Luxury Tax

 
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LAKERMIKE2
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:18 am    Post subject: Luxury Tax

Has anyone disgust if Jeanie has said she’s willing to pay the luxury tax to bring back a winning team? All this talk about cap space for 1 or 2 free agents is not that important if Jeanie with all the money the Lakers generates shouldn’t be an issue!

I believe there are some teams that are above it even though the Warriors are favored to win it every year, even if there’s 27-29 mill for next year why not go over & pay it for 2 or 3 more decent players, I just don’t get it? While LBJ is here for 3-4 years why not pay the luxury tax during that time to better your team & have a better shot, her father undoubtedly would... I think Magic would if he owned the team, not restrict someone in a huge market... Com’on Jeanie make it happen!
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:24 am    Post subject:

It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:31 am    Post subject:

Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:46 am    Post subject:

There are of course restrictions on teams who are paying the luxury tax, that would not allow the Lakers to entice players like the one's you've mentioned.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:48 am    Post subject:

LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:57 am    Post subject:

AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).


So, am I wrong to understand let’s say hypothetically without AD coming we sign Leonard or Irving? Can we still sign a guy like Walker or Butler or can’t we, can we if we pay the luxury tax & then get one year players like we did with Rondo, Lance & Mcgee?

Basically can we sign to max guys or does the third have to fall under a certain amount or does the luxury tax kick in regardless of rest of roster?
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:00 am    Post subject:

About 5 years ago Mitch said they would if they were ever in contention again. I assume that it holds true with Magic and Lebron in charge.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:09 am    Post subject:

That’s not how it works unfortunately. You can’t just go over any time you want. The only way to go over is to sign players with cap space and in future seasons give out raises and extensions with exceptions, or make trades with higher incoming salary or using other exceptions like MLE. You can’t jusy sign a player when you don’t have cap space and pay a penalty.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:17 am    Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:
That’s not how it works unfortunately. You can’t just go over any time you want. The only way to go over is to sign players with cap space and in future seasons give out raises and extensions with exceptions, or make trades with higher incoming salary or using other exceptions like MLE. You can’t jusy sign a player when you don’t have cap space and pay a penalty.


Yeah I thought that was it thanx, but it seems like since Jimmy & Mitch were told not to I wonder if Jeanie will revisit this once we’re capable of doing so once again. At this point doesn’t seem the kids will be around even when LBJ retires...

Be nice to get back into that situation again!
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:29 am    Post subject:

LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).


So, am I wrong to understand let’s say hypothetically without AD coming we sign Leonard or Irving? Can we still sign a guy like Walker or Butler or can’t we, can we if we pay the luxury tax & then get one year players like we did with Rondo, Lance & Mcgee?

Basically can we sign to max guys or does the third have to fall under a certain amount or does the luxury tax kick in regardless of rest of roster?



25. What are salary cap exceptions?

Quote:

The basic rule of the NBA's salary cap is that a team can't sign a player or make a trade that leaves the team's team salary above the cap, unless the team is using an exception. In a system with a soft cap, exceptions are the mechanisms that allow teams to function while above the cap. Some exceptions are available only for making trades, and are described in detail starting in question number 84. The exceptions available for signing players are as follows1:



Once the available cap space is used up to sign free agents such as Kyrie Irving in your example, they (Magic & Pelinka) will need to convince a second level guy such as Middleton to sign via an exception. Since they will have used cap space to sign Irving, the only exception available to use will be the Room Exception which will be about $4.8 million. Since Middleton could make $13 million next season if he keeps his current contract with the Bucks and perhaps over $20 million if he opts out for a new contract, getting him to sign with the Lakers for $4.8 million is not likely.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:30 am    Post subject:

LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).


So, am I wrong to understand let’s say hypothetically without AD coming we sign Leonard or Irving? Can we still sign a guy like Walker or Butler or can’t we, can we if we pay the luxury tax & then get one year players like we did with Rondo, Lance & Mcgee?

Basically can we sign to max guys or does the third have to fall under a certain amount or does the luxury tax kick in regardless of rest of roster?


This is a common confusion. The luxury tax is something you pay when you go way over the cap (I won't get into figures to keep it simple), but you don't always get to go so over the cap. For that, basically, you need to go on resigning players for bigger salaries when you have their bird rights or exceptions for example.

What people confuse a lot is that they think you can just sign guys ad eternum and pay the lux tax. That's not how it works. If you're over the cap (like we'd be after getting a max guy) we will only be able to:

- Re-sign our own guys if we have their bird rights
- Sign the draft picks we select
- Sign guys for the vet min
- Sign guys for one of the many exceptions (MLE, Room Exception, etc)

So by doing that, yes, sometimes you'll go over the tax, but those are very limited moves. Usually if you're over the cap and presuming no trades and no good draft picks, you get to add 1-2 good rotation players per offseason using those exceptions mostly.

And that is also one of the difficulties we'd have if we trade for AD. Even if we mantain space for a 3rd Max, we'd have to build a team of vet. min guys basically (still worthy though, but just to exemplify).
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:05 am    Post subject:

AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).


So, am I wrong to understand let’s say hypothetically without AD coming we sign Leonard or Irving? Can we still sign a guy like Walker or Butler or can’t we, can we if we pay the luxury tax & then get one year players like we did with Rondo, Lance & Mcgee?

Basically can we sign to max guys or does the third have to fall under a certain amount or does the luxury tax kick in regardless of rest of roster?


This is a common confusion. The luxury tax is something you pay when you go way over the cap (I won't get into figures to keep it simple), but you don't always get to go so over the cap. For that, basically, you need to go on resigning players for bigger salaries when you have their bird rights or exceptions for example.

What people confuse a lot is that they think you can just sign guys ad eternum and pay the lux tax. That's not how it works. If you're over the cap (like we'd be after getting a max guy) we will only be able to:

- Re-sign our own guys if we have their bird rights
- Sign the draft picks we select
- Sign guys for the vet min
- Sign guys for one of the many exceptions (MLE, Room Exception, etc)

So by doing that, yes, sometimes you'll go over the tax, but those are very limited moves. Usually if you're over the cap and presuming no trades and no good draft picks, you get to add 1-2 good rotation players per offseason using those exceptions mostly.

And that is also one of the difficulties we'd have if we trade for AD. Even if we mantain space for a 3rd Max, we'd have to build a team of vet. min guys basically (still worthy though, but just to exemplify).



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:04 am    Post subject: Re: Luxury Tax

LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Has anyone disgust if Jeanie has said she’s willing to pay the luxury tax to bring back a winning team? All this talk about cap space for 1 or 2 free agents is not that important if Jeanie with all the money the Lakers generates shouldn’t be an issue!

I believe there are some teams that are above it even though the Warriors are favored to win it every year, even if there’s 27-29 mill for next year why not go over & pay it for 2 or 3 more decent players, I just don’t get it? While LBJ is here for 3-4 years why not pay the luxury tax during that time to better your team & have a better shot, her father undoubtedly would... I think Magic would if he owned the team, not restrict someone in a huge market... Com’on Jeanie make it happen!


Luxury tax eats into profits.

Profits are probably distributed to the other siblings at the end of the year. That's probably their major source of income.

She'd have to think about that aspect of it too. Especially the siblings that aren't really involved in the team anymore.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:08 am    Post subject:

AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
AirKobe8 wrote:
LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Bard207 wrote:
It is difficult for a team to go from signing free agents into cap space and into paying luxury tax in the same season.

Give a general idea of moves that they could make that would have them paying luxury tax in the near future.


Well, in general whether AD comes or not? Just going into summer if she tells Magic she’s willing to pay tax it makes it easier to go after 2 max guys for sure & still have money to have a decent bench like players Batum, Reddick, Middleton, Ariza, Rozier, Beverly, etc, etc...


We couldn't get those players after signing max guys, regardless of luxury tax. That's another issue. I think you may have a wrongful conception of what the luxury tax is, I'd suggest you to read more about it (sorry if that's not the case, that's just my impression from this post).


So, am I wrong to understand let’s say hypothetically without AD coming we sign Leonard or Irving? Can we still sign a guy like Walker or Butler or can’t we, can we if we pay the luxury tax & then get one year players like we did with Rondo, Lance & Mcgee?

Basically can we sign to max guys or does the third have to fall under a certain amount or does the luxury tax kick in regardless of rest of roster?


This is a common confusion. The luxury tax is something you pay when you go way over the cap (I won't get into figures to keep it simple), but you don't always get to go so over the cap. For that, basically, you need to go on resigning players for bigger salaries when you have their bird rights or exceptions for example.

What people confuse a lot is that they think you can just sign guys ad eternum and pay the lux tax. That's not how it works. If you're over the cap (like we'd be after getting a max guy) we will only be able to:

- Re-sign our own guys if we have their bird rights
- Sign the draft picks we select
- Sign guys for the vet min
- Sign guys for one of the many exceptions (MLE, Room Exception, etc)

So by doing that, yes, sometimes you'll go over the tax, but those are very limited moves. Usually if you're over the cap and presuming no trades and no good draft picks, you get to add 1-2 good rotation players per offseason using those exceptions mostly.

And that is also one of the difficulties we'd have if we trade for AD. Even if we mantain space for a 3rd Max, we'd have to build a team of vet. min guys basically (still worthy though, but just to exemplify).


1 other way:
You can take back 125% salary + $100K in trades. Trading for AD at $25.4M, we could send out $20.3 adding $5M to payroll.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:09 am    Post subject:

Old Doc Buss had a policy (and it was a good one) that you only pay true superstars max salaries. Guys like Kareem, Magic, Kobe, Shaq, etc were the only guys worth going into a luxury tax situation for in his opinion. Because those were the guys who were going to have you complete for championships year after year. And that is what the Lakers are all about. Championships.

I agree with him. If we are going into a luxury tax for Lebron, Davis, Kwahi, Durant, etc then go for it. But if we are going into a luxury tax situation for Mike Conley, Blake Griffin, John Wall, or others like that forget it.

Look at Miami this year. They have the highest team salary in the NBA this year. Are they championship contenders? I don't think so. Do we want to be Portland with the 6th highest? Washington with the 7th highest? Memphis with the 10th highest?

[url]Link to team salaries[/url]
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 11:41 am    Post subject:

Laker7 wrote:
Old Doc Buss had a policy (and it was a good one) that you only pay true superstars max salaries. Guys like Kareem, Magic, Kobe, Shaq, etc were the only guys worth going into a luxury tax situation for in his opinion. Because those were the guys who were going to have you complete for championships year after year. And that is what the Lakers are all about. Championships.

I agree with him. If we are going into a luxury tax for Lebron, Davis, Kwahi, Durant, etc then go for it. But if we are going into a luxury tax situation for Mike Conley, Blake Griffin, John Wall, or others like that forget it.

Look at Miami this year. They have the highest team salary in the NBA this year. Are they championship contenders? I don't think so. Do we want to be Portland with the 6th highest? Washington with the 7th highest? Memphis with the 10th highest?

[url]Link to team salaries[/url]



As others have said that's not quite how the luxury tax works.

(Very simplified):

In our situation, we would sign free agents us to bring us up to the cap limit. At that point we can't spend anymore. However, at a certain point we have players who come off their rookie contracts are eligible for raises. So we have to decide if it's worth paying them or losing. If you pay enough of them, you go into luxury tax.

So Miami is so high because they matched an offer for Tyler Johnson and signed an extension with Josh Richardson. So they are taking a hit while they wait for the contracts of their previous signings to run out.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Luxury Tax

LAKERMIKE2 wrote:
Has anyone disgust if Jeanie has said she’s willing to pay the luxury tax to bring back a winning team? All this talk about cap space for 1 or 2 free agents is not that important if Jeanie with all the money the Lakers generates shouldn’t be an issue!

I believe there are some teams that are above it even though the Warriors are favored to win it every year, even if there’s 27-29 mill for next year why not go over & pay it for 2 or 3 more decent players, I just don’t get it? While LBJ is here for 3-4 years why not pay the luxury tax during that time to better your team & have a better shot, her father undoubtedly would... I think Magic would if he owned the team, not restrict someone in a huge market... Com’on Jeanie make it happen!


Money doesn't gross on trees!
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