Do the Lakers Have a Top 3 Bench?
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:06 pm    Post subject:

I would think a bench of Rondo/Hart/Svi/Kuzma/Beasley/Zu should definitely be a top 2 bench. Their bench really has everything except a rim protector. No idea how some people are saying GS has a better bench.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:07 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
^That clarifies things, but "Anything but a below average starter?"

That's a terrible take.


Why? He’s very clearly a standout starter, if not one of the best players on the team—already. He’s no where near below average.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:19 pm    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:
VicXLakers wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
^That clarifies things, but "Anything but a below average starter?"

That's a terrible take.


wasn't my take


watchMe dropped a bomb and left the scene


he either forgot to flush or it was a floater
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 10:32 pm    Post subject:

Can't really say if the Lakers have a top 3 bench since we don't know what their team chemistry will be like during games yet.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2018 11:36 pm    Post subject:

I believe so.

Kuzma/J.Hart/Rondo. 3 guys that can start on some teams.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:40 am    Post subject:

watchME wrote:
Doc JC wrote:
Wouldn’t assume BI is starting over Kuzma to be honest. Kuzma imo is the best fit next to Lebron.

Remember Lebron plays the SF position quite often, which would put BI in the post.
Tell me one offensive skill kcp has that kuzma doesn’t. Tell me who ran PG better last year Ingram or Lonzo. If you want to win games Ingram-Kuzma-Lebron have to start.

and @mike we were #6 in pace before lonzo arrived, lukes goal has been to speed up the game because lonzo can not play half court basketball. Btw in the playoffs things will slow down.


Ingram and Kuzma were both negative players last season. The only thing they did better than Zo was score. You're not winning a lot of games with two negatives on defense and asking a 34 y/o LeBron, @ SF, to have to guard guys like Durant.

The Lakers aren't taken the only two positive players they had out of their starting lineup to play LeBron at SF, so he can get torch every night on defense.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:14 am    Post subject:

Four Decade Bandwagon wrote:
On paper... absolutely!

In reality there is a lot to be worked out. I love the depth, versatility and mix of vet and young players.

My concern is chemistry and egos. Can they "play nice" with one another? Can they accept limited mpg or DNPs at times? Roster has a lot of new players playing new roles. In some ways there is already a built in division of the locker room of the guys that have been there and the 1 year contracts. Where will James fit into the equation?

I am slowly coming to terms with the possibilities of this roster, this season. Going to be interesting to see them work it out on the court.


I'm with you on this one Potentially the best bench in the game But there are questions Can they play unselfishly and as a cohesive unit? We will see. Rondo, Hart,Kuzma, Lance and Beasley can start for a lot of teams this is one of the most interesting rosters I've ever seen
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:04 am    Post subject:

venturalakersfan wrote:
Quantity over quality. Rondo and Beasley would be positives. Better than most though not up to the GS standard. And unless you are playing for third place, that is the standard.


GS? Huh? They're not nearly as deep as they once were. That is apparent to most.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:34 am    Post subject:

Wildchild027 wrote:
watchME wrote:
Doc JC wrote:
Wouldn’t assume BI is starting over Kuzma to be honest. Kuzma imo is the best fit next to Lebron.

Remember Lebron plays the SF position quite often, which would put BI in the post.
Tell me one offensive skill kcp has that kuzma doesn’t. Tell me who ran PG better last year Ingram or Lonzo. If you want to win games Ingram-Kuzma-Lebron have to start.

and @mike we were #6 in pace before lonzo arrived, lukes goal has been to speed up the game because lonzo can not play half court basketball. Btw in the playoffs things will slow down.


Ingram and Kuzma were both negative players last season. The only thing they did better than Zo was score. You're not winning a lot of games with two negatives on defense and asking a 34 y/o LeBron, @ SF, to have to guard guys like Durant.

The Lakers aren't taken the only two positive players they had out of their starting lineup to play LeBron at SF, so he can get torch every night on defense.


Yep. If you want to win games, you play the guys who positively affect the game not the other way around.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:18 am    Post subject:

I honestly think this is the best bench in the NBA. Rondo, Stephenson, Kuz, Beasley, Hart are as solid as you can get...each has or can be a legit NBA starter.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:03 am    Post subject:

King Randle wrote:
I honestly think this is the best bench in the NBA. Rondo, Stephenson, Kuz, Beasley, Hart are as solid as you can get...each has or can be a legit NBA starter.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:13 am    Post subject:

King Randle wrote:
I honestly think this is the best bench in the NBA. Rondo, Stephenson, Kuz, Beasley, Hart are as solid as you can get...each has or can be a legit NBA starter.


Add zubac, Svi and mo Wagner.

That's super deep
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:05 am    Post subject:

AirKobe8 wrote:
I saw a guy make an interesting point the other day about the way they built our roster.

It's not just about doing something different than GS/Houston. It's about doing something different because these two teams already have the best players to play that way, so there's no way we could top them by doing the same thing no matter how much people prefer Tyreke/Nappier over Rondo/Lance.


this is what magic and pelinka's entire strategy.
aint no reason trying to out do something that cant be out done. its foolish.

Gstate not only have the 3 best shooters in the nba on one team. They have the 3 best shooters that are also scorers and defenders on the same team. You will never find that in the nba. there isnt a single player in the nba that can shoot as well as klay at SG/SF that can also lock up on defense like him. that other guy just doesnt exist. anyone else you get will be surely lacking in either shooting or defense. someone from houston probably thought Ariza is our klay..uhhh i love my boy trev but ...NO. Trev can play some lockdown d at times. but his shooting is on the level of a prime danny greene. thats good, thats solid but that aint no Klay splash bros thompson. klay can mess around and drop 50 on you in 3 qtrs all shooting, with no dribbles. while make it rough on your best sg or sf. no one else in the league is that type of player. Steph is a very good defender shooter at the pg spot .but he doesnt just chuck 3's. he's a top 3 ball handler in the nba and a top 10 passer. Cp3 is the only other guy thats up there with him in all of those categories. we dont have curry or cp. dont even try to duplicate that. its foolish like i said.

durant cant be duplicated. no need to discuss it.

But what you can do is try to find your own unicorn(Giannis or Bron) so now we can match up with KD's freak abilities. Then you find guys who can defend but also have High basketball IQ's and very very good passing ability. thats one thing you can find in the nba. and make sure these guys are athletic but also strong so they can go thru gstates defense.

Gstate beats people for a few reasons. but the usually beat the top teams because they can clamp down on defense when times get tough and when the shots aint falling. in addition they pass so well as a team they will always score. The only way you slow that down is to have similar level passing from all positions possible and similar scoring ability(which is going to be rough since they have so many scorers on one team aint many left in the league that dont have to pound the ball 100 times in order to setup for a basket. this means you need quick attack guys which is exactly what we have.)

what you will see if by chance we get lucky enough to see gstate. is this:
They will pack the paint since we can't shoot a ton. but if we're smart we will still break them down with dribble penetration from almost any position since most of the guys on this current roster can dribble and pass very well. its penetrate and score/get fouled, or penetrate and dump it off to another cutter, then another cutter gets the extra pass and dunk/and 1. our offense will be more compact. its like running a tight 3 man weave vs a wide 3 man weave. they are both very effective when ran correctly. in addition defensively we have the length, athleticism and IQ to defend guys and also start forcing gstate to turn the ball over. the team we have can capitalize on those TO's where others teams ,, not so much.

if curry tries to get cute and throws that patent behind the back pass, Lance can easily hop in the passing lane, steal it, push it full court, with 2 other lakers on the wing and 2 other trailers. where even if they stop the initial break, we have at minimum 3 other guys outside of lance that can make the right decision to still get a nice open shot at the rim(which is where we will live with this team give or take a few guys shooting like hard, kuz, maybe ball if the shot is right, and svi.

and we have a team where when our coach says NO MORE 3's from the opponent. they can actually get all the way up in guys and stop those 3's. some teams just dont have the personnel for that.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 8:14 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
VicXLakers wrote:
defense wrote:
ItsJustMagic wrote:
brock wrote:
watchME wrote:
VicXLakers wrote:
Kuz makes it a top flight bench
That should tell you he is not a bench player. I will be very dissapointed in management if they bench him in favor of ball & kcp who are both below average starters.



Ball is anything but a below average starter...




Definitely not statistically. He grades as plus player in lots of advance stats.


Ball is a starter just for his d...Kuz is like the guy who comes out of the pen and throws sliders after a fastball starter

using your assets correctly


And not for pushing the Lakers for #1 pace and getting them more transition opportunities than the Golden State Warriors, or helping get the team from 26th to 7th in assists, let alone becoming a top 5 rebounding team.

Got it.
MIke did it so i wouldnt have to. Thanks Mike.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:08 am    Post subject:

I can't discern how good the bench will be. The bench is not even defined let alone assembled for the first pre-season practice. Top three ?

Hell, it might not turn out to be even top ten in any one measure. Chemistry, health, all unknowns. No one knows. Reminds me of when my parents were guessing the eye color of my first child three months before her birth. No one guessed one blue and one hazel eye and that's what we got. Loved that.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:25 am    Post subject:

depth wise, i see our roster rotation as 12 players.

(minus the rookies, 10), but both provide a need and will get quality burn time. thats alot of depth. Lots of fresh bodies to input.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:15 am    Post subject:

Bench Lonzo and you bring in rondo. Without skipping a beat you have an equally talkented guard that plays a similar style. Bench KCP and you bring in hart...again, equally talented players.

Ingram sits and you bring in Stephenson. Another wing that can playmake and create his own shot. Beat you off the dribble whenever they want.
Lebron sits and you bring in arguably the two best bench scorers in the nba on the same team. Scoring punch never stops.

This team will assault teams non stop for 48 minutes and I just don’t see how teams matchup with our size or versatility at all position

My guess is that javale and KCP sit first at 5 min mark

Lonzo
hart
Ingram
Kuzma
Bron

Then, after 3 minutes of this death lineup rondo and Beasley enter

Rondo
Hart
Lebron
Kuzma
Beasley

That lineup finishes the quarter and we start the second with Stephenson
,Kcp and javale

Rondo
Kcp
Stephenson
Beasley
Javale

This lineup will play the first 5 minutes of the second before you start rotating the starters back in.


With this rotation you have a lot going on, but imo the most important is that you play lebron at 3 different positions. That’s the key to this roster working because you have to gameplan for that. If lebron is at the 5, that throws off the other teams rotations and forces them to play our game imo.

I like using lance Stephenson in this way too because he brings energy to start the second quarter. We have been running the other team into the ground for 12 minutes and then bring our spark plug in to give us a boost and get the team and crowd pumped.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:42 am    Post subject:

I believe so yes!!

This team is very deep 1-10
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:11 pm    Post subject:

PICKnPOP wrote:
Bench Lonzo and you bring in rondo. Without skipping a beat you have an equally talkented guard that plays a similar style. Bench KCP and you bring in hart...again, equally talented players.

Ingram sits and you bring in Stephenson. Another wing that can playmake and create his own shot. Beat you off the dribble whenever they want.
Lebron sits and you bring in arguably the two best bench scorers in the nba on the same team. Scoring punch never stops.

This team will assault teams non stop for 48 minutes and I just don’t see how teams matchup with our size or versatility at all position

My guess is that javale and KCP sit first at 5 min mark

Lonzo
hart
Ingram
Kuzma
Bron

Then, after 3 minutes of this death lineup rondo and Beasley enter

Rondo
Hart
Lebron
Kuzma
Beasley

That lineup finishes the quarter and we start the second with Stephenson
,Kcp and javale

Rondo
Kcp
Stephenson
Beasley
Javale

This lineup will play the first 5 minutes of the second before you start rotating the starters back in.


With this rotation you have a lot going on, but imo the most important is that you play lebron at 3 different positions. That’s the key to this roster working because you have to gameplan for that. If lebron is at the 5, that throws off the other teams rotations and forces them to play our game imo.

I like using lance Stephenson in this way too because he brings energy to start the second quarter. We have been running the other team into the ground for 12 minutes and then bring our spark plug in to give us a boost and get the team and crowd pumped.



I doubt NBA teams would be all that fazed by a lot of rapid substitutions that tried to "run them into the ground." From everything I've seen and read, that approach doesn't have a significant impact on team performance or success.

In reality, I think Luke will tinker with different combinations at the start of the season, but he'll have more traditional substitutions patterns rather pull guys in and out in such spurts.

The best scenario would be if the young guys played so well, Luke was compelled to give them 34-35 minutes and send the rent-a-vets to the bench. If you really had an 11-man rotation where people were rotating in and out so freely, it probably would mean no one was really standing out.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:18 pm    Post subject:

It’s hard to say. I think we have one of the better set of bench players, but I think we are going to see a lot of intermixing with the starters.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:28 pm    Post subject:

We have the potential to have 7 guys average 10+ points:
LeBron
Kuzma
Ingram
KCP
Hart
Ball
Beasley
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:39 pm    Post subject:

Should we bench LeBron so that we have the best bench? Deliberate.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:50 pm    Post subject:

PRLakeShow wrote:
Should we bench LeBron so that we have the best bench? Deliberate.



That's a good first step.

We could then trade Ball, Ingram and Kuz for Leonard and put him and Lebron on the bench.

Bring them both in 1 minute after the game starts, and let them both play 40 minutes.

They'd be duking it out for 6th Man of the Year.

Best bench ever.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:50 pm    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
PICKnPOP wrote:
Bench Lonzo and you bring in rondo. Without skipping a beat you have an equally talkented guard that plays a similar style. Bench KCP and you bring in hart...again, equally talented players.

Ingram sits and you bring in Stephenson. Another wing that can playmake and create his own shot. Beat you off the dribble whenever they want.
Lebron sits and you bring in arguably the two best bench scorers in the nba on the same team. Scoring punch never stops.

This team will assault teams non stop for 48 minutes and I just don’t see how teams matchup with our size or versatility at all position

My guess is that javale and KCP sit first at 5 min mark

Lonzo
hart
Ingram
Kuzma
Bron

Then, after 3 minutes of this death lineup rondo and Beasley enter

Rondo
Hart
Lebron
Kuzma
Beasley

That lineup finishes the quarter and we start the second with Stephenson
,Kcp and javale

Rondo
Kcp
Stephenson
Beasley
Javale

This lineup will play the first 5 minutes of the second before you start rotating the starters back in.


With this rotation you have a lot going on, but imo the most important is that you play lebron at 3 different positions. That’s the key to this roster working because you have to gameplan for that. If lebron is at the 5, that throws off the other teams rotations and forces them to play our game imo.

I like using lance Stephenson in this way too because he brings energy to start the second quarter. We have been running the other team into the ground for 12 minutes and then bring our spark plug in to give us a boost and get the team and crowd pumped.



I doubt NBA teams would be all that fazed by a lot of rapid substitutions that tried to "run them into the ground." From everything I've seen and read, that approach doesn't have a significant impact on team performance or success.

In reality, I think Luke will tinker with different combinations at the start of the season, but he'll have more traditional substitutions patterns rather pull guys in and out in such spurts.

The best scenario would be if the young guys played so well, Luke was compelled to give them 34-35 minutes and send the rent-a-vets to the bench. If you really had an 11-man rotation where people were rotating in and out so freely, it probably would mean no one was really standing out.


I don’t see these as rapid substitutions at all, seems like a regular rotation to me, the only difference is the backup center (being rotated every few minutes to reduce wear and tear on one person). Javale and KCP playing the first 5 minutes of each quarter puts them at ~25 mpg where a lot of people expect them to be anyway and also ensures we close out the half and game playing small.

The next substitution would be at the 8 minute mark removing Lonzo and Ingram from the starting lineup. This would put them at around 15 minutes per half each and gives them a 2-3 minute run of the team when they come back in before lebron comes back with 4-5 minutes left in the half (Call this time to develop).

Id also sit lebron on back to backs and only play zubac, or Wagner against teams with legit bigmen rotations.

We have a lot of depth and it’s going to take creativity to keep everyone happy with playing time. I think this rotation does that and gives everyone a nice run when they do get into a game.

Btw lance Stephenson will get his minutes in 2 long runs to start the 2nd and 4th quarters. He’ll play the first 7-8 minutes of each (depending on game situation). He will then be replaced when lebron comes back in the game.

I think this is a solid rotation.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:10 pm    Post subject:

PRLakeShow wrote:
Should we bench LeBron so that we have the best bench? Deliberate.



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