LA Lakers Should Add Kawhi Leonard to List of Superstar Targets
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emplay
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:51 am    Post subject: LA Lakers Should Add Kawhi Leonard to List of Superstar Targets

Hey all,

Here's my latest:

LA Lakers Should Add Kawhi Leonard to List of Superstar Targets @BleacherReport - be it in 2019 free agency or perhaps even sooner via trade. How much is worth giving up if Lakers can have 3 legit All-Stars? Would San Antonio go there?
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2761094-la-lakers-should-add-kawhi-leonard-to-list-of-superstar-targets

I wouldn't say it's a recommendation but I did map out the "what if" scenario.

Cheers,

EP
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lukewaltonsdad
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:09 pm    Post subject:

#ComehomeKawhi.

In all seriousness, I agree, he should be on our list of superstar targets. However, if the disconnect is as bad as reported, and the Spurs can't resolve it, then he'll get traded. They aren't just letting him walk without getting anything in return.

Then, if you're the Lakers, it just becomes about what you're willing to offer at that point; and from what I have seen, getting an All-Star on your team is very difficult. IMO, it just depends on the pieces going out and ensuring that Kawhi is healthy.

For the trade experts, what is a reasonable deal?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:34 pm    Post subject:

lukewaltonsdad wrote:
#ComehomeKawhi.

In all seriousness, I agree, he should be on our list of superstar targets. However, if the disconnect is as bad as reported, and the Spurs can't resolve it, then he'll get traded. They aren't just letting him walk without getting anything in return.

Then, if you're the Lakers, it just becomes about what you're willing to offer at that point; and from what I have seen, getting an All-Star on your team is very difficult. IMO, it just depends on the pieces going out and ensuring that Kawhi is healthy.

For the trade experts, what is a reasonable deal?


Since Kawhi would only have one year left on his deal, the Spurs can't expect a king's ransom like both Ball and Ingram or something. IMO, if he's healthy, the appropriate price to pay is one top young player plus a 1st, or another young prospect that is nice, but doesn't necessarily have star potential. So, something like Ingram or Ball and the CLE pick, or even our 2019 pick (which we could trade as soon as the '18 Draft is over). Or Ingram or Ball and Kuzma or Hart. Somewhere in that ballpark.

We don't have to match salary because of our massive cap space, so this would probably be a more realistic trade, and it would be beneficial to them to be able to actually save cap space in a move like this, if they are trading Kawhi anyway. If we did try to include Deng for salary-matching purposes (which, again, we don't have to do since we have so much cap space), then the cost of acquiring Kawhi would go up exponentially. Then they would probably want AT LEAST two 1st's in addition to Ball or Ingram, and maybe even Kuzma or Hart too.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:39 pm    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Since Kawhi would only have one year left on his deal, the Spurs can't expect a king's ransom like both Ball and Ingram or something. IMO, if he's healthy, the appropriate price to pay is one top young player plus a 1st, or another young prospect that is nice, but doesn't necessarily have star potential. So, something like Ingram or Ball and the CLE pick, or even our 2019 pick (which we could trade as soon as the '18 Draft is over). Or Ingram or Ball and Kuzma or Hart. Somewhere in that ballpark.

We don't have to match salary because of our massive cap space, so this would probably be a more realistic trade, and it would be beneficial to them to be able to actually save cap space in a move like this, if they are trading Kawhi anyway. If we did try to include Deng for salary-matching purposes (which, again, we don't have to do since we have so much cap space), then the cost of acquiring Kawhi would go up exponentially. Then they would probably want AT LEAST two 1st's in addition to Ball or Ingram, and maybe even Kuzma or Hart too.


The problem is that San Antonio has no motivation to deal him to the Lakers. In fact, given their history they'll probably have an "anybody but the Lakers" mentality. I think it's far more likely they shop him around to anyone else. Part of the reason that Indiana lost leverage with Paul George was when the whole "not going to re-sign with anyone" part was put out, and it essentially became the Lakers or no one.
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emplay
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 12:40 pm    Post subject:

what I suggested within the article - if Spurs take Deng, would Lakers do Kuzma and Ingram?

Not saying they should but if they did, they'd still have the ability to sign 2 max guys to play with Kawhi and Lonzo, Hart
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lukewaltonsdad
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:02 pm    Post subject:

Kuzma and Ingram? That's a lot.
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emplay
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:03 pm    Post subject:

it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo
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lukewaltonsdad
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:11 pm    Post subject:

emplay wrote:
it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo


Now that'd be interesting. I wonder how long the Spurs keep Leonard until they have to make a decision with him if he refuses to play.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:51 pm    Post subject:

The dude has a bad injury that he can't get over. I'd wait to see if he recovers first.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:04 pm    Post subject:

emplay wrote:
it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo


That's a championship team.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:06 pm    Post subject:

emplay wrote:
it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo


No Randle?
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:22 pm    Post subject:

LakerLogic wrote:
emplay wrote:
it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo


That's a championship team.


Wow! Do it Magic!
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 5:30 pm    Post subject:

emplay wrote:
it is - and not saying they do that - but if they did in June, they'd be able to field a team that starts with LBJ, Kawhi, PG and Zo


That would be the best defensive trio since the Jordan/Pippen/Rodman Bulls. Zo a nice 4th to that mix too. Not that it's going to happen but just the fact that the Lakers have a semi plausible path to it is crazy.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 6:08 pm    Post subject:

Pg, lbj and Leonard...we can only wish. Most likely we over pay and sign boogie and make smaller deals w/Randle, Bradley and perhaps it. Iím not sure why pg or lbj would want to leave their current teams that are pretty good.
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 7:49 pm    Post subject:

Other teams would offer a lot more value than Ingram. We'd probably need to offer Ingram and Ball. I'd pass on that one.
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emplay
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:07 pm    Post subject:

Teams don't offer much for a guy about to hit free agency
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:41 pm    Post subject:

Indiana didn't end up doing too bad when they had zero leverage in trading Paul George to the Thunder.. They acquired an All Star Victor Oladipo (24.2 ppg, 5.4 rpg, 4.2apg, and 2.1 steals per game)

They also acquired 21 year old c/pf Domas Sabonis ( 12.3ppg and 8.3 rpg in 25 minutes per night off the bench. So you'd have to expect the Spurs could get at the very least a similar package for Kawhi Leonard.

In addition the Pacers did not have to take on a bad contract in the trade (although at the time Oladipo's 4 yr 84 mil deal was seen as one)

Paul George was traded at age 27 the same age Leonard will be this season.So I really don't see the Spurs wanting to give up cap space to acquire Deng's contract as a throw in.
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emplay
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 9:44 pm    Post subject:

That's a hindsight take
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:32 pm    Post subject:

Lakers should study the OKC situation. The gave away all their best young talent to get PG and Carmelo and are paying the price for being too thin.

If you take Lopez, Randle, Ingram, Pope, Kuz and IT off this years team, even adding a few Superstars is NOT going to be enough to fill the void...
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:49 pm    Post subject:

OKC 100% hit a home run in their moves - they got Russell to extend

nothing else matters

a small market like OKC can't get a guy like RW - unless they tank forever and get lucky
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:04 pm    Post subject:

Let's not move the goalposts here; Oladipo was not supposed to be this good, and not even Indiana expected this. He wasn't considered to have as high of a ceiling as a guy like Ingram, and Oladipo was actually not even on his rookie deal anymore, like Ingram is. Sabonis probably had value commensurate with a late 1st round pick, as a decent young prospect, but certainly not an upper-level one.

In this case, you have another guy in Kawhi who, like PG, would be headed into the final year of his deal. Now, Kawhi is a tier up from PG, but I don't think they could reasonably ask for much more than one upper-tier young prospect in a deal. I think they could look for one such prospect and then another lesser young prospect, or, instead of another lesser prospect, perhaps another 1st round draft pick that isn't a premium pick.

Again, just my opinion, I think something like Ingram and the CLE pick (or the '19 pick, which could be traded after the draft) is fair. Ingram and Kuzma or Hart is about as far as I'd go if they wanted 2 young players. As Emplay suggests, if they would take Deng, I'd give up Kuzma and Ingram. If we could pull that off, we'd still have all our draft picks moving forward. That could be important in getting OKC to sign off on a trade for PG if he opts in, thus saving us almost $10MM this summer, which might enable us to keep Randle and still get LeBron too. Along with trading for Kawhi. I'm pretty sure all that could logistically work, if we go with Emplay's proposal involving Deng.

LeBron $35.35MM (full max)
PG $20.7MM
Kawhi $20.1MM
Randle $11MM (estimated year one salary of a 4-year deal)
Ball $7.5MM
Hart $1.7MM
Zubac $1.5MM
Bryant $1.4MM
4 min cap holds $3.3MM

This above team totals about $1.5MM too much. It's so close, though, that some minor modifications would make it work. Maybe one of Zubac or Bryant goes, likely involved in one of the trades. Maybe Randle's first-year salary is 500K to a million less. Maybe LeBron would take 500K less or something to make this happen. But this would be a sick team.

I also agree with Emplay that teams aren't going to be offering up two stud prospects for one year of Kawhi Leonard. Teams just don't do business like that anymore for rentals. And maybe the Lakers wouldn't have the best offer, that's possible. The Spurs certainly are under no obligation to move him to us if he's on the block, but if he really did indicate that he wants the Lakers, other teams might not offer much. As was mentioned in this thread, that seems to be what happened with PG, when teams simply didn't offer the farm for him.

I'll also state very clearly that I would not trade for Kawhi unless we did our due diligence (hopefully through back channel communication) on his injury. If there was doubt about the injury, particularly if his camp were to be tight-lipped about it, I wouldn't move forward with it.
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:17 pm    Post subject:

weel we re gone have to wait and see. If we somehow get paul george and kawhi, there will be no play time for ingram so he is the big favorite for such a trade.but if you have pg and bi committed to long term contracts, i m not sure where s the need for a kawhi
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:21 pm    Post subject:

and while kawhi seems like injury prone, bi is 20 years old and maybe we havent seen his ceiling yet
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:04 am    Post subject:

unleasHell wrote:
Lakers should study the OKC situation. The gave away all their best young talent to get PG and Carmelo and are paying the price for being too thin.

If you take Lopez, Randle, Ingram, Pope, Kuz and IT off this years team, even adding a few Superstars is NOT going to be enough to fill the void...


To be fair, Carmelo is nowhere near the names we're talking about, guy is finished...
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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:55 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
In this case, you have another guy in Kawhi who, like PG, would be headed into the final year of his deal. Now, Kawhi is a tier up from PG, but I don't think they could reasonably ask for much more than one upper-tier young prospect in a deal. I think they could look for one such prospect and then another lesser young prospect, or, instead of another lesser prospect, perhaps another 1st round draft pick that isn't a premium pick.


You aren't looking at it correctly. Eric is suggesting that the Spurs would take Ingram and Deng's contract for Leonard. They will get better offers than that. I expect that we would need to send them Ingram and Ball to compete.
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