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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46681
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:18 am Post subject: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144472 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:26 am Post subject: |
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I wouldn’t, but I would point out the growth of some of our young players. _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:28 am Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
I wouldn't bother debating them.
By the second week of July or so, we'll see if the FO has struck out; signed two top free agents as hoped for; or landed somewhere in-between.
We'll know in about 90 days; until then. Until then, every opinion, positive or negative, is just a guess, a hope or a fear. I wouldn't be surprised by anything, from us coming up dry to us landing two big dish. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:28 am Post subject: |
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Worst case scenario we return our young guys, who probably win 40 games if healthy.
WORST CASE.
No more Moz/Deng panic signings IMO. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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AY2043 Franchise Player
Joined: 26 Feb 2012 Posts: 10621
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:33 am Post subject: |
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yinoma2001 wrote: | Worst case scenario we return our young guys, who probably win 40 games if healthy.
WORST CASE.
No more Moz/Deng panic signings IMO. |
Well, worst case is Julius signs an offer sheet w/ another team right at the start of Free Agency, and LeBron and Paul George take their sweet time and eventually reject us after the 3 days to match Julius' offer sheet has elapsed..
Not sure we win 40 games in that scenario.
Luckily I don't think the chance of that happening is all that big |
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Judah Star Player
Joined: 23 Jun 2015 Posts: 4759
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:47 am Post subject: |
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Pessimism is a choice. As a fan base, we have good reason to be optimistic about this summer, even if Plan A doesn't come to fruition. But it's ultimately up to the individual to be optimistic. But again, it's a choice. If someone would prefer to keep a faithless, doom and gloom outlook, let them be. Just don't allow them to suck you into their pessimistic paradigm because there's zero joy to be found in it.
Be optimistic. Always. _________________ “Christ did not die to forgive sinners who go on treasuring anything above seeing and savoring God. And people who would be happy in heaven if Christ were not there, will not be there."
- John Piper |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46681
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:58 am Post subject: |
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Judah wrote: | Pessimism is a choice. As a fan base, we have good reason to be optimistic about this summer, even if Plan A doesn't come to fruition. But it's ultimately up to the individual to be optimistic. But again, it's a choice. If someone would prefer to keep a faithless, doom and gloom outlook, let them be. Just don't allow them to suck you into their pessimistic paradigm because there's zero joy to be found in it.
Be optimistic. Always. |
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32 Retired Number
Joined: 04 Nov 2009 Posts: 73071
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:07 am Post subject: |
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I am really excited about the possibilities we have this summer. I am hopeful we can put together a squad capable of making the playoffs. _________________ Nobody in the NBA can touch the Laker brand, which, like the uniform color, is pure gold. |
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Vin Star Player
Joined: 03 Jan 2013 Posts: 6005 Location: France
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:47 am Post subject: |
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I still don't really believe anything big is going to happen in FA for us this summer so I'am not going to try to convince anyone. But you can try to convince me if you're bored
There has been a lot of noise and nothing recently so I just wait and see. Like yinoma said, I'd still be very happy if we just got our guys back. Actually I really don't want anyone to be traded even though I understand the idea behind it. |
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Wilkes52 Star Player
Joined: 02 Jun 2009 Posts: 2415 Location: Far from home
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:53 am Post subject: |
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I'll wait to converse on the subject with whoever actually wants to say their position is what the OP presents. _________________ “These GOAT discussions are fun distractions while sitting around waiting for the pizza to be served.”
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar |
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Bard207 Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013 Posts: 7713
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:54 am Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46681
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 11:58 am Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
Had we had Magic in the fold, I think he would have sealed the deal with Melo and Monroe, the others were more interested in winning and I don’t think the roster even with Magic and Pelinka would have been desirable cause of lack of talent and youth.
Last edited by Inspector Gadget on Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:18 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bard207 Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013 Posts: 7713
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:14 pm Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
Had we had Magic in the fold, I think he would have sealed the deal with Melo and Monroe, the others were more interested in winning and I don’t think the roster even with Rob and Pelinka would have been desirable cause of lack of talent and youth. |
Yes
Because there is a better product to sell than a few seasons ago.
Philadelphia and LA took deep dives the past several seasons and are bouncing back up. The teams that have been just patching their rosters over the years such as Charlotte, Detroit etc are stuck in the middle with limited to no upside. |
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Inspector Gadget Retired Number
Joined: 18 Apr 2016 Posts: 46681
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:22 pm Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
Had we had Magic in the fold, I think he would have sealed the deal with Melo and Monroe, the others were more interested in winning and I don’t think the roster even with Rob and Pelinka would have been desirable cause of lack of talent and youth. |
Yes
Because there is a better product to sell than a few seasons ago.
Philadelphia and LA took deep dives the past several seasons and are bouncing back up. The teams that have been just patching their rosters over the years such as Charlotte, Detroit etc are stuck in the middle with limited to no upside. |
Yep, part of the reason why I think another reason of blowing up old FO and bringing in a new 1 is because the new regime knows more about the new CBA and how to construct and gather valuable assets. |
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activeverb Retired Number
Joined: 17 Jun 2006 Posts: 37470
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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Judah wrote: | Pessimism is a choice. As a fan base, we have good reason to be optimistic about this summer, even if Plan A doesn't come to fruition. But it's ultimately up to the individual to be optimistic. But again, it's a choice. If someone would prefer to keep a faithless, doom and gloom outlook, let them be. Just don't allow them to suck you into their pessimistic paradigm because there's zero joy to be found in it.
Be optimistic. Always. |
Being overly optimistic or overly pessimistic is bad.
Too much optimism can lead you to do stupid things. One study found that overly optimistic people tend to die earlier and become disabled more often -- you can guess why. Of course, too much pessimism can make you miserable.
As far as following sports, whatever floats your boat. The overly pessmistic fan might not be as disappointed if our plans fall through and he might be happier if they pan out because his expectations were lower,
I'm more of a "whatever happens happens" sort. I don't get invested in predictions of future events I have no control over. |
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yinoma2001 Retired Number
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 119487
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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I will admit that having been a diehard Lakers fan even through this last half decade of futility (which used to be measured by not winning rings), I will have a newfound appreciation towards a winning team again.
Having been a 30+ year Lakers fan, sometimes it's a nice jolt to the fan-system to appreciate that again. _________________ From 2-10 to the Western Conference Finals |
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venturalakersfan Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001 Posts: 144472 Location: The Gold Coast
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
Had we had Magic in the fold, I think he would have sealed the deal with Melo and Monroe, the others were more interested in winning and I don’t think the roster even with Rob and Pelinka would have been desirable cause of lack of talent and youth. |
Yes
Because there is a better product to sell than a few seasons ago.
Philadelphia and LA took deep dives the past several seasons and are bouncing back up. The teams that have been just patching their rosters over the years such as Charlotte, Detroit etc are stuck in the middle with limited to no upside. |
Yep, part of the reason why I think another reason of blowing up old FO and bringing in a new 1 is because the new regime knows more about the new CBA and how to construct and gather valuable assets. |
Of course that isn’t true but when has the truth ever stopped you? _________________ RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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Bard207 Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013 Posts: 7713
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: How would you explain to a pessimist fan that this summers FA won’t the same as in recent years |
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Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | Bard207 wrote: | Inspector Gadget wrote: | If you had a debate with a negative fan, how would you explain that the New FO is different and then the last regime and that they won’t come up empty in the meetings?
I see a lot of fans say that they won’t be surprised if the same roster came back which in essence would mean that the FO came up dry in the off season.
I wanna see if realistic fans see the great mind that the current FO represents. |
The organization has stopped tanking and the roster has been restocked some.
Would Magic and Pelinka have been able to close deals with Melo or LeBron or LMA etc a few years ago when the tanking campaign to restock the roster was in full swing? |
Had we had Magic in the fold, I think he would have sealed the deal with Melo and Monroe, the others were more interested in winning and I don’t think the roster even with Rob and Pelinka would have been desirable cause of lack of talent and youth. |
Yes
Because there is a better product to sell than a few seasons ago.
Philadelphia and LA took deep dives the past several seasons and are bouncing back up. The teams that have been just patching their rosters over the years such as Charlotte, Detroit etc are stuck in the middle with limited to no upside. |
Yep, part of the reason why I think another reason of blowing up old FO and bringing in a new 1 is because the new regime knows more about the new CBA and how to construct and gather valuable assets. |
Seems like Larry Coon mentioned that through his interactions across the league, he could see that the LA FO wasn't current* on some things.
Why new Charlotte Hornets GM Mitch Kupchak says he's undecided on rebuilding team
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He values analytics, but not over instinct
“Gut instinct has been a big part of talent evaluation: watching the player, watching the player walking to the bench, how he interacts with the coach. Scouting games in person. Those things are the biggest. Over the last 15 years, with the introduction of cameras on top of each building basically like GPS, it’s created a whole new form of data. That creates so much data every night; data uploaded every night and you have to have people to evaluate that data. That’s how the business has really changed.
“Every GM is different (as far as) confirming your instincts as a GM. If it ever was a tie I’d always go to my instincts. Might be 70-30 or 60-40.”
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___________
* Or language similar to that. |
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Baron Von Humongous Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jul 2015 Posts: 32979
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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The fifth time's the charm...? |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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First time with two max contracts to offer. |
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trablos Star Player
Joined: 10 May 2017 Posts: 3020
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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Simply that FA's really, really, care about their confidence in the FO since it's a direct indication of the direction of the team. Two people might have similar strategies but different levels of credibility. Weather it was deserved or not, Jim had a horrible reputation and Mitch was guilty by association. Magic is the polar opposite, pretty much idolized by all current players, and Rob is a guy I wouldn't mind running my business for me. |
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kikanga Retired Number
Joined: 15 Sep 2012 Posts: 29338 Location: La La Land
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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IIRC we didn't have room for 2 max free agents in past offseasons.
So that's a big difference. Along with the Kuzma and Hart overachieving so far. _________________ "Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better” |
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greenfrog Retired Number
Joined: 02 Jan 2011 Posts: 36081 Location: 502 Bad Gateway
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:34 pm Post subject: |
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trablos wrote: | Simply that FA's really, really, care about their confidence in the FO since it's a direct indication of the direction of the team. Two people might have similar strategies but different levels of credibility. Weather it was deserved or not, Jim had a horrible reputation and Mitch was guilty by association. Magic is the polar opposite, pretty much idolized by all current players, and Rob is a guy I wouldn't mind running my business for me. |
I really don't believe that. The difference is simply money this time. If Mitch and Jim had ever allocated enough to bring in two top 15/max-level players, which essentially constitutes a new team, rather than ask just one to come in and carry the burden of leading a very crappy team the outcome could have been different. |
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MIMLaker Franchise Player
Joined: 18 Jul 2001 Posts: 10015 Location: Los Angeles/ Alhambra, CA
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:42 pm Post subject: |
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We're not the same team we've been the past 3 summersL
(1) Better team reputation – 9 more wins than last year, with clearly-improved defense;
(2) Better talent reputation – Noticeable improvement or flat-out surprise years from all of our young core players.
(3) Better FO reputation – Moz trade, TWO great sleeper picks in Hart and Kuz, IT and a 1stRP for spare-parts trade. Maginka got some swag back for the FO.
Last year, we had NO LEVERAGE to swing our cap space with. We still don’t have a ton, but we clearly have more bargaining strength than last year.
And our biggest strength? It’s that we do NOT have to deal this summer.
What do we do if worse comes to worst and we don’t get LBJ or PG?
(a) We re-sign Julius - even at a bit of an overpriced deal to ward off Cuban or some other FA suitor);
(b) We get another potential rotation player with the CLE pick - or maybe even 2 if Ryan West & Co. can pull another rabbit out of some other 2nd-round hat; AND
(c) Our young guys continue to improve.
If all of that happens, and if we avoid serious injuries, then we become a No. 8 or No. 7 playoff team, right in time for the 2019 FA summer.
This is what improvement and legitimate hope look like. We're going to be OK. |
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cyborgspider Starting Rotation
Joined: 21 Sep 2017 Posts: 930
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Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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Be honest, you wanted to title this "How would you explain to VLF..."
I'd just say "cool, see you in October! we'll see who turned out right". |
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