LaVar Ball, Luke Walton Have Vastly Different Approaches to Developing Youth
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:18 pm    Post subject: LaVar Ball, Luke Walton Have Vastly Different Approaches to Developing Youth

Hey all,

At @BleacherReport LaVar Ball, Luke Walton Have Vastly Different Approaches to Developing Youth - Both are powerful voices in Lonzo's ear. Call it an old vs. new school battle
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2745234-lavar-ball-luke-walton-have-vastly-different-approaches-to-developing-youth

Please read beyond the headline and gotcha quotes, lol.

Cheers,

Eric
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:46 pm    Post subject:

...

Last edited by fusuyballer on Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:47 pm    Post subject:

I agree with Lavar Ball about the toughness of this team. They need to be held to a standard and to develop mental toughness. Even Kobe was disgusted with these guys doing the Lin era...i.e the cursing in practice and Kimmel episode.

Instead of holding Lonzo's hand, he needs to be held to the fire. Play with energy, hustle, and aggressiveness, or sit down and let someone else play.

That should be the standard with Lonzo. I can understand him missing shots, I don't wanna hear anything about how he lost his confidence because his shot wasn't falling. The moment you stop fighting or lose ur confidence, next man up.

You know what else? Jordan Clarkson, Brandon Ingram, and Julius Randle should have mastered the art of taking care of the ball by now and should be pulled out of games when they don't.

Some of you guys don't like Lavar and I do not care. He is right about this team and many of these young teams in the NBA today. Tough love can be a good thing. I think a lot of these young teams...including the Lakers could use some of it..
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:52 pm    Post subject:

Could a good cop, bad cop routine between Luke and LaVar provide a benefit to the Lakers? It's an interesting question at the least. Probably would be difficult if Ball started to talk about players other than Lonzo.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 1:57 pm    Post subject:

And although it does seem like Lavar contradicts himself at times...this being one of those times. I do tend to think that tough love is better for young people ....including young athletes more than being a players coach. I think a players' coach is more for veterans who have earned their right to police themselves, i.e. the Houston Rockets under Rudy T. Tough love is great as long as the love is there when you're dealing with young people. I imagine what this team would be like with a tougher-minded coach. A fighter / with coaching acumen who could teach Lonzo and co how to fight as much as win.

I saw Gary Payton coaching in ice cube's league. I don't know how good GP is when it comes to x and os, i imagine he would be pretty good because he ran the PG position. I think he has a great personality for coaching, he's in ur face but he's a good dude. I wish he spent more time on the sidelines so he could be in the running for a coaching job now.

I also want to say this. I was watching Earl Watson on Undisputed talk about Lonzo Ball.....and Earl is an intelligent guy and seems like a good dude...Earl comes off as the kind of guy that wants to be a players mentor/coach/friend, etc. I also believe that's one of the reasons Earl is out of a job as we speak.

The second game of the season Lonzo and co-ran through the Suns "soft" defense...As much as I think PHX upper mgmt is crap, as smart as Earl is, his team did not play hard enough under him..you can make that same argument that their not playing hard enough for the interim coach.

My point is, young coaches, dont always have the gusto to deal with young players and hold them accountable. They try to be these players friends instead of holding them to a standard, and that can be a big mistake.

So, this just confirms what Lavar was saying in this article about young players. They need to be pushed and not babied into being soft. You baby them and they wont fight for you....and when they stop fighting, you might as well pack your bags.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:46 pm    Post subject:

LaVAR is clueless...why anyone listens to his alligator mouth
is beyond me..
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 4:54 pm    Post subject:

fusuyballer wrote:
And although it does seem like Lavar contradicts himself at times...this being one of those times. I do tend to think that tough love is better for young people ....including young athletes more than being a players coach. I think a players' coach is more for veterans who have earned their right to police themselves, i.e. the Houston Rockets under Rudy T. Tough love is great as long as the love is there when you're dealing with young people. I imagine what this team would be like with a tougher-minded coach. A fighter / with coaching acumen who could teach Lonzo and co how to fight as much as win.


This approach worked out really well for Byron.
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:28 pm    Post subject:

Its easy to think that the Lakers are a "soft" team considering Luke is always about the positive comments when talking to the press or maybe when Zo walks away from a confrontation. Even the players don't talk or tweet big on other players or teams. But when you're a top 5 or 6 defensive team, I'm thinking that makes for a pretty tough team. It takes a lot of focus, strength and trust to get there, especially knowing that there's not a lot of recognition or highlights. What I think Lavar really wants is a loud boisterous yeller because I think he thinks that equates to coaching. But guess what, Kuz, Randle and Clarkson don't seem to have a problem scoring. And they all have the same coach as Zo.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:41 am    Post subject:

Yeah, this lakers team is far from "soft". They play stupid at times (like any young team does) but they never give up and are constantly coming back in games when going down. They scrap and battle every game which makes me as a fan always have hope once again that every single game is winnable.

I think just throwing a young player in the fire works for some players and can hurt the future potential of others. You have to judge that on a player to player basis and should never just be a general rule imo and that goes for pretty much every sport. Lonzo is still growing into his body and probably a year or two away from where he is going to feel much more comfortable and take it to another level regardless of what any coach does (kind of like both randle and ingram especially).

I see a lot of people hating walton as a coach but I am the polar opposite and love what he has instilled in this team and made the overall feel and culture leaps and bounds better then it has been for quite awhile. Some of his rotations can be frustrating and I think he could use some more veteran coaches on the bench but like his team he is still learning on the fly as well and will only improve as time goes imo.

Obviously, a lot is riding on the upcoming off season but unless we somehow got Pop or one of maybe 3-4 other guys I would rather stick with Luke then any other coaches right now.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 1:41 pm    Post subject:

I'm on the look at Luke bus. He's a young first year head coach with a lot to learn. He has a young talented team with a lot to learn. I'm a armchair coach as are many in the forum, with no NBA coaching experience. I don't like some of Luke's rotations but I don't know the players as well as he does. I'm confident he'll be OK.

LaVar Ball is a loud mouth father who seems to only have his son in his game plan. In the article he said Lonzo's been away from him to long. I hope Lonzo listens respectfully to his father and learns what Luke and Magic are trying to teach. LaVar has no idea what it takes to "just win."

I trust Magic, Luke and Shaw will show Lonzo how the NBA works, it's not like high school or college.

I don't like Lonzo's shot %. Magic couldn't shoot when he first came to the NBA. He developed it during and in the off season. I'm giving Lonzo the benefit of the doubt and hope to see some improvement in % during and in next season. Unless his % improves during the season it may be time to work on his release.

I'm liking #27.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 1:59 pm    Post subject:

deal wrote:
LaVAR is clueless...why anyone listens to his alligator mouth
is beyond me..

you wish her were clueless. But in reality he isnt. at least not when it comes to his son and basketball. He built the zo you see. not all the brick laying. but the overall way he plays is a cross between Zo's personal mentality and love for lebron(his favorite player), and Lavar balls favorite player (Magic Johnson).
Both bron and magic could start a break after grabbing a defense rebound. So can Zo.

Lavar knows this because he taught him to do it.
Yes lavar is a loud mouth father. but unlike a lot of player parents. lavar played semi pro sports and college sports, even the mom was a sports athlete(i think hoops too). You have 2 other brothers that are at worse superstars at the high school level in your state. Zo's Uncles are twins who were also High school basketball stars in their day.

This aint no regular daddy yapping. He knows the game a bit. especially his sons game and how he's trained him up.

Now does that mean he has to have a lavar(yeller, tough love) in his ear to push him? Probably. Does that mean thats the only person that should be in his ear? Probably not. It's a combination of a Tough love or Good Cop bad cop situation. Question for the lakers is, if luke is the good cop, who's playing bad cop? Is it Bshaw?
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:12 pm    Post subject:

^^^This is not high school, college, semi pro, it's the NBA a professional league, run by professionals. IMO LaVar should step back and let the pros handle it. I hope he's not the reason Zo is playing at such a low level. He may be pressing to please his father.
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:10 pm    Post subject:

As long as he sticks to Zo and not any other player or coach, I don't mind the criticism. At some point Zo has to 'man up' and find some consistency in his game. :Byroncrossarmsemoji:
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 8:03 am    Post subject:

Seriously, somehow ‘soft’ old Luke has gotten this team to play top 5 defense. Tough guy Byron got his team to play no defense what so ever.
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 24, 2017 9:27 am    Post subject:

Byron chimed in on it

Quote:
"Shut up," Scott said when asked whether Ball needs to let current Lakers coach Luke Walton coach, per a Thursday story from TMZ Sports. "Stay put. Stay on the sidelines. We got this."

Scott's comments come after Ball called the Lakers coaches "soft," per Eric Pincus of Bleacher Report.

"They don't know how to coach my son. I know how to coach him," Ball continued. "I tell him to go get the victory. Stop messing around."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2745767-ex-lakers-hc-byron-scott-on-lavar-ball-shut-up-stay-put

A Byron/LaVar rivalry could be even better than Trump

Also scares me that Byron used the term "We" no doubt he still has influence within the org
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject:

22 wrote:
Byron chimed in on it

Quote:
"Shut up," Scott said when asked whether Ball needs to let current Lakers coach Luke Walton coach, per a Thursday story from TMZ Sports. "Stay put. Stay on the sidelines. We got this."

Scott's comments come after Ball called the Lakers coaches "soft," per Eric Pincus of Bleacher Report.

"They don't know how to coach my son. I know how to coach him," Ball continued. "I tell him to go get the victory. Stop messing around."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2745767-ex-lakers-hc-byron-scott-on-lavar-ball-shut-up-stay-put

A Byron/LaVar rivalry could be even better than Trump

Also scares me that Byron used the term "We" no doubt he still has influence within the org


Yeah, that is scary!
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:37 am    Post subject:

22 wrote:
Byron chimed in on it

Quote:
"Shut up," Scott said when asked whether Ball needs to let current Lakers coach Luke Walton coach, per a Thursday story from TMZ Sports. "Stay put. Stay on the sidelines. We got this."

Scott's comments come after Ball called the Lakers coaches "soft," per Eric Pincus of Bleacher Report.

"They don't know how to coach my son. I know how to coach him," Ball continued. "I tell him to go get the victory. Stop messing around."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2745767-ex-lakers-hc-byron-scott-on-lavar-ball-shut-up-stay-put

A Byron/LaVar rivalry could be even better than Trump

Also scares me that Byron used the term "We" no doubt he still has influence within the org


Is it a surprise?
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:17 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
22 wrote:
Byron chimed in on it

Quote:
"Shut up," Scott said when asked whether Ball needs to let current Lakers coach Luke Walton coach, per a Thursday story from TMZ Sports. "Stay put. Stay on the sidelines. We got this."

Scott's comments come after Ball called the Lakers coaches "soft," per Eric Pincus of Bleacher Report.

"They don't know how to coach my son. I know how to coach him," Ball continued. "I tell him to go get the victory. Stop messing around."


http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2745767-ex-lakers-hc-byron-scott-on-lavar-ball-shut-up-stay-put

A Byron/LaVar rivalry could be even better than Trump

Also scares me that Byron used the term "We" no doubt he still has influence within the org


Is it a surprise?



Yep, LaVar shows his true colors with Trump, chicken yellow...
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:26 pm    Post subject:

splashmtn wrote:
deal wrote:
LaVAR is clueless...why anyone listens to his alligator mouth
is beyond me..

you wish her were clueless. But in reality he isnt. at least not when it comes to his son and basketball. He built the zo you see. not all the brick laying. but the overall way he plays is a cross between Zo's personal mentality and love for lebron(his favorite player), and Lavar balls favorite player (Magic Johnson).
Both bron and magic could start a break after grabbing a defense rebound. So can Zo.

Lavar knows this because he taught him to do it.
Yes lavar is a loud mouth father. but unlike a lot of player parents. lavar played semi pro sports and college sports, even the mom was a sports athlete(i think hoops too). You have 2 other brothers that are at worse superstars at the high school level in your state. Zo's Uncles are twins who were also High school basketball stars in their day.

This aint no regular daddy yapping. He knows the game a bit. especially his sons game and how he's trained him up.

Now does that mean he has to have a lavar(yeller, tough love) in his ear to push him? Probably. Does that mean thats the only person that should be in his ear? Probably not. It's a combination of a Tough love or Good Cop bad cop situation. Question for the lakers is, if luke is the good cop, who's playing bad cop? Is it Bshaw?



Write in English, that will help my comprehension.

Sounds like Zo has family members that played some basketball? Seems to me that Bill Walton, you know Luke's dad, is in the Hall of Fame; that should pretty much trump whatever you said about Zo's family. And Little Luke was a starter for the Los Angeles Lakers, assistant coach for the Championship team, etc. Don't go there, the Ball's have no place in that discussion.

Zo has a natural feel for the game, but that nice shot his dad let him develop will take him nowhere.

You may be in love with the Ball family but they are no where close to NBA basketball, unless you want to consider the dad's place in scrubsville.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 1:39 pm    Post subject:

deal wrote:
LaVAR is clueless...why anyone listens to his alligator mouth
is beyond me..
i know this phrase is over used when talking about someone you dont like. "so and so is clueless...why do people listen to so and so..its beyond me."

but in regards to lavar that is actually not the case when he's being serious and talking about basketball in regards to his son or even the lakers.

if me and you can talk about the lakers. so can he. he's older than a few of us and has been a laker fan as long as some of us if not longer. so he has every right to say something and have a take. just like us on LG. no different.

The fact that he actually is the reason his son plays like he does is also something to think about. Lavar was a coach, still is on that travelling team. lavar has been around basketball for a very long time and he trains kids. Actually he has more knowledge than most people on LG about the subject matter.

The truth is, you just dont like him so you want to put it off as if he's clueless when thats far from the case. now can you say he's wrong about this? sure. but clueless? Nope.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 1:44 pm    Post subject:

deal wrote:
splashmtn wrote:
deal wrote:
LaVAR is clueless...why anyone listens to his alligator mouth
is beyond me..

you wish her were clueless. But in reality he isnt. at least not when it comes to his son and basketball. He built the zo you see. not all the brick laying. but the overall way he plays is a cross between Zo's personal mentality and love for lebron(his favorite player), and Lavar balls favorite player (Magic Johnson).
Both bron and magic could start a break after grabbing a defense rebound. So can Zo.

Lavar knows this because he taught him to do it.
Yes lavar is a loud mouth father. but unlike a lot of player parents. lavar played semi pro sports and college sports, even the mom was a sports athlete(i think hoops too). You have 2 other brothers that are at worse superstars at the high school level in your state. Zo's Uncles are twins who were also High school basketball stars in their day.

This aint no regular daddy yapping. He knows the game a bit. especially his sons game and how he's trained him up.

Now does that mean he has to have a lavar(yeller, tough love) in his ear to push him? Probably. Does that mean thats the only person that should be in his ear? Probably not. It's a combination of a Tough love or Good Cop bad cop situation. Question for the lakers is, if luke is the good cop, who's playing bad cop? Is it Bshaw?



Write in English, that will help my comprehension.

Sounds like Zo has family members that played some basketball? Seems to me that Bill Walton, you know Luke's dad, is in the Hall of Fame; that should pretty much trump whatever you said about Zo's family. And Little Luke was a starter for the Los Angeles Lakers, assistant coach for the Championship team, etc. Don't go there, the Ball's have no place in that discussion.

Zo has a natural feel for the game, but that nice shot his dad let him develop will take him nowhere.

You may be in love with the Ball family but they are no where close to NBA basketball, unless you want to consider the dad's place in scrubsville.


i'll say it again. if you and I can comment on all things lakers. So can lavar ball. a guy that has played the sport, a guy that has coached the sport, and a fan of the los angeles lakers. just say I dont like him and get it over with. dont lie on the guy. he isnt clueless. and yes big bill walton has a ton of knowledge and so does luke. never said they didnt.

That still doesnt mean either walton can't be wrong. phil jackson was wrong at times. Greg Pop has been wrong at times.

lavar has a right to speak his mind just like you and I. if they stuck a mic in our faces and we were being honest. we would say the exact same stuff we type out on LG. there is no difference. except a lot of people on LG have never played organized basketball. or have never played stiff competition when they did or has never played against, with, nba caliber players. they have less of a clue than lavar ball in this regard. they have never coached possible nba talent or at worse top D1 4 to 5 star talent.

Lavar actually knows a little something something about basketball. you dont have to agree with his philosophy to admit he knows a thing or two. I dont always agree with MDA's philosophy but i still know that man knows basketball. i'm not a fool. and because I dont let me disdain for people cloud what I see in them. I wont do that with MDA. or anyone else thats a real nba coach or a just a smart fan.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 1:48 pm    Post subject:

Dr. Funkbot wrote:
Seriously, somehow ‘soft’ old Luke has gotten this team to play top 5 defense. Tough guy Byron got his team to play no defense what so ever.
horrible analogy. byron didnt have zo at pg either. who was better on defense in their first year Zo thus far or Dlo? i think we already know that answer.

Who was better on defense at Center when scott was the coach?

Luke has lopez a vet that has been a known shot blocker to some degree.

luke has KCP where's scott's KCP? didnt have one. oh, he had old man MWP i think right?lol

Byron didnt have josh hart, byron didnt have kuz. rookies who know how to move their feet laterally.

Byron had a younger Randle a more out of control randle that would show sparks from time to time. he's a fully grown man now. he no longer gets winded like a kid fresh out of college. he's in excellent shape(thanks to magic who was not running things when scott was here.)

clarkson is a better defender even if its just because he's been the nba for a few years now and knows some guys tendencies.

to make luke look good you dont even have to mention scott's name.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:34 pm    Post subject:

splashmtn wrote:
Dr. Funkbot wrote:
Seriously, somehow ‘soft’ old Luke has gotten this team to play top 5 defense. Tough guy Byron got his team to play no defense what so ever.
horrible analogy. byron didnt have zo at pg either. who was better on defense in their first year Zo thus far or Dlo? i think we already know that answer.

Who was better on defense at Center when scott was the coach?

Luke has lopez a vet that has been a known shot blocker to some degree.

luke has KCP where's scott's KCP? didnt have one. oh, he had old man MWP i think right?lol

Byron didnt have josh hart, byron didnt have kuz. rookies who know how to move their feet laterally.

Byron had a younger Randle a more out of control randle that would show sparks from time to time. he's a fully grown man now. he no longer gets winded like a kid fresh out of college. he's in excellent shape(thanks to magic who was not running things when scott was here.)

clarkson is a better defender even if its just because he's been the nba for a few years now and knows some guys tendencies.

to make luke look good you dont even have to mention scott's name.


It's fair to say that Luke has a far better group of defenders than Scott ever did. Lopez, Pope, Ball and Nance may not make an all-defensive team anytime soon, but they're better than anyone Scott had.

In addition, the Lakers have already dropped to the #7 defense, so it wouldn't shock me if they finish the season closer to the middle of the pack.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:24 pm    Post subject:

Lavar never played in the NBA so he has no clue what he's talking about.
Hell he was in D1 basketball but stunk that he transferred to D2 at Cal State LA.
Him being a good dad has no bearing on his NBA knowledge.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:27 pm    Post subject:

Pop never played in the NBA, not really relevant
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