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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | adkindo wrote: | PG13 wrote: | That guy had 0 post game and was way slower than Mo |
Pittsnogle had a lot of good post moves...his feet were good for 6'11" and he could go over both shoulders. |
As good as okafor? |
in the post on offense...no, nor is Wagner |
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mixtim Starting Rotation
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 965
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | ChickenStu wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Here’s something to cheer you guys up: The guy most of you guys wanted DiVincenzo... didn’t make Bucks fan happy when the Bucks drafted him, so there will always be doubters no matter who the guy is. |
Yeah they missed Huerter and Hutchison.
They still got a dude that could shoot and defend. I don't see what the issue is. |
They didn’t think he was the best player Available just like Laker fans didn’t think Wagner was the best player available... that means both fan bases need to give there guy a chance to prove himself. |
I think if you had a list of guys that you want at that pick, he's the Top 3-5.
I think Wagner is easily there at 39. How long is the list for the Lakers?
They had several seasons to prove themselves just to get to the draft too. |
I don't think Wagner would've been there at 39. |
All of the mock drafts had him,at worst,in the first round,yet now,all of a sudden,he should have been there at 39 |
that is a very false statement |
Prove it |
Basketball Insider - Avg. #36
CBS Sports - Unlisted in 1st Round
Net Scouts - #45
Bleacher Report - #37
USA Today - unlisted in 1st Round
Sports Illustrated - #40
The Ringer - #34 |
That's formalism,wich doesn't change a zilch of the substance
It has been said that Wagner would have been there at 39
Well,who had him at 39 or beyond? |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | epak wrote: | adkindo wrote: | PG13 wrote: | That guy had 0 post game and was way slower than Mo |
Pittsnogle had a lot of good post moves...his feet were good for 6'11" and he could go over both shoulders. |
As good as okafor? |
in the post on offense...no, nor is Wagner |
Thank goodness, cuz okafor doesn't seem to be having a good time in the league. |
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LakersMD Star Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2003 Posts: 8014
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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Pittsnogle had nowhere near the mobility or ball skills that Wagner has. The comparison ends at being tall, capable of shooting and playing for the same coach. |
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Laker's Fan Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002 Posts: 12813
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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DancingBarry wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | The interviews with Walton and Pelinka emphasize shooting and intangibles. It gave me the impression of drafting for fit rather than BPA; and the Lakers had both in all of their prospects last year.
But, they really love having great personalities in the locker room while taking basketball seriously. That goes for all of the guys last season too. |
Yeah the Walton interview raised an eyebrow when I heard it. Definitely gave the impression of a change in approach. Maybe we’ll have more details when we’re in Vegas. |
Is there a meetup or something
I think Mo was a Magic pick whereas last year Zo was his pick while Buss and his team did the drafting late. I think Magic had his eyes on Mo for months based on something he said about talented prospects in Michigan earlier in the year. If you filter for shooting, basketball IQ and the ability to step in and contribute minutes right away, that's a pretty short list at #25. Definitely as much a fit pick as anything.
I'm normally not ok with that, but if we land James guys with those qualities are the ones who will see the court. Clearing cap space means we need more of that from our picks next season. _________________ Austin Reaves keeps his game tight, like Kobe Bryant on game night. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | ChickenStu wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Here’s something to cheer you guys up: The guy most of you guys wanted DiVincenzo... didn’t make Bucks fan happy when the Bucks drafted him, so there will always be doubters no matter who the guy is. |
Yeah they missed Huerter and Hutchison.
They still got a dude that could shoot and defend. I don't see what the issue is. |
They didn’t think he was the best player Available just like Laker fans didn’t think Wagner was the best player available... that means both fan bases need to give there guy a chance to prove himself. |
I think if you had a list of guys that you want at that pick, he's the Top 3-5.
I think Wagner is easily there at 39. How long is the list for the Lakers?
They had several seasons to prove themselves just to get to the draft too. |
I don't think Wagner would've been there at 39. |
All of the mock drafts had him,at worst,in the first round,yet now,all of a sudden,he should have been there at 39 |
that is a very false statement |
Prove it |
Basketball Insider - Avg. #36
CBS Sports - Unlisted in 1st Round
Net Scouts - #45
Bleacher Report - #37
USA Today - unlisted in 1st Round
Sports Illustrated - #40
The Ringer - #34 |
That's formalism,wich doesn't change a zilch of the substance
It has been said that Wagner would have been there at 39
Well,who had him at 39 or beyond? |
guy, you made a false claim that "All of the mock drafts had him,at worst,in the first round"...I gave you 7 different Mocks that are included in NBA.com's Consensus Mock Draft that proves you absolutely made a false statement. You can say you were incorrect, or you say nothing at all.....but stop with the silly formalism stuff. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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LakersMD wrote: | Pittsnogle had nowhere near the mobility or ball skills that Wagner has. The comparison ends at being tall, capable of shooting and playing for the same coach. |
you go with what you believe....I am sure you know much more about Pittsnogle's game than I do. |
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PlantedTanks Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017 Posts: 3156
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:32 pm Post subject: |
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mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | ChickenStu wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Here’s something to cheer you guys up: The guy most of you guys wanted DiVincenzo... didn’t make Bucks fan happy when the Bucks drafted him, so there will always be doubters no matter who the guy is. |
Yeah they missed Huerter and Hutchison.
They still got a dude that could shoot and defend. I don't see what the issue is. |
They didn’t think he was the best player Available just like Laker fans didn’t think Wagner was the best player available... that means both fan bases need to give there guy a chance to prove himself. |
I think if you had a list of guys that you want at that pick, he's the Top 3-5.
I think Wagner is easily there at 39. How long is the list for the Lakers?
They had several seasons to prove themselves just to get to the draft too. |
I don't think Wagner would've been there at 39. |
All of the mock drafts had him,at worst,in the first round,yet now,all of a sudden,he should have been there at 39 |
that is a very false statement |
Prove it |
Basketball Insider - Avg. #36
CBS Sports - Unlisted in 1st Round
Net Scouts - #45
Bleacher Report - #37
USA Today - unlisted in 1st Round
Sports Illustrated - #40
The Ringer - #34 |
That's formalism,wich doesn't change a zilch of the substance
It has been said that Wagner would have been there at 39
Well,who had him at 39 or beyond? |
Mock drafts, prospect rankings are a useful guide but generally provides very little factual substance outside the top 5. Look at the diverse rank/mock for Javon Carter in the list above. Keita Bates Diop was mocked in the 1st a number of times but fell to 48.
Statements such as Wagner would have been available at 39 is not even an educated guess but simply a unpredictable guess as the draft is unpredictable in and of itself. |
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PlantedTanks Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017 Posts: 3156
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Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 11:48 pm Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | LakersMD wrote: | Pittsnogle had nowhere near the mobility or ball skills that Wagner has. The comparison ends at being tall, capable of shooting and playing for the same coach. |
you go with what you believe....I am sure you know much more about Pittsnogle's game than I do. |
If you feel Wagner is Pittsnogle's you should qualify by saying a modern NBA Pittsnogle.
Someone well conditioned, more muscle mass with better quickness and speed. Able to handle the ball, dribble dirve with spin moves and body control and finish.
Maybe if Pitts was exposed to a strength and conditioning program and skills training like most prospects have been for multi years he may have had an NBA career. |
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DeeAgeaux Star Player
Joined: 11 Apr 2009 Posts: 1652
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:00 am Post subject: |
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PlantedTanks wrote: | adkindo wrote: | LakersMD wrote: | Pittsnogle had nowhere near the mobility or ball skills that Wagner has. The comparison ends at being tall, capable of shooting and playing for the same coach. |
you go with what you believe....I am sure you know much more about Pittsnogle's game than I do. |
If you feel Wagner is Pittsnogle's you should qualify by saying a modern NBA Pittsnogle.
Someone well conditioned, more muscle mass with better quickness and speed. Able to handle the ball, dribble dirve with spin moves and body control and finish.
Maybe if Pitts was exposed to a strength and conditioning program and skills training like most prospects have been for multi years he may have had an NBA career. |
I am not diving into a debate about Pittsnogle....it is pissing in the wind....it was over a decade ago with not a great amount of film to substantiate any position. I feel very comfortable that my knowledge and recollection of Pittsnogle's game supersedes others on LG....and I am good with that. |
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GonzagaAlum Star Player
Joined: 09 Dec 2005 Posts: 3021
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:00 am Post subject: |
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Most mocks make it clear they had to get him then if they were going to get him. Not every year will a team like the jazz do what the Lakers did with hart last year. _________________ How can I get a copy of a Laker game played on Sunday, March 11, 2001 Sonics/Lakers? If you know PM me please
I would be willing to pay you for it. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:01 am Post subject: |
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have not seen anything about Billy Preston being picked up....we did not work him out, correct? Would like to take a look at him in summer league. |
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PlantedTanks Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017 Posts: 3156
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:13 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | PlantedTanks wrote: | adkindo wrote: | LakersMD wrote: | Pittsnogle had nowhere near the mobility or ball skills that Wagner has. The comparison ends at being tall, capable of shooting and playing for the same coach. |
you go with what you believe....I am sure you know much more about Pittsnogle's game than I do. |
If you feel Wagner is Pittsnogle's you should qualify by saying a modern NBA Pittsnogle.
Someone well conditioned, more muscle mass with better quickness and speed. Able to handle the ball, dribble dirve with spin moves and body control and finish.
Maybe if Pitts was exposed to a strength and conditioning program and skills training like most prospects have been for multi years he may have had an NBA career. |
I am not diving into a debate about Pittsnogle....it is pissing in the wind....it was over a decade ago with not a great amount of film to substantiate any position. I feel very comfortable that my knowledge and recollection of Pittsnogle's game supersedes others on LG....and I am good with that. |
Yeah I don't doubt your knowledge of Pittsnogle is superior to mine but if you don't see the difference in body type and additional skill set beyond shooting that Wagner possesses then not much more to say.
I do remember that WVU team primarily due to Mike Gansey. I thought he could play in the NBA but it just never materialized. |
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LonzoLegend2 Starting Rotation
Joined: 05 Aug 2017 Posts: 680
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 12:32 am Post subject: |
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Worst draft ever since the Caracter/Ebanks fiasco...boom or bust with free agency now . |
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Runway8 Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Posts: 22734 Location: La Jolla, San Diego
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:24 am Post subject: |
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LonzoLegend2 wrote: | Worst draft ever since the Caracter/Ebanks fiasco...boom or bust with free agency now . |
One guy was in the 40's, and the other guy was in the 50's if I recall correctly. Yeah, what a fiasco! A fiasco is Darko at #2, Anthony Bennet #1. |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 1:30 am Post subject: |
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Reading the immediate reaction of Wagner being drafted (from page 424-428) is absolutely comical (and disappointing). It just goes to show you how programmed we men are into being emotional, fanatical shrills. What happened to the days when men measured their thoughts before speaking.
I’m sorry. Carry on. _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter.
Last edited by Joe Pesci on Sat Jun 23, 2018 2:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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lakersfan8 Star Player
Joined: 27 May 2014 Posts: 2991
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 3:25 am Post subject: |
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My thought:
1. It is obvious Lakers was drafting for fit rather than BPA. This is usually the strategy for contending team, so it shows how our front office is confident signing two max free agents.
2. I still think plan A was to trade up or send Deng away with the picks. I am disappointed that neither of that happened. The free agency market doesn't have many good quality PG and it would be great if we could get Holiday on the second unit. Personally, I think trading a pick that is so far ahead is a risky move and now if we have to attach 2 1st round picks to facilitate a Deng trade, it has to be 2021. Not saying I don't like Wagner, it is just I would prefer something else happened. |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 3:40 am Post subject: |
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Derrick Caracter
Lane Agility drill 12.78
3/4 Court Sprint 3.61
3 point percentage... 27% on 15 shots
Moe Wagner
Lane Agility drill 11.48
3/4 Court Sprint 3.18
3 point percentage... 39% on 160 shots
Devin Ebanks
Lane Agility drill 11.69
3/4 Court Sprint 3.25
3 point percentage... 10% on 30 shots
Svi Mykhailiuk
Lane Agility drill 11.25
3/4 Court Sprint 3.15
3 point percentage... 44% on 259 shots
Of course with the advancement in training techniques and medical science over the last eight years... (sarcastic, just in case) you never know what they might have achieved in the modern era... but our center ran faster and was more agile than the perimeter player.
Some successful players from 2010 just for comparison.
Hassan Whiteside
Lane Agility drill 11.83
3/4 Court Sprint 3.54
John Wall
Lane Agility drill 10.84
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 33% on 114 shots
Gordon Hayward
Lane Agility drill 11.73
3/4 Court Sprint 3.22
3 pt. Percentage 29% on 160 shots
Avery Bradley
Lane Agility drill 11.47
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 38% on 112 shots
DeMarcus Cousins
Lane Agility drill 11.40
3/4 Court Sprint 3.55
Greg Monroe
Lane Agility drill 12.10
3/4 Court Sprint 3.35
Moe is faster than all the centers though not as agile as Boogie was
Svi runs straight ahead pretty much at the same speed as John Wall
Moe's agility number is the same as Avery Bradley.
They both shoot better than any of those 2010 prospects who became successful players.
I'm not saying they will 100% succeed but it is likely they will do better than Caracter or Ebanks. |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:06 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | I woke up this morning.....and it felt like one of those mornings where something bad happened the previous day, and you realize it was not just a bad dream. Yeah, I am not happy about our draft. I feel like the FO must see an entirely different NBA than the one I have watched evolve in recent years. The most valuable players/assets in the NBA are 2 Way perimeter players, and we finished the night adding zero....when we could have added 3 with that potential.
Wagner is a solid basketball player...has been the last couple years @ Michigan. In my opinion, he has been Beilein's latest version of Kevin Pittsnogle (WVU 2002-06)...a 6'11" guy that struggles on defense, cannot defend the rim, but can shoot the long ball. While Wagner is the latest version, I do not think he was as good as Pittsnogle. Pittsnogle averaged almost 20 Points his last season, while Wagner averaged less than 15. Pittsnogle was a career 41% shooter from 3...while Wagner shot 38% from 3 at Michigan on a much lower volume. Kevin Pittsnogle played 0 NBA Games and is an elementary school gym teacher in Fairmont, WV.
Wagner is a Michigan player that looked good on offense.....do you know how dangerous that is to draft? John Beilein is an offensive genius who routinely has been able to make good players look great. He took a WVU team lead by Pittsnogle and Mike Gansey to the Elite 8 and the Sweet 16 the following year....not one single player played in the NBA from that squad. Look at some of the guys he has had at Michigan that have been drafted....Ekpe Udoh (1st Rd. #6), Darius Morris (2nd Rd.), Trey Burke (1st Rd. #9), Glenn Robinson (2nd Rd.), Nik Stauskas (1st Rd. #8), Mitch McGary (1st Rd. #21). Caris LeVert (1st Rd. #20), D.J. Wilson (1st Rd. #17), and Tim Hardaway Jr. (1st Rd. #24).....outside of Hardaway, see a trend? All guys that Beilein was able to make look like great players @ Michigan that have never been able to continue success near that level in the NBA. It is a tough task to take a player coached by John Beilein and make them look as good as he did....
I have tried to think of every angle that may make our picks make sense to me....from maybe they know we are signing major FA's, and just wanted some good dudes in the locker room....to maybe Pelinka demanded a Michigan Man....but I came up with nothing that made sense. I just watched the last two years of playoffs where guys with similar skill makeups of Wagner and Svi are near unplayable.
I believe we will be one of several teams that will regret passing on Jevon Carter....and I can live with that.....but I fear we may also regret passing on 5 or more other guys....guys that can defend multiple positions, that have versatile 2 Way ability.....that are more built for the NBA in 2018. I wish our new guys well, and hope I have to admit how wrong I was someday.
....wanted to get the full vent out so I would hopefully not allow the negativity to linger for days. |
All of this. _________________ Under New Management |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:08 am Post subject: |
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mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | adkindo wrote: | mixtim wrote: | ChickenStu wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Here’s something to cheer you guys up: The guy most of you guys wanted DiVincenzo... didn’t make Bucks fan happy when the Bucks drafted him, so there will always be doubters no matter who the guy is. |
Yeah they missed Huerter and Hutchison.
They still got a dude that could shoot and defend. I don't see what the issue is. |
They didn’t think he was the best player Available just like Laker fans didn’t think Wagner was the best player available... that means both fan bases need to give there guy a chance to prove himself. |
I think if you had a list of guys that you want at that pick, he's the Top 3-5.
I think Wagner is easily there at 39. How long is the list for the Lakers?
They had several seasons to prove themselves just to get to the draft too. |
I don't think Wagner would've been there at 39. |
All of the mock drafts had him,at worst,in the first round,yet now,all of a sudden,he should have been there at 39 |
that is a very false statement |
Prove it |
Basketball Insider - Avg. #36
CBS Sports - Unlisted in 1st Round
Net Scouts - #45
Bleacher Report - #37
USA Today - unlisted in 1st Round
Sports Illustrated - #40
The Ringer - #34 |
That's formalism,wich doesn't change a zilch of the substance
It has been said that Wagner would have been there at 39
Well,who had him at 39 or beyond? |
This is stunted. Stop trolling. _________________ Under New Management |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:10 am Post subject: |
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Sentient Meat wrote: | Derrick Caracter
Lane Agility drill 12.78
3/4 Court Sprint 3.61
3 point percentage... 27% on 15 shots
Moe Wagner
Lane Agility drill 11.48
3/4 Court Sprint 3.18
3 point percentage... 39% on 160 shots
Devin Ebanks
Lane Agility drill 11.69
3/4 Court Sprint 3.25
3 point percentage... 10% on 30 shots
Svi Mykhailiuk
Lane Agility drill 11.25
3/4 Court Sprint 3.15
3 point percentage... 44% on 259 shots
Of course with the advancement in training techniques and medical science over the last eight years... (sarcastic, just in case) you never know what they might have achieved in the modern era... but our center ran faster and was more agile than the perimeter player.
Some successful players from 2010 just for comparison.
Hassan Whiteside
Lane Agility drill 11.83
3/4 Court Sprint 3.54
John Wall
Lane Agility drill 10.84
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 33% on 114 shots
Gordon Hayward
Lane Agility drill 11.73
3/4 Court Sprint 3.22
3 pt. Percentage 29% on 160 shots
Avery Bradley
Lane Agility drill 11.47
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 38% on 112 shots
DeMarcus Cousins
Lane Agility drill 11.40
3/4 Court Sprint 3.55
Greg Monroe
Lane Agility drill 12.10
3/4 Court Sprint 3.35
Moe is faster than all the centers though not as agile as Boogie was
Svi runs straight ahead pretty much at the same speed as John Wall
Moe's agility number is the same as Avery Bradley.
They both shoot better than any of those 2010 prospects who became successful players.
I'm not saying they will 100% succeed but it is likely they will do better than Caracter or Ebanks. |
You're really caught up on this false notion that the lane agility drill means something. _________________ Under New Management |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:12 am Post subject: |
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Joe Pesci wrote: | Reading the immediate reaction of Wagner being drafted (from page 424-428) is absolutely comical (and disappointing). It just goes to show you how programmed we men are into being emotional, fanatical shrills. What happened to the days when men measured their thoughts before speaking.
I’m sorry. Carry on. |
I liked you better when you were stoic and beat your wife with a flinty gazed resolve.
Without tears. _________________ Under New Management |
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Sentient Meat Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014 Posts: 12978
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:16 am Post subject: |
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Baron Von Humongous wrote: | Sentient Meat wrote: | Derrick Caracter
Lane Agility drill 12.78
3/4 Court Sprint 3.61
3 point percentage... 27% on 15 shots
Moe Wagner
Lane Agility drill 11.48
3/4 Court Sprint 3.18
3 point percentage... 39% on 160 shots
Devin Ebanks
Lane Agility drill 11.69
3/4 Court Sprint 3.25
3 point percentage... 10% on 30 shots
Svi Mykhailiuk
Lane Agility drill 11.25
3/4 Court Sprint 3.15
3 point percentage... 44% on 259 shots
Of course with the advancement in training techniques and medical science over the last eight years... (sarcastic, just in case) you never know what they might have achieved in the modern era... but our center ran faster and was more agile than the perimeter player.
Some successful players from 2010 just for comparison.
Hassan Whiteside
Lane Agility drill 11.83
3/4 Court Sprint 3.54
John Wall
Lane Agility drill 10.84
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 33% on 114 shots
Gordon Hayward
Lane Agility drill 11.73
3/4 Court Sprint 3.22
3 pt. Percentage 29% on 160 shots
Avery Bradley
Lane Agility drill 11.47
3/4 Court Sprint 3.14
3 pt. Percentage 38% on 112 shots
DeMarcus Cousins
Lane Agility drill 11.40
3/4 Court Sprint 3.55
Greg Monroe
Lane Agility drill 12.10
3/4 Court Sprint 3.35
Moe is faster than all the centers though not as agile as Boogie was
Svi runs straight ahead pretty much at the same speed as John Wall
Moe's agility number is the same as Avery Bradley.
They both shoot better than any of those 2010 prospects who became successful players.
I'm not saying they will 100% succeed but it is likely they will do better than Caracter or Ebanks. |
You're really caught up on this false notion that the lane agility drill means something. |
Not really... but interesting that both Kuzma and Hart had good numbers in the combine... seems like this might be trend for our front office.
The shooting is what impresses me... and of course the speed. |
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PHILosophize Franchise Player
Joined: 05 Nov 2012 Posts: 10758
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Posted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 4:21 am Post subject: |
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Baron Von Humongous wrote: | adkindo wrote: | I woke up this morning.....and it felt like one of those mornings where something bad happened the previous day, and you realize it was not just a bad dream. Yeah, I am not happy about our draft. I feel like the FO must see an entirely different NBA than the one I have watched evolve in recent years. The most valuable players/assets in the NBA are 2 Way perimeter players, and we finished the night adding zero....when we could have added 3 with that potential.
Wagner is a solid basketball player...has been the last couple years @ Michigan. In my opinion, he has been Beilein's latest version of Kevin Pittsnogle (WVU 2002-06)...a 6'11" guy that struggles on defense, cannot defend the rim, but can shoot the long ball. While Wagner is the latest version, I do not think he was as good as Pittsnogle. Pittsnogle averaged almost 20 Points his last season, while Wagner averaged less than 15. Pittsnogle was a career 41% shooter from 3...while Wagner shot 38% from 3 at Michigan on a much lower volume. Kevin Pittsnogle played 0 NBA Games and is an elementary school gym teacher in Fairmont, WV.
Wagner is a Michigan player that looked good on offense.....do you know how dangerous that is to draft? John Beilein is an offensive genius who routinely has been able to make good players look great. He took a WVU team lead by Pittsnogle and Mike Gansey to the Elite 8 and the Sweet 16 the following year....not one single player played in the NBA from that squad. Look at some of the guys he has had at Michigan that have been drafted....Ekpe Udoh (1st Rd. #6), Darius Morris (2nd Rd.), Trey Burke (1st Rd. #9), Glenn Robinson (2nd Rd.), Nik Stauskas (1st Rd. #8), Mitch McGary (1st Rd. #21). Caris LeVert (1st Rd. #20), D.J. Wilson (1st Rd. #17), and Tim Hardaway Jr. (1st Rd. #24).....outside of Hardaway, see a trend? All guys that Beilein was able to make look like great players @ Michigan that have never been able to continue success near that level in the NBA. It is a tough task to take a player coached by John Beilein and make them look as good as he did....
I have tried to think of every angle that may make our picks make sense to me....from maybe they know we are signing major FA's, and just wanted some good dudes in the locker room....to maybe Pelinka demanded a Michigan Man....but I came up with nothing that made sense. I just watched the last two years of playoffs where guys with similar skill makeups of Wagner and Svi are near unplayable.
I believe we will be one of several teams that will regret passing on Jevon Carter....and I can live with that.....but I fear we may also regret passing on 5 or more other guys....guys that can defend multiple positions, that have versatile 2 Way ability.....that are more built for the NBA in 2018. I wish our new guys well, and hope I have to admit how wrong I was someday.
....wanted to get the full vent out so I would hopefully not allow the negativity to linger for days. |
All of this. |
crap _________________ one dog goes that way the other dog goes the other way |
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