What SG should start next to Lebron (poll)
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Who should start at SG?
KCP
62%
 62%  [ 81 ]
Josh Hart
37%
 37%  [ 48 ]
Total Votes : 129

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kobe_somebody_odom
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:38 pm    Post subject:

I see this as the biggest question mark going into the season.

I give KCP the edge in traditional SG skills, pick and pop off the screen and roll and cutting to the basket. I would give Hart the nod everywhere else but we are talking about the SG position.

I think I would start KCP and let Hart win the job during the season based on play if he can.

1st

Lonzo
KCP
Ingram
James
McGee

2nd

Rondo
Hart
Kuzma
Kuzma
Zubac

Kuzma splits time between 3 and 4 with Stephenson, Beasley, Mo and Svi on the bench for spot minutes.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject:

I expect Hart to be our long term solution at SG, but KCP needs to start. He is a known quantity, the jury is still out on Hart and he needs to take the job. I expect him to.
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lakerMark
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 9:25 pm    Post subject:

Here is my starting lineup wish

Lonzo or Rondo - PG
BI - SG
Lebron - SF
Kuzma - PF
McGee - C
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matrixskillz
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:38 pm    Post subject:

kobe_somebody_odom wrote:
I see this as the biggest question mark going into the season.

I give KCP the edge in traditional SG skills, pick and pop off the screen and roll and cutting to the basket. I would give Hart the nod everywhere else but we are talking about the SG position.

I think I would start KCP and let Hart win the job during the season based on play if he can.

1st

Lonzo
KCP
Ingram
James
McGee

2nd

Rondo
Hart
Kuzma
Kuzma
Zubac

Kuzma splits time between 3 and 4 with Stephenson, Beasley, Mo and Svi on the bench for spot minutes.


Rondo
Hart
Stephenson
Kuzma
Beasley

Zubac should not get minutes and rookies likely won't play much. This also gives us a fast switching line up off the bench to replicate the starters.
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Treble Clef
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:18 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
lakersboy wrote:
The accepted inconsistency here is mind boggling. KAT, Ben Simmons, Embiid, and others are accepted as can't miss types because of what they did in college, or others based on what they did in workouts. Hart did it on an NBA floor, then clearly improved over the summer but because it wasn't against NBA players, it didn't happen. Are you kidding me? When from a standstill, he looked a defender in the eye, drove to his left, and dunked on him left handed, it was clearly something KCP could never do. He was named MVP because he showed he can penetrate at will in both directions, unlike last year, unlike KCP. His shot is clearly better than KCP.

A lot of people here are sleeping on Josh Hart. He's more than just a nice player who you consider throwing in for a malcontent rental like Butler. John Ireland said the Lakers are extremely high on Hart. For the poster who said KCP has more shake on his dribble, that's what Hart has been working on this summer, and we already saw it helped him win summer MVP..

KCP didn't seem to improve any aspect of his game last year. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't have reason to anticipate that he will be better than last year. Hart appears to be more focused and determined to improve his skill set

In the end, Lakers politics aren't going to win. LeBron's politics will win. He was at courtside loving what he saw Hart doing in the summer.


Seriously? The guy couldn't miss from 3-pt range after the ASB (42%; TS .601).


I don't know how KCP's shooting last year was so overlooked. He started off slow but toward the end, I was shocked anytime he missed.
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oldlakerfan
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 9:26 am    Post subject:

I really think it is close between KCP and Hart.

Experience: KCP
Defense: Hart though KCP is no slouch
3 Point Shooting: About even maybe a slight edge to KCP who is more proven
Rebounding: Hart but KCP is really good
Driving to the Hoop: Hart
Running the break: KCP by a smidge
Playmaking: Even both are only average

Gosh when I break it down Hart seems to look really good to me. I think both have similar strengths. I have seen a lot of Hart at PG and I don't think either is much of a playmaker at this point. We have seen the improvement in Hart but KCP has been working and with his legal troubles behind him and a year in the system he may have a big jump in production.
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Hellspawn
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:54 am    Post subject:

Like Magic said, every position is up for grabs except Bron's.

If there is no clear winner between the two, KCP will probably start to justify his pay and for seniority reasons until Hart's play forces them to start him.

Regardless, they will likely get roughly equal minutes, probably with Hart actually getting more minutes, especially if a game is somewhat decided to help his development. The Lakers are not going to sacrifice the development of their future SG for KCP's or his agent's ego.

Not really much more to discuss.
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StillSWOL
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2018 10:57 am    Post subject:

Kyle Kuzma
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lakersboy
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 6:45 pm    Post subject:

Adding fuel to this duel, after playing 1 on 1 with Hart, KCP acknowledged what a lot of people don't want to admit but has been clearly seen: "Josh has gotten better from last year, I can tell. He's been working a lot, so we're out here having fun with him."

This isn't the same guy who finished the season very strong last year, and apparently the impressive summer, performance was no fluke. Malinka saw it and loved it. KCP has seen it, and soon, doubters and others who prefer to hesitate before counting him as a significant reason for team success, will have to include him in the conversation as being a star on the rise.
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J.C. Smith
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 9:01 pm    Post subject:

Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.
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lakersboy
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 9:15 pm    Post subject:

J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.

Practice was a continuation of summer league, which was a continuation of the end of the season. THAT guy is is a special player who improved. We saw what we thought we saw. It wasn't a short hot streak he was on. That's how I, and others who see him up close are looking at it.
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lakersboy
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 9:26 pm    Post subject:

Feel free to consider me out on a limb when I say unapologetically, Hart is going to draw rave reviews because of his improvement and overall ability. People will look at this team differently based on his ability and some others too.

I've never been so certain about a player improving since I've been watching the Lakers in the early 70's
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Judah
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 9:31 pm    Post subject:

J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.

I doubt anyone expects him to go out and dominate games like he did during SL, but SL did demonstrate that he's taken a significant step in his development and that his game has grown. I think he's growing into more than a 3 and D guy. If you notice, KCP's comments were rooted in what he's seen from him during their summer workouts and one on one battles. Not SL. I do expect KCP to win out in the end for the starting job, but Hart does have a legitimate shot and just might get it.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 10:43 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.




I doubt anyone expects him to go out and dominate games like he did during SL

...except me

He won't be the #1 option on the team, but his strong first step, vastly improved ball handling, the Euro step he added, and excellent finishing ability with both hands off the wrong foot on both sides, as well as increased explosion off the ground, will cause defenses fits. When they back off of that, he's shown good range on an improved 3pt shot.

Somebody is going to get dominated this year.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:07 am    Post subject:

audioaxes wrote:
answer is obvious...
Hart is already better than KCP
Hart is still developing and needs as many minutes as possible to get as much experience as possible
Hart is here for the long run, KCP is likely gone next season


This is not necessarily a given for me. True, he may be the beneficiary in a seller's market next summer but I also could see him taking the rest of the cap space or room exception for a year and then signing a long-term deal with bird rights in the summer of 2020. A guard rotation with Lonzo, Hart, KCP, and likely one of our wings sliding down would be great moving forward.
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:21 am    Post subject:

lakersboy wrote:
Judah wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.




I doubt anyone expects him to go out and dominate games like he did during SL

...except me

He won't be the #1 option on the team, but his strong first step, vastly improved ball handling, the Euro step he added, and excellent finishing ability with both hands off the wrong foot on both sides, as well as increased explosion off the ground, will cause defenses fits. When they back off of that, he's shown good range on an improved 3pt shot.

Somebody is going to get dominated this year.


Let's temper the expectations. Remember what happened last time when you expected Julius Randle to show his 3pt range?

I expect Hart to have a nice season though, and he showed flashes towards the end of last season to build on.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:00 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
I expect Hart to be our long term solution at SG, but KCP needs to start. He is a known quantity, the jury is still out on Hart and he needs to take the job. I expect him to.



Agreed
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:19 pm    Post subject:

Hart had more than just flashes last year. When given the chance, he was a consistently good player, he played smart in the closing minutes, he was a good decision maker, when starting he could regularly score 20ppg, and he's a player who by all accounts is likely to come back even better.

One thing I saw frequently last year were posters angry at KCP for ill-advised shots on fast breaks and in close games, by a player who was very active but statistically not that good on defense, a player capable of going on a spectacular hot streak late in the game but just as likely to let you down badly with the game on the line by taking a shot too early in the offense, clanking it, and keying a fast break the opposite direction. Last spring a lot of posters didn't even want KCP back this season. Didn't see that kind of anger towards Hart, and there's a reason for this. Can KCP improve? Sure, we'll see.

Hart, when given the chance, was clutch af when he finished games, getting the key change of possession, matching up with bigger, physical players and stopping the easy score on what should have been a mismatch, and making the intelligent play when the pressure was on. He didn't have to have the last shot, but when the situation called for it or someone else missed, Hart would nail the clutch shot too. He was consistently near or at the top in 3 point shooting all season long, whereas KCP was all over the map. Josh Hart showed a lot more than just flashes as the season progressed and I'd trust a key role on a title contender to Hart long before I'd trust it to KCP.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 12:30 pm    Post subject:

ISN'T THIS A GREAT PROBLEM TO HAVE?


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:20 pm    Post subject:

I voted KCP, but I'm a little surprised the poll isn't closer. Hart is easily the more intelligent player, IMO.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 1:46 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
ISN'T THIS A GREAT PROBLEM TO HAVE?



It is. And Hart also doesnt seem like the kind of person that would be put off by playing off the bench either, which is good in case it works out that way.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:04 pm    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
lakersboy wrote:
Judah wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.




I doubt anyone expects him to go out and dominate games like he did during SL

...except me

He won't be the #1 option on the team, but his strong first step, vastly improved ball handling, the Euro step he added, and excellent finishing ability with both hands off the wrong foot on both sides, as well as increased explosion off the ground, will cause defenses fits. When they back off of that, he's shown good range on an improved 3pt shot.

Somebody is going to get dominated this year.


Let's temper the expectations. Remember what happened last time when you expected Julius Randle to show his 3pt range?

I expect Hart to have a nice season though, and he showed flashes towards the end of last season to build on.

So...let's all have the same opinion?
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ringfinger
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:18 pm    Post subject:

lakersboy wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
lakersboy wrote:
Judah wrote:
J.C. Smith wrote:
Let them play against one another in training camp and make a judgement based on that. Hart has improved, he could make a run at the starting gig, but there's a big difference between the SPL and the NBA.




I doubt anyone expects him to go out and dominate games like he did during SL

...except me

He won't be the #1 option on the team, but his strong first step, vastly improved ball handling, the Euro step he added, and excellent finishing ability with both hands off the wrong foot on both sides, as well as increased explosion off the ground, will cause defenses fits. When they back off of that, he's shown good range on an improved 3pt shot.

Somebody is going to get dominated this year.


Let's temper the expectations. Remember what happened last time when you expected Julius Randle to show his 3pt range?

I expect Hart to have a nice season though, and he showed flashes towards the end of last season to build on.

So...let's all have the same opinion?


That's not what that means.
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h2omike
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 2:24 pm    Post subject:

Short term, KCP

Long term. Hart

It will be interesting to see what the Lakers long term plans are, is Hart going to be a shooting guard, sixth man combo guard, or will he surplant Lonzo as the starting PG in the future?
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 04, 2018 3:28 pm    Post subject:

yinoma2001 wrote:
ISN'T THIS A GREAT PROBLEM TO HAVE?


Sure is!
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