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Joe Pesci
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 Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:43 pm Post subject: |
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Some people act like Walker isn’t the hands down best player by a country mile in this trade scenario.
It’s really not even close, yet people act as if it’s insulting to include two #2 picks for a guy six feet tall.
Reminds me exactly of Magic trading Russell (another number two pick) for capspace. Everyone lost their collective minds screaming what if no one signs for the space.
Magic knew James was coming and I think he knows someone else is coming as well. If I’m right, if Durant does come, Walker makes this team infinitely better than do Ball and Ingram.
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:45 pm Post subject: |
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| saetarubia wrote: | | Joe Pesci wrote: | | saetarubia wrote: | | Joe Pesci wrote: | | saetarubia wrote: | And some here are only thinking about perfect scenario in Kemba trade this season. What if we get no max FA next summer? You are left with almost 35 year old Lebron next season and Kemba going no where with no young lottery talent left. Make first round or 2nd for couple of years then tank for many years for lottery talent again like 2013-17? No thanks. We just dodged terrible Nash trade which could have had catastrophic effects like Nets suffered. Giving up on two #2 picks for Kemba is no different if we can't land a young max player.
I'd rather have BI, Lonzo, Kuzma as 3rd, 4th and 5th option than mighty Kemba as 3rd option risking so much. |
Well, since you’re “what if’ing”: I’d say the odds are infinitely greater that the Lakers sign Durant outright than they are that the Lakers trade Ball and Ingram, two players who’ll make 16 mill, for Lillard or Davis, two players who’ll make around 30 mill.
You, sir, have no real answers. |
Maybe. But trading both Ingram and Ball for Kemba is the least likely of the three scenarios imo.  IF if we show show interest, I see us offering one maximum. |
No maybes about it and no opinions either.
Trading Ball and Ingram’s 16 mill for Davis or Lillard’s 30 mill is effin impossible dude. You can really take all of your feelings out of it. |
For AD, I'd be willing to give up 3 of BI, Ball, Kuz, Hart plus couple of first rounders. Kemba is not even Top 20 player in the league where as AD is a top 5 and two way player too. FO can get creative adding a 3rd team using the picks. |
Two words: Salary Match
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ChickenStu
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Joined: 25 Apr 2015
Posts: 31910
Location: Anaheim, CA
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe Pesci wrote: | Some people act like Walker isn’t the hands down best player by a country mile in this trade scenario.
It’s really not even close, yet people act as if it’s insulting to include two #2 picks for a guy six feet tall.
Reminds me exactly of Magic trading Russell (another number two pick) for capspace. Everyone lost their collective minds screaming what if no one signs for the space.
Magic knew James was coming and I think he knows someone else is coming as well. If I’m right, if Durant does come, Walker makes this team infinitely better than do Ball and Ingram. |
You are failing to acknowledge that Walker's status, as a guy who is an expiring contract, weakens Charlotte's position. Look at recent trades where stars were moved in the final year of their deals. PG got traded to OKC, and Oladipo was seen as a ho-hum player making big money and Sabonis was a late lottery pick who hadn't shown much yet. Kawhi got traded to Toronto and the Spurs got back a big-money All-Star who isn't going to move the needle for their franchise in the least. Butler just got traded for 2 role players, though I like Saric. (Covington I like less, given how much money he's making. His contract is fair, just not a great value.) Kemba isn't even in those dudes' class, though I like Kemba and have for quite some time.
Trading both Lonzo and BI for Kemba Walker is not going to happen. I think it's within the realm of possibility if one of them goes. |
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | | Joe Pesci wrote: | Some people act like Walker isn’t the hands down best player by a country mile in this trade scenario.
It’s really not even close, yet people act as if it’s insulting to include two #2 picks for a guy six feet tall.
Reminds me exactly of Magic trading Russell (another number two pick) for capspace. Everyone lost their collective minds screaming what if no one signs for the space.
Magic knew James was coming and I think he knows someone else is coming as well. If I’m right, if Durant does come, Walker makes this team infinitely better than do Ball and Ingram. |
You are failing to acknowledge that Walker's status, as a guy who is an expiring contract, weakens Charlotte's position. Look at recent trades where stars were moved in the final year of their deals. PG got traded to OKC, and Oladipo was seen as a ho-hum player making big money and Sabonis was a late lottery pick who hadn't shown much yet. Kawhi got traded to Toronto and the Spurs got back a big-money All-Star who isn't going to move the needle for their franchise in the least. Butler just got traded for 2 role players, though I like Saric. (Covington I like less, given how much money he's making. His contract is fair, just not a great value.) Kemba isn't even in those dudes' class, though I like Kemba and have for quite some time.
Trading both Lonzo and BI for Kemba Walker is not going to happen. I think it's within the realm of possibility if one of them goes. |
I can’t argue with much of what you’re saying here. I’ve already considered it all though.
What you’re failing to see is that: (A) Ball and Ingram are also viewed across the league as potential role players. (B) Kupchak (and the entire league) know what the Lakers would be attempting to do. Everyone knows that the Lakers would resign Walker with their eyes closed and still have room to sign whomever and create a dynasty. (C) The Butler situation is different because of the distraction he caused. Walker has been the exact opposite of Butler — a galvanizer.
The deal only gets done with Ball and Ingram. You might be able to get a pick or two coming back to save face because of the on paper talent (and hype) imbalance.
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ChickenStu
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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^
I fundamentally disagree with you on an expiring non-superstar player commanding enough value to get both Ball and Ingram. If it were an expiring Anthony Davis or something like that, it's a completely different story imo. |
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| ChickenStu wrote: | ^
I fundamentally disagree with you on an expiring non-superstar player commanding enough value to get both Ball and Ingram. If it were an expiring Anthony Davis or something like that, it's a completely different story imo. |
Every player you referenced as an example of an expiring who got pennies on the dollar, with the exception of Butler, casted a ton of doubt with their new team about resigning.
George and Leonard were risks because of all the LAker talk.
Butler caused a major distraction.
With Walker coming to the Lakers, with James here and space to sign Durant, Walker’s impending free agency becomes far less important, from a trade negotiation standpoint, than that of George and Leonard and Butler.
Yes, all four were impending free agents, but, other than that, the similarities end. You’re not considering the nuances. Add to that, Walker is playing out if his mind, Kupchak will not take anything less than Ball and Ingram, and Ball and Ingram are proving to be somewhat limited players, and you have a situation where this team’s two #2 picks will be the minimum asking price.
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Jesusdelonla
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:46 pm Post subject: |
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Let me get this straight Joe, we didn't trade Ingram + picks for KL or even Paul George but we r going to trade bi + so + picks in hopes of signing KD & resigning kemba?
Just FYI: kemba loves Charlotte and was almost in tears last trade deadline.
Also remember the fact that all star weekend is in Charlotte this year |
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noahp45
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Location: Oceanside Ca
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
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Bard207
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
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noahp45
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
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Joe Pesci
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Jesusdelonla wrote: | Let me get this straight Joe, we didn't trade Ingram + picks for KL or even Paul George but we r going to trade bi + so + picks in hopes of signing KD & resigning kemba?
Just FYI: kemba loves Charlotte and was almost in tears last trade deadline.
Also remember the fact that all star weekend is in Charlotte this year |
Good points about his love for Charlotte and the All-Star. I hadn’t considered either one of those fine points.
The first point, however, is irrelevant to me because what truly makes Walker appealing to the Lakers, other than him averaging nearly thirty a game and his perfect fit next to James, is his caphold.
His caphold along with added exposure to Ball and Ingram’s fit next to stars make the situations different.
Y’all gotta look past how it looks on paper (two hyped up, long-limbed, number two picks for a small, underhyped guard) and if you can’t do that, just make sure you scribble the fact that Walker is CLEARLY the best player in the deal and averages 30 per on that same piece of paper.
Don’t get caught up in “puppy love”.
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Last edited by Joe Pesci on Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:02 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bard207
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He is 26 and making $14.8 million which suggests that he won't be a RFA next summer.
Last edited by Bard207 on Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:03 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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AirTupac
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Something something 30 years old and 6'0... |
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RusselDoeee01
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Joined: 28 Apr 2014
Posts: 1072
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:02 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
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noahp45
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Posts: 6572
Location: Oceanside Ca
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:05 pm Post subject: |
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| RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
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RusselDoeee01
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Joined: 28 Apr 2014
Posts: 1072
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
Nah. We are 10 games into the season lol. People need to relax on Brandon Ingram. He’s 21 years old and once again 10 games into the season.
Everyone in the organization and around the league are high on Ingram. The only people down on him are on this site |
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RusselDoeee01
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Joined: 28 Apr 2014
Posts: 1072
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Joe Pesci wrote: | Some people act like Walker isn’t the hands down best player by a country mile in this trade scenario.
It’s really not even close, yet people act as if it’s insulting to include two #2 picks for a guy six feet tall.
Reminds me exactly of Magic trading Russell (another number two pick) for capspace. Everyone lost their collective minds screaming what if no one signs for the space.
Magic knew James was coming and I think he knows someone else is coming as well. If I’m right, if Durant does come, Walker makes this team infinitely better than do Ball and Ingram. |
We have no problem scoring. That’s what Kemba brings.
Ball has been a great defender this season and so has Ingram. We would be infinitely worse on defense with this trade. |
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Bard207
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Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:10 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
What kind of protection would you have the first round pick? |
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Sentient Meat
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Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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We are only three games out of first place when we played without a center for most of those games... when two of our key players were suspended and with three of our four youngsters playing below their normal averages.
Let's see what happens before we make a panic move.
I bet we are 20-10 shortly... perhaps even better.
It's a matter of time before their shots start falling. |
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noahp45
Star Player
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 6572
Location: Oceanside Ca
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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| Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
What kind of protection would you have the first round pick? |
I would only offer a 2ND rounder |
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noahp45
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Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 6572
Location: Oceanside Ca
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:16 pm Post subject: |
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| RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
Nah. We are 10 games into the season lol. People need to relax on Brandon Ingram. He’s 21 years old and once again 10 games into the season.
Everyone in the organization and around the league are high on Ingram. The only people down on him are on this site |
Defense and shooting is a huge weakness, BI needs probably two more years before we know what we have.
I'm thinking we shouldn't waste A prime bron Year |
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RusselDoeee01
Star Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2014
Posts: 1072
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:17 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
What kind of protection would you have the first round pick? |
I would only offer a 2ND rounder |
LOL I’m sure the clippers will do that... |
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Inspector Gadget
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Joined: 18 Apr 2016
Posts: 46639
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Sentient Meat wrote: | We are only three games out of first place when we played without a center for most of those games... when two of our key players were suspended and with three of our four youngsters playing below their normal averages.
Let's see what happens before we make a panic move.
I bet we are 20-10 shortly... perhaps even better.
It's a matter of time before their shots start falling. |
Pretty sure what you just posted is exactly what radio shows and NBA people are saying, heck even Cowherd and Broussard were talking about how the Lakers are in a great position.... so yep definitely a great time to be a Laker fan... if we can find that true 2nd star either from our young players or via trade we are gonna own the NBA. |
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Bard207
Star Player
Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 7713
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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| noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | RusselDoeee01 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | | Bard207 wrote: | | noahp45 wrote: | Lakers should try and get Tobias Harris.
Would like to see a starting 5 of
Ball
Hart
McGee
Harris
Bron |
He will be a free agent this summer, so the opportunity will be there to get him. |
Will the Clips let him just walk? We could give a draft pick or something |
He’s a FREE agent. Why would we have to give a pick? |
Get him now, don't need to wait we need a wing now. BI not making the strides we need him to. |
What kind of protection would you have the first round pick? |
I would only offer a 2ND rounder |
I don't know what the exact job title is for Jerry West, but he is quite high in the Clippers hierarchy. He wanted to come back to the Lakers and he wasn't wanted.
Now you are expecting him to do the Lakers a big favor and tell the Clippers FO to trade Harris for a second round pick and some expiring salary? |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2018 11:24 pm Post subject: |
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| Inspector Gadget wrote: | | Sentient Meat wrote: | We are only three games out of first place when we played without a center for most of those games... when two of our key players were suspended and with three of our four youngsters playing below their normal averages.
Let's see what happens before we make a panic move.
I bet we are 20-10 shortly... perhaps even better.
It's a matter of time before their shots start falling. |
Pretty sure what you just posted is exactly what radio shows and NBA people are saying, heck even Cowherd and Broussard were talking about how the Lakers are in a great position.... so yep definitely a great time to be a Laker fan... if we can find that true 2nd star either from our young players or via trade we are gonna own the NBA. |
If we had a center... if no one was suspended... if our players were shooting well... you begin to worry.
We've won 4 out of the last 5 with Ingram and Kuzma shooting like garbage... with Ball scoring less than 5 points in three of those games.
LBJ and BI stinking up the floor with turnovers.
Nowhere to go but up. |
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