Official 2018 NBA Draft Thread: Lakers select Moe Wagner (#25), Isaac Bonga (#39), and Svi Mykhailiuk (#47) - see 1st page for draft links
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BigGameHames
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:09 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


JJJ > Ayton and Bagley

I like bigs who defend and shoot more than one-way roll men who like to show off their post moves to the detriment of their team's overall offensive efficiency.


I wouldn’t describe Ayton or Bagley as those guys. Not sure how you came to that conclusion with either of them.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:10 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


Here's my very early one after the Lottery:

1. Suns--Ayton
2. Kings--Doncic
3. Hawks--Bagley
4. Grizzlies--JJJ
5. Mavs--Bamba
6. Magic--Young
7. Bulls--Porter Jr.
8. Cavs--Carter Jr.
9. Knicks--Mikal Bridges
10. Sixers--Z. Smith
11. Hornets--Sexton
12. Clippers--SGA
13. Clippers--Miles Bridges
14. Nuggets--Knox
15. Wizards--Jontay Porter
16. Suns--Williams
17. Bucks--Hutchison
18. Spurs--Musa
19. Hawks--Walker
20. Wolves--Troy Brown
21. Jazz--Evans
22. Bulls--Okogie
23. Pacers--Holiday
24. Blazers--Robinson
25. Lakers--Huerter
26. Sixers--Brunson
27. Celtics--Thomas
28. Warriors--Shamet
29. Nets--Simons
30. Hawks--DiVincenzo
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:16 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
2019 wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
Doncic was the 4th-leading scorer & 4th-leading assist guy in the 2nd best league in the world at age 18/19. For whatever it's worth, I don't think anyone has ever matched his statistical production in the Euroleague at the same age.

He's the clear #1 pick.


Ayton, Ayton Ayton.

You want to build a contending team in the future, you need one of these "unicorn" bigs. AD, Embiid, Porzingis, Jokic, Towns... Ayton is in that category.

To be able to pair Booker with a big like that who has inside/outside game and moves like a gazelle is too hard to pass up. Then you got an Artest/Iggy hybrid on the wing, and you've got yourself a superb core. Just draft Aaron Holiday #21. Ayton/Jackson/Warren/Booker/Holiday//Bender/Chris


I’m not arguing against Ayton at #1 but the bolded isn’t true. None of those guys have even played in a conference finals. Great players but have been proven not to be essential.

But I love Ayton as a prospect too.


You don't necessarily need a unicorn big but in this NBA you need multiple unicorns to contend. I consider Curry, Green and Durant unicorns and Klay pretty close. For Houston Harden and Paul. Cavs Lebron the ultimate unicorn.

Great bigs may not be essential but great players are.
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justsomelakerfan
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:17 pm    Post subject:

Speak it into existence ChickenStu
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:22 pm    Post subject:

justsomelakerfan wrote:
Speak it into existence ChickenStu


And we get Jevon Carter at 47. I just haven't done my 2nd Round Mock yet, but yeah, that could happen!
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:30 pm    Post subject:

Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:31 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?


A bit of a better floor, a bit of a better athlete/playmaker/midrange shooter(IMO)
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:32 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
justsomelakerfan wrote:
Speak it into existence ChickenStu


And we get Jevon Carter at 47. I just haven't done my 2nd Round Mock yet, but yeah, that could happen!


Sure, I like Jevon! I can't even order my thoughts together for a first round mock draft lol
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:49 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


JJJ > Ayton and Bagley

I like bigs who defend and shoot more than one-way roll men who like to show off their post moves to the detriment of their team's overall offensive efficiency.


I wouldn’t describe Ayton or Bagley as those guys. Not sure how you came to that conclusion with either of them.

Please describe them in your own words.
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Baron Von Humongous
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:53 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


Here's my very early one after the Lottery:

1. Suns--Ayton
2. Kings--Doncic
3. Hawks--Bagley
4. Grizzlies--JJJ
5. Mavs--Bamba
6. Magic--Young
7. Bulls--Porter Jr.
8. Cavs--Carter Jr.
9. Knicks--Mikal Bridges
10. Sixers--Z. Smith
11. Hornets--Sexton
12. Clippers--SGA
13. Clippers--Miles Bridges
14. Nuggets--Knox
15. Wizards--Jontay Porter
16. Suns--Williams
17. Bucks--Hutchison
18. Spurs--Musa
19. Hawks--Walker
20. Wolves--Troy Brown
21. Jazz--Evans
22. Bulls--Okogie
23. Pacers--Holiday
24. Blazers--Robinson
25. Lakers--Huerter
26. Sixers--Brunson
27. Celtics--Thomas
28. Warriors--Shamet
29. Nets--Simons
30. Hawks--DiVincenzo

I'd prefer Melton to Huerter while poor DLo looks like he could be Wally Pipped by Simons. But that looks more likely than mine (I mixed some of what I think teams will do with what I think they should do).
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LakersForever123
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 4:53 pm    Post subject:

What do you guys think of Ray Spalding?

late combine invite, 6'10 with a 7'6 wingspan. He looks mobile, plays defense and has shooting touch.

Maybe with our 47th pick?
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:14 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?


Not way off but, international line is 1.5 feet longer than NCAA line. Doncic makes better reads now that DAR, right now.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:18 pm    Post subject:

44TheLogo wrote:
adkindo wrote:
LakersForever123 wrote:
adkindo wrote:
LakersForever123 wrote:
Mitchell Robinson probably received a promise.

Just like Chandler Hutchinson pulling out of the combine today. He probably got a promise.


Chandler Hutchinson pulled out of combine?



Yes.


the irony


how do you not comprehend that hutchison has played 4 years of college basketball while mitchell robinson has not played a game in a year and none of us have seen him play a second of competitive basketball? how can any of you have any confidence about him as a prospect if you've never seen him play before? or if you have seen footage, please feel free to share it.


Hm. Not irony.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:22 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


JJJ > Ayton and Bagley

I like bigs who defend and shoot more than one-way roll men who like to show off their post moves to the detriment of their team's overall offensive efficiency.


I wouldn’t describe Ayton or Bagley as those guys. Not sure how you came to that conclusion with either of them.

Please describe them in your own words.


Ayton- Closest thing to Shaq physically since Shaq. Potential to be a dominant force inside on both ends. Ability to face up and make mid range jumpers. Potential to develop spot up 3 point shot. Great roll man and finisher around the basket. Good shot blocker but defending in space will likely be his biggest weakness.

Bagley- Reminds me a lot of KG with some taller longer Julius mixed in. Best ball handler and playmaker of the trio by a wide margin. Most versatile of the 3. Potential to become a versatile defender and will eventually be big enough to play C full time IMO. Biggest weakness is shooting if he’s at the 4, rim protection if he’s at the 5. A bit of a 4/5 tweeter.

Neither guy “shows off post moves at the detriment of his team” or can’t defend.

Jackson Jr- Stretch 5 with great shot blocking. Limited offensive skill set with the ball in his hands. Potential to be a versatile defender but less so than Bagley. Smaller body inside, I don’t think he’ll have the presence in the paint that Ayton does on either end. Clearest niche to fill but lowest ceiling by a fair margin out of the 3. Most holes in his game but his strengths allow him to fill a valuable role.

I like JJJ but he’s a tier below the other guys IMO.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:31 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?


Not way off but, international line is 1.5 feet longer than NCAA line. Doncic makes better reads now that DAR, right now.


Appreciate your thoughts, and those of KIROE, as well. I remember Rick Pitino calling DLo a "passing savant" during that draft process, but that hasn't materialized.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:33 pm    Post subject:

Baron Von Humongous wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Baron Von Humongous wrote:
Just for fun (not a BPA mock):

1. Phoenix - Doncic
2. Sacramento - Jackson, Jr.
3. Atlanta - Ayton
4. Memphis - Bagley
5. Dallas - Bamba
6. Orlando - Young
7. Chicago - Porter, Jr.
8. Cleveland - Carter
9. New York - Mikal Bridges
10. Philadelphia - SGA
11. Charlotte - Miles Bridges
12. LA Clippers - Sexton
13. LA Clippers - Z. Smith
14. Denver - Knox
15. Washington - J. Porter
16. Phoenix - R. Williams
17. Milwaukee - M. Robinson
18. San Antonio - T. Brown
19. Atlanta - Walker
20. Minnesota - J. Evans
21. Utah - Simons
22. Chicago - Huerter
23. Indiana - Hutchinson
24. Portland - Melton
25. Los Angeles Lakers - Okogie
26. Philadelphia - Musa
27. Boston - Milton
28. Golden State - Shamet
29. Brooklyn - Frazier
30. Atlanta - Okobo


Here's my very early one after the Lottery:

1. Suns--Ayton
2. Kings--Doncic
3. Hawks--Bagley
4. Grizzlies--JJJ
5. Mavs--Bamba
6. Magic--Young
7. Bulls--Porter Jr.
8. Cavs--Carter Jr.
9. Knicks--Mikal Bridges
10. Sixers--Z. Smith
11. Hornets--Sexton
12. Clippers--SGA
13. Clippers--Miles Bridges
14. Nuggets--Knox
15. Wizards--Jontay Porter
16. Suns--Williams
17. Bucks--Hutchison
18. Spurs--Musa
19. Hawks--Walker
20. Wolves--Troy Brown
21. Jazz--Evans
22. Bulls--Okogie
23. Pacers--Holiday
24. Blazers--Robinson
25. Lakers--Huerter
26. Sixers--Brunson
27. Celtics--Thomas
28. Warriors--Shamet
29. Nets--Simons
30. Hawks--DiVincenzo

I'd prefer Melton to Huerter while poor DLo looks like he could be Wally Pipped by Simons. But that looks more likely than mine (I mixed some of what I think teams will do with what I think they should do).


I'm intrigued by Melton. The workouts will be really important for him. I'd need to see him look like he can be a competent shooter to take him over Huerter, even with Melton's projected defense. But it's a pick I could definitely get behind.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:37 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?


Not way off but, international line is 1.5 feet longer than NCAA line. Doncic makes better reads now that DAR, right now.


Appreciate your thoughts, and those of KIROE, as well. I remember Rick Pitino calling DLo a "passing savant" during that draft process, but that hasn't materialized.


He is. He showed multiple flashes of it as a Laker, actually. The decision-making and the pull-up jumper? That didn't translate from Ohio State, hence the frustration.

Except, Doncic doesn't have those decision-making issues, and has a pull up jumper, to the point of breaking a few guys ankles in Iso to get open.

I also think it's a world of difference if DAR is 6'8" 225lbs.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:38 pm    Post subject:

Quote:

I'm intrigued by Melton. The workouts will be really important for him. I'd need to see him look like he can be a competent shooter to take him over Huerter, even with Melton's projected defense. But it's a pick I could definitely get behind.
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The shot is critical for me when it comes to Melton.

But Huerter now? Even if he's an average wing defender and gets burned a few times, the fact that he draws gravity out to 25' is valuable.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:41 pm    Post subject:

Quote:

Ayton- Closest thing to Shaq physically since Shaq. Potential to be a dominant force inside on both ends. Ability to face up and make mid range jumpers. Potential to develop spot up 3 point shot. Great roll man and finisher around the basket. Good shot blocker but defending in space will likely be his biggest weakness.


You know, I read this argument often and just think, the biggest difference with Shaq wasn't the size, it was the guard-like motor that Ayton doesn't have.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:42 pm    Post subject:

44TheLogo wrote:
question - have any of you ever watched luka doncic play a full game?

he's one of the slowest elite prospects i've ever seen. it's something i don't think people generally appreciate, because being relatively unathletic isn't a big problem in european basketball.


I have watched and wondered how his lack of elite athleticism will translate to the hyper athletic NBA....but honestly that is why I do not opine much on guys I have not seen play American basketball, because I just do not really have any feel for international competition.....I have been very right and very wrong about international players in the past, and although I can say the same for American players....in hindsight I usually understand what I missed on them, but the international guys are often a mystery for me even in hindsight.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:46 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mitchell and Hutchinson getting a promise already it looks like.

I'm cool with that. As long as Porter didn't get a promise yet I'm fine. Unless that promise is from us.


honestly, I struggle to see how anyone gets a promise this early....maybe my memory of past drafts is just off?
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:47 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Hm. Not irony.


you literally go out of your way
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P.K.
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:48 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Regarding Doncic's athleticism, I'm not as concerned with that as I am with 44TL pointing out that he only shot, what, 30% from 3? I mean, this was always my concern with D'Angelo Russell and it continues to be. I don't think DLo is a great athlete, but if he shot the ball better, he'd be a big hit. And maybe he still will be. But if DLo is not going to shoot it well from deep, there's only so much he can do beyond being a decent player. Doncic has more size to offer, but if he doesn't shoot well from deep, that would be my concern: that he has a current Dlo-like floor.

Am I way off there?

.318 last year. from Euro distance 22'1.75" vs NBA distance 23'9"
1ft&7.25" closer than the NBA line
and not being defended by NBA speed players
I'd add that in 3 years in the EuroLeague, his 3pt% has gone DOWN every year
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adkindo
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Joined: 16 Jun 2005
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:54 pm    Post subject:

for those that do not listen regularly....Vecenie and Zwicker give an excellent post lottery response and who they expect to be drafted in the lottery, where and why....

https://soundcloud.com/sam-vecenie/nba-draft-lottery-breakdown

I would give their list, but they simply do not agree on a lot of picks.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:57 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Hm. Not irony.


you literally go out of your way


You're playing victim over a discussion about actually seeing a player actually play vs. cancelling workouts, interviews, not playing, being questionable, etc. and that every player you compare him too, has actually played a season, let alone 4?

Nah. You're going out of your way with a poor argument.
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