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chekmatex4
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 Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 6:59 am Post subject: |
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I think it will be a year for the young guys to develop under Lebron's leadership and see the work he puts into the game. I hope he raises the bar for everyone.
On the court, I imagine seeing a lot of fast break points. Lebron's Miami's team always tried to get easy buckets with run outs after rebounds. Lonzo is one of the best at rebounding and throwing the outlet. Half court Lebron will do his thing. They will be top 5 in fast break baskets scored.
I also expect Lakers to improve defensively. Everyone can switch now and they will improve on their 3 pint defense from last year. The interior might be a little soft so we'll see how it goes. Might not be as much of an issue with more teams playing smaller. We have above average rebounders 1 through 5. |
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kb24GOAT
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:27 am Post subject: |
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| ingle wrote: | I wouldn't read more into it than what's necessary, we aren't gonna beat GSW this year and that's that. Personally I think the FO knows this year is a write-off from the perspective of contending for a championship, and deliberately filled the roster up with easy scapegoats on 1 year contracts to serve as distractions for the media.
We all know that with any Lebron team comes a media circus and witchhunt for the ultimate scapegoat, we also know we have a very talented young core that needs 1-2 more years of development before they're able to threaten the real contenders in the playoffs.
Hence while Javale, Rondo, Beasley and Lance aren't bad players, I think they are just the decoys for the media this year so that our young core can keep developing without attracting the media backlash that comes with being Lebron's teammate. |
you never know. we are one steph curry achilles tear away from winning a title. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:34 am Post subject: |
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| Wilkes52 wrote: | It's remarkable that the Showtime team comparison gets hauled out. Sheesh.
This squad is nothing like those guys at all. How easy it is to forget (it seems) that before Magic Johnson was drafted to the club, the Lakers had two all-NBA players on board (Wilkes, Abdul-Jabbar) who each already owned key roles on past college and NBA championship teams. Each has been RoY. The Lakers were making regular trips into the playoffs before Magic arrived. Kareem was a scoring god in this league, and Wilkes was in his prime physically. We have no one accomplished like that at all here today, except LeBron (who will be age 34 before New Years.)
Adding LeBron to this crew isn't like adding Magic to the '79-'80 team, tempting as it may be to imagine that it is. |
The argument is also that we will be some great defensive team so let the preseason optimism reign. We can adjust as the season proceeds. We have to remember that this isn’t the roster we desired, it is the roster that fit into the one year contract plan. Hopefully enjoy being in the playoffs this season and make a big splash next offseason.
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:41 am Post subject: |
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| chekmatex4 wrote: | I think it will be a year for the young guys to develop under Lebron's leadership and see the work he puts into the game. I hope he raises the bar for everyone.
On the court, I imagine seeing a lot of fast break points. Lebron's Miami's team always tried to get easy buckets with run outs after rebounds. Lonzo is one of the best at rebounding and throwing the outlet. Half court Lebron will do his thing. They will be top 5 in fast break baskets scored.
I also expect Lakers to improve defensively. Everyone can switch now and they will improve on their 3 pint defense from last year. The interior might be a little soft so we'll see how it goes. Might not be as much of an issue with more teams playing smaller. We have above average rebounders 1 through 5. |
Agree except for the defensive part. The young players can learn from Lebron and the other vets this season and hopefully be more impactful next season.
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activeverb
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:16 am Post subject: |
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| Wilkes52 wrote: | | It's remarkable that the Showtime team comparison gets hauled out. Sheesh. |
Human nature.
When Luke got hired from Golden State, people wanted to compare everyone on the roster to the Warriors,
When Magic came aboard, it was a given people would find parallels to Showtime.
If we hired Pop as coach, people would suddenly find reasons why the roster was eerily similar to the Spurs ring teams. |
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activeverb
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:38 am Post subject: |
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| ingle wrote: | I wouldn't read more into it than what's necessary, we aren't gonna beat GSW this year and that's that. Personally I think the FO knows this year is a write-off from the perspective of contending for a championship, and deliberately filled the roster up with easy scapegoats on 1 year contracts to serve as distractions for the media.
We all know that with any Lebron team comes a media circus and witchhunt for the ultimate scapegoat, we also know we have a very talented young core that needs 1-2 more years of development before they're able to threaten the real contenders in the playoffs.
Hence while Javale, Rondo, Beasley and Lance aren't bad players, I think they are just the decoys for the media this year so that our young core can keep developing without attracting the media backlash that comes with being Lebron's teammate. |
I don't think that's it at all. The Lakers were hoping to get a second big free agent, and when that didn't happen they loaded up on one-year rentals to preserve cap space for next year.
I don't think the signings are "decoys." The Lakers are trying to build the most competitive team for this year without surrounding flexibility next year (or for a mid season trade). |
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governator
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| starters - 2nd unit are all interchangable parts with LAbron as the head, the Voltron |
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Staccatos
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| Reilec142002 wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | One of the kids (or Kawhi if they trade for him) is going to have to play at an All-NBA level to make this comparison work. |
Theres this guy named Lebron. I hear he's pretty good and one day may be the best player in the league. |
I heard hes pretty good. |
He may be good, but he ain't pretty. |
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audioaxes
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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I dont recall any talk of that Miami team being a collection of players that didnt fit.
Shaq still in his prime
Wade at elite level, shooting 50% FG, getting FTs from someone just looking at him, and a very good passer and defender
3 and D wing player James Posey
Mourning still playing elite D
Walker playing stretch 4 role
White Chocolate balancing out the back court with decent 3pt shooting
Haslem as an elite rebounder and decent mid range jumper
This was before the rise of super teams so a team like this was easily considered a championship contender from the jump
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LakerSanity
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:59 pm Post subject: |
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2011-2012 Miami Heat
Off. Rating: 106.6 (8th)
Def. Rating: 100.2 (4th)
PPG Scored: 98.5 (7th)
PPG Allowed: 92.5 (4th)
Pace: 91.2 (16th)
Win. %: 69.7%
2011-2012 Top 3 Per 36 Minutes
Lebron (per 36): 26.0 PPG (60.5 TS%), 7.6 RPG, 6.0 APG, 1.8 SPG, 0.8 BPG
Wade (per 36): 24.0 PPG (55.9 TS%), 5.3 RPG, 5.0 APG, 1.8 SPG, 1.4 BPG
Bosh (per 36): 19.4 PPG (55.1 TS%), 8.1 RPG, 1.8 APG, 0.9 SPG, 0.8 BPG
2011-2012 Top 3 Per 36 Minutes Adjusted to Lakers 2017-2018 Pace
Lebron (per 36): 28.1 PPG (60.5 TS%), 8.2 RPG, 6.5 APG, 1.9 SPG, 0.9 BPG
Wade (per 36): 25.9 PPG (55.9 TS%), 5.7 RPG, 5.4 APG, 1.9 SPG, 1.5 BPG
Bosh (per 36): 21.0 PPG (55.1 TS%), 8.8 RPG, 1.9 APG, 1.0 SPG, 0.9 BPG
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Total (per 36): 75.0 PPG (57.2 TS%), 22.7 RPG, 13.8 APG, 4.8 SPG, 3.3 BPG
2017-2018 Los Angeles Lakers
Off. Rating: 106.5 (23rdth)
Def. Rating: 108.0 (12th)
PPG Scored: 108.1 (11th)
PPG Allowed: 109.6 (25th)
Pace: 100.3 (2nd)
Win. %: 42.7%
2017-2018 Top 3 Per 36 Minutes
Randle (per 36): 21.7 PPG (60.6 TS%), 10.7 RPG, 3.5 APG, 0.7 SPG, 0.7 BPG
Ingram (per 36): 17.3 PPG (53.6 TS%), 5.7 RPG, 4.2 APG, 0.8 SPG, 0.8 BPG
Kuzma (per 36): 18.6 PPG (54.9 TS%), 7.2 RPG, 2.1 APG, 0.7 SPG, 0.5 BPG
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Total (per 36): 57.6 PPG (56.4 TS%), 23.6 RPG, 9.8 APG, 2.2 SPG, 2.0 BPG
2017-2018 Top 3 Per 36 Minutes (w/ 2018 Lebron Instead of Randle Adj. for Pace)
Lebron (per 36): 27.3 PPG (62.1 TS%), 8.6 RPG, 9.1 APG, 1,4 SPG, 0.8 BPG
Ingram (per 36): 17.3 PPG (53.6 TS%), 5.7 RPG, 4.2 APG, 0.8 SPG, 0.8 BPG
Kuzma (per 36): 18.6 PPG (54.9 TS%), 7.2 RPG, 2.1 APG, 0.7 SPG, 0.5 BPG
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Total (per 36): 62.2 PPG (56.9 TS%), 21.5 RPG, 15.4 APG, 2.9 SPG, 2.1 BPG
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2012 Heat Big 3 v. 2018 Lakers Big 3 (Per 36 Adjusted for Pace)
MIA Total: 75.0 PPG (57.2 TS%), 22.7 RPG, 13.8 APG, 4.8 SPG, 3.3 BPG
LAL Total: 57.6 PPG (56.4 TS%), 23.6 RPG, 9.8 APG, 2.2 SPG, 2.0 BPG
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Difference: -17.4 PPG (-0.8 TS%), +0.9 RPG, -4.0 APG, -2.6 SPG, -1.3 BPG
2012 Heat Big 3 v. 2018 Lakers Big 3 w/ Lebron (Per 36 Adjusted for Pace)
MIA Total: 75.0 PPG (57.2 TS%), 22.7 RPG, 13.8 APG, 4.8 SPG, 3.3 BPG
LAL Total: 62.2 PPG (56.9 TS%), 21.5 RPG, 15.4 APG, 2.9 SPG, 2.1 BPG
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Difference: -12.8 PPG (-0.3 TS%), -1.2 RPG, +1.6 APG, -1.9 SPG, -1.2 BPG
Obviously, whichever way you look at it, scoring and defense are the two biggest differences. As a third option, offensively, Bosh and Kuzma actually aren't that far apart. However, they are worlds apart defensively. Ingram and Wade aren't close in terms of scoring ability or defensive impact (but statistically a wash in other aspects of the game). Lebron isn't the same as 2012 Lebron - better offensively, but much worse defensively.
The bottom line is that for us to really be compared to the 2012 Miami Heat, Ingram needs to step up both scoring-wise and defensively, Kuzma needs to step up huge on defense and the entire team needs to outplay the 2012 Miami Heat defensively in order to make up for Lebron's gap there.
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:26 pm Post subject: |
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How many threads with weird analogies to past championship teams are we going to see before training camp? I am setting the over/under at 7.
So far, we have seen the '89 Pistons, the '04 Pistons, and the '06 Heat. |
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CervantesRises
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Aeneas Hunter wrote: | How many threads with weird analogies to past championship teams are we going to see before training camp? I am setting the over/under at 7.
So far, we have seen the '89 Pistons, the '04 Pistons, and the '06 Heat. |
Hope springs eternal in the off season...and I'm sipping the koolaid too.
But I dont think this team has a comp. But I do think the ceiling is #2 seed top 4 team once everyone gets into their roles.
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splashmtn
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 1:46 pm Post subject: Re: I think I see the blueprint for this Laker team |
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| slavavov wrote: | I've seen threads comparing our current roster to the 2004 Pistons, 2005 Heat or even the late 80s Pistons. I see no comparison to any of those teams.
The closest model I see are Magic's own Laker teams from the mid 80s. Except for Rondo, most of our rotation guys are between 6-5 and 6-9 and can run, score and create off a dribble at least a little bit, just like those showtime teams. I also feel like the emphasis will be on defense, especially later in the season when these guys have figured out how to play with each other on offense.
Other than Ingram and/or Kuzma becoming Lebron's sidekick or co-star, I think defense will be the X-factor for this team. Magic has said he wants us to play even faster than we did last year. As they say, you can't run if you don't have the ball. I wonder if we'll be a good enough defensive rebounding team for our transition game to reach its full potential. I also hope we see some pressure D at times, where we trap guys and play full court D like how Magic's showtime teams did when they really wanted to speed the game up.
To do all that, you always need fresh guys in the game who can run and are skilled at both ends. The Warriors don't have a bad bench, but their bench isn't exactly great either. We may have the makings of a bench that can extend leads and put the pressure on the Warriors. This can also allow Lebron to only play 33-35 minutes a game. |
you're about to see guys get trapped on some of these pick and rolls. that switch everything all the time can't be the only way we play it. we will have to go back a few years and ice those screen and rolls, and trap the ball handler at times. we have the length and the IQ to pull it off. there will be times we need to full court press and half court press. we have more than enough guys on the team where guys wont wear down. no excuses. lock up on defense and turn that ball over. here's the funny thing, we're trying to play similar to Lavar ball had his sons playing, trapping/pressing a lot to create more turnovers and leak outs. obviously its the nba so you can't abuse it like you can in high school. or AAU. but you can do it in spurts with the proper personnel. |
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Aeneas Hunter
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 2:43 pm Post subject: |
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| CervantesRises wrote: | | Aeneas Hunter wrote: | How many threads with weird analogies to past championship teams are we going to see before training camp? I am setting the over/under at 7.
So far, we have seen the '89 Pistons, the '04 Pistons, and the '06 Heat. |
Hope springs eternal in the off season...and I'm sipping the koolaid too.
But I dont think this team has a comp. But I do think the ceiling is #2i seed top 4 team once everyone gets into their roles. |
Oh, I get it. Even though I’m usually skeptical about everything, I find myself getting excited about this season. But the 2006 Heat? I’m not seeing that one. Just the same, I’m not expecting anyone to compare this team to the Vancouver Grizzlies. |
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24Legend007
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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| A better version of the 2014-2015 Cavs... minus Kyrie and Love. |
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Villain6Activated
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Reilec142002 wrote: | | Car54 wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | One of the kids (or Kawhi if they trade for him) is going to have to play at an All-NBA level to make this comparison work. |
Theres this guy named Lebron. I hear he's pretty good and one day may be the best player in the league. |
I heard hes pretty good. |
I heard he's trash
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Judah
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| 24Legend007 wrote: | | A better version of the 2014-2015 Cavs... minus Kyrie and Love. |
🤔
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ShowtimeDynasty_24/7
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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I think the blueprint has been stated by Magic and Pelinka. We want a basketball team of tough minded playmakers who are smart offensively. We don't have the right personnel to win with that right now, but we are obtaining players who fall into that mold. This year we will not contend, and I don't think thats the goal of our organization right now, but we are going to develop a culture. A culture that when we finally get the longterm pieces in will already be in place and conducive to winning. Ultimately, I think we are going for an original blueprint- a team that can sustain winning for a long time.
Lonzo Ball
"Cutting/Great shooting/Great defender 2"
Brandon Ingram
LeBron James
"Fluid, good shooting, good passing, long big who can block shots"
Kyle Kuzma
Josh Hart
Mo Wagner |
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ShowtimeDynasty_24/7
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Posts: 8361
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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| No doubt however, that rebounding, shooting, and low post defense will be an achilles of this team. Plus whatever blunders come from lack of chemistry and historically bad decision makers (McGee, Stepheson, Beasley). |
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Mike@LG
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| Posted: Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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An attack squad that can create from every corner of the floor and exploit mistakes with passing.
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70sdude
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Posts: 4567
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| Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:12 am Post subject: |
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As a "type" of team, the roster looks like an interim team, a step towards building a better team.
A bunch of guys look to have been brought on board as placeholders for a year, the obvious names and contracts. This doesn't look like a great team in any of the usual patterns overall: as an open court team, a PnR team, a perimeter shooting team, a lock-down defensive team. It's based on LeBron James' historical ability to affect the W-L bottom line big time. It's based on the supposition that LeBron will help make things more interesting while the staff watches for the returning main guys (BI, KK, LB, JH) to get another year under their belts. |
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Intlakeshow
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| Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:46 am Post subject: |
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| The easiest comparison is the Rockets from two years ago. That team won 55 games with a roster that’s eerily similar to ours. They were a fast paced team led by an offensive superstar who didn’t play much defense and a bunch of role players, not one single all-star other than Harden. Now that group could shoot better than this Lakers team but didn’t have as much playmakers. But like I said, if you analyze their roster one by one, we’re right there with them. Plus there’s the whole symmetry of them getting another superstar the next year, as we’ll hopefully do also. |
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RG73
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| Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:51 am Post subject: |
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| LakerSanity wrote: |
Obviously, whichever way you look at it, scoring and defense are the two biggest differences.. |
So basically you’re saying the two teams are similar except on offense and defense? |
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| 70sdude wrote: | As a "type" of team, the roster looks like an interim team, a step towards building a better team.
A bunch of guys look to have been brought on board as placeholders for a year, the obvious names and contracts. This doesn't look like a great team in any of the usual patterns overall: as an open court team, a PnR team, a perimeter shooting team, a lock-down defensive team. It's based on LeBron James' historical ability to affect the W-L bottom line big time. It's based on the supposition that LeBron will help make things more interesting while the staff watches for the returning main guys (BI, KK, LB, JH) to get another year under their belts. |
It is, the FO has said as much. That is why I won’t get too high or too low.
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rancar
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| Posted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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| They are punting this year by filling the roster with a bunch of 1 year rentals. I'm fine with it. |
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