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Megaton
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 Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:52 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | Remember we were a blistering 10-10 last year, then injuries derailed the season, particularly b/c Luke wants to keep 2 units separate.
Hopefully the injury bug doesn't strike again (though Nance...ouch). |
The difference between last year's 10-10 team and this team so far is the defense from last year's team was abysmal even at its best. This year we have a top 10 defense thus far.
We're much better than 5-5. 7-3 if not for bad rotations that cost the game, and 8-2 if Lillard didn't break our hearts.  |
Indeed. But if we suffered the same back breaking injuries (remember at one point our entire starting backcourt, Nance, Jules were out?), there's not too much you can do. I agree that there seems to be a sustainable defensive blueprint here. |
The thing with Nance out is that the guy that replaced him is the one that should have been starting in the first place. Last year if Randle or Nance were out, it was replaced with an inferior player. Same with DLO or Randle out, replaced with an inferior player and our team got worse.
Now Nance got hurt, we got Kuzma. If KCP's injury was more serious, we got Clarkson. However if Lonzo, Ingram or Brook got hurt.... 
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:53 am Post subject: |
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We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception.
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Megaton
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now. 
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:57 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it.
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epak
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:58 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it. |
Can you sign someone to a 1 year room exception? |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it. |
Can you sign someone to a 1 year room exception? |
Yes. I believe it can be up to 2 years.
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Megaton
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:04 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it. |
And just to add more salt to the wound, guess who's killing it in Europe?
Matt Thomas: 16 ppg, 59% FG, 62% 3P, 92% FT.
Cold as Ice Thomas is still do this day killing it from deep. The real player that should have gotten the two way contract.
Him over Brewer and Ennis easily at least. 
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epak
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:05 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it. |
And just to add more salt to the wound, guess who's killing it in Europe?
Matt Thomas: 16 ppg, 59% FG, 62% 3P, 92% FT.
Cold as Ice Thomas is still do this day killing it from deep. The real player that should have gotten the two way contract.
Him over Brewer and Ennis easily at least. |
Definitely a shooter.
But our defense wouldn't be top 10 IMO. Cuz he has no defense. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:13 am Post subject: |
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I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three best shooters in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our offense efficiency has suffered to the point we are #27 in the league. Similarly, I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three worst defenders in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our defensive efficiency has improved to the point that we are tied for #6 in the league currently.
Just goes to show you how truly valuable a 3 and D player is, and why KCP was such a good get assuming he can continue his upswing with his 3pt shooting. Hart needs to watch KCP and take notices. If Hart can one day get his 3pt shot to around the 40% mark, become another Danny Green, he'd have such a great career.
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Megaton
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:14 am Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
Yeah. We still have the room exception just in case. Not sure Ennis/Caruso will cut it. |
And just to add more salt to the wound, guess who's killing it in Europe?
Matt Thomas: 16 ppg, 59% FG, 62% 3P, 92% FT.
Cold as Ice Thomas is still do this day killing it from deep. The real player that should have gotten the two way contract.
Him over Brewer and Ennis easily at least. |
Definitely a shooter.
But our defense wouldn't be top 10 IMO. Cuz he has no defense. |
A guy playing 10-12 min a game would suddenly drop our defensive rating from 7 to out of the top ten? I'm gonna have to strongly disagree with you sir. Especially when Ennis has never heard of that word defense. Or current Corey Brewer right now who likes to foul people from full court now.
That and Thomas making more shots = more time for our defense to be set and engaged in transition and half court.
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12
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:17 am Post subject: |
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| Man.. if we didnt blow away that huge lead against Utah and if Lillard didnt make that ridiculous 3 at the buzzer, we might have been 7-3. |
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epak
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:19 am Post subject: |
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Here's the current TPA model for the Lakers:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DN9RaFXUIAAnuDC.jpg:large
1. Is TPA a good model?
2. If so, Brook and Larry seem like the positives on both sides of the floor.
3. BTW, someone tell me if i'm reading it incorrectly.
Last edited by epak on Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:28 am; edited 1 time in total |
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epak
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:23 am Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: |
A guy playing 10-12 min a game would suddenly drop our defensive rating from 7 to out of the top ten? I'm gonna have to strongly disagree with you sir. Especially when Ennis has never heard of that word defense. Or current Corey Brewer right now who likes to foul people from full court now.
That and Thomas making more shots = more time for our defense to be set and engaged in transition and half court. |
10-12 minutes of Matt... at the SG or SF spot?
Not at PG, so I dont even look at the Ennis comparison. But Corey? I think Corey does some decent defense with effort.
No doubt Matt would be awesome at hitting the open 3s that the Lakers havent been able to do. For me, I guess i would say it's not a given that having Matt in there for the Brewer minutes equates to a net positive. |
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Roon
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:10 am Post subject: |
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| epak wrote: | | Megaton wrote: |
A guy playing 10-12 min a game would suddenly drop our defensive rating from 7 to out of the top ten? I'm gonna have to strongly disagree with you sir. Especially when Ennis has never heard of that word defense. Or current Corey Brewer right now who likes to foul people from full court now.
That and Thomas making more shots = more time for our defense to be set and engaged in transition and half court. |
10-12 minutes of Matt... at the SG or SF spot?
Not at PG, so I dont even look at the Ennis comparison. But Corey? I think Corey does some decent defense with effort.
No doubt Matt would be awesome at hitting the open 3s that the Lakers havent been able to do. For me, I guess i would say it's not a given that having Matt in there for the Brewer minutes equates to a net positive. |
Brewer probably offers a lot more off the court as well. He's been around the block. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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Fun fact for everyone: we are averaging 10 possessions more per game than the 2005-2006 Suns. Whereas we are 3rd in pace, that Suns team - yes, the same 7 seconds or less team - would be dead last in pace if they played in today's NBA.
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Dr. Funkbot
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Megaton wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | We still have a shaky backup situation if Lonzo is out. He's only 19 so I was surprised we didn't get a more established backup PG with the room exception. |
Ennis is such garbage. I'd rather have Vander Blue replace him. He's actually passing more now.
Surprised we didn't go after Jameer Nelson like the Pelicans did. He would have been great for 8-12 mins. |
JC is our back up PG, IMO he has been much better as a 1 than a 2. Then you have Hart and KCP at SG.
I don't know if you saw Ennis' last game, but he got 10 in very limited minutes, looked great out there.
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Dr. Funkbot
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| Posted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:00 pm Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three best shooters in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our offense efficiency has suffered to the point we are #27 in the league. Similarly, I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three worst defenders in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our defensive efficiency has improved to the point that we are tied for #6 in the league currently.
Just goes to show you how truly valuable a 3 and D player is, and why KCP was such a good get assuming he can continue his upswing with his 3pt shooting. Hart needs to watch KCP and take notices. If Hart can one day get his 3pt shot to around the 40% mark, become another Danny Green, he'd have such a great career. |
Yeah man, the difference is night and day with our roster turn over. Kudos to the new FO. I would much rather have a team full of good defenders than a team of good shooters. The shooting comes and goes but the D is always there.
And there are many cases where a good defender developed a decent 3 point shot. I can't think of too many non-defenders who became good defenders later in there careers.
I think that Hart will get that shot down.
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pio2u
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tox
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:14 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three best shooters in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our offense efficiency has suffered to the point we are #27 in the league. Similarly, I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three worst defenders in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our defensive efficiency has improved to the point that we are tied for #6 in the league currently.
Just goes to show you how truly valuable a 3 and D player is, and why KCP was such a good get assuming he can continue his upswing with his 3pt shooting. Hart needs to watch KCP and take notices. If Hart can one day get his 3pt shot to around the 40% mark, become another Danny Green, he'd have such a great career. |
Our worst defenders last year were probably Randle and Clarkson. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:22 am Post subject: |
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| tox wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three best shooters in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our offense efficiency has suffered to the point we are #27 in the league. Similarly, I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three worst defenders in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our defensive efficiency has improved to the point that we are tied for #6 in the league currently.
Just goes to show you how truly valuable a 3 and D player is, and why KCP was such a good get assuming he can continue his upswing with his 3pt shooting. Hart needs to watch KCP and take notices. If Hart can one day get his 3pt shot to around the 40% mark, become another Danny Green, he'd have such a great career. |
Our worst defenders last year were probably Randle and Clarkson. |
I think there is a correlation between poor perimeter defense and poor interior defense. I think if your perimeter defense is poor, everything else falls apart much more easily. While Randle has clearly done a 180 defensively, I think he was made to look even worse than he actually was because we had such poor defenders on the perimeter.
As for Clarkson, that's probably true, so add him and say its our four worst defenders. The point remains the same.
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tox
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:37 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: | | tox wrote: | | LakerSanity wrote: | I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three best shooters in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our offense efficiency has suffered to the point we are #27 in the league. Similarly, I don't think its a coincidence that we lost our three worst defenders in Russell, Young and Lou, and that our defensive efficiency has improved to the point that we are tied for #6 in the league currently.
Just goes to show you how truly valuable a 3 and D player is, and why KCP was such a good get assuming he can continue his upswing with his 3pt shooting. Hart needs to watch KCP and take notices. If Hart can one day get his 3pt shot to around the 40% mark, become another Danny Green, he'd have such a great career. |
Our worst defenders last year were probably Randle and Clarkson. |
I think there is a correlation between poor perimeter defense and poor interior defense. I think if your perimeter defense is poor, everything else falls apart much more easily. While Randle has clearly done a 180 defensively, I think he was made to look even worse than he actually was because we had such poor defenders on the perimeter.
As for Clarkson, that's probably true, so add him and say its our four worst defenders. The point remains the same. |
I really don't think so. Julius was the obvious weak link with our starters last year. Replace him with Tarik or Larry and the starters became borderline elite, though in only about 80-100 min. That's my litmus test for whether it's the player himself or the team around him.
But yeah I do agree with the general point. We've lost some of our worst defenders. But I'd also emphasize that some of our other worst defenders improved. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 11:39 am Post subject: |
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^No doubt re: improvement too. I'll say Randle sucked defensively last year and has obviously improved - thus my 180 comment. However, I think while his improvement may be the most stark from an individual standpoint, from a team standpoint, I think our improvement in perimeter defense due to the change of the guards has had the most teamwide impact.
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70sdude
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Yeah, coming into the preseason there were concerns about how the Lakers seemed poorly built in terms of 3P%, both for and against. The concerns were well founded, to this point. The Laker defense is looking better in other ways, so given time (i.e., player development and seasoning, an acquisition of a deep range sharpshooter), the 3P-related improvements may come. I can wait. |
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epak
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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| 70sdude wrote: | | Yeah, coming into the preseason there were concerns about how the Lakers seemed poorly built in terms of 3P%, both for and against. The concerns were well founded, to this point. The Laker defense is looking better in other ways, so given time (i.e., player development and seasoning, an acquisition of a deep range sharpshooter), the 3P-related improvements may come. I can wait. |
After 10 games, 3pt %:
Lopez: 40% (4.5 3pa)
JC: 39.3% (2.8 3pa)
BI: 38.9% (1.8 3pa)
Kuzma: 33.3% (3.9 3pa)
KCP: 31.4% (4.4 3pa)
Lonzo: 23.4% (4.7 3pa)
Hart: 22.2% (1.0 3pa)
I think if KCP and Lonzo either make more 3s, or take less 3s, their 3pt average will be in a good place. Hopefully the former happens.
I'm loving Lopez's and JC's numbers on 3s. |
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Tue Nov 07, 2017 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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^KCP has shot 35% from 3 over the last 4 games. He shot 35% from 3 last year as a whole, and shot 40% from 3 for half the year last year before he got injured. I think his 3pt numbers will pick up as we go along. Seems he just needed to get more comfortable and used to playing here, much like Lopez.
I think Hart's 3pt shot will improve as he gets used to the NBA 3 and just gains some more confidence. While I think Hart's improvement from the 3pt line will gradually come this season, I'm not so confident to say the same for Ball. Looking at GT's analysis in his video, I'm persuaded that Ball needs to rework his footwork. Its unlikely that can happen in the middle of the season and likely needs an offseason to address it. However, still, Ball needs to keep shooting - even if he makes 30% (as opposed to 23.4%) while taking 3-4 a game, that's enough to help us with spacing while him taking no 3s would be detrimental to spacing (even if he shoots a low %).
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