Quinn Cook #’s shows a more productive PG over Rajon Rondo?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 10:58 am    Post subject: Quinn Cook #’s shows a more productive PG over Rajon Rondo?

https://twitter.com/imsupercap/status/1230532602034974721?s=21
https://twitter.com/imsupercap/status/1230559302932295680?s=21

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Interesting Stat:

Rajon Rondo in 38 games has been +56 (+1.5 per game)

Quinn Cook in only 34 games is a higher +85 (+2.5 per game)

However in 14 games that Rondo was out, Cook as the secondary PG was a +63 (+4.5 per) averaging 7 points, 2 assists, shot 47% from the field (42/90) and 35% from 3-point range (12/34) playing about 17 mins per game. Lakers were 11-3 in that span (79%)

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:09 am    Post subject:

not surprised I have long said even Cook and Daniels can do more for this team with Rondo's minutes
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:12 am    Post subject:

Rondo obviously dribbles better than Cook.

But shooting-wise, not even close. Cook is basically an undersized "SG" but we can't play him alongside someone like Rondo b/c of the resultant defensive nightmare.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:14 am    Post subject:

Cook is going to struggle playing the Lebron role.

Could probably be just fine playing the KCP or Fisher role though.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:16 am    Post subject:

I think the only team we really need Rondo is against the Clippers. Man, guards looked bad dribbling against pressure. But then again, Alex was also out that game.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:20 am    Post subject:

Vogel likes to play a bench lineup of

- PG Rondo
- SG Caruso
- SF KCP
- PF Kuzma
- C Dwight

Caruso can play the facilitator role. He was the backup of Lonzo Ball for 2 seasons.

I'd rather see a bench lineup of

- PG Caruso
- SG Cook/KCP or someone who can shoot
- SF KCP
- PF Kuzma
- C Dwight
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:25 am    Post subject:

Rondo is to Vogel as Luke was to Phil

Some coaches just love certain players, and I think it's a personal bias because they just happen to like the guy. As long as Vogel tweaks the lineups in the playoffs and shortens Rondo's leash, I can live with being 1st in the west with old man Rondo getting minutes. I am actually one of Rondo's supporters but I can't deny that every analytic says he's playing like the worst player on the team. I still think he can have a few big moments in the playoffs for us.

I really like Cook a lot. I was pretty happy when we signed him because I saw him step up in the Finals and hit big shots. That's what you want from role players. And after watching his interview on The Green Room I like him even more.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:52 am    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
Rondo is to Vogel as Luke was to Phil

Some coaches just love certain players, and I think it's a personal bias because they just happen to like the guy. As long as Vogel tweaks the lineups in the playoffs and shortens Rondo's leash, I can live with being 1st in the west with old man Rondo getting minutes. I am actually one of Rondo's supporters but I can't deny that every analytic says he's playing like the worst player on the team. I still think he can have a few big moments in the playoffs for us.

I really like Cook a lot. I was pretty happy when we signed him because I saw him step up in the Finals and hit big shots. That's what you want from role players. And after watching his interview on The Green Room I like him even more.


I think it may be the opposite. That the "playoff Rondo" thing will propel Vogel to play Rondo more in the playoffs to our detriment. Hopefully I'm wrong about that.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 11:56 am    Post subject:

i'd like to see cook rotated in lineups with caruso, kcp, green who all provide complementary wing defense. he really can open up the floor for LBJ/AD.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:21 pm    Post subject:

Lonzo-Lite wrote:
Vogel likes to play a bench lineup of

- PG Rondo
- SG Caruso
- SF KCP
- PF Kuzma
- C Dwight

Caruso can play the facilitator role. He was the backup of Lonzo Ball for 2 seasons.

I'd rather see a bench lineup of

- PG Caruso
- SG Cook/KCP or someone who can shoot
- SF KCP
- PF Kuzma
- C Dwight


Agreed - pair Cook with Caruso, helps cover his defensive weaknesses especially off-ball where Caruso is a monster and his shooting opens up the floor. He is also much more of an offensive threat with his dribble pull up game and he has been pretty good in P&R with Dwight.

This seems like a no brainer if you remove politics from the equation.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:32 pm    Post subject:

It's baffling to me why the media can't figure out why point guards aren't signing here. Reggie Jackson got First Take debating brand and anti-Laker sentiments. It's really simple, as deep as the Clippers are, they have one official point guard on their squad. Reggie Jackson don't wanna be dancing around Rondo politics. He and Lou Williams will out play KCP and Rondo... that's Doc's pitch. What's the Lakers' pitch? "On some nights, it'll be you, on some nights it'll be Rondo, if we need more D, on some nights it'll be Caruso. It'll be great, join our family."
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 1:46 pm    Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:
It's baffling to me why the media can't figure out why point guards aren't signing here. Reggie Jackson got First Take debating brand and anti-Laker sentiments. It's really simple, as deep as the Clippers are, they have one official point guard on their squad. Reggie Jackson don't wanna be dancing around Rondo politics. He and Lou Williams will out play KCP and Rondo... that's Doc's pitch. What's the Lakers' pitch? "On some nights, it'll be you, on some nights it'll be Rondo, if we need more D, on some nights it'll be Caruso. It'll be great, join our family."


That's a good point about Rondo. A buyout guy would be wondering if he is going to sit on the bench b/c of a team's infatuation with a washed up Rondo.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:25 pm    Post subject:

epic_ wrote:
I think the only team we really need Rondo is against the Clippers. Man, guards looked bad dribbling against pressure. But then again, Alex was also out that game.


Alex can't handle it either imo. I love the guy but early in the season when he had more ball handling duties, the results weren't good. Solid handles but suspect for a primary ball handler against a team like the Clippers.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:59 pm    Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:
What's the Lakers' pitch? "On some nights, it'll be you, on some nights it'll be Rondo, if we need more D, on some nights it'll be Caruso. It'll be great, join our family."


You think that's what they told Darren Collison which is why he stayed retired?
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:02 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
It's baffling to me why the media can't figure out why point guards aren't signing here. Reggie Jackson got First Take debating brand and anti-Laker sentiments. It's really simple, as deep as the Clippers are, they have one official point guard on their squad. Reggie Jackson don't wanna be dancing around Rondo politics. He and Lou Williams will out play KCP and Rondo... that's Doc's pitch. What's the Lakers' pitch? "On some nights, it'll be you, on some nights it'll be Rondo, if we need more D, on some nights it'll be Caruso. It'll be great, join our family."


That's a good point about Rondo. A buyout guy would be wondering if he is going to sit on the bench b/c of a team's infatuation with a washed up Rondo.


Makes sense
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:11 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
Rondo is to Vogel as Luke was to Phil

Some coaches just love certain players, and I think it's a personal bias because they just happen to like the guy. As long as Vogel tweaks the lineups in the playoffs and shortens Rondo's leash, I can live with being 1st in the west with old man Rondo getting minutes. I am actually one of Rondo's supporters but I can't deny that every analytic says he's playing like the worst player on the team. I still think he can have a few big moments in the playoffs for us.

I really like Cook a lot. I was pretty happy when we signed him because I saw him step up in the Finals and hit big shots. That's what you want from role players. And after watching his interview on The Green Room I like him even more.


I think it may be the opposite. That the "playoff Rondo" thing will propel Vogel to play Rondo more in the playoffs to our detriment. Hopefully I'm wrong about that.


One thing I like about Vogel is he rides the hot hand. Thats why a lot of times Caruso finishes the game over Rondo. I mean even Obama told Vogel to play AC more. I have to assume Frank isnt a bonehead ane he has a plan. Perhaps doesn't want to reveal all his cards in the reg season.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:22 pm    Post subject:

Lonzo-Lite wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
What's the Lakers' pitch? "On some nights, it'll be you, on some nights it'll be Rondo, if we need more D, on some nights it'll be Caruso. It'll be great, join our family."


You think that's what they told Darren Collison which is why he stayed retired?


I dunno, but in all their pitches, there has to be an elephant name Rondo in the room. The media is also not talking enough about how AD and Bron runs the show. If they want Reggie Jackson, they call Reggie Jackson. But their boy is Rondo, so how hard did they recruit?

A point guard isn't stepping on anybody's toes joining the Clippers. That's why I was perplexed why people thought Collison was a lock for the Lakers. Yeah he had lunch with Linda Rambis, the confidant. LOL! But what matters is feeling wanted by AD or Bron, and again, I bet there wasn't any real hard recruiting because of Rondo.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:28 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
epic_ wrote:
I think the only team we really need Rondo is against the Clippers. Man, guards looked bad dribbling against pressure. But then again, Alex was also out that game.


Alex can't handle it either imo. I love the guy but early in the season when he had more ball handling duties, the results weren't good. Solid handles but suspect for a primary ball handler against a team like the Clippers.


I agree.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 3:39 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
epic_ wrote:
I think the only team we really need Rondo is against the Clippers. Man, guards looked bad dribbling against pressure. But then again, Alex was also out that game.


Alex can't handle it either imo. I love the guy but early in the season when he had more ball handling duties, the results weren't good. Solid handles but suspect for a primary ball handler against a team like the Clippers.

Alex can handle bringing the ball up the court with pressure just fine. He only gets in trouble when he tries to do too much with the ball
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 6:17 pm    Post subject:

I thought it was interesting Quinn Cook made first page honors on the NBA’s “average speed on defense” stat. Of course, James Harden was dead last. Sharing first page honors were Avery Bradley and Danny Green.

Meanwhile, Rajon Rondo was on the last page with James Harden .

> Players > Tracking > Speed & Distance https://on.nba.com/38M4dj5
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:05 pm    Post subject:

Its funny but Bonga is actually a good defender
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 7:43 am    Post subject:

We saw Cook as a backup PG in the Finals and it wasn’t pretty
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 8:09 am    Post subject:

Playoffs will be about LBJ playing about 40 a game, especially in close games, it could be 42. The Lakers guards will need to be able to first deliver the ball to LBJ and AD under immense disruption and guard depth.

If LBJ is doing well running the point and getting to the paint, then you do not need Rondo, and you can go with a better shooter like Cook (or whomever). I still think that once playoffs roll some teams will begin to send doubles at Lebron up high, and then you will see him have to move the ball out of his hands early. The way to combat that is to have somepne with PG ballhandling skills like Rondo, who can then deliver the pass to Lebron at the wing (who can then create from there). The doubles are that much harder to put on Lebron, when you start the offense with him off the ball.

Like I said, it is all about what the defense is doing and how effective LBJ is. If he is being effective as the PG, you do not need Rondo. If you feel that LBJ needs to go more off the ball, you have to give Rondo some PT to get those set ups. Same thing with AD, to a lesser degree.

Once defenses pressure at a playoff intensity and elite defensive level, Caruso or Cook or Bradley bringing the ball up is not an option. Rondo has to get some PT in that scenario.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:03 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
We saw Cook as a backup PG in the Finals and it wasn’t pretty


I’m guessing you loved Cook and Cousins on the Warriors last year. I don’t have any facts, but I know your love for 3 organizations (not named the Lakers) and a current Knicks player.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 21, 2020 9:06 am    Post subject:

Let's face it. Rondo is on the team because of chemistry. I wouldn't be surprised to see Cook get more minutes in the run up to the playoffs.
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