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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:49 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Judah wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Rob: when we took over the team was capped out without a pick. Huh?


When they took over this team had no guaranteed 2017 draft pick and no 2018 draft pick. After they took over: 3 first round picks, 1 pick in 2018.

They had no cap space for a max contract, now they have cap space for 2.

facts


Preach.

The fact that some want to go back to the dark ages is shocking.

And yet, vlf didn’t actually say that. It was just a strange comment that needed some clarification. Not the biggest deal in the world.


Exactly. Mitch and jim had given themselves one max slot flexibility, Magic and rob have thus far stretched that to two. And they added the two first rounders last year, one on a deal Mitch had set up and one on their own deal. So they got more first rounders. Can’t really speak the Cleveland pick they got at the deadline this year because Mitch is fired, so of course he couldn’t make deals this year (that also technically applies to the other deal last year too, but I don’t assume Mitch does that deal so it reasonably applies)

I think that was vlf’s point. There are large, concrete accomplishments that don’t need to be spun with dishonesty. They can stand on their own.
Facts.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 3:26 pm    Post subject:

I do not see how this is a Mitch vs. Magic and Rob competition. Mitch was a great GM and his work should never be forgotten. He had some obstacles (the rejection of the CP3 trade and the addition of Jim and Chad) that were beyond his control. I really do not believe the end of his tenure is entirely Mitch's fault (the Dung and Moz fiasco). Moving on to Magic and Rob. I have yet to see them make a bad move. They have done everything possible to turn this team around as quickly as possible (and overcoming two of the worse signings in recent NBA history). These are exciting times and we are very close to being relevant. I have 100% faith in their ability to finish the job. If someone does not like them as people, that is fine. However, any heat (such as lacking foresight) directed at them is unjustifiable at this point.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 4:44 pm    Post subject:

Vancouver Fan wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Judah wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Rob: when we took over the team was capped out without a pick. Huh?


When they took over this team had no guaranteed 2017 draft pick and no 2018 draft pick. After they took over: 3 first round picks, 1 pick in 2018.

They had no cap space for a max contract, now they have cap space for 2.

facts


Preach.

The fact that some want to go back to the dark ages is shocking.

And yet, vlf didn’t actually say that. It was just a strange comment that needed some clarification. Not the biggest deal in the world.


Exactly. Mitch and jim had given themselves one max slot flexibility, Magic and rob have thus far stretched that to two. And they added the two first rounders last year, one on a deal Mitch had set up and one on their own deal. So they got more first rounders. Can’t really speak the Cleveland pick they got at the deadline this year because Mitch is fired, so of course he couldn’t make deals this year (that also technically applies to the other deal last year too, but I don’t assume Mitch does that deal so it reasonably applies)

I think that was vlf’s point. There are large, concrete accomplishments that don’t need to be spun with dishonesty. They can stand on their own.
Facts.


Nope.

What first round pick deal did Mith and Jim set up? Both the 27 and 30th picks were deals by our no FO (bleep) outta here.

Nor did they have enough money to give out even a single max contract.

Y'all can't just make up (bleep) and scream facts
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 5:50 pm    Post subject:

Endless3D wrote:
Vancouver Fan wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Judah wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Rob: when we took over the team was capped out without a pick. Huh?


When they took over this team had no guaranteed 2017 draft pick and no 2018 draft pick. After they took over: 3 first round picks, 1 pick in 2018.

They had no cap space for a max contract, now they have cap space for 2.

facts


Preach.

The fact that some want to go back to the dark ages is shocking.

And yet, vlf didn’t actually say that. It was just a strange comment that needed some clarification. Not the biggest deal in the world.


Exactly. Mitch and jim had given themselves one max slot flexibility, Magic and rob have thus far stretched that to two. And they added the two first rounders last year, one on a deal Mitch had set up and one on their own deal. So they got more first rounders. Can’t really speak the Cleveland pick they got at the deadline this year because Mitch is fired, so of course he couldn’t make deals this year (that also technically applies to the other deal last year too, but I don’t assume Mitch does that deal so it reasonably applies)

I think that was vlf’s point. There are large, concrete accomplishments that don’t need to be spun with dishonesty. They can stand on their own.
Facts.


Nope.

What first round pick deal did Mith and Jim set up? Both the 27 and 30th picks were deals by our no FO (bleep) outta here.

Nor did they have enough money to give out even a single max contract.

Y'all can't just make up (bleep) and scream facts


It has been widely reported that Mitch was shopping Lou and that he had tentative deals on the table from at least two teams (Utah and Houston). Again, you don’t need to combat basic facts to support your larger view that Magic and Rob are doing very well. They are.

Btw, you might want to take a slightly lower profile when returning under a new screen name. Word to the wise...
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:16 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
Vancouver Fan wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Judah wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Rob: when we took over the team was capped out without a pick. Huh?


When they took over this team had no guaranteed 2017 draft pick and no 2018 draft pick. After they took over: 3 first round picks, 1 pick in 2018.

They had no cap space for a max contract, now they have cap space for 2.

facts


Preach.

The fact that some want to go back to the dark ages is shocking.

And yet, vlf didn’t actually say that. It was just a strange comment that needed some clarification. Not the biggest deal in the world.


Exactly. Mitch and jim had given themselves one max slot flexibility, Magic and rob have thus far stretched that to two. And they added the two first rounders last year, one on a deal Mitch had set up and one on their own deal. So they got more first rounders. Can’t really speak the Cleveland pick they got at the deadline this year because Mitch is fired, so of course he couldn’t make deals this year (that also technically applies to the other deal last year too, but I don’t assume Mitch does that deal so it reasonably applies)

I think that was vlf’s point. There are large, concrete accomplishments that don’t need to be spun with dishonesty. They can stand on their own.
Facts.


Nope.

What first round pick deal did Mith and Jim set up? Both the 27 and 30th picks were deals by our no FO (bleep) outta here.

Nor did they have enough money to give out even a single max contract.

Y'all can't just make up (bleep) and scream facts


It has been widely reported that Mitch was shopping Lou and that he had tentative deals on the table from at least two teams (Utah and Houston). Again, you don’t need to combat basic facts to support your larger view that Magic and Rob are doing very well. They are.

Btw, you might want to take a slightly lower profile when returning under a new screen name. Word to the wise...


The quote literally says "when I took over this team it had no picks or cap space" which is literally all facts. Why do we have to consider a whole bunch of crap to disprove a basic quote thats right?

I didn't make up anything, those are facts. Pelinka's quote is all facts too. Alot of stuff has been widely reported too, doesn't make Pelinka's statement any less true.

I didn't get suspended or banned, nor did I have any single history of causing problems in the 5 years I posted, I got drunk and changed my password to a bunch of gibberish. I tried to hit up goldenthroat a few times on reddit to get it back but he didn't reply (but he's LakersFilmRoom and probably gets 1000 PMs).

If I can get my old account back that'd be great.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:35 pm    Post subject:

The fact was that the team was working on trades for Williams (one of which Magic consummated), had cap room in the off-season and the ready ability via several methods (stretch deng, trade Clarkson, etc.) to get to a full max, and had either a lottery pick in 2017 or their own pick in 2018 by nba rule (and if the latter had two more second rounders). You can call that a whole bunch of whatever, but those are facts. And again, why would we need to litigate nonsense like this when the team cleared an extra max and added two draft picks and had a very successful draft and season?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:15 am    Post subject:

CabinCreek44 wrote:
32 wrote:
Magic: "We’re not going to give money away just to say we signed somebody."


Agreed, but no one is looking for them to do that. They do, however, need to produce results. This summer.
the bold is not true. Fans are looking for them to do that. laker fans and LG posters say this every ...single...year. "why didnt we sign anyone or we should've sign (non-allstar solid player) A, B, and C since we struck out with FA's and we should've signed those guys to 3+ year deals. Right here on LG you have fans saying this stuff every single year. some fans just like to see player movement. even if we won a ring you will have some saying this. it never fails. This is why as a GM/owner you can never listen to your fanbase. you listen to them about arena accommodations, ticket prices. stuff like that. But not who to get who to get rid of etc.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 10:16 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
The fact was that the team was working on trades for Williams (one of which Magic consummated), had cap room in the off-season and the ready ability via several methods (stretch deng, trade Clarkson, etc.) to get to a full max, and had either a lottery pick in 2017 or their own pick in 2018 by nba rule (and if the latter had two more second rounders). You can call that a whole bunch of whatever, but those are facts. And again, why would we need to litigate nonsense like this when the team cleared an extra max and added two draft picks and had a very successful draft and season?
some people just can't let it go.

It's over, we moved on and things are looking much better now.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:01 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
Vancouver Fan wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
Judah wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Endless3D wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
Rob: when we took over the team was capped out without a pick. Huh?


When they took over this team had no guaranteed 2017 draft pick and no 2018 draft pick. After they took over: 3 first round picks, 1 pick in 2018.

They had no cap space for a max contract, now they have cap space for 2.

facts


Preach.

The fact that some want to go back to the dark ages is shocking.

And yet, vlf didn’t actually say that. It was just a strange comment that needed some clarification. Not the biggest deal in the world.


Exactly. Mitch and jim had given themselves one max slot flexibility, Magic and rob have thus far stretched that to two. And they added the two first rounders last year, one on a deal Mitch had set up and one on their own deal. So they got more first rounders. Can’t really speak the Cleveland pick they got at the deadline this year because Mitch is fired, so of course he couldn’t make deals this year (that also technically applies to the other deal last year too, but I don’t assume Mitch does that deal so it reasonably applies)

I think that was vlf’s point. There are large, concrete accomplishments that don’t need to be spun with dishonesty. They can stand on their own.
Facts.


Nope.

What first round pick deal did Mith and Jim set up? Both the 27 and 30th picks were deals by our no FO (bleep) outta here.

Nor did they have enough money to give out even a single max contract.

Y'all can't just make up (bleep) and scream facts


It has been widely reported that Mitch was shopping Lou and that he had tentative deals on the table from at least two teams (Utah and Houston). Again, you don’t need to combat basic facts to support your larger view that Magic and Rob are doing very well. They are.

Btw, you might want to take a slightly lower profile when returning under a new screen name. Word to the wise...


So reports about possible trades are now facts?

Magic made that deal...Morrey is a great friend to Andrew Friedman who runs the Dodgers (the team Magic Owns)...Friedman help get that conversation set up and helped Magic make sure he wasn't getting fleeced prior to signing off on it. Remember this all happened before Rob was officially hired.

Come on man...no way you can wave a 'wildly reported' trade from a notoriously close to the vest GM in Mitch as a fact.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:37 pm    Post subject:

I guess that Morey was lying when he said that the deal was on the table and he was just waiting on Mitch to pull the trigger. As a veteran FO exec, Mitch knew that making the deal early could mean missing out on a bigger deal at the deadline, so he waited. Mitch and Morey had worked together on deals before and had that relationship.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:00 pm    Post subject:

splashmtn wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
The fact was that the team was working on trades for Williams (one of which Magic consummated), had cap room in the off-season and the ready ability via several methods (stretch deng, trade Clarkson, etc.) to get to a full max, and had either a lottery pick in 2017 or their own pick in 2018 by nba rule (and if the latter had two more second rounders). You can call that a whole bunch of whatever, but those are facts. And again, why would we need to litigate nonsense like this when the team cleared an extra max and added two draft picks and had a very successful draft and season?
some people just can't let it go.

It's over, we moved on and things are looking much better now.


What some people like myself can't let go is the continued fail that is revisionist history.

Did Mitch make the Lou William's Trade?
Was stretching Moz or Deng even a consideration by the last FO one year into their contracts?
Was trading JC 1 year after extending him even a consideration by the last FO?
What cap room is being alluded to? Because everything I've researched showed it didn't exist prior to Magic coming on.

So I again respectfully disagree with every fiber of my being astral and otherwise that just because you say something over and over again that it magically becomes a fact.

The facts are that Mitch was fired.
That Magic traded Lou.
That Magic & Rob traded DLO to get rid of 1 horrific contract which opened cap space and cleansed the locker room.
That Magic & Rob along with our excellent scouting department had an exceptional draft by any measurement.
That Magic & Rob had maybe 1 ping pong lottery pick when they took over but ended up with 4 total.
That Magic & Rob traded JC and Larry to get another 1st rounder and officially opened the door to 2 max free agents which was not an option just 1 year prior.
Yes Mitch and Jim could have done all that, but they didn't...but what was being widely reported was they were attempting to trade BI and others for Boogie to save their jobs and Jeannie had to act fast after being alerted by Joey via email that is now public.

And how any of this can be credited to Mitch and vicariously Jim by association...and then bandied about as facts is mind-numbingly revisionist and suggests a loyalty to a person you probably don't know over reasonable and factual evidence that is easy to cull.

BTW this is my last post on this topic...what Rob said at the exit interview was accurate...he didn't embellish to prop himself up, and I personally think he comes across as a person with a tremendous amount of integrity and compassion for people...so I think that if you feel he's embellishing that what you're doing is calling him a liar. And I don't think genuine people that care about people should be slighted for telling the truth.

Just my final thoughts and I eagerly await any repudiation sure to arrive post haste.

PS I really like Mitch and thought he should have taken a sabbatical after his daughter unexpectedly passed away rather than be the pinata for the Jeannie-Jim Family Feud.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:34 pm    Post subject:

CervantesRises wrote:
splashmtn wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
The fact was that the team was working on trades for Williams (one of which Magic consummated), had cap room in the off-season and the ready ability via several methods (stretch deng, trade Clarkson, etc.) to get to a full max, and had either a lottery pick in 2017 or their own pick in 2018 by nba rule (and if the latter had two more second rounders). You can call that a whole bunch of whatever, but those are facts. And again, why would we need to litigate nonsense like this when the team cleared an extra max and added two draft picks and had a very successful draft and season?
some people just can't let it go.

It's over, we moved on and things are looking much better now.


What some people like myself can't let go is the continued fail that is revisionist history.

Did Mitch make the Lou William's Trade?
Was stretching Moz or Deng even a consideration by the last FO one year into their contracts?
Was trading JC 1 year after extending him even a consideration by the last FO?
What cap room is being alluded to? Because everything I've researched showed it didn't exist prior to Magic coming on.

So I again respectfully disagree with every fiber of my being astral and otherwise that just because you say something over and over again that it magically becomes a fact.

The facts are that Mitch was fired.
That Magic traded Lou.
That Magic & Rob traded DLO to get rid of 1 horrific contract which opened cap space and cleansed the locker room.
That Magic & Rob along with our excellent scouting department had an exceptional draft by any measurement.
That Magic & Rob had maybe 1 ping pong lottery pick when they took over but ended up with 4 total.
That Magic & Rob traded JC and Larry to get another 1st rounder and officially opened the door to 2 max free agents which was not an option just 1 year prior.
Yes Mitch and Jim could have done all that, but they didn't...but what was being widely reported was they were attempting to trade BI and others for Boogie to save their jobs and Jeannie had to act fast after being alerted by Joey via email that is now public.

And how any of this can be credited to Mitch and vicariously Jim by association...and then bandied about as facts is mind-numbingly revisionist and suggests a loyalty to a person you probably don't know over reasonable and factual evidence that is easy to cull.

BTW this is my last post on this topic...what Rob said at the exit interview was accurate...he didn't embellish to prop himself up, and I personally think he comes across as a person with a tremendous amount of integrity and compassion for people...so I think that if you feel he's embellishing that what you're doing is calling him a liar. And I don't think genuine people that care about people should be slighted for telling the truth.

Just my final thoughts and I eagerly await any repudiation sure to arrive post haste.

PS I really like Mitch and thought he should have taken a sabbatical after his daughter unexpectedly passed away rather than be the pinata for the Jeannie-Jim Family Feud.


Again, you're supplying me arguments I didn't make and not accepting the actual provable facts I did supply:

Mitch was negotiating the Williams deal when he was fired. He was very likely to make a deal (in fact he had multiple offers), but the fact remains that they made the trade because they fired him while it was in progress (which, BTW, is why they kept the asst GM on for a brief while). So while it is technically correct to call this their trade, and I'm OK with that, it's a bit disingenuous to act like it wasn't sitting there waiting for them. And even setting that aside, the team had begun tanking. We don't know how many wins they get or if they get the pick, but even if they don't, they are guaranteed their pick this year by league rules. So the statement about no picks is incorrect in duplicate. If they want to say they improved the odds of getting the Lonzo pick, that's a subjective opinion I can't falsify, and they did add the picks via the Dlo trade and the Clarkson trade, although again, they are comparing moves after firing a guy vs moves he can't make because he's fired. The fair assessment is they made a bunch of moves and likely ended up with more picks than Mitch would have (because I don't think he makes the DLo deal, and because I think he was after PG13 via trade, so he wouldn't be collecting so much as sending picks), which is a nice thing, as are their choices, which again, we can't assume Mitch makes, so they deserve huge praise for every pick they've made IMO.

The Lakers had cap room as of July 2017. Prior to that, the new regime actually ADDED to the cap (the net of the Williams and DLo/Moz trades was MORE salary in 2017, not less). The savings comes this offseason when Lopez expires. And yet they spent almost 18 million of the cap they didn't create on KCP? Again, how does that happen if, according to Rob, they were left with "capped out"?

It is also true that the Lakers could open up one max space in 2017 or 2018 under their salary prior to the firings. They could stretch Mozgov, trade Clarkson, other small moves, etc (no one knows which moves they would have made, merely that it was there for them. Just as the current team has two max capability if they make some small moves. So again, the argument was one max vs two, not two maxes vs capped out. That is not my opinion vs yours, or saying something a bunch to make it true, that's documentable fact.

And again, my point is they've done well. By the standards they set, their trades and picks have been very very very successful, and they are well positioned to use the cap room they acquired as well as the cap room they added to it. That's an A season in my book. Solid A. I just disputed the factual veracity above, and I am right. I didn't even bring it up, merely spoke when others attacked someone who did. And he was correct too. At some point, needing to harangue people for facts when you're wrong AND the rest of it is all going the way you want, and those people are even willing to admit that, is not a good look.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:41 pm    Post subject:

Great Post CervantesRises!
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:44 pm    Post subject:

It might be time to lock this thread. It is producing more heat than light.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 4:18 pm    Post subject:

RI Laker wrote:
Great Post CervantesRises!


I concur.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:44 am    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
oldlakerfan wrote:
Inspector Gadget wrote:
it will be interesting to see how much value Lakers will want to give up for a player like Kawhi Leonard


Probably take a signed Randle plus first rounder or Hart, maybe both.


A sign and trade Randle, 25th pick and future first would certainly be ideal.


Maybe BI, Deng and a the first rounder would work.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:54 am    Post subject:

RI Laker wrote:
Great Post CervantesRises!


I agree, he separated his personal feelings about the situation and just laid down the facts
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 5:55 pm    Post subject:

Mitch did great, until he didn't. Mozgov /Deng sucked. Magic is cleaning it up, and we will eventually move on. Mitch had a great run but he laid a turd we are still trying to flush.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:12 pm    Post subject:

al242 wrote:
RI Laker wrote:
Great Post CervantesRises!


I agree, he separated his personal feelings about the situation and just laid down the facts


Other than getting the facts wrong.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 7:56 pm    Post subject:

Jim buss moved on
Mitch moved on and got another job

Time for us all to move on
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:27 pm    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
I guess that Morey was lying when he said that the deal was on the table and he was just waiting on Mitch to pull the trigger. As a veteran FO exec, Mitch knew that making the deal early could mean missing out on a bigger deal at the deadline, so he waited. Mitch and Morey had worked together on deals before and had that relationship.


And therein lies the problem.

Mitch was a master of waiting.

He always waited and passed on deals always waiting for the home run.

And he missed.

And missed again.

Magic came in and immediately saw there was action to take and he took it.

That's the difference.

You can credit Mitch all you want for supposed deals but Magic actually executed, knowing the small pieces are sometimes worth it over the potential of a bigger deal.

Mitch would've passed at the deadline like he typically did.

Magic took advantage and that directly led to us getting Kuzma.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:07 pm    Post subject:

That’s quite possible
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:14 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
al242 wrote:
RI Laker wrote:
Great Post CervantesRises!


I agree, he separated his personal feelings about the situation and just laid down the facts


Other than getting the facts wrong.


Which was untrue? Everything he posted definitely occurred.
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danzag
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:19 am    Post subject:

Jesusdelonla wrote:
Jim buss moved on
Mitch moved on and got another job

Time for us all to move on


Yeah. People are still talking about DLO, Jim Buss and Mitch. Let it go
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venturalakersfan
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:46 am    Post subject:

crucifixion wrote:
venturalakersfan wrote:
I guess that Morey was lying when he said that the deal was on the table and he was just waiting on Mitch to pull the trigger. As a veteran FO exec, Mitch knew that making the deal early could mean missing out on a bigger deal at the deadline, so he waited. Mitch and Morey had worked together on deals before and had that relationship.


And therein lies the problem.

Mitch was a master of waiting.

He always waited and passed on deals always waiting for the home run.

And he missed.

And missed again.

Magic came in and immediately saw there was action to take and he took it.

That's the difference.

You can credit Mitch all you want for supposed deals but Magic actually executed, knowing the small pieces are sometimes worth it over the potential of a bigger deal.

Mitch would've passed at the deadline like he typically did.

Magic took advantage and that directly led to us getting Kuzma.


Mitch’s waiting for the home run got us Pau and 2 titles. Magic’s single got us a lottery spot without a pick.
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