NON-2 Max 2018 Summer Options
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BizLA
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:37 am    Post subject:

danzag wrote:
BizLA wrote:
deal wrote:
danzag wrote:
blackmamba08 wrote:
I actually really like this Dewayne Dedmon. He is big body, great defensive presence and can shoot some 3s. Great with boards and blocks. We do not need dominant center. We need someone to protect the rim and to be able to run. He is quite quick for his size and can switch to guard smaller players. For reasonable deal I will take it.


I'd love to see him on the Lakers



He usually looks like a backup; the question is if Zu and Bryant can hold down the C with one of Nance and/or Randle.


Randle & Nance need to go.


Nope


Undersized guys with no skill isn’t a winning combination.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:54 am    Post subject:

BizLA wrote:
danzag wrote:
BizLA wrote:
deal wrote:
danzag wrote:
blackmamba08 wrote:
I actually really like this Dewayne Dedmon. He is big body, great defensive presence and can shoot some 3s. Great with boards and blocks. We do not need dominant center. We need someone to protect the rim and to be able to run. He is quite quick for his size and can switch to guard smaller players. For reasonable deal I will take it.


I'd love to see him on the Lakers



He usually looks like a backup; the question is if Zu and Bryant can hold down the C with one of Nance and/or Randle.


Randle & Nance need to go.


Nope


Undersized guys with no skill isn’t a winning combination.


right....the kid out of Plano, Texas ranked the #2 player in the country coming out of high school by Rivals and 247Sports as a 5 Star Prospect in both now has no skills
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:56 am    Post subject:

BizLA wrote:
danzag wrote:
BizLA wrote:
deal wrote:
danzag wrote:
blackmamba08 wrote:
I actually really like this Dewayne Dedmon. He is big body, great defensive presence and can shoot some 3s. Great with boards and blocks. We do not need dominant center. We need someone to protect the rim and to be able to run. He is quite quick for his size and can switch to guard smaller players. For reasonable deal I will take it.


I'd love to see him on the Lakers



He usually looks like a backup; the question is if Zu and Bryant can hold down the C with one of Nance and/or Randle.


Randle & Nance need to go.


Nope


Undersized guys with no skill isn’t a winning combination.



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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 6:15 am    Post subject:

At this point (and others can help me with the cap #s), my preferred plan assuming we don't get any max FAs this summer is to punt 1 max forward to 2019, and spend whatever else cap on long-term vets.

There would be less of a need to trade/stretch Deng in that circumstance, so we would have at the least, 10m less in cap space.

I'm not sure what the team would do with Jules/JC, as it seems at least with JC, that there may be mutual feelings about parting.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:25 am    Post subject:

Thanks to the amazing Bard207 who came up with an estimate of how much space we'd have, assuming:

1. we didn't spend cap on max FAs b/c they declined;
2. kept Deng
3. kept JC
4. extended Jules on a 15m/year deal.

Quote:
* $101 million Salary Cap

$18,000,000......Luol Deng (1)
$12,500,000......Jordan Clarkson (2)
$15,000,000......Julius Randle (3)

$7,461,960........Lonzo Ball (4)
$5,757,120........Brandon Ingram (5)
$2,272,391........Larry Nance Jr. (6)
$1,689,840........Kyle Kuzma (7)
$1,655,160........Josh Hart (8)
$1,544,951........Ivica Zubac (9)
$1,378,242........Thomas Bryant (10)

$831,311...........Min Salary (11)
$831,311...........Min Salary (12)


Roughly $32 million in cap space.

Trade JC you have around 45m. Stretch Deng too (why?), you'd have around 55m to play around with. Assuming we'd have to punt around 35m for 1 max in 2019, the most we could play around with may be around 20m assuming the criteria above.

If you kept Jules at 15m/year, and had 20m in cap space to spent on long-term deals, and possibly 35m to use for expiring deals as a budget, what would you do?
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:41 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Thanks to the amazing Bard207 who came up with an estimate of how much space we'd have, assuming:

1. we didn't spend cap on max FAs b/c they declined;
2. kept Deng
3. kept JC
4. extended Jules on a 15m/year deal.

Quote:
* $101 million Salary Cap

$18,000,000......Luol Deng (1)
$12,500,000......Jordan Clarkson (2)
$15,000,000......Julius Randle (3)

$7,461,960........Lonzo Ball (4)
$5,757,120........Brandon Ingram (5)
$2,272,391........Larry Nance Jr. (6)
$1,689,840........Kyle Kuzma (7)
$1,655,160........Josh Hart (8)
$1,544,951........Ivica Zubac (9)
$1,378,242........Thomas Bryant (10)

$831,311...........Min Salary (11)
$831,311...........Min Salary (12)


Roughly $32 million in cap space.

Trade JC you have around 45m. Stretch Deng too (why?), you'd have around 55m to play around with. Assuming we'd have to punt around 35m for 1 max in 2019, the most we could play around with may be around 20m assuming the criteria above.

If you kept Jules at 15m/year, and had 20m in cap space to spent on long-term deals, and possibly 35m to use for expiring deals as a budget, what would you do?

a $32 mil max... would 'he' come alone? cause this would be the ideal situation then Deng becomes a $18mil expiring and we can go for another max next yr
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 7:57 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
BizLA wrote:
danzag wrote:
BizLA wrote:
deal wrote:
danzag wrote:
blackmamba08 wrote:
I actually really like this Dewayne Dedmon. He is big body, great defensive presence and can shoot some 3s. Great with boards and blocks. We do not need dominant center. We need someone to protect the rim and to be able to run. He is quite quick for his size and can switch to guard smaller players. For reasonable deal I will take it.


I'd love to see him on the Lakers



He usually looks like a backup; the question is if Zu and Bryant can hold down the C with one of Nance and/or Randle.


Randle & Nance need to go.


Nope


Undersized guys with no skill isn’t a winning combination.


right....the kid out of Plano, Texas ranked the #2 player in the country coming out of high school by Rivals and 247Sports as a 5 Star Prospect in both now has no skills


A guy that can’t even hit a mid range shot consistently isn’t too skilled to me
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:15 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
Thanks to the amazing Bard207 who came up with an estimate of how much space we'd have, assuming:

1. we didn't spend cap on max FAs b/c they declined;
2. kept Deng
3. kept JC
4. extended Jules on a 15m/year deal.

Quote:
* $101 million Salary Cap

$18,000,000......Luol Deng (1)
$12,500,000......Jordan Clarkson (2)
$15,000,000......Julius Randle (3)

$7,461,960........Lonzo Ball (4)
$5,757,120........Brandon Ingram (5)
$2,272,391........Larry Nance Jr. (6)
$1,689,840........Kyle Kuzma (7)
$1,655,160........Josh Hart (8)
$1,544,951........Ivica Zubac (9)
$1,378,242........Thomas Bryant (10)

$831,311...........Min Salary (11)
$831,311...........Min Salary (12)


Roughly $32 million in cap space.

Trade JC you have around 45m. Stretch Deng too (why?), you'd have around 55m to play around with. Assuming we'd have to punt around 35m for 1 max in 2019, the most we could play around with may be around 20m assuming the criteria above.

If you kept Jules at 15m/year, and had 20m in cap space to spent on long-term deals, and possibly 35m to use for expiring deals as a budget, what would you do?

a $32 mil max... would 'he' come alone? cause this would be the ideal situation then Deng becomes a $18mil expiring and we can go for another max next yr


For purposes of this thread, am assuming no PG13/LBJ/Boogie/any 'max' FAs.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:17 am    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Thanks to the amazing Bard207 who came up with an estimate of how much space we'd have, assuming:

1. we didn't spend cap on max FAs b/c they declined;
2. kept Deng
3. kept JC
4. extended Jules on a 15m/year deal.

Quote:
* $101 million Salary Cap

$18,000,000......Luol Deng (1)
$12,500,000......Jordan Clarkson (2)
$15,000,000......Julius Randle (3)

$7,461,960........Lonzo Ball (4)
$5,757,120........Brandon Ingram (5)
$2,272,391........Larry Nance Jr. (6)
$1,689,840........Kyle Kuzma (7)
$1,655,160........Josh Hart (8)
$1,544,951........Ivica Zubac (9)
$1,378,242........Thomas Bryant (10)

$831,311...........Min Salary (11)
$831,311...........Min Salary (12)


Roughly $32 million in cap space.

Trade JC you have around 45m. Stretch Deng too (why?), you'd have around 55m to play around with. Assuming we'd have to punt around 35m for 1 max in 2019, the most we could play around with may be around 20m assuming the criteria above.

If you kept Jules at 15m/year, and had 20m in cap space to spent on long-term deals, and possibly 35m to use for expiring deals as a budget, what would you do?


If it were possible, at not too high a cost, trading for PG would be (would have been) the most prudent move. According to reports, he was willing to opt in for Cleveland which makes me think he would have opted in with us for a year if it also meant we could have gotten LeBron. In that situation, we trade for PG, he opts it, we sign LeBron, then we re-sign Randle. We lose JC to trade and stretch Deng but keeping Randle was/is possible under the scenario.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
My guess is if Magic strikes out on free agency, he'll go with the young guys, punt with one-year contracts and go after free agents next year. Don't know who's on the market.


This is exactly what I think he'll do. 2-3 FA's on one year contracts, with options on 2nd year. Try again in 2019.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:23 am    Post subject:

King Randle wrote:
activeverb wrote:
My guess is if Magic strikes out on free agency, he'll go with the young guys, punt with one-year contracts and go after free agents next year. Don't know who's on the market.


This is exactly what I think he'll do. 2-3 FA's on one year contracts, with options on 2nd year. Try again in 2019.


Trying to punt 2 max into 2019 is insanity. That would show ineptitude of the highest order.

Punt 1 max, develop the rest of the team.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:30 am    Post subject:

BizLA wrote:
deal wrote:
danzag wrote:
blackmamba08 wrote:
I actually really like this Dewayne Dedmon. He is big body, great defensive presence and can shoot some 3s. Great with boards and blocks. We do not need dominant center. We need someone to protect the rim and to be able to run. He is quite quick for his size and can switch to guard smaller players. For reasonable deal I will take it.


I'd love to see him on the Lakers



He usually looks like a backup; the question is if Zu and Bryant can hold down the C with one of Nance and/or Randle.


Randle & Nance need to go.


Gotta preserve the tank
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:32 am    Post subject:

King Randle wrote:
activeverb wrote:
My guess is if Magic strikes out on free agency, he'll go with the young guys, punt with one-year contracts and go after free agents next year. Don't know who's on the market.


This is exactly what I think he'll do. 2-3 FA's on one year contracts, with options on 2nd year. Try again in 2019.


Yes, the Jim Buss plan
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:07 am    Post subject:

I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:17 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.

There's nothing we can do. Jeanie signs Magic and Rob's checks.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:22 am    Post subject:

Do you guys have any inside info on upcoming lottery #'s. I figure since you can tell the future, you may want to share.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:36 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:12 am    Post subject:

Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!

Well, the title of this thread is non 2 max plan, so my comment is based on that result. Comparing them to the last regime is not crazy. What's crazy is if people still support them if their 2 max plan fail. With the way how we are treating Randle and Clarkson, even if we don't trade them, they will likely walk away when their contract ends.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:39 am    Post subject:

Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!


They have the same approach as the previous FO. Comparison is apples to apples. They have one off season of striking out, do we send them packing after 3?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:42 am    Post subject:

There's a possibility we don't get any max FAs. But there is a way to proceed without killing our franchise (and punting 2 max deals instead of 1 to 2019 IMO is a bad move as is spending the entire cap on bad Moz/Deng level players/years).
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:46 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!

Well, the title of this thread is non 2 max plan, so my comment is based on that result. Comparing them to the last regime is not crazy. What's crazy is if people still support them if their 2 max plan fail. With the way how we are treating Randle and Clarkson, even if we don't trade them, they will likely walk away when their contract ends.


How are they treating Randle and Clarkson exactly?
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:51 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!


They have the same approach as the previous FO. Comparison is apples to apples. They have one off season of striking out, do we send them packing after 3?


One off season of striking out? When? Last summer? Magic clearly stated that the was not gonna be players last summer because they didn't think that there was anybody on the market that was worth it. Something that the old regime would not have done. They would have signed some over priced player to too much money and too many years!

If the comparison is apples to apples as you say, it must be red apples vs Granny smith green apples.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:54 am    Post subject:

I was ok with Magic not joining the 2017 FA market. Less talented FAs there.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:10 am    Post subject:

Harlemlakerfan wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!


They have the same approach as the previous FO. Comparison is apples to apples. They have one off season of striking out, do we send them packing after 3?


One off season of striking out? When? Last summer? Magic clearly stated that the was not gonna be players last summer because they didn't think that there was anybody on the market that was worth it. Something that the old regime would not have done. They would have signed some over priced player to too much money and too many years!

If the comparison is apples to apples as you say, it must be red apples vs Granny smith green apples.


We saw that there were players last season who were worth pursuing so failing to do so isn’t a defense. Identifying those players is their job. They didn’t and have one offseason of failure.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 12, 2018 10:13 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Harlemlakerfan wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Harlemlakerfan wrote:
lakersfan8 wrote:
I am surprised people have that much of tolerance to this new front office. They already traded away Russell and is going to trade away Randle, Clarkson and Nance in order to get that second max spot. After lossing Russell, Randle, Clarkson and Nance, people are okay with not able to sign the second max player? The Magic supporter said the new front office will have a different approach to the free agency market and will help us land the player we want. If they can't then they are no different to the previous guys.


Outside of Russell, Magic hasn't traded any of the other guy's yet. Even if he does, shouldn't we wait to see what the fall out will be? The tolerance level is what is should be, wait and see, not jumping the gun with doom and gloom before things even take shape. Your complaining about things that haven't even happen yet, if at all. Comparing them to the last regime is crazy! They are 1 year on the job, let them work, sheesh!!!!


They have the same approach as the previous FO. Comparison is apples to apples. They have one off season of striking out, do we send them packing after 3?


One off season of striking out? When? Last summer? Magic clearly stated that the was not gonna be players last summer because they didn't think that there was anybody on the market that was worth it. Something that the old regime would not have done. They would have signed some over priced player to too much money and too many years!

If the comparison is apples to apples as you say, it must be red apples vs Granny smith green apples.


We saw that there were players last season who were worth pursuing so failing to do so isn’t a defense. Identifying those players is their job. They didn’t and have one offseason of failure.


Call it what you want. I vehemently disagree.
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