) are gone. Finally, Magic and Rob (I know some do not like them and I do not understand why) add credibility to the free agent process as they are more attractive to potential free agents than our previous FO. This is a work in process and we are moving in the right direction. |
But who are they going to add if they miss on the 1 or 2 max plan? Another summer of pure punt moves? |
I think we will get one max (PG) and re-evaluate after next season. The point is the process is going to take a couple of seasons. I think the FO has a firm grasp on whats going on and will balance improving the team while not flaming money. |
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Laker's Fan
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Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12861
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:09 pm Post subject: |
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Here are the higher profile restricted free agents this July:
J Parker, A Gordon, M Smart, E Payton, Z Lavine, J Nurkic, R Hood, J Randle, C Capela, K Anderson, D McDermott and possibly N Jokic.
That's a long list as only Harris, Wiggins, and Embiid got extended (Jordan and Powell got early deals as second rounders and Saric is delayed a year).
Now add the unrestricted free agents and incoming draft class, then take a look at the available cap space this summer.
What team offers Randle $18 million per?
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Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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PHILosophize
Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2012
Posts: 10758
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | 32 wrote: | | We are in a good place right now. There are a lot of moving parts and lots of opportunities to improve the team. |
So your expecting a trade this season? |
Gadget I know you've got the 35 mill to give to LeBron under the table to convince him to sign, right?
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Laker's Fan
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Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12861
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:12 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Laker's Fan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | So what are the best PG13 + teams?
1. do you punt the other cap space to 2019?
2. do you sign tier 2-beyond guys to suit the personnel, but eat up 2019 cap space?
3. keep both JC/Jules (and extend the latter eating into 2019 cap space)?
It gets a bit dicey, and PG13 + might not be enough to guarantee even the playoffs. |
I try to deal Deng+Asset for George Hill. Would be the vet guard next to/behind Lonzo that we need, he's tight with PG and his 19-20 salary is only $1M guaranteed. He's also reportedly not happy in Sacramento and spent time with Maginka this summer as a free agent target.
Fills a roster need, would make PG happy, punts cap space to 2019. |
That works. Combo guard who will get PT. How about JC? Keep him? Jules? |
Resign Jules on a deal that will grow as an asset over time and keep Jordan unless you can get something better. He's valuable but as you get more high usage guys he gets fewer looks and his impact dimishes.
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Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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AFireInside619
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Joined: 11 Dec 2015
Posts: 11447
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | So what are the best PG13 + teams?
1. do you punt the other cap space to 2019?
2. do you sign tier 2-beyond guys to suit the personnel, but eat up 2019 cap space?
3. keep both JC/Jules (and extend the latter eating into 2019 cap space)?
It gets a bit dicey, and PG13 + might not be enough to guarantee even the playoffs. |
I would do PG13 plus a shooter who can come off screens. Think Rip Hamilton. Since the 2017 version of Rip plays for the Raptors and since the 2 guard position has been thin of late, we would have to overpay for a one year rental. Who's a role player, willing to be overpaid for one season, is a great shooter, and can come off screens? JJ Reddick. I do think he's a long shot though. It seems like he's done with living in LA. He moved his family to Brooklyn right before signing with the Sixers. My guess is he stays in the NE.
If we only get PG13, we should definitely punt/rental that cap space till 2019. I think Klay is destined to be a Laker. A backcourt of Zo & the best 3&D player in NBA history would decimate teams.
Until then, I would definitely keep Clarkson around. Offensively, he fits very well with Zo. Especially with the schemes they have started to run in the half court. And if we punt, we can hold Deng for one more season and he should be a lot easier to trade with only one year left on his contract. |
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:15 pm Post subject: |
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| RI Laker wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | Everyone who thinks we are getting Lebron is setting themselves up for failure. We are not getting him, and quite frankly, he doesn't fit into what we are trying to do (unless you think we can dethrone the Warriors in the next year or two). Some are speculating that our team should or will be finalized this off season (in all likelihood the process will take two years or longer). I do not see the FO getting impatient or immediately shooting their load this off season (unless the opportunity presents itself).
We will be in a VASTLY IMPROVED position this off season then we were during our worst off season in team history. First off, we do have a solid young nucleus (BI, Ball,and Kuz). Secondly, Jimmy the dunce (and Chad) are gone. Finally, Magic and Rob (I know some do not like them and I do not understand why) add credibility to the free agent process as they are more attractive to potential free agents than our previous FO. This is a work in process and we are moving in the right direction. |
But who are they going to add if they miss on the 1 or 2 max plan? Another summer of pure punt moves? |
I think we will get one max (PG) and re-evaluate after next season. The point is the process is going to take a couple of seasons. I think the FO has a firm grasp on whats going on and will balance improving the team while not flaming money. |
PG is my #1 realistic/attainable guy. I still think he wants either another star or 1-2 other proven vets on longer deals to join him. If that's the case, and we end up with say PG/Bradley/keep Jules, is that enough to compete for a championship long-term? I don't think it is, though it would be a possible playoff team (maybe a 7-8th seed).
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yinoma2001
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Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| Laker's Fan wrote: | Here are the higher profile restricted free agents this July:
J Parker, A Gordon, M Smart, E Payton, Z Lavine, J Nurkic, R Hood, J Randle, C Capela, K Anderson, D McDermott and possibly N Jokic.
That's a long list as only Harris, Wiggins, and Embiid got extended (Jordan and Powell got early deals as second rounders and Saric is delayed a year).
Now add the unrestricted free agents and incoming draft class, then take a look at the available cap space this summer.
What team offers Randle $18 million per? |
I don't know. Maybe Dallas? But was just trying to get a FMV for Jules. Certainly over 12.4-5m cap hold but under 20m? (look at how Dallas overpaid for guys like Barnes/Matthews, even Parsons).
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yinoma2001
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Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:18 pm Post subject: |
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| AFireInside619 wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | So what are the best PG13 + teams?
1. do you punt the other cap space to 2019?
2. do you sign tier 2-beyond guys to suit the personnel, but eat up 2019 cap space?
3. keep both JC/Jules (and extend the latter eating into 2019 cap space)?
It gets a bit dicey, and PG13 + might not be enough to guarantee even the playoffs. |
I would do PG13 plus a shooter who can come off screens. Think Rip Hamilton. Since the 2017 version of Rip plays for the Raptors and since the 2 guard position has been thin of late, we would have to overpay for a one year rental. Who's a role player, willing to be overpaid for one season, is a great shooter, and can come off screens? JJ Reddick. I do think he's a long shot though. It seems like he's done with living in LA. He moved his family to Brooklyn right before signing with the Sixers. My guess is he stays in the NE.
If we only get PG13, we should definitely punt/rental that cap space till 2019. I think Klay is destined to be a Laker. A backcourt of Zo & the best 3&D player in NBA history would decimate teams.
Until then, I would definitely keep Clarkson around. Offensively, he fits very well with Zo. Especially with the schemes they have started to run in the half court. And if we punt, we can hold Deng for one more season and he should be a lot easier to trade with only one year left on his contract. |
Klay? How are we saving up enough cap space for him?
It's one thing to leave a struggling OKC team; it's another to expect him to leave the Warriors if they're going dynasty hunting with multiple championships.
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46684
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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| PHILosophize wrote: | | Inspector Gadget wrote: | | 32 wrote: | | We are in a good place right now. There are a lot of moving parts and lots of opportunities to improve the team. |
So your expecting a trade this season? |
Gadget I know you've got the 35 mill to give to LeBron under the table to convince him to sign, right? |
I really think LeBron is fond of being able to restore the Lakers winning ways with a guy like Zo who he has praised for like a thousand times since he was drafted, you never see LeBron gushing on someone, I mean maybe what I’m saying doesn’t matter... but yeah I think Lakers will give the mega fortune if they can sign Bron, it’s obvious he wants to play with Lonzo without making it super obvious |
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RI Laker
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Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7158
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | RI Laker wrote: | Everyone who thinks we are getting Lebron is setting themselves up for failure. We are not getting him, and quite frankly, he doesn't fit into what we are trying to do (unless you think we can dethrone the Warriors in the next year or two). Some are speculating that our team should or will be finalized this off season (in all likelihood the process will take two years or longer). I do not see the FO getting impatient or immediately shooting their load this off season (unless the opportunity presents itself).
We will be in a VASTLY IMPROVED position this off season then we were during our worst off season in team history. First off, we do have a solid young nucleus (BI, Ball,and Kuz). Secondly, Jimmy the dunce (and Chad) are gone. Finally, Magic and Rob (I know some do not like them and I do not understand why) add credibility to the free agent process as they are more attractive to potential free agents than our previous FO. This is a work in process and we are moving in the right direction. |
But who are they going to add if they miss on the 1 or 2 max plan? Another summer of pure punt moves? |
I think we will get one max (PG) and re-evaluate after next season. The point is the process is going to take a couple of seasons. I think the FO has a firm grasp on whats going on and will balance improving the team while not flaming money. |
PG is my #1 realistic/attainable guy. I still think he wants either another star or 1-2 other proven vets on longer deals to join him. If that's the case, and we end up with say PG/Bradley/keep Jules, is that enough to compete for a championship long-term? I don't think it is, though it would be a possible playoff team (maybe a 7-8th seed). |
I hear what you are saying. I just think PG wants to come home more than anything else. Would he like to have another max guy on board? I am sure he would. Oddly enough, getting another max guy will be up to him more than anyone else. Once he is signed, the question then becomes who can he convince to join the party. If there is someone, that would be great. If not, we can move on knowing that we will in all likelihood significantly improve. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:44 pm Post subject: |
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I think if we get PG13, we will have to provide him a reason to join a team that is more than a fringe playoff squad, home and all.
If he wanted Bradley on a long term deal (meaning Ingram comes off the bench) would you do it?
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PHILosophize
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Joined: 05 Nov 2012
Posts: 10758
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | I think if we get PG13, we will have to provide him a reason to join a team that is more than a fringe playoff squad, home and all.
If he wanted Bradley on a long term deal (meaning Ingram comes off the bench) would you do it? |
How much money are we giving to Bradley
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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| Just curious.. would getting PG now give us a better chance to convince him to sign as opposed coming here in FA? For example if we got him now via trade and we went on some crazy run... wouldn’t that be a better way to convince him to sign rather then convincing him in a meeting during FA? |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| PHILosophize wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think if we get PG13, we will have to provide him a reason to join a team that is more than a fringe playoff squad, home and all.
If he wanted Bradley on a long term deal (meaning Ingram comes off the bench) would you do it? |
How much money are we giving to Bradley |
Say 4 years, 20m/year. Would give us:
Lonzo
Bradley
PG13
Means BI likely has to be a 6th man.
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Mon Dec 18, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | PHILosophize wrote: | | We're not signing Lebron. |
Yeah, because all of LG doesn't have $35M to throw around. But what about the Lakers?
I actually think they'll get shut out on Lebron, George, and Cousins next summer, but I wanted to post my near best case scenario. |
Good lord. IF we can't even get one of them, it's going to be a long basketball winter in Lakers-land. |
If the 2018 doomsday scenario comes to pass, I think they hit the pause button for one more season and target Jokic and Klay in 2019. Outside of re-signing Julius to a reasonable deal (hopefully something like 4/$52M), Maginka should punt cap space again with overpriced one-year deals and/or trades for expiring contracts. By summer 2019 Deng's contract may be somewhat movable, JC should be even easier to trade, Nance, Bryant, and Zu are all expendable if need be, and even Randle on a brand new contract could be moved for an asset if he continues to improve. In addition, given the new draft lottery odds in 2019, the Lakers might want to tank a bit.
But that scenario is as optimistic if not moreso than trying to land Lebron and PG13 this summer. If they do whiff on 2018 free agents, hopefully Magic and Pelinka learn to be a bit more humble and don't trade assets for cap space without already holding a signed contract.
Anyway, the 2019 two max dream:
Ball
Klay/Hart
Ingram/Nasir Little (?)
Kuzma/Nance(?)
Jokic/Julius(?)/Zu or Bryant(?) |
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