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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 3:44 pm Post subject: |
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deal wrote: | epak wrote: | Can't believe it's only 4 more days...
Hopefully we find out about our lotto pick before then. |
Find out before? Totally impossible. To many teams pick ahead of the Lakers for us to actually know who will be there.
We will know on Thursday. |
I meant if we trade for a lotto pick |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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kawhileonard wrote: | Honestly if Deng isn't traded by draft night I have my doubts that he will get traded in general |
You’re wrong here my friend.
Deng can’t be traded until July 1st. No one has space to absorb him until then.
You’ll have to wait until then, and you’ll also have to wait until, at the very least, after James and George verbally commit. _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter. |
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Mike@LG Moderator
Joined: 10 Apr 2001 Posts: 65135 Location: Orange County, CA
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: |
I echo BVs summary verbatim. I don't agree w a lot of 94 feet report.
What's lost is how much physical development KBD has had already. How much more eohysical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs NCAA?
When you watch KBD through a more developed MBAM lens, the perceived value rises dramatically. |
Again, I’m not an expert on him at all, never watched him play actual games, but are you essentially saying that you can’t envision Diop, a 22 year-old, gaining more weight, adding more strength and muscle mass?
If you are implying he can’t “grow” anymore, you must not remember Elden Campbell. He came to the Lakers 6’11, 205 soaking wet. He retired from the NBA at nearly 300 pounds. He can gain more weight and strength if he desires to, IMO. No problem. |
Elden Campbell in his prime was 245lbs. Getting near 300lbs., is just letting himself go and not being effective.
It took Campbell what, 3-5 years just to get to that 245 mark? Did he even retain any of that athleticism when his weight exceeded that? I don't think so. At least Campbell was an energy big with major hops as a rookie. KBD, is not that. He doesn't exactly have "Athleticism to spare" for the sake of adding more bulk. _________________ Resident Car Nut.
https://lakersdraft.substack.com/
I am not an economic advisor nor do I advise economic strategies or plans. |
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cital Star Player
Joined: 25 May 2002 Posts: 3647
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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There have been a lot of trades that have happened at the draft and get announced by the media, but can’t be made official until after July 1st |
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ValleyLakeshowLover Sixth Man
Joined: 12 Jul 2015 Posts: 65
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
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2019 Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014 Posts: 10786
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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ValleyLakeshowLover wrote: | With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
they're prepping for all options IMO |
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€H£M£$TR¥ Star Player
Joined: 03 Apr 2017 Posts: 3782
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:29 pm Post subject: |
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2019 wrote: | ValleyLakeshowLover wrote: | With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
they're prepping for all options IMO |
This is the whole job. All the scouting. All the analytics. And your ability as a talent evaluator to make all the pieces unstoppable and sustainable. _________________ DEAR BASKETBALL |
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kawhileonard Starting Rotation
Joined: 15 Jun 2018 Posts: 599
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:33 pm Post subject: |
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Joe Pesci wrote: | kawhileonard wrote: | Honestly if Deng isn't traded by draft night I have my doubts that he will get traded in general |
You’re wrong here my friend.
Deng can’t be traded until July 1st. No one has space to absorb him until then.
You’ll have to wait until then, and you’ll also have to wait until, at the very least, after James and George verbally commit. |
Why July 1?
I'm sure there are a few teams with enough cap space.
Also, our pick becomes of lesser value after the draft. |
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deal Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Aug 2008 Posts: 14900 Location: Earth
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | deal wrote: | epak wrote: | Can't believe it's only 4 more days...
Hopefully we find out about our lotto pick before then. |
Find out before? Totally impossible. To many teams pick ahead of the Lakers for us to actually know who will be there.
We will know on Thursday. |
I meant if we trade for a lotto pick |
Yeah, yeah; we'll see as these next few days pass. _________________ Lakers need to build a freaking team ! |
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lakerfanaticPT Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2005 Posts: 1572
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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Lots of smoke and lots of curve balls until Thursday. Should be a fun week and end of the month😀 |
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StoicChalice392 Star Player
Joined: 19 Jul 2017 Posts: 1724 Location: Yorba Linda, Ca
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 7:58 pm Post subject: |
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€H£M£$TR¥ wrote: | 2019 wrote: | ValleyLakeshowLover wrote: | With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
they're prepping for all options IMO |
This is the whole job. All the scouting. All the analytics. And your ability as a talent evaluator to make all the pieces unstoppable and sustainable. |
if history is any indication, we can't just rely on Plan A,B, or C. We need at least 10-15 plans. |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 8:21 pm Post subject: |
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IMO....this week is kind of the best and worst week for the draft.....on one had, there will be lots of attention and content which is good....but on the other hand, this is usually when bs starts flowing like margarita's at a Jimmy Buffet beach party. |
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LuciusAllen Star Player
Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Posts: 5786
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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ValleyLakeshowLover wrote: | With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
I think that's by design. If a normal fan could figure out their strategy, that means they're playing checkers, not chess. (No offense intended.) |
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ValleyLakeshowLover Sixth Man
Joined: 12 Jul 2015 Posts: 65
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 8:36 pm Post subject: |
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LuciusAllen wrote: | ValleyLakeshowLover wrote: | With all the rumors that the Lakers would like to move up in draft to snag Zhaire Smith, I have a question.
If the Lakers are looking to trade Deng away so that they can sign LeBron, Paul George, and resign Randle, how are we supposed to move up in the draft?
Are they looking to move Lonzo for a pick? Trade a future pick along with #25? Are they not trying to keep Randle so they can just stretch Deng and let Randle walk?
I can't figure out what Rob and Magic are aiming to do Thursday. |
I think that's by design. If a normal fan could figure out their strategy, that means they're playing checkers, not chess. (No offense intended.) |
Haha none taken. You're obviously right. It all seems so contradictory, but misdirection is clearly the point. |
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vicman Star Player
Joined: 25 Jun 2005 Posts: 2379 Location: Arcadia
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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As much as I really like this draft it would be awesome if a big name fell and the lakers got a taker for 25 and deng. Follow that up with either justin Jackson at 47 or moving up to get carter. Not a very sexy draft day but probably the best result for us if they can pull it off. |
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1hu2ren3dui4 Franchise Player
Joined: 19 Jul 2002 Posts: 15403 Location: Oak Park
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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Doesn’t this seem like the year we should trade for the #13 pick and draft on crazy upside potential. If only deng actually had any value. |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Sun Jun 17, 2018 11:30 pm Post subject: |
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kawhileonard wrote: | Joe Pesci wrote: | kawhileonard wrote: | Honestly if Deng isn't traded by draft night I have my doubts that he will get traded in general |
You’re wrong here my friend.
Deng can’t be traded until July 1st. No one has space to absorb him until then.
You’ll have to wait until then, and you’ll also have to wait until, at the very least, after James and George verbally commit. |
Why July 1?
I'm sure there are a few teams with enough cap space.
Also, our pick becomes of lesser value after the draft. |
July 1st is the day when the new contract cycles begin and free agents actually become free agents. On this day, teams like Atlanta and Chicago, and others will have actual space to absorb Deng’s contract. Before that day, no one 18million in space to take Deng’s contract (unless the Lakers take salary back). _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter. |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 12:16 am Post subject: |
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Mike@LG wrote: | Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: |
I echo BVs summary verbatim. I don't agree w a lot of 94 feet report.
What's lost is how much physical development KBD has had already. How much more eohysical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs NCAA?
When you watch KBD through a more developed MBAM lens, the perceived value rises dramatically. |
Again, I’m not an expert on him at all, never watched him play actual games, but are you essentially saying that you can’t envision Diop, a 22 year-old, gaining more weight, adding more strength and muscle mass?
If you are implying he can’t “grow” anymore, you must not remember Elden Campbell. He came to the Lakers 6’11, 205 soaking wet. He retired from the NBA at nearly 300 pounds. He can gain more weight and strength if he desires to, IMO. No problem. |
Elden Campbell in his prime was 245lbs. Getting near 300lbs., is just letting himself go and not being effective.
It took Campbell what, 3-5 years just to get to that 245 mark? Did he even retain any of that athleticism when his weight exceeded that? I don't think so. At least Campbell was an energy big with major hops as a rookie. KBD, is not that. He doesn't exactly have "Athleticism to spare" for the sake of adding more bulk. |
I wish you had’ve answered my question instead of critiquing an example.
My question was in response to this: “How much more physical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs in the NCAA?” _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter. |
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PlantedTanks Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017 Posts: 3156
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:39 am Post subject: |
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Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: |
I echo BVs summary verbatim. I don't agree w a lot of 94 feet report.
What's lost is how much physical development KBD has had already. How much more eohysical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs NCAA?
When you watch KBD through a more developed MBAM lens, the perceived value rises dramatically. |
Again, I’m not an expert on him at all, never watched him play actual games, but are you essentially saying that you can’t envision Diop, a 22 year-old, gaining more weight, adding more strength and muscle mass?
If you are implying he can’t “grow” anymore, you must not remember Elden Campbell. He came to the Lakers 6’11, 205 soaking wet. He retired from the NBA at nearly 300 pounds. He can gain more weight and strength if he desires to, IMO. No problem. |
Elden Campbell in his prime was 245lbs. Getting near 300lbs., is just letting himself go and not being effective.
It took Campbell what, 3-5 years just to get to that 245 mark? Did he even retain any of that athleticism when his weight exceeded that? I don't think so. At least Campbell was an energy big with major hops as a rookie. KBD, is not that. He doesn't exactly have "Athleticism to spare" for the sake of adding more bulk. |
I wish you had’ve answered my question instead of critiquing an example.
My question was in response to this: “How much more physical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs in the NCAA?” |
Did not consider him for 27 but seeing this conversation I reviewed more of his tape.
1. Looking at his frame he does not appear to have the base to anchor against centers in the NBA and don't feel he could put on much weight below the waist.
2. He is not a dynamic athlete but it appears he could effectively switch on PNR's in regards to defense. His game resembles a PF and would fit better there as Baron stated.
3. I could see him put on another 10 lbs in the upper body but anymore might be bad weight for basketball.
4. He has some touch on his shots and decent mechanics. Just appears a little stiff (watch his free throws). I feel the additional distance of the NBA 3 will give him problems.
5. Does not appear to have the ability to take his defender off the dribble which he will need to develop to effectively score in the NBA.
6. I tried to find a similar player to him in the NBA but come up blank which makes it difficult to consider in the 1st. Avg height, avg size, avg athlete, great length, decent shot, ? handles, ? passing, good defense, avg rebounder, low steal rate, good shot blocker.
Nice complementary player who would fit nicely on a playoff team. In this draft I feel a better player will be available at 27. |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 2:01 am Post subject: |
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PlantedTanks wrote: | Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: | Joe Pesci wrote: | Mike@LG wrote: |
I echo BVs summary verbatim. I don't agree w a lot of 94 feet report.
What's lost is how much physical development KBD has had already. How much more eohysical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs NCAA?
When you watch KBD through a more developed MBAM lens, the perceived value rises dramatically. |
Again, I’m not an expert on him at all, never watched him play actual games, but are you essentially saying that you can’t envision Diop, a 22 year-old, gaining more weight, adding more strength and muscle mass?
If you are implying he can’t “grow” anymore, you must not remember Elden Campbell. He came to the Lakers 6’11, 205 soaking wet. He retired from the NBA at nearly 300 pounds. He can gain more weight and strength if he desires to, IMO. No problem. |
Elden Campbell in his prime was 245lbs. Getting near 300lbs., is just letting himself go and not being effective.
It took Campbell what, 3-5 years just to get to that 245 mark? Did he even retain any of that athleticism when his weight exceeded that? I don't think so. At least Campbell was an energy big with major hops as a rookie. KBD, is not that. He doesn't exactly have "Athleticism to spare" for the sake of adding more bulk. |
I wish you had’ve answered my question instead of critiquing an example.
My question was in response to this: “How much more physical upside is there after gaining almost 40lbs in the NCAA?” |
Did not consider him for 27 but seeing this conversation I reviewed more of his tape.
1. Looking at his frame he does not appear to have the base to anchor against centers in the NBA and don't feel he could put on much weight below the waist.
2. He is not a dynamic athlete but it appears he could effectively switch on PNR's in regards to defense. His game resembles a PF and would fit better there as Baron stated.
3. I could see him put on another 10 lbs in the upper body but anymore might be bad weight for basketball.
4. He has some touch on his shots and decent mechanics. Just appears a little stiff (watch his free throws). I feel the additional distance of the NBA 3 will give him problems.
5. Does not appear to have the ability to take his defender off the dribble which he will need to develop to effectively score in the NBA.
6. I tried to find a similar player to him in the NBA but come up blank which makes it difficult to consider in the 1st. Avg height, avg size, avg athlete, great length, decent shot, ? handles, ? passing, good defense, avg rebounder, low steal rate, good shot blocker.
Nice complementary player who would fit nicely on a playoff team. In this draft I feel a better player will be available at 27. |
Fair enough. I have to say again, that I’m not an expert on the guy.
He seems to be a longer, far less explosive version of Larry Nance without the offensive ineptness, and that sounds good to me.
Nance plays almost exclusively at Center these days without Diop’s sthotblocking ability, so it’s not unreasonable to see him get time there.
If Randle is your starting center and you implore a full-time switching defense, Diop could be a more than serviceable backup Center, one who could also play alongside Randle as well if his jumper proves respectable like I think it will. _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter. |
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epak Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005 Posts: 34147
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:37 am Post subject: |
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Quote: | Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
Michael Porter Jr. to Sacramento at No. 2? There are rival teams who believe that the Kings are still strongly weighing it ... |
I'm surprised. Seems high.
But it is sacramento |
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adkindo Retired Number
Joined: 16 Jun 2005 Posts: 40345 Location: Dirty South
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:46 am Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | Quote: | Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
Michael Porter Jr. to Sacramento at No. 2? There are rival teams who believe that the Kings are still strongly weighing it ... |
I'm surprised. Seems high.
But it is sacramento |
I think it is high based on risk....but not on ceiling. In my opinion, a healthy MPJ has future #1 Option/All Star written all over him. |
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Lucky_Shot Star Player
Joined: 10 Jan 2016 Posts: 5140
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:52 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | epak wrote: | Quote: | Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
Michael Porter Jr. to Sacramento at No. 2? There are rival teams who believe that the Kings are still strongly weighing it ... |
I'm surprised. Seems high.
But it is sacramento |
I think it is high based on risk....but not on ceiling. In my opinion, a healthy MPJ has future #1 Option/All Star written all over him. |
Wasn't this the guy everyone said last summer that he would be the number 1 pick in 2018?
Eitheway its all a crapshoot, just pick the guy you think will be the best and to hell with what everyone else thinks because its your job on the line not theirs
Last edited by Lucky_Shot on Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:56 am; edited 2 times in total |
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Joe Pesci Star Player
Joined: 15 Oct 2017 Posts: 3885
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:54 am Post subject: |
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epak wrote: | Quote: | Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
Michael Porter Jr. to Sacramento at No. 2? There are rival teams who believe that the Kings are still strongly weighing it ... |
I'm surprised. Seems high.
But it is sacramento |
Said it in the Randle thread a day or two ago:
Joe Pesci wrote: | Dallas will be driven by the draft.
Very hard to prognosticate the draft, but as I see it:
Phoenix - Ayton
Sacramento - Porter Jr. (I know, I know, crazy, but I see them going that way)
Atlanta - Bamba
Cleveland (Memphis trades pick and Parsons to Cleveland for #8 and Love) - Doncic
Dallas - Jackson Jr.
Orlando - Young
Chicago - Bagley
Memphis (after Love/pick swap with Cleveland) - Mikal Bridges
In several varying draft scenarios I have Dallas aggressively going after Randle in each one.
The only thing that’ll keep them from Randle, IMO, is if they go after Cousins. |
I remember reading last year that Divac had a major hard on for him.
In his defense though, I think Divac is feeling quite secure in his job (kind of like Baylor with the Clippers) and he feels like they need to go after the guy who has the most potential to be a franchise cornerstone/instant go-to guy.
For Divac, even with the injury risk, Porter Jr. is that guy. He probably feels like Doncic has strong roleplayer potential and all the other bigs don’t have Porter’s impact potential. _________________ A creative scorer, a wing defender, and a shooter. |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:07 am Post subject: |
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adkindo wrote: | IMO....this week is kind of the best and worst week for the draft.....on one had, there will be lots of attention and content which is good....but on the other hand, this is usually when bs starts flowing like margarita's at a Jimmy Buffet beach party. |
Mmmm...bs margaritas... _________________ Under New Management |
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