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Aeneas Hunter
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:03 am    Post subject:

PinoyLBJFan wrote:
if OKC will exits early in this play-offs i think PG will blame himself for not signing with the lakers. if he chooses the lakers this season, even with the injuries that we have, we could still be in the playoffs and perhaps could be in the running for the finals.


Why would you think that? OKC illustrates what you get with two stars and a weak supporting cast. Now imagine if Westbrook was 34 years old and if they didn't have Adams and Schroder. With the injuries to Ball and Ingram, and with Lebron not 100% after his injury, that's what we would have looked like. We wouldn't have Rondo and McGee -- PG would have taken that cap space.

Likewise, signing Kawhi Leonard will not be a cure-all for our problems. We need Ball and Ingram to fully emerge and to stay healthy. Otherwise, we will just be a marginal playoff team.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:12 am    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
PinoyLBJFan wrote:
if OKC will exits early in this play-offs i think PG will blame himself for not signing with the lakers. if he chooses the lakers this season, even with the injuries that we have, we could still be in the playoffs and perhaps could be in the running for the finals.


Why would you think that? OKC illustrates what you get with two stars and a weak supporting cast. Now imagine if Westbrook was 34 years old and if they didn't have Adams and Schroder. With the injuries to Ball and Ingram, and with Lebron not 100% after his injury, that's what we would have looked like. We wouldn't have Rondo and McGee -- PG would have taken that cap space.

Likewise, signing Kawhi Leonard will not be a cure-all for our problems. We need Ball and Ingram to fully emerge and to stay healthy. Otherwise, we will just be a marginal playoff team.


McGee is on a vet min deal and not having Rondo would actually make us beter. Of course signing with us was not a perfect scenario for PG, but there was more room for improvement. Signing with OKC and their cap trapped team in a small market was a sure limbo for the next few years.

But PG wasn't giving a damn to all that. If he really cared about fit + winning possibilities, he would've signed with the Sixers, but he didn't even sit down with them.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:29 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
Watching Paul George following Rus's lead during their post-game interviews is pretty sad. He's getting dragged down by Westbook.


I was wondering about that. Can't say I followed pacers basketball, but has PG been a jerk to the media before?
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:32 am    Post subject:

LAL1947 wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
Salaries owed for the next four years in millions.

John Wall 37.8/40.8/43.8/46.9
Russ 38.1/41.0/43.8/46.7

Wall's TS% the last two years 51.5%... 52.7%
Russ's TS% the last two years 52.4%... 50.1%

DLO's TS% 50.9%... 53.3%
Ingram's TS% 53.6%... 55.5%

Steph's TS% 67.5%... 64.1%
Kawhi's TS% 61.0%... 60.6%
Harden's TS% 61.9%... 61.6%
Klay's TS% 59.8%... 57.1%
Dame's TS% 59.4%... 58.8%
Kyrie's TS% 61.0%... 59.2%

How the f*ck did they get these teams to pay those salaries?

This is why people shouldn't worry so much about names.

This is why Ingram and DLO aren't worth max salaries yet.

Gotta get to the high fifties to warrant that money.

Agreed... but this is also why Vuc, Tobias and Middleton type players are not worth the max IMO. Even Kemba is not worth the max to any team other than Charlotte and I think they'd be making a mistake giving him the supermax because it will handicap them. Just because the cap-space is available doesn't mean it has to be distributed to players who are not absolute superstars. I think teams should wait until they've got a roster in place that will challenge for the title for some years and only then can start going into max contract territory through renewals. Easier said than done, yes.... but they've got to start doing it.


A lot depends on LBJ's feelings about an extension.

If he's going to retire in three years... it's not bad to overpay a little to maximize our chances at a title during his time here.

If he's going to insist on staying, it might be disastrous to have a second tier star plus LBJ's farewell tour money on the books.

There will be a lot tough calls this summer... but if we aren't careful, I agree we could find ourselves in the same trouble that Washington, OKC, Memphis... even Houston might have with CP3 if he ages quickly.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:36 am    Post subject:

It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:39 am    Post subject:

Laker_Town wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
Watching Paul George following Rus's lead during their post-game interviews is pretty sad. He's getting dragged down by Westbook.


I was wondering about that. Can't say I followed pacers basketball, but has PG been a jerk to the media before?



I don't believe so. He's always been a likable player, especially after he recovered from his leg injury.
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Sentient Meat
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:42 am    Post subject:

We've talked so much smack about PG and Russ than now I'm starting to wonder if they mount an unlikely comeback from 3-1 down.

They certainly should have the motivation and bulletin board material.

Then again Dame would totally have to choke and Russ would have to break out of a two year slump for that to happen.

Still wouldn't put it past them... would make great theater if it did.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:43 am    Post subject:

PinoyLBJFan wrote:
if OKC will exits early in this play-offs i think PG will blame himself for not signing with the lakers. if he chooses the lakers this season, even with the injuries that we have, we could still be in the playoffs and perhaps could be in the running for the finals.


Imho PG made the worst decision in his life to sign with OKC and not take the Lakers' offer. He was pressured by Westbrook to stay in OKC, and now he's stuck in a small market city with a star player that may not be the same ever as far as production. Westbrooks knees are pretty much done, and so there PG enjoy your early exit every year in nowhere land.
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:45 am    Post subject:

richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.
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Sentient Meat
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:48 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Now that Magic quit... is there anyone crazy enough to trade for Westbrook?

Serious question.
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:52 am    Post subject:

Sentient Meat wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Now that Magic quit... is there anyone crazy enough to trade for Westbrook?

Serious question.



I think the following teams would trade for Westbrook in a heartbeat:

- Chicago
- Clippers
- Minnesota
- Memphis
- Orlando
- NOLA
- Detroit
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Sentient Meat
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 6:59 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
Sentient Meat wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Now that Magic quit... is there anyone crazy enough to trade for Westbrook?

Serious question.



I think the following teams would trade for Westbrook in a heartbeat:

- Chicago
- Clippers
- Minnesota
- Memphis
- Orlando
- NOLA
- Detroit


What would some of those trades look like?

Chicago and the Clippers have up and coming teams... Phoenix does too... I could see signing him outright as a free agent... but losing young assets and tying up space for someone who may never be efficient again?

I wonder about trading him for Conley or Wall... just so each can be in a fresh environment... but unless something is physically wrong that can be fixed... I don't see how he does anything other than a slow decline as his athleticism no longer compensates for his lack of shooting ability.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:04 am    Post subject:

AirKobe8 wrote:
PinoyLBJFan wrote:
if OKC will exits early in this play-offs i think PG will blame himself for not signing with the lakers. if he chooses the lakers this season, even with the injuries that we have, we could still be in the playoffs and perhaps could be in the running for the finals.


Don't think that will happen (yet). He's been severely injured since the AS Break. There are some rumors he's actually playing through a torn rotator cuff, which is a very bad injury. Before all that, they were looking like a HCA team with a great shot at WCF.


Who cares? We were looking like a HCA advantage team as well on Xmas before injuries. Guess what, who cares? We got injuries; no one feels sorry for us. And no one should feel sorry for Paulina
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:09 am    Post subject:

I think an interesting trade for NOLA would be to trade AD to OKC for Westbrook and a 1st R pick. He's the best player they could get for AD in a trade and would be locking in an All-Star player for the next 4 seasons.

OKC would get out from under Westbrook contract and would have a strong case for AD to stick around by surrounding him with PG and Adams.

Chicago could offer Lavine package and a #1.

Clippers could ship Galinari, Lou and a #1.

Minny could move Wiggins and a #1.

Orlando - Gordon + Fultz + #1.


These are all teams who would love to get an All-Star on their team, to either pair with who they have or to be the face of the franchise.
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Sentient Meat
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
I think an interesting trade for NOLA would be to trade AD to OKC for Westbrook and a 1st R pick. He's the best player they could get for AD in a trade and would be locking in an All-Star player for the next 4 seasons.

OKC would get out from under Westbrook contract and would have a strong case for AD to stick around by surrounding him with PG and Adams.

Chicago could offer Lavine package and a #1.

Clippers could ship Galinari, Lou and a #1.

Minny could move Wiggins and a #1.

Orlando - Gordon + Fultz + #1.


These are all teams who would love to get an All-Star on their team, to either pair with who they have or to be the face of the franchise.


Thanks for a thorough answer, but the only one that makes sense to me for the non OKC teams is maybe Wiggins for Russ... but then why would OKC do that other than if they thought Wiggins was somehow more moveable and slightly cheaper.

Lavine had a huge uptick in efficiency... Lou is great value, so you want to keep him other than the fact he's getting old.

Gordon is good value also.

I don't think NO would forgive their front office for trading AD for Russ.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject:

Quote:
If Kawhi hasn’t been the best player in these Playoffs, he’s been darn close to it.
28 points, 6.5 rebounds, 3.3 assists on 53/43/86 shooting.
63.1 TS%
33.2 USG%
+56
Raps 21.3 Net Rating with him on, -2.3 Net Rating with him off


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:18 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Who is trading for that contract?
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:26 am    Post subject:

We all knew what kind of bed PG was making when he resigned with OKC, now sleep in it breh.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:27 am    Post subject:

Dr. Laker wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Who is trading for that contract?


Exactly....no one is trading for that, plus, Westbrook is OKC. Yesterday he had a crappy game but he's not the only reason they lost. They just don't play the type of "team" ball that Portland plays.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:45 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Westbrook will be 31 in November. He has had a huge fall off the last couple of years, with his BPM going from a monstrous 15.6 two years ago down to 8.2 last season and 6.5 this season--still very high but going quickly in the wrong direction. His true shooting percentage of 50.1 was well below Josh Hart's and Lance Stephenson's. He has shot below 30% from the 3-point line 4 of the last 5 seasons. Meanwhile he is promised $78 million over the next two years. I don't think there is much of a market for him.
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:52 am    Post subject:

markjay wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Westbrook will be 31 in November. He has had a huge fall off the last couple of years, with his BPM going from a monstrous 15.6 two years ago down to 8.2 last season and 6.5 this season--still very high but going quickly in the wrong direction. His true shooting percentage of 50.1 was well below Josh Hart's and Lance Stephenson's. He has shot below 30% from the 3-point line 4 of the last 5 seasons. Meanwhile he is promised $78 million over the next two years. I don't think there is much of a market for him.



Let's just say OKC agrees with you and wants desperately to rid themselves of his contract (they don't). Do you think they'd turn down an offer from the Clippers of Galinari, Lou Williams and a future 1st Round pick?

Do you think OKC would turn down an offer from Orlando of Gordon, Fultz and a 1st Round pick?

Because the Clippers and the Magic would do those trades.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 7:54 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
markjay wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Westbrook will be 31 in November. He has had a huge fall off the last couple of years, with his BPM going from a monstrous 15.6 two years ago down to 8.2 last season and 6.5 this season--still very high but going quickly in the wrong direction. His true shooting percentage of 50.1 was well below Josh Hart's and Lance Stephenson's. He has shot below 30% from the 3-point line 4 of the last 5 seasons. Meanwhile he is promised $78 million over the next two years. I don't think there is much of a market for him.



Let's just say OKC agrees with you and wants desperately to rid themselves of his contract (they don't). Do you think they'd turn down an offer from the Clippers of Galinari, Lou Williams and a future 1st Round pick?

Do you think OKC would turn down an offer from Orlando of Gordon, Fultz and a 1st Round pick?

Because the Clippers and the Magic would do those trades.


Why in the world are the clippers trading 7m 6moy Lou Williams for a guy getting paid supermax?

Makes no sense
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vanexelent
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:02 am    Post subject:

Jesusdelonla wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
markjay wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Westbrook will be 31 in November. He has had a huge fall off the last couple of years, with his BPM going from a monstrous 15.6 two years ago down to 8.2 last season and 6.5 this season--still very high but going quickly in the wrong direction. His true shooting percentage of 50.1 was well below Josh Hart's and Lance Stephenson's. He has shot below 30% from the 3-point line 4 of the last 5 seasons. Meanwhile he is promised $78 million over the next two years. I don't think there is much of a market for him.



Let's just say OKC agrees with you and wants desperately to rid themselves of his contract (they don't). Do you think they'd turn down an offer from the Clippers of Galinari, Lou Williams and a future 1st Round pick?

Do you think OKC would turn down an offer from Orlando of Gordon, Fultz and a 1st Round pick?

Because the Clippers and the Magic would do those trades.


Why in the world are the clippers trading 7m 6moy Lou Williams for a guy getting paid supermax?

Makes no sense


Because he's better than Lou Williams, a perennial All-Star, All-NBA and MVP level talent?
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:05 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
markjay wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
richsmith wrote:
It was inevitable that OKC were going to get dumped out early again. It was one reason why I was so surprised that PG re-signed with them so quickly. Did he not see that their roster is so clearly first-round fodder? He's been great this year and has done what he can, but I ultimately don't have much sympathy for him. OKC don't really have anywhere to go, they've hitched their wagon to Westbrook and it won't end well.



OKC could still trade Westbrook and go all in on PG as their #1 guy.


Westbrook will be 31 in November. He has had a huge fall off the last couple of years, with his BPM going from a monstrous 15.6 two years ago down to 8.2 last season and 6.5 this season--still very high but going quickly in the wrong direction. His true shooting percentage of 50.1 was well below Josh Hart's and Lance Stephenson's. He has shot below 30% from the 3-point line 4 of the last 5 seasons. Meanwhile he is promised $78 million over the next two years. I don't think there is much of a market for him.



Let's just say OKC agrees with you and wants desperately to rid themselves of his contract (they don't). Do you think they'd turn down an offer from the Clippers of Galinari, Lou Williams and a future 1st Round pick?

Do you think OKC would turn down an offer from Orlando of Gordon, Fultz and a 1st Round pick?

Because the Clippers and the Magic would do those trades.


Why in the world are the clippers trading 7m 6moy Lou Williams for a guy getting paid supermax?

Makes no sense


Because he's better than Lou Williams, a perennial All-Star, All-NBA and MVP level talent?


But he's not better than Lou Williams paired with all that capspace.

Lou plus Kawhi... Lou plus Kyrie... Lou plus anyone other than Kevin Durant is cheaper than Westbrook.

It's about the value for the price.

Westbrook obviously still has some value... but it's the price that's absolutely crippling.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 22, 2019 8:13 am    Post subject:

OKC isn’t trading WB. They consider him their homegrown star and I think he will retire there.

I do see Adams and yes, even PG being shopped. That’s over 55m in combined salary right there.
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