I'm really really excited about the depth of this first round
There's like 10 guys who could be available in or range who could be super solid nba contributors
And for that reason I think we should try hard to move our 2nd round pick up about 10 spots
Joined: 18 Jul 2001 Posts: 10015 Location: Los Angeles/ Alhambra, CA
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:49 pm Post subject:
Mike@LG wrote:
Holiday is a 1st round talent. If he's at 47... man..
This would be my live reaction:
Oh, I get it. I think the 23-30 range is best for him, and I don't see him going past 34 or 35 even if he did drop. He's still one of my favorites this year because I figure he could give us what we got out of IT -- maybe without 30-point-outburst potential this year, but with at least capable defense, 5 inches more height, and about 6 inches more wingspan that IT just doesn't have.
Larry Shamet: average athletically. His shot is flat and I wonder if it will translate at the NBA 3. Not a penetrator or great passer. What will his role be?
Khyri Thomas: I like this player. Physically ready for the NBA. Solid shooter, slasher. Good athlete who is ready to contribute now. Although might duplicate Josh Hart I would pick at 25 if available unless someone unexpectedly falls (Troy Brown). I'll probably be skewered for this but reminds me of Donovan Mitchell although a tad less athletic.
Appreciate the takes, but just wanted to note that, indeed, I don't agree with the bolded at all.
I should have elaborated further. I wasn't comparing their physical attributes but more their overall game.
Fundamentally good shooters and KT should be able to extend to the NBA 3. Able to effectively penetrate the lane, DM with quickness, KT with size (wider body). Both are physically strong with reputation as good defenders. They can split the double teams with the dribble.
Never thought of KT as a point guard but I don't really consider DM a true one either. In my initial write up I mentioned KT may duplicate Josh Hart. They have differences in their game but duplication was in reference to their playing position.
Begs the question What aspect of his game are you interested in?
Near 12% block rate which is double what it should be due to level of competition.
Grab and go ability.
Making reads in transition and a few in the halfcourt.
Developing shot.
Average athlete, massive wingspan to compensate. Cannot handle switches well, lead footed/balance issues, but evidence of triple threat skills.
Has a clue with off-ball ability.
Thanks Mike. Agree with most of these takes but still feel his ability to block shots will be null. He has very little lift and quickness.
Still question what position he will play. Most likely PF but with the transition to athletic skilled PF's he will be a huge defensive liability. But you are right maybe with development (body and skills) he could carve out an NBA career. Also he appears to have the BBIQ to complement other players.
Joined: 29 Jan 2016 Posts: 963 Location: The Dark Side of the Moon
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 2:31 pm Post subject:
I'm starting to see the Martin twins show up in the rankings. I brought them up mid season. Not sure if they've declared, I'm betting they will. 1 of them would be a great grab at 47. Caleb can score at all levels, Cody the more well rounded player, but not near the scorer as his brother.
edit: looks like they're testing the waters, no agent along with Caroline. Caroline should try to be a tight end imo. _________________ We pour this booze and we drink this booze because we think it's yummy. YUMMY! So over the tounge and down the throat to party in our tummys.
DOWN THE HOLA BITC*OLA!!!
No idea why Aaron Holiday has never impressed me as a potential NBA talent. dunno what it is that gives me pause about him though.
Maybe I didn't watch him enough this year, but I just don't see it the way other people seem to, as far as an NBA potential talent goes. (shrugs) maybe that will change at workouts or something, who knows. _________________ How NBA 2K18 failed the All-Time Lakers:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxMBYm3wwxk
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:50 pm Post subject:
Quote:
Thanks Mike. Agree with most of these takes but still feel his ability to block shots will be null. He has very little lift and quickness.
Still question what position he will play. Most likely PF but with the transition to athletic skilled PF's he will be a huge defensive liability. But you are right maybe with development (body and skills) he could carve out an NBA career. Also he appears to have the BBIQ to complement other players.
I think he's shown good instincts as a swatter. Doesn't jump high, but times it well. Usually in the right spot. He may not be quick, but wingspan makes up for all of it.
If he has an NBA position, it's definitely PF, off the bench (for now). But those abilities from a front court position off the pine? Super valuable. Teams aren't that deep with hyper athletic 4s, and even then, he can compensate with his offensive versatility. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:10 pm Post subject:
PlantedTanks wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Holiday is a 1st round talent. If he's at 47... man..
This would be my live reaction:
Could you compare Holiday vs Jevon Carter?
They seem like similar players in both size and skills but I don't believe you feel JC is a 1st round talent.
The one thing I like about Carter that I don't believe is mentioned often is his vision and passing skills. Better than Holiday in imo.
I'll stick to Holiday. adkindo is the Carter expert.
Like a 2 in a PG body. Triple threat player (Pass, shoot, drive), and has good length by height. Good finisher (not great), good dexterity around finishes. Despite the tempo changes, still right at 44% at 3pt. Dude is going to be a knockdown 3pt shooter eventually. In terms of vision, mostly sees half the court, or the side that he's on. If he's on the strongside, he can make the corner pass, but not the corner opposite pass or even the diagonal (reverse) pass out of PnR. He plays with a switch (on/off) on defense and can really pressure guys if he wants, but may get overwhelmed easily defending 2s.
Intangibles - Dude gets sped up, just like Jordan Clarkson. Any hint of opposing double teams and he forces the issue, and it leads to a bad decision. He'll force passes that aren't open, drives with no lanes, lose control of the basketball, etc. A series of those plays and he loses his poise.
All of things things are usually fixable and worked on with lots of NBA experience, especially the court vision and handling defensive pressure. It's kind of up to him. He wasn't showing advanced reads playing beside Lonzo, and they were rare in frequency this year. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29337 Location: La La Land
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:16 pm Post subject:
Haven't studied the draft this year.
Is it outlandish if we use one of our picks on LiAngelo? Would that be a wasted pick? Genuinely wondering. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Last edited by kikanga on Fri Apr 20, 2018 4:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
I'm starting to see the Martin twins show up in the rankings. I brought them up mid season. Not sure if they've declared, I'm betting they will. 1 of them would be a great grab at 47. Caleb can score at all levels, Cody the more well rounded player, but not near the scorer as his brother.
edit: looks like they're testing the waters, no agent along with Caroline. Caroline should try to be a tight end imo.
Aztecs had to bust them up the last two times they played them last season. _________________ Love, Laker Lanny
Holiday is a 1st round talent. If he's at 47... man..
This would be my live reaction:
Could you compare Holiday vs Jevon Carter?
They seem like similar players in both size and skills but I don't believe you feel JC is a 1st round talent.
The one thing I like about Carter that I don't believe is mentioned often is his vision and passing skills. Better than Holiday in imo.
I'll stick to Holiday. adkindo is the Carter expert.
Like a 2 in a PG body. Triple threat player (Pass, shoot, drive), and has good length by height. Good finisher (not great), good dexterity around finishes. Despite the tempo changes, still right at 44% at 3pt. Dude is going to be a knockdown 3pt shooter eventually. In terms of vision, mostly sees half the court, or the side that he's on. If he's on the strongside, he can make the corner pass, but not the corner opposite pass or even the diagonal (reverse) pass out of PnR. He plays with a switch (on/off) on defense and can really pressure guys if he wants, but may get overwhelmed easily defending 2s.
Intangibles - Dude gets sped up, just like Jordan Clarkson. Any hint of opposing double teams and he forces the issue, and it leads to a bad decision. He'll force passes that aren't open, drives with no lanes, lose control of the basketball, etc. A series of those plays and he loses his poise.
All of things things are usually fixable and worked on with lots of NBA experience, especially the court vision and handling defensive pressure. It's kind of up to him. He wasn't showing advanced reads playing beside Lonzo, and they were rare in frequency this year.
Thanks Mike. Your statement Like a 2 in a PG body is the perfect description. If he had more quickness/explosion he would be a sub 20 pick.
Some notes on players I have reviewed primarily on YT so take this with a grain of salt. Some of this might already have been mentioned but I only started keeping up in depth with this thread 4 to 5 weeks ago.
Looking mostly at players previously mentioned who could be available at 25.
Larry Shamet: average athletically. His shot is flat and I wonder if it will translate at the NBA 3. Not a penetrator or great passer. What will his role be?
Zhaire Smith: Good player but maybe over hyped. Very good athlete but not near elite. Outside shot looks raw but potential to be solid NBA average. High BBIQ and competes. I would prefer Khyri Thomas and Shake Milton over him at 25 as they are ready to contribute now.
Khyri Thomas: I like this player. Physically ready for the NBA. Solid shooter, slasher. Good athlete who is ready to contribute now. Although might duplicate Josh Hart I would pick at 25 if available unless someone unexpectedly falls (Troy Brown). I'll probably be skewered for this but reminds me of Donovan Mitchell although a tad less athletic.
Shake Milton: Another player that I like at 25. Great shooting form and touch with a quick release. Can play PG but question if he will be able to penetrate the paint. Average athlete who needs to add weight/muscle.
Troy Brown: Really nice player. Very skilled but nothing appears elite. Good athlete but not explosive. Would probably select at 25 over those previously listed based on potential though it would be a tough choice over Khyri Thomas.
Mitch Robinson: Torn on this player. Preferred if his wing span was elite. Can see the potential but very raw. Appears to be at least 3 maybe 4 years before he is NBA ready. Do we want to wait that long?
There are others that have been discussed/desired but I wanted to list players I do prefer and 2 (Shamet, Robinson) that I don't. The rest (Holiday, Carter, Brunson, Porter, ...) fall in the middle.
If draft and stash I prefer Isaac Bonga. Bust potential but high ceiling.
post your big board in the draft forum of the site por favor
Sorry I don't do a big board. I normally review the draft sites then start reviewing players I believe will be within the Lakers pick. Kinda sucks when we don't have a 1st rounder.
Look forward to more posts from you on shooting mechanics. I basically go by what I see but started picking up nuances from your posts.
Some notes on players I have reviewed primarily on YT so take this with a grain of salt. Some of this might already have been mentioned but I only started keeping up in depth with this thread 4 to 5 weeks ago.
Looking mostly at players previously mentioned who could be available at 25.
Larry Shamet: average athletically. His shot is flat and I wonder if it will translate at the NBA 3. Not a penetrator or great passer. What will his role be?
Zhaire Smith: Good player but maybe over hyped. Very good athlete but not near elite. Outside shot looks raw but potential to be solid NBA average. High BBIQ and competes. I would prefer Khyri Thomas and Shake Milton over him at 25 as they are ready to contribute now.
Khyri Thomas: I like this player. Physically ready for the NBA. Solid shooter, slasher. Good athlete who is ready to contribute now. Although might duplicate Josh Hart I would pick at 25 if available unless someone unexpectedly falls (Troy Brown). I'll probably be skewered for this but reminds me of Donovan Mitchell although a tad less athletic.
Shake Milton: Another player that I like at 25. Great shooting form and touch with a quick release. Can play PG but question if he will be able to penetrate the paint. Average athlete who needs to add weight/muscle.
Troy Brown: Really nice player. Very skilled but nothing appears elite. Good athlete but not explosive. Would probably select at 25 over those previously listed based on potential though it would be a tough choice over Khyri Thomas.
Mitch Robinson: Torn on this player. Preferred if his wing span was elite. Can see the potential but very raw. Appears to be at least 3 maybe 4 years before he is NBA ready. Do we want to wait that long?
There are others that have been discussed/desired but I wanted to list players I do prefer and 2 (Shamet, Robinson) that I don't. The rest (Holiday, Carter, Brunson, Porter, ...) fall in the middle.
If draft and stash I prefer Isaac Bonga. Bust potential but high ceiling.
post your big board in the draft forum of the site por favor
Sorry I don't do a big board. I normally review the draft sites then start reviewing players I believe will be within the Lakers pick. Kinda sucks when we don't have a 1st rounder.
Look forward to more posts from you on shooting mechanics. I basically go by what I see but started picking up nuances from your posts.
thanks. I'm pretty obsessed with simple strokes now, less cockback - using cockback just to fold the wrist back/incorporate it..any more cockback than that is wasted motion/time. I think this will fix will be key with Ingram's stroke
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29337 Location: La La Land
Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:31 pm Post subject:
Mike@LG wrote:
kikanga wrote:
Haven't studied the draft this year.
Is it outlandish if we use one of our picks on LiAngelo? Would that be a wasted pick? Genuinely wondering.
Yes, it is outlandish.
Is it because of his time spent in jail?
Strictly based on basketball ability, is the projected 47th pick on a much higher level than LiAngelo? _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Haven't studied the draft this year.
Is it outlandish if we use one of our picks on LiAngelo? Would that be a wasted pick? Genuinely wondering.
Yes, it is outlandish.
Is it because of his time spent in jail?
Strictly based on basketball ability, is the projected 47th pick on a much higher level than LiAngelo?
You don't need to draft Liangelo. You want him, he'll be there when the draft is over. He's not talented enough for any team to draft, let alone enough that they'd deal with Lavar Ball.
Haven't studied the draft this year.
Is it outlandish if we use one of our picks on LiAngelo? Would that be a wasted pick? Genuinely wondering.
Yes, it is outlandish.
Is it because of his time spent in jail?
Strictly based on basketball ability, is the projected 47th pick on a much higher level than LiAngelo?
1. Based strictly on his basketball ability, LiAngelo is not considered an NBA-level prospect; nor was he considered one before the incident in China.
2. If I were the Lakers, I'd have no desire to become more deeply entangled with the Ball family. Just the opposite. All things being equal, I'd prefer to take a different player with the same ability than take LiAngelo. Let someone else take some of the circus if they want.
LiAngelo doesn't have a position to guard - he's a ground-bound, heavy-footed, stocky 6'5 PF with SG length - and he lacks the ball skills or quickness to ever be much of a threat on offense except as a spot-up shooter. He's not useless as a basketball player - he has a quick release, he can be a smart ball-mover when he isn't trying to showboat, he has a solid feel as a cutter, and he has a nose for the boards - but even if LiAngelo becomes a legit elite shooter, I don't see how he's any better than a smushed Jason Kapono.
There will definitely be better players at #47, and besides, what is LiAngelo going to do after he goes undrafted? Not join the Lakers Summer League squad? Come on.
Is the draft deep enough where the Lakers should consider pulling another Josh Hart like trade and move down a bit to pick up another asset? Atlanta would fit that bill with the 30th and 33th picks for the 25th. Or perhaps Brooklyn again with the less appealing 29th and 40th picks.
Is the draft deep enough where the Lakers should consider pulling another Josh Hart like trade and move down a bit to pick up another asset? Atlanta would fit that bill with the 30th and 33th picks for the 25th. Or perhaps Brooklyn again with the less appealing 29th and 40th picks.
Yes, yes it is. We could get a real contributor in the late 30s. I doubt teams are going to be jumping at the chance to give us another pick to possibly get a steal, though. Salty mFs
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thanks. I'm pretty obsessed with simple strokes now, less cockback - using cockback just to fold the wrist back/incorporate it..any more cockback than that is wasted motion/time. I think this will fix will be key with Ingram's stroke
