After watching The philly "process" players some may believe the Grass is Greener...
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LakerLanny
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:15 am    Post subject:

MJST wrote:


Pretty much thinking this was Jim and Mitch's plan.

However Magic came in and is now trying to rush everything to happen by 2017 and it's hurting us more than it's helping us.


Ridiculous.

Whatever Mitch and Jim's "plan" was, it clearly was doomed and not working. They cratered the franchise.

Magic is raising the expectation level which it is well past time to do around the organization after the bumbling, low energy Kupchak/Jimbo era.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:15 am    Post subject:

I have no problem saluting the 76ers with their talented core. This isn't even taking into account Fultz, who could end up being a great 3rd piece of the puzzle.

I don't think they want to go the LBJ route TBH. They have an internal culture, have their own mini-LBJ.

Was talking with a co worker who is a diehard 76ers fan, and we agreed that the 76ers should instead go after someone like Avery Bradley. Imagine this:

Fultz
Bradley
Covington
Simmons
Embiid

That's probably the best EC team for the next 5 years.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:17 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
I have no problem saluting the 76ers with their talented core. This isn't even taking into account Fultz, who could end up being a great 3rd piece of the puzzle.

I don't think they want to go the LBJ route TBH. They have an internal culture, have their own mini-LBJ.

Was talking with a co worker who is a diehard 76ers fan, and we agreed that the 76ers should instead go after someone like Avery Bradley. Imagine this:

Fultz
Bradley
Covington
Simmons
Embiid

That's probably the best EC team for the next 5 years.


Totally agree. They don't need Lebron really. They got Simmons. Love Avery Bradley. He is who I was hoping we would add to our team over the superstar route.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:19 am    Post subject:

They looked ok, other then Ben and Em they have no one. We still should have won that game. Put Bogut on Embed after we take the lead we win that game.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:21 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I have no problem saluting the 76ers with their talented core. This isn't even taking into account Fultz, who could end up being a great 3rd piece of the puzzle.

I don't think they want to go the LBJ route TBH. They have an internal culture, have their own mini-LBJ.

Was talking with a co worker who is a diehard 76ers fan, and we agreed that the 76ers should instead go after someone like Avery Bradley. Imagine this:

Fultz
Bradley
Covington
Simmons
Embiid

That's probably the best EC team for the next 5 years.


Totally agree. They don't need Lebron really. They got Simmons. Love Avery Bradley. He is who I was hoping we would add to our team over the superstar route.


They are the one team I would argue against adding LBJ. This is Simmons's show and he should run it with Embiid. What they need is a 3/D guard and they're set.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:30 am    Post subject:

The way the Covington extension is structured, they are preparing for a big 2018 FA, with 30.8 million open. Could have a Lebron sized max I think if they also dump Bayless, which shouldn't be too hard (8.6 mn expiring).
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:33 am    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
The way the Covington extension is structured, they are preparing for a big 2018 FA, with 30.8 million open. Could have a Lebron sized max I think if they also dump Bayless, which shouldn't be too hard (8.6 mn expiring).


Would you chase LBJ if you were the 76ers, or use that possible 30m to add Bradley and a few more players?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:36 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
The way the Covington extension is structured, they are preparing for a big 2018 FA, with 30.8 million open. Could have a Lebron sized max I think if they also dump Bayless, which shouldn't be too hard (8.6 mn expiring).


Would you chase LBJ if you were the 76ers, or use that possible 30m to add Bradley and a few more players?


I think you stack the mega stars and figure out the other pieces later. You'll also get ring chasing role players coming in. Can you imagine a Lebron who doesn't have to play big minutes?
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:38 am    Post subject:

Embiid and Simmons looked amazing... but their team shot 10% better than us and we still could have won the game. Sure, Redick had an off night but Lopez, Lonzo, Julius, and KCP had terrible shooting issues and we were right there. Do we have a center as good as Embiid? No, but we might if we get Cousins. Do we have an all around player as good as Simmons? No, but if Lonzo does his normal playmaking job... we would have neutralized him with the combination of Kuz and Lonzo. The X factor here is Covington... his FG percentage for four years was worse than Ingram's rookie season. Do you believe he will continue to shoot 50% the rest of the year? If you do then maybe their young core is better... however, if you believe Covington can shoot 10% better after four years of futility... then you have to believe that so can Lonzo and Ingram. If Lonzo and Ingram shoot better in four years... then our young core is better than theirs.

We had two young players shoot career highs and this board felt like a Philly or at best a neutral NBA board last night. Yes, I concede both Embiid and Simmons are excellent... projecting in my mind as all stars... but I see only Simmons as ahead of us on the development curve, and I can easily see Kuzma and Ingram looking like all stars in their fourth years... and I still see Ball right with them if he can fix his mental/shooting issues. The thing is, our whole plan has been to sign two all stars... if we complete that as planned... we are better than Philly even if Fultz pans out. The only thing that went wrong last night was Ball's shooting and Luke's coaching... everything else looked rosy.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:40 am    Post subject:

fiendishoc wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
The way the Covington extension is structured, they are preparing for a big 2018 FA, with 30.8 million open. Could have a Lebron sized max I think if they also dump Bayless, which shouldn't be too hard (8.6 mn expiring).


Would you chase LBJ if you were the 76ers, or use that possible 30m to add Bradley and a few more players?


I think you stack the mega stars and figure out the other pieces later. You'll also get ring chasing role players coming in. Can you imagine a Lebron who doesn't have to play big minutes?


Is that 30m cap space with Bayless being moved?

Not that it matters, but my 76ers friends don't want LBJ. Strange as that sounds.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:46 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
fiendishoc wrote:
The way the Covington extension is structured, they are preparing for a big 2018 FA, with 30.8 million open. Could have a Lebron sized max I think if they also dump Bayless, which shouldn't be too hard (8.6 mn expiring).


Would you chase LBJ if you were the 76ers, or use that possible 30m to add Bradley and a few more players?


I think you stack the mega stars and figure out the other pieces later. You'll also get ring chasing role players coming in. Can you imagine a Lebron who doesn't have to play big minutes?


Is that 30m cap space with Bayless being moved?

Not that it matters, but my 76ers friends don't want LBJ. Strange as that sounds.


No, that's before he's moved and before potential draft picks and stashes coming back. (But I'd assume that part of those would also be going out with Bayless). So hypothetically they would have 38mn or so.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:49 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
Embiid and Simmons looked amazing... but their team shot 10% better than us and we still could have won the game. Sure, Redick had an off night but Lopez, Lonzo, Julius, and KCP had terrible shooting issues and we were right there. Do we have a center as good as Embiid? No, but we might if we get Cousins. Do we have an all around player as good as Simmons? No, but if Lonzo does his normal playmaking job... we would have neutralized him with the combination of Kuz and Lonzo. The X factor here is Covington... his FG percentage for four years was worse than Ingram's rookie season. Do you believe he will continue to shoot 50% the rest of the year? If you do then maybe their young core is better... however, if you believe Covington can shoot 10% better after four years of futility... then you have to believe that so can Lonzo and Ingram. If Lonzo and Ingram shoot better in four years... then our young core is better than theirs.

We had two young players shoot career highs and this board felt like a Philly or at best a neutral NBA board last night. Yes, I concede both Embiid and Simmons are excellent... projecting in my mind as all stars... but I see only Simmons as ahead of us on the development curve, and I can easily see Kuzma and Ingram looking like all stars in their fourth years... and I still see Ball right with them if he can fix his mental/shooting issues. The thing is, our whole plan has been to sign two all stars... if we complete that as planned... we are better than Philly even if Fultz pans out. The only thing that went wrong last night was Ball's shooting and Luke's coaching... everything else looked rosy.

How can anyone watch last night and think Lonzo is "right there" with Embiid? Embiid punked the entire Ball family while Lonzo completely shrunk under the pressure.

By the way, Philly also gets our draft pick this year.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:56 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
Embiid and Simmons looked amazing... but their team shot 10% better than us and we still could have won the game. Sure, Redick had an off night but Lopez, Lonzo, Julius, and KCP had terrible shooting issues and we were right there. Do we have a center as good as Embiid? No, but we might if we get Cousins. Do we have an all around player as good as Simmons? No, but if Lonzo does his normal playmaking job... we would have neutralized him with the combination of Kuz and Lonzo. The X factor here is Covington... his FG percentage for four years was worse than Ingram's rookie season. Do you believe he will continue to shoot 50% the rest of the year? If you do then maybe their young core is better... however, if you believe Covington can shoot 10% better after four years of futility... then you have to believe that so can Lonzo and Ingram. If Lonzo and Ingram shoot better in four years... then our young core is better than theirs.

We had two young players shoot career highs and this board felt like a Philly or at best a neutral NBA board last night. Yes, I concede both Embiid and Simmons are excellent... projecting in my mind as all stars... but I see only Simmons as ahead of us on the development curve, and I can easily see Kuzma and Ingram looking like all stars in their fourth years... and I still see Ball right with them if he can fix his mental/shooting issues. The thing is, our whole plan has been to sign two all stars... if we complete that as planned... we are better than Philly even if Fultz pans out. The only thing that went wrong last night was Ball's shooting and Luke's coaching... everything else looked rosy.

Spot on analysis.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:03 am    Post subject:

Did you even read what I said?

I said Embiid and Simmons played like future all stars.
I said Covington was the X factor as he's shooting 10% above his career average after four years.

Our plan has been to sign two free agents all along.

If we sign any two of LBJ, PG13, or Boogie... this neutralizes Embiid and Simmons.

If you include Covington as part of the young Philly core, then you need to consider what our youngsters will be after four years.

The rest of our young core is better than Philly's if you take the best four or five of Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Nance, Clarkson, Randle because we are deeper.

You disregarded nearly everything I said and fixated on Ball who had an atrocious game. You disregarded the fact that we could have beaten these two future stars with zero contribution at point guard. Ball will play better and get over his shooting issues, but even if he didn't... we still win that game with any average NBA shooter in his place.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:06 am    Post subject:

I think the 76ers are in a great place b/c they have young talent, but also some cap flexibility (b/f they have to worry about extending Simmons/Saric/Fultz) and possibility for a sustained 6-7 year run.

PG13/LBJ/Boogie would be amazing, but they are also closer to being out of their primes and would be a shorter run (2-4 years)
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:20 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
crucifixion wrote:
Inverse wrote:
Hard for me to imagine we lose this game if D'Angelo Russell is on our squad still

Lonzo
DLO
Ingram
Kuzma
Randle

would've beaten the sixers today, even if they were having career nights. Yeah I know, DLO isn't on the team, move on blah blah blah. W/e point is, we've drafted good players too

The loss today is on Luke. He embarrassed Randle by letting him get destroyed out there


We got the kuzma pick by getting rid of DLo. You can't assume kuzma would've been there one pick later.


Oh lord, this crap again?


But the bolded is true.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:21 am    Post subject:

Ujah's Goat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
crucifixion wrote:
Inverse wrote:
Hard for me to imagine we lose this game if D'Angelo Russell is on our squad still

Lonzo
DLO
Ingram
Kuzma
Randle

would've beaten the sixers today, even if they were having career nights. Yeah I know, DLO isn't on the team, move on blah blah blah. W/e point is, we've drafted good players too

The loss today is on Luke. He embarrassed Randle by letting him get destroyed out there


We got the kuzma pick by getting rid of DLo. You can't assume kuzma would've been there one pick later.


Oh lord, this crap again?


But the bolded is true.


No. B/c you CAN assume he would have been there. But I'm not relitigating this.

I love how the DLO dump went from:

-2 max baby
-ok, maybe Brook and KCP
-ok, maybe it's Kuz baby
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:25 am    Post subject:

trablos wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
Embiid and Simmons looked amazing... but their team shot 10% better than us and we still could have won the game. Sure, Redick had an off night but Lopez, Lonzo, Julius, and KCP had terrible shooting issues and we were right there. Do we have a center as good as Embiid? No, but we might if we get Cousins. Do we have an all around player as good as Simmons? No, but if Lonzo does his normal playmaking job... we would have neutralized him with the combination of Kuz and Lonzo. The X factor here is Covington... his FG percentage for four years was worse than Ingram's rookie season. Do you believe he will continue to shoot 50% the rest of the year? If you do then maybe their young core is better... however, if you believe Covington can shoot 10% better after four years of futility... then you have to believe that so can Lonzo and Ingram. If Lonzo and Ingram shoot better in four years... then our young core is better than theirs.

We had two young players shoot career highs and this board felt like a Philly or at best a neutral NBA board last night. Yes, I concede both Embiid and Simmons are excellent... projecting in my mind as all stars... but I see only Simmons as ahead of us on the development curve, and I can easily see Kuzma and Ingram looking like all stars in their fourth years... and I still see Ball right with them if he can fix his mental/shooting issues. The thing is, our whole plan has been to sign two all stars... if we complete that as planned... we are better than Philly even if Fultz pans out. The only thing that went wrong last night was Ball's shooting and Luke's coaching... everything else looked rosy.

Spot on analysis.


+1000. Everyone was saying Embiid is a HOF player because why? He dropped most of his 46 and 7 blocks on Randle in single coverage. Randle was having a particularly bad game by his standards. Ball was missing. As a team we shot knly 38.5%. And we still almost came out with the W.

Laker fans suck sometimes I swear.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:27 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Ujah's Goat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
crucifixion wrote:
Inverse wrote:
Hard for me to imagine we lose this game if D'Angelo Russell is on our squad still

Lonzo
DLO
Ingram
Kuzma
Randle

would've beaten the sixers today, even if they were having career nights. Yeah I know, DLO isn't on the team, move on blah blah blah. W/e point is, we've drafted good players too

The loss today is on Luke. He embarrassed Randle by letting him get destroyed out there


We got the kuzma pick by getting rid of DLo. You can't assume kuzma would've been there one pick later.


Oh lord, this crap again?


But the bolded is true.


No. B/c you CAN assume he would have been there. But I'm not relitigating this.

I love how the DLO dump went from:

-2 max baby
-ok, maybe Brook and KCP
-ok, maybe it's Kuz baby


Kuz said that the Nets were interested in drafting him.
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:28 am    Post subject:

Ujah's Goat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Ujah's Goat wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
crucifixion wrote:
Inverse wrote:
Hard for me to imagine we lose this game if D'Angelo Russell is on our squad still

Lonzo
DLO
Ingram
Kuzma
Randle

would've beaten the sixers today, even if they were having career nights. Yeah I know, DLO isn't on the team, move on blah blah blah. W/e point is, we've drafted good players too

The loss today is on Luke. He embarrassed Randle by letting him get destroyed out there


We got the kuzma pick by getting rid of DLo. You can't assume kuzma would've been there one pick later.


Oh lord, this crap again?


But the bolded is true.


No. B/c you CAN assume he would have been there. But I'm not relitigating this.

I love how the DLO dump went from:

-2 max baby
-ok, maybe Brook and KCP
-ok, maybe it's Kuz baby


Kuz said that the Nets were interested in drafting him.


Yet they had a 22nd pick and didn't pick him and in fact traded the pick. Lakers have consistently said they were high on Kuz. I mean this is really a senseless argument. I wont get back into that.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:30 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
Did you even read what I said?

I said Embiid and Simmons played like future all stars.
I said Covington was the X factor as he's shooting 10% above his career average after four years.

Our plan has been to sign two free agents all along.

If we sign any two of LBJ, PG13, or Boogie... this neutralizes Embiid and Simmons.

If you include Covington as part of the young Philly core, then you need to consider what our youngsters will be after four years.

The rest of our young core is better than Philly's if you take the best four or five of Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Nance, Clarkson, Randle because we are deeper.

You disregarded nearly everything I said and fixated on Ball who had an atrocious game. You disregarded the fact that we could have beaten these two future stars with zero contribution at point guard. Ball will play better and get over his shooting issues, but even if he didn't... we still win that game with any average NBA shooter in his place.


Yes, if most teams sign two all NBA type players, they'll be good. This is the pipe dream Magic and Pelinka are selling. If it happens, and I don't think it will, I'll tip my cap. I won't care about Ball's struggles or all the Russell deal. if it fails, they're up sheet creek without a paddle.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:31 am    Post subject:

Regarding the 2 max plan (because let’s face it, we better hit on that)...Kuzma and Ingram are showing things that would be attractive to the FAs. We need Lonzo to start showing a bit more than what he has though.

The good thing is the Lakers have competed pretty well in just about every game with exception of opening night. A lot of that is the defense, but it certainly helps. I was afraid they would get blown out like last season and no one would join that.

But yeah, our route requires 2 max star FAs. Sixers route was different as they sucked for longer and actually got a #1 pick in a year where Simmons was undisputed top pick.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:34 am    Post subject:

If we get PG13/Boogie, we'll have a nice 3-4 year window given their age. Hopefully by then BI/Lonzo will be hitting their stride.

With LBJ, I fear more younglings will be traded for vets as he would be more "championship now" than even a PG/Boogie summer.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:34 am    Post subject:

lakers4life78 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
Did you even read what I said?

I said Embiid and Simmons played like future all stars.
I said Covington was the X factor as he's shooting 10% above his career average after four years.

Our plan has been to sign two free agents all along.

If we sign any two of LBJ, PG13, or Boogie... this neutralizes Embiid and Simmons.

If you include Covington as part of the young Philly core, then you need to consider what our youngsters will be after four years.

The rest of our young core is better than Philly's if you take the best four or five of Ball, Ingram, Kuzma, Nance, Clarkson, Randle because we are deeper.

You disregarded nearly everything I said and fixated on Ball who had an atrocious game. You disregarded the fact that we could have beaten these two future stars with zero contribution at point guard. Ball will play better and get over his shooting issues, but even if he didn't... we still win that game with any average NBA shooter in his place.


Yes, if most teams sign two all NBA type players, they'll be good. This is the pipe dream Magic and Pelinka are selling. If it happens, and I don't think it will, I'll tip my cap. I won't care about Ball's struggles or all the Russell deal. if it fails, they're up sheet creek without a paddle.


Even if we only sign one which I think almost any NBA analyst would tell you isn't a pipe dream... and Lonzo's shooting resolves itself we are a playoff team. Then we add Klay the following season... still better than Philly.
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:34 am    Post subject:

ducasse2 wrote:
Embiid is talented but fragile. There's a pretty good chance his career gets limited by future injuries.



Yup. Embiid and Simmons were amazing. I would be ecstatic if they were on my team going forward. But Embiid's body does not bode well for long term play. Big men deteriorate more quickly. Guys like Shaq are freak of nature.
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