Official MAGINKA Front Office Thread (Magic: "I built this team based on playoffs", p. 27)
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epak
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 7:47 am    Post subject:

Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 7:53 am    Post subject:

epak wrote:
Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!


I doubt they're looking to trade BI, if Kawhi really wants LA then they'll have an opportunity to meet with him in FA without giving up the young guys.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:18 am    Post subject:

PengShow wrote:
epak wrote:
Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!


I doubt they're looking to trade BI, if Kawhi really wants LA then they'll have an opportunity to meet with him in FA without giving up the young guys.


Yep. Patience is key.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:27 am    Post subject:

I for one can't wait for the season to start. I want to see how all these pieces fit together. Gonna be one heck of a ride!
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:34 am    Post subject:

justsomelakerfan wrote:
Judah wrote:
In response to whether or not LeBron is or has ever been the mentoring type:

ĒIím not promising a championship. I know how hard that is to deliver. Weíre not ready right now. No way. Of course, I want to win next year, but Iím realistic. It will be a long process, much longer than it was in 2010. My patience will get tested. I know that. Iím going into a situation with a young team and a new coach. I will be the old head. But I get a thrill out of bringing a group together and helping them reach a place they didnít know they could go. I see myself as a mentor now and Iím excited to lead some of these talented young guys. I think I can help Kyrie Irving become one of the best point guards in our league. I think I can help elevate Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters.Ē

^^This, obviously, is from his ĒIím Coming HomeĒ letter back in 2014.

ĒJames didn't have much of a relationship with Irving. They'd been together at Team USA training camp in 2012 and both were represented by Nike. But Irving was more drawn to Kobe Bryant, whom he idolized. Nonetheless, James believed he could succeed with Irving because of his immense talent, and he believed he could mentor him. James never sought much counsel from older players when he came to the NBA but had come to enjoy mentoring younger players, whether they wanted it or not. Most did, as James had been in the league eleven years and many young players had grown up as fans of him.Ē

^And this is an excerpt from Return Of The King: LeBron James, the Cleveland Cavaliers And The Greatest Comeback In NBA History by Windhorst and McMenamin.


Great find. I'm optimistic too. It's on the young core to deliver though - none of them are at a Kyrie Irving level of talent. These quotes fit perfectly for where the Lakers are currently at.


actually BI and Zo have Kyrie talent. They just dont have it all bottled up in one thing.

It's very difficult for people to see this in others. which is why this world is a world of Do one thing really well or we think you're not that good at anything. how does it go "jack of all trades, master of none." as if being a master of being a jack of all trades is not as deadly as being a master of one.

kyrie drops 30 on you. but with little to no defense. Kyrie's man has 25 points with a high fg%. Kyrie needed to outscore his guy (aka hero ball) in order to help his team win the game

Zo drops 12 on you with very good man defense and excellent team defense, with excellent playmaking. Zo's man defense/team defense and passes slowed his opponent down to a bad shooting percentage while also getting others heavily involved so their scoring averages went up this game.

The lakers are up the entire game, no need for hero ball.

BI does it all. similar to what i stated with zo but just more efficient scoring.

what Zo and BI do is not something that most nba guys CAN do. most of them can't do it. most of them dont have the IQ to be a floor general like BI and Zo. The other guys are born scorers so its very difficult for them to turn it on and off at the right times.
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splashmtn
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:36 am    Post subject:

PengShow wrote:
epak wrote:
Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!


I doubt they're looking to trade BI, if Kawhi really wants LA then they'll have an opportunity to meet with him in FA without giving up the young guys.
exactly, what I would tell KL is look. lebron is getting old real fast. This will be your team in a year or two max. Once that happens and bron calls it quits or goes some where to play with his son which is possible. Then you have a team ready to win rings right here because you kept these guys as they grew up vs trading away everyone just to get you. imagine that team, KL in his prime still, and all the kids still in their early to mid 20's.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:41 am    Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Who's the new director of analytics


The Lance Stephenson signing should tell you we dont have one.
lol.

analytics isnt always about stats from box scores like, 3point% or fg%. for all we know the stat people ran the numbers on lance and realized where he's most effective and now that he has a much reduced role they can make sure he's only shooting in those areas and at those times during the game. Stats can also look at why are you bricking so much? is it that you take a bunch of bad shots? or is it hat your talent does not put you in a position to be a star player but due to your lack of good teammates around you, you end up having to take star player shots which will result in bricks. now you dont have that issue anymore. all of a sudden LS could have a solid FG%.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:43 am    Post subject:

Nash Vegas wrote:
Magic rambling on natl TV on how to assemble a team to beat the Warriors and giving out his blueprint was a bit too much rambling.
but this is exactly what you laker fans asked for. you guys hated that jim and mitch would keep everything close to the vest(this is pre mosgov/deng signings.) you wanted to know "THE PLAN". i said back then, why tell the world your plan? doesnt make sense and has never been the MO of our FO even during Doc buss days. so now you have talking magic. he will tell you the entire plan or close to it. now you dont like that. so which way do you want it? close to the vest or tell all book? lol.
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governator
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:34 am    Post subject:

LAbron

plus the 1yr contracts:
KCP
McGee
Lance
Rondo
Beasley
Caruso
T.Wear

B+/A-
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LAII
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 11:13 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:

There is some of that. More generally, Magic's plan looks pretty stupid and amateurish to me...

I'm curious to see how this freak show of a team works out...If this team really accomplishes something, it will be because one of the kids makes a leap...


You first paragraph and subsequent comments are completely at odds with one another. Most Lakers fans are ecstatic we got the "greatest player in the world," and are pleased to evaluate the kids (having only given up Randle, Clarkson, and Nance to accomplish this) and have massive cap flexibility. Truly the only thing the Lakers didn't accomplish was ridding themselves of the Dang contract.
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Judah
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:45 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
PengShow wrote:
epak wrote:
Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!


I doubt they're looking to trade BI, if Kawhi really wants LA then they'll have an opportunity to meet with him in FA without giving up the young guys.


Yep. Patience is key.

I would also add that with Kawhi reportedly not being all that excited that LeBron is here now, that's all the more reason to not risk sacrificing any of the young players for him, especially BI. Itís not worth the risk of him walking as a free agent.

But hey, if Toronto is willing to accept a package centered around Zubac and Deng, Rob em, Magic.
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Last edited by Judah on Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:16 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:57 pm    Post subject:

A+

getting LAbron was superhit
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epak
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:21 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
epak wrote:
PengShow wrote:
epak wrote:
Magic and Rob have done a great job of getting rid of the old regime's players.
BI + Zubac + Deng for Kawhi and the transformation will be complete!


I doubt they're looking to trade BI, if Kawhi really wants LA then they'll have an opportunity to meet with him in FA without giving up the young guys.


Yep. Patience is key.

I would also add that with Kawhi reportedly not being all that excited that LeBron is here now, that's all the more reason to not risk sacrificing any of the young players for him, especially BI. Itís not worth the risk of him walking as a free agent.

But hey, if Toronto is willing to accept a package centered around Zubac and Deng, Rob em, Magic.



Yep, that's the hard part. Trying to filter legit info from non-legit info. Hard to tell from our standpoint. Imagine if we trade for Kawhi for a young'n and then Kawhi leaves next summer. That would be horrible--worse than if Kawhi just didn't come here next summer as FA.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:57 pm    Post subject:

LAII wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:

There is some of that. More generally, Magic's plan looks pretty stupid and amateurish to me...

I'm curious to see how this freak show of a team works out...If this team really accomplishes something, it will be because one of the kids makes a leap...


You first paragraph and subsequent comments are completely at odds with one another. Most Lakers fans are ecstatic we got the "greatest player in the world," and are pleased to evaluate the kids (having only given up Randle, Clarkson, and Nance to accomplish this) and have massive cap flexibility. Truly the only thing the Lakers didn't accomplish was ridding themselves of the Dang contract.


Thatís because you took those comments out of their original context. The first comment was referring to the commitment to a cap space strategy followed by the signing of stalwarts like McGee and Stephenson when we whiffed on Paul George. I donít perceive a genius master plan.

At this point, Iím talked out on the subject. Weíll see what happens at the trade deadline and next summer.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 7:38 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
LAII wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:

There is some of that. More generally, Magic's plan looks pretty stupid and amateurish to me...

I'm curious to see how this freak show of a team works out...If this team really accomplishes something, it will be because one of the kids makes a leap...


You first paragraph and subsequent comments are completely at odds with one another. Most Lakers fans are ecstatic we got the "greatest player in the world," and are pleased to evaluate the kids (having only given up Randle, Clarkson, and Nance to accomplish this) and have massive cap flexibility. Truly the only thing the Lakers didn't accomplish was ridding themselves of the Dang contract.


Thatís because you took those comments out of their original context. The first comment was referring to the commitment to a cap space strategy followed by the signing of stalwarts like McGee and Stephenson when we whiffed on Paul George. I donít perceive a genius master plan.

At this point, Iím talked out on the subject. Weíll see what happens at the trade deadline and next summer.


We didn't get PG and Maginka pivoted to keeping that cap space for 2019 when they can add another superstar without giving up any more of the young pieces.

Amateurish would have been simply throwing out deals to more qualified guys (on longer term deals) and then locking ourselves into a place where if our young guys don't bloom before LeBron retires in a few years, we would have never maximized LeBron.

Amateurish would have been overpaying for Kawhi who has health questions among other questions of staying long term. Again, giving away the kids to get a guy we don't know much about would have set us back years. Magic played in conservatively.

I would have done a couple small things differently but nothing that Magic has done feels stupid. He got the best player in the world, kept all of our kids (sans Julius) and has found a way to have enough cap space for another max player + $7MM beyond that. He's found a way to have the best player in the world, add another in prime superstar next summer, and still keep 2-4 potential future stars. That is how you build a SUSTAINABLE winner-- our window could be for the next 10+ years.

2018: LeBron - check
2019: KD, Klay, Kawhi, Butler, Cousins* - we're going to get one

LeBron/Wager
Kuzma
Ingram/Svi
Kawhi/Hart
Lonzo

will you complain about that core? If so, the Magic is as stupid and amateurish as you say.
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:10 pm    Post subject:

2019 wrote:
Aeneas Hunter wrote:
Thatís because you took those comments out of their original context. The first comment was referring to the commitment to a cap space strategy followed by the signing of stalwarts like McGee and Stephenson when we whiffed on Paul George. I donít perceive a genius master plan.

At this point, Iím talked out on the subject. Weíll see what happens at the trade deadline and next summer.


We didn't get PG and Maginka pivoted to keeping that cap space for 2019 when they can add another superstar without giving up any more of the young pieces.

Amateurish would have been simply throwing out deals to more qualified guys (on longer term deals) and then locking ourselves into a place where if our young guys don't bloom before LeBron retires in a few years, we would have never maximized LeBron.

Amateurish would have been overpaying for Kawhi who has health questions among other questions of staying long term. Again, giving away the kids to get a guy we don't know much about would have set us back years. Magic played in conservatively.

I would have done a couple small things differently but nothing that Magic has done feels stupid. He got the best player in the world, kept all of our kids (sans Julius) and has found a way to have enough cap space for another max player + $7MM beyond that. He's found a way to have the best player in the world, add another in prime superstar next summer, and still keep 2-4 potential future stars. That is how you build a SUSTAINABLE winner-- our window could be for the next 10+ years.

2018: LeBron - check
2019: KD, Klay, Kawhi, Butler, Cousins* - we're going to get one

LeBron/Wager
Kuzma
Ingram/Svi
Kawhi/Hart
Lonzo

will you complain about that core? If so, the Magic is as stupid and amateurish as you say.


I addressed most of this last week. If you feel the urge, then you (like the other poster) can go back and read stuff that I wrote last week. I am talked out on the subject and don't feel motivated to repeat myself.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:51 pm    Post subject:

After signing LeBron, it's been an interesting mix in building the roster with veterans on one-year deals as bridge players for that transition period between rebuild and contention. Rondo makes sense from a mentor standpoint. Hart will be challenged by KCP. We'll see what the young players will learn from the other veterans.

Luke is gonna have a lot on his hands figuring out the rotation. He'll have to balance the continued development of the young players, especially with fewer minutes available compared to last season for some of them, as well as figuring out the right match-up combinations on the floor. This season may see some separation between the young players in terms of who is regarded as truly untouchable.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:45 pm    Post subject:

Just thinking about what Magic and Rob have done so far with what they had... really outstanding job!
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:55 am    Post subject:

mookielala wrote:
Just thinking about what Magic and Rob have done so far with what they had... really outstanding job!


They just signed LeBron James, and they literally might sign kawhi Leonard next summer. Just an unbelievable turn around.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 6:59 am    Post subject:

Ranking the 10 best front offices in the NBA

1. Golden State
2. Boston
3. Houston
4. Toronto
5. Utah
6. San Antonio
7. Oklahoma City
8. LA Clippers
9. Indiana
10. LA Lakers

LINK
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:21 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Ranking the 10 best front offices in the NBA

1. Golden State
2. Boston
3. Houston
4. Toronto
5. Utah
6. San Antonio
7. Oklahoma City
8. LA Clippers
9. Indiana
10. LA Lakers

LINK


That would be more interesting if the author had consistent criteria. My criteria would be success over a period of time and an established ability to rebuild or retool. At the moment, the gold standard is the Spurs and the Celtics, followed by the Rockets. As for teams like the Warriors, remember that Joe Dumars was once hailed as a genius. He did it once, but then flopped.
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:32 am    Post subject:

Indiana lucks out on oladipo suddenly they're a top 10 FO
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2018 5:44 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
adkindo wrote:
Ranking the 10 best front offices in the NBA

1. Golden State
2. Boston
3. Houston
4. Toronto
5. Utah
6. San Antonio
7. Oklahoma City
8. LA Clippers
9. Indiana
10. LA Lakers

LINK


That would be more interesting if the author had consistent criteria. My criteria would be success over a period of time and an established ability to rebuild or retool. At the moment, the gold standard is the Spurs and the Celtics, followed by the Rockets. As for teams like the Warriors, remember that Joe Dumars was once hailed as a genius. He did it once, but then flopped.


We we must remember we started out at the bottom of the trash heap with Jim Buss leading the way. Praise God Jeanie finally pulled the trigger which had to be tough. But hiring Magic and Rob was also a great move.

The Laker organization has become top flight especially when you add in the coaching staff. What is most impressive is that Magic and Rob took a terrible had with to incredibly stupid deals of Deng and Mosgov and turned around the entire situation for the Lakers.

Despite the position Jim Buss left the team in:

We were in a position to sign a big a big time free agent
We did sign a big time free agent the best player of all time arguable
We are in a position to sign another one next year
We are the talk of the league, at least the buzz is back
We will be a prime destination next year. They may fight for our spot.

It is quite amazing that we are were we are.

Plus we draft really well late in the draft. High in the draft so so thinking DLO only right now.

We have great integration with our G League team and it will get better this year.

We have done a great job of player development from a training, diet and coaching perspective.

Jeanie Buss has a chance to go down as a great owner because she pulled the trigger and had a vision for the franchise.

I see the ranking of 10 but I think that is because we are still climbing out of the hole but make not mistake that ranking is way off. Our front office will be recognized and respected again around the league and the Lakers will be the model franchise again as they should be.
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2018 6:19 am    Post subject:

oldlakerfan wrote:
I see the ranking of 10 but I think that is because we are still climbing out of the hole but make not mistake that ranking is way off. Our front office will be recognized and respected again around the league and the Lakers will be the model franchise again as they should be.


In my book, you become a great front office by achieving things, not by talking about how you are going to achieve things. I would put the front offices around the league into four tiers. I am doing this off the cuff, without looking up each team to see whether the current front office is the same group that accomplished the results. If I took the time, I would probably make some adjustments.

Tier I: Front offices that have won titles or produced contending teams over an extended period of time, including at least one period of successful retooling or rebuilding. This is not about winning titles, per se, and it certainly is not about ring counting. That's for players and coaches. This is about showing that you can build contenders and that you are not just a fluke like Joe Dumars.

1. San Antonio (Buford/Popovich)

2. Boston (Ainge)

3. Miami (Riley)

4. Houston (Morey)

Tier II: Front offices that have won a title or that have produced contending teams, but have not yet showed that they can sustain it. In other words, you haven't proven that aren't just another Joe Dumars.

5. Golden State

6. OKC

7. Dallas

8. Cleveland

Tier III: Front offices that have built a solid, sustainable playoff team at least once

Philadelphia, Toronto, Portland, Utah, Clippers

Tier IV: Front offices that have achieved nothing yet

Everyone else, including the Lakers

Note that the Lakers could jump several tiers this year. However, in my book, you don't move up the tiers by talking a good game or by signing a big free agent. You move up the tiers by producing results. The results don't have to include a title -- that's for the players and coaches. But you have to assemble the players and coaches who can seriously contend.
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 04, 2018 6:24 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
I see the ranking of 10 but I think that is because we are still climbing out of the hole but make not mistake that ranking is way off. Our front office will be recognized and respected again around the league and the Lakers will be the model franchise again as they should be.


In my book, you become a great front office by achieving things, not by talking about how you are going to achieve things. I would put the front offices around the league into four tiers. I am doing this off the cuff, without looking up each team to see whether the current front office is the same group that accomplished the results. If I took the time, I would probably make some adjustments.

Tier I: Front offices that have won titles or produced contending teams over an extended period of time, including at least one period of successful retooling or rebuilding. This is not about winning titles, per se, and it certainly is not about ring counting. That's for players and coaches. This is about showing that you can build contenders and that you are not just a fluke like Joe Dumars.

1. San Antonio (Buford/Popovich)

2. Boston (Ainge)

3. Miami (Riley)

4. Houston (Morey)

Tier II: Front offices that have won a title or that have produced contending teams, but have not yet showed that they can sustain it. In other words, you haven't proven that aren't just another Joe Dumars.

5. Golden State

6. OKC

7. Dallas

8. Cleveland

Tier III: Front offices that have built a solid, sustainable playoff team at least once

Philadelphia, Toronto, Portland, Utah, Clippers

Tier IV: Front offices that have achieved nothing yet

Everyone else, including the Lakers

Note that the Lakers could jump several tiers this year. However, in my book, you don't move up the tiers by talking a good game or by signing a big free agent. You move up the tiers by producing results. The results don't have to include a title -- that's for the players and coaches. But you have to assemble the players and coaches who can seriously contend.


Where would you put Mitch/Jimmy (assuming Mitch/Jerry was tier 1)?
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