How is the gun lobby more powerful than Bush and Obama
Kind of sick if you ask me
Because the congress has to pass the law, not the president... and the NRA has bought the congress when it comes to gun control
Amid renewed debate over gun control after Wednesday's school shooting in Florida, House Speaker Paul Ryan is arguing that now is not the time to wage political battles.
"This is one of those moments where we just need to step back and count our blessings," he told reporters Thursday at a news conference at the Capitol. "We need to think less about taking sides and fighting each other politically, and just pulling together. This House, and the whole country, stands with the Parkland community." - Paul Ryan (Speaker of the House)
“I am a responsible, highly trained gun owner,” Dickmann wrote on Facebook. “However I do not need this rifle. No one without a law enforcement badge needs this rifle.”
“I enjoyed shooting this rifle immensely but I don’t need it. I have other types I can shoot for the same enjoyment,” Dickmann wrote. “I have surrendered this rifle to The Broward Sheriff at the Tamarac Post.”
“I could have easily sold this rifle, but no person needs this,” Dickmann said. “I will be the change I want to see in this world. If our lawmakers will continue to close their eyes and open their wallets, I will lead by example.”
Dickmann’s Facebook post has gone viral with over 497,000 likes and more than 204,000 shares as of Sunday afternoon.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144475 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:04 pm Post subject:
Omar Little wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Didn't you say civilians should be allowed to own them for sport shooting?
The 2nd amendment has to be revisited. It's been lawyer-ed to suit gun advocates, (NRA)
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
That’s incorrect. The ar-15 is noteworthy for not being reliable when mucked up, that would be the AK47.
You are correct _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 8:55 pm Post subject:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Didn't you say civilians should be allowed to own them for sport shooting?
The 2nd amendment has to be revisited. It's been lawyer-ed to suit gun advocates, (NRA)
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
That’s incorrect. The ar-15 is noteworthy for not being reliable when mucked up, that would be the AK47.
You are correct
I know, I spent a few years married to one. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
The early M16s (military version of AR15) used to get fouled by debris and jammed due to a defective type of magazine when they were first delivered to troops in Vietnam. Merely distributing a superior magazine eased a lot of the complaints by the first troops issued M16s, but cleaning the weapon was much more involved than cleaning an AK47. Current variants like the M4 are a lot less prone to fouling than their forebearers according to one of the designers of the original, but AK47s can be dumped in mud and covered in sand and frozen and still fire.
I would posit that the major value of the M16/AR15, etc is the combination of their accuracy, immediate stopping power, killing ability, and they suffer much less muzzle climb than an AK during rapid fire. The groupings of an AK at maximum fire tend to look erratic unless the shooter is highly skilled with the weapon, though some early SEALs preferred and used the AK in Vietnam over the M16. The AR15 according to one of the designers who's still alive said the weapon on semi-auto is NO LESS lethal, and probably MORE SO, than on full automatic (military variants can go full without bumpstocks). The cavitation and the deformation/tumbling of the round in a victim's body is lethal in most cases. Guy said in early reports from the field that an enemy shot in the ankle by an M16 died because the bleeding couldn't be contained. They tested the M16 by shooting at bags of pig guts and they completely exploded when the round hit them. They didn't just pierce and exit. _________________ GOAT MAGIC REEL SEDALE TRIBUTE EDDIE DONX!
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
Posted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 9:51 pm Post subject:
Bingo. The value of an ar15 is that it is accurate and deadly, easy to handle and control, and easy to acquire multiple targets in rapid succession. And yes, much more effective in semi auto mode. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 8377 Location: Santa Monica
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:32 am Post subject:
non-player zealot wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
Their no reasoning with the craven, ignorant MFers who believe that (bleep).
I have saved an HBO Real Sports epi from May 2016 where they did a segment on the AR15 as "modern sporting rifles". I've never got around to uploading in order to post it here and I'm not sure if I'll get a copyright strike for it, but I always go back and watch it after each of these things. It's effing disgusting. The only way one of these POSes would care about dead kids is if one of their own got killed in similar fashion. Money talks, GOP is in the NRA's back pockets and they obviously don't even care enough about dead children if Newtown didn't faze them. Likewise I remember reading redneck rubes saying Obama was acting when he cried about the kids killed in that event.
This is the kind of pig the gun lobby has to argue against any change in laws to eliminate bumpstocks, even after Las Vegas. Even simple things like that. High capacity magazines can essentially still be had even after the N. Hollywood bank shootout. I could go on and on.
This guy even looks like a pig. Big fat pink pig's head.
I've been thinking the same thing. Reminds me of how James Brady pushed for mandatory background checks after he was wounded by John Hinckley Jr., even though Brady was a Republican.
The fact the the GOP and NRA members never change or evolve their views on what constitutes responsible gun ownership just reaffirms how divided our nation is, and how stubborn people have become regarding their views. _________________ Lakers 49ers Chargers Dodgers
Here's the first 7 minutes of that HBO Real Sports epi on the AR15 from a couple years ago that I mentioned. It's roughly 2/3rds of the full segment including the most vital info of the segment (imo). Unfort recorded from a camera so not the best, but the audio sounds better at lower levels. Disturbing nonetheless.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67744 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:27 am Post subject:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Didn't you say civilians should be allowed to own them for sport shooting?
The 2nd amendment has to be revisited. It's been lawyer-ed to suit gun advocates, (NRA)
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
You say you've used them for sport shooting. How did you do that? Do you own one, borrow one? What was your relationship with the weapon? _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144475 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:46 am Post subject:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Didn't you say civilians should be allowed to own them for sport shooting?
The 2nd amendment has to be revisited. It's been lawyer-ed to suit gun advocates, (NRA)
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
You say you've used them for sport shooting. How did you do that? Do you own one, borrow one? What was your relationship with the weapon?
One of my son’s friends has one. I am just as happy with my Ruger 10-22. But since it looks like a normal rifle, no one has an issue with it. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:57 am Post subject:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
I actually think the handgun should be first on the list to be barred from carry on the street. Its portability and concealability make it the most dangerous firearm in the country.
FWIW, I think we should also have a frank discussion about the difference between possession and carry. The former becomes less of an issue if we are smart about the latter. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67744 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:16 am Post subject:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
jodeke wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Didn't you say civilians should be allowed to own them for sport shooting?
The 2nd amendment has to be revisited. It's been lawyer-ed to suit gun advocates, (NRA)
I have used them for sport shooting and some do use them for hunting pigs. It isn’t something I would take on a hunting trip. Their value is in durability, they can get mucked up and still fire. Perfect for the military. I have 30 and 50 round clips for my .22, an AR15 isn’t necessary for more fire power. I would never spend money on one but in the grand scheme of things they are just another gun.
You say you've used them for sport shooting. How did you do that? Do you own one, borrow one? What was your relationship with the weapon?
One of my son’s friends has one. I am just as happy with my Ruger 10-22. But since it looks like a normal rifle, no one has an issue with it.
You say you have 30 50 round clips for your 22. Does your rifle look like THIS large photo lower left. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
I actually think the handgun should be first on the list to be barred from carry on the street. Its portability and concealability make it the most dangerous firearm in the country.
FWIW, I think we should also have a frank discussion about the difference between possession and carry. The former becomes less of an issue if we are smart about the latter.
Don't want open carry. Hand guns are more dangerous to those who own them and households that keep them. I don't have them in my house and I don't want them in schools. But, I'm not against others having them in their homes.
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67744 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:16 pm Post subject:
vanexelent wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
I actually think the handgun should be first on the list to be barred from carry on the street. Its portability and concealability make it the most dangerous firearm in the country.
FWIW, I think we should also have a frank discussion about the difference between possession and carry. The former becomes less of an issue if we are smart about the latter.
Don't want open carry. Hand guns are more dangerous to those who own them and households that keep them. I don't have them in my house and I don't want them in schools. But, I'm not against others having them in their homes.
Do any in the forum want THIS _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 02 May 2005 Posts: 90307 Location: Formerly Known As 24
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 12:31 pm Post subject:
vanexelent wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
I actually think the handgun should be first on the list to be barred from carry on the street. Its portability and concealability make it the most dangerous firearm in the country.
FWIW, I think we should also have a frank discussion about the difference between possession and carry. The former becomes less of an issue if we are smart about the latter.
Don't want open carry. Hand guns are more dangerous to those who own them and households that keep them. I don't have them in my house and I don't want them in schools. But, I'm not against others having them in their homes.
The problem there is relative right to possess vs right of the neighbor not to be hit with your fire. And that to me is the more sane conversation to be having. There is pretty broad agreement that you can't own a bazooka, or carry a gun in a federal building, and we have case law precedents to indicate that the 2nd Amendment isn't a blanket own anything carry anywhere directive.
So the question becomes primarily one about where you can carry what. _________________ “We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.” ― Elie Wiesel
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
Well, I'm not american.
There's no need for someone to have a firearm of any kind, IMHO.
Killing animals for sport is also incredibly stupid.
Joined: 13 Jan 2002 Posts: 7925 Location: Lake Forest
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:54 pm Post subject:
danzag wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
Well, I'm not american.
There's no need for someone to have a firearm of any kind, IMHO.
Killing animals for sport is also incredibly stupid.
In the rural areas, it isn't for sport. Just like mountain lions, bears and moose don't consider it sport when they're trying to kill you.
The night I was out in the rurals that I came upon a car that hit a cow I realized why farmers have guns. Watching a half dead cow stare @ us for an hour until we found someone to euthanize it was awful. If I was living in the rurals I would have one.
Joined: 10 Dec 2006 Posts: 52660 Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:44 pm Post subject:
LakersRGolden wrote:
danzag wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
Well, I'm not american.
There's no need for someone to have a firearm of any kind, IMHO.
Killing animals for sport is also incredibly stupid.
In the rural areas, it isn't for sport. Just like mountain lions, bears and moose don't consider it sport when they're trying to kill you.
The night I was out in the rurals that I came upon a car that hit a cow I realized why farmers have guns. Watching a half dead cow stare @ us for an hour until we found someone to euthanize it was awful. If I was living in the rurals I would have one.
Don't need an assault rifle to kill an animal that is attacking, or for purposes of euthanasia . . . not even in "the rurals". _________________ You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames
Joined: 17 Nov 2007 Posts: 67744 Location: In a world where admitting to not knowing something is considered a great way to learn.
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 2:51 pm Post subject:
The 2nd amendment has been bastardized to suit the NRA's agenda. There's no need for a militia for which the Founding Fathers wrote the right to bear arms. It won't defeat the today's modern military.
I abide with having a gun for home protection if properly trained. AK-47's, AR-15's don't fit the bill.
IMO the only people who should legally carry in public are public officials. _________________ Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.
America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144475 Location: The Gold Coast
Posted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 6:58 pm Post subject:
vanexelent wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
danzag wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
For some reason this one seems different to me. Listening to how articulate these kids and parents are speaking about how serious they are about gun control gives me some home for change here. Even if they succeed in getting AR-15's banned in Florida, that will be a positive change.
Those should be banned in the US. yes, it will force people to the black market. Good.
There is no reason that civilians should own one.
Or any kind of firearm.
That's a radical viewpoint. I'd bet most Americans think owning a hand gun or hunting rifles is fine.
And there's nothing wrong with having AR-15's accessible to sport shooters. Just make them only available to rent at a controlled shooting location, with proper security and around people who want to be around guns.
I actually think the handgun should be first on the list to be barred from carry on the street. Its portability and concealability make it the most dangerous firearm in the country.
FWIW, I think we should also have a frank discussion about the difference between possession and carry. The former becomes less of an issue if we are smart about the latter.
Don't want open carry. Hand guns are more dangerous to those who own them and households that keep them. I don't have them in my house and I don't want them in schools. But, I'm not against others having them in their homes.
I have a couple and I have used them for hunting. At home they are locked away in the safe, they aren’t intended for protection. The 20 gauge is much more effective, it is so loud you wouldn’t need to shoot anyone, they will be running when they hear it. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023.
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