Funny response to question whether Kobe can hang in the BIG3
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GoldenThroat
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 9:16 am    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:49 am    Post subject:

That was good
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 10:52 am    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Funny response to question whether Kobe can hang in the BIG3

Runway8 wrote:
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/stephen-jackson-offers-slap-reporter-asked-kobe-bryant-handle-big3-play-214901173.html

Lol!
how old was the dude asking the question? I assume he is early 30's. now he still should know better. but he may not remember kobe played in the 90's too. The 90's wasnt the 80s rough but it was still very rough. much rougher than it is now. so either the guy was super young and really didnt know that. Or he's so used to the current nba today and his last memory of kobe was him playing in today's league that he forgot kobe was born and raised off that physicality. kobe's generation was the last of the street ball generation. which means they live and breath physicality on the basketball court no matter how big or small the guy may be. he had to deal with that physical game of basketball in those older eras. If kobe wasnt so injured on his way out. he could dominate the current nba as well as the big 3. just pull up the archives of kobe saying he liked the hold way better with all that physicality.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:16 pm    Post subject:

The Lebrons wrote:
Have people already forgotten how Kobe played? Dude was posting up everyone and their mom.
and their granny
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:20 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
scooterp10 wrote:
I wish he would play


I don't.
That league is trash. IMO.
I'm really surprised it's going to be an olympic event. Sigh.
That means out of shape guys can still play and be successful. smh
its not trash. its different. 3 on 3 is much different than 5 v 5. Its almost its own separate game. with how physical it can get and the 3 point shot/now 4 point play.

If you ever played in a 3 on 3 tournament while also playing 5 v 5 you would understand you have to respect both individually. I've seen old out of shape big boys, go to work on young inshape dudes who would run circles around these old dudes on a full court. but not in that half court. You dont have to use your head when you can out run a guy. but when you can't due to the size of the court, you're going to have to out think him and out muscle him or out quick him with great footwork in small spaces. We're talking about X nba dudes who are already on that level. So even not in their peak shape of nba level. they are still going to beat you 9 times out of 10.

You should want to see great 1 v 1 players play in the big 3. due to the fact you cant see that 1 v 1 anymore in the current nba which is a good thing. less iso ball, more entertaining ,etc. but that kills the 1 v 1 mano y mano. its all team defensive schemes and what not. Kobe and some defender on an island in a game where they can both get physical. lol. thats what kobe's game was built on.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:22 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
2019 wrote:
epak wrote:
scooterp10 wrote:
I wish he would play


I don't.
That league is trash. IMO.
I'm really surprised it's going to be an olympic event. Sigh.
That means out of shape guys can still play and be successful. smh


Yeah but Imagine AD/KD/Curry in a game of 3 on 3? Or LeBron/Harden/Westbrook..

in the Olympics, I'd love to see NBA players go 3 on 3.

In the Big 3? Kobe should just enjoy the praise and keep winning Oscars.


Hehe. That would be insane.
But I feel like it's impossible to play good team defense when it's 3v3. And as a fan of good team defense, I'm still iffy on it
and thats the beauty of 3 v 3. no hiding behind team defense. MAN UP. thats what i do miss about the old eras pre zone defense. MAN UP. let me see if you can stop this guy or not.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:24 pm    Post subject:

deal wrote:
KOBE should never play again. That halo, mystique or whatever you want to call it, is worth a bundle...his businesses have taken off, he should stick to that now and let people wonder, discuss, argue, etc but not play; he has nothing to prove.
he wouldnt be doing it to prove anything. if he did it he would be doing it because he loves to play and he wants to help cube and this new league of his thrive. to if nothing else give back to his next batch of nba old heads who are not like kobe and still want to play the game but can't or wont be allowed in the nba to play at the nba level.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:25 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.
and thats why i always liked GT. breaking da numbas down properly.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 12:33 pm    Post subject:

I legit thought the guy worded his question poorly, and probably meant something along the lines of, handling the physicality of the BIG3 after his injuries. It was definitely funny when I first watched it, but mistakes from the media, like anything poorly worded or flat out absurd, draws that kind of reaction.
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 3:15 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
I legit thought the guy worded his question poorly, and probably meant something along the lines of, handling the physicality of the BIG3 after his injuries. It was definitely funny when I first watched it, but mistakes from the media, like anything poorly worded or flat out absurd, draws that kind of reaction.
i thought so too until he repeated it Mike. he doubled down. "...I mean the physicality" like dude. unless you're really that young what were you watching in those 20 years of kobe?
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2018 5:31 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
scooterp10 wrote:
I wish he would play


I don't.
That league is trash. IMO.
I'm really surprised it's going to be an olympic event. Sigh.
That means out of shape guys can still play and be successful. smh


I would just love to see him play again, even if Big3 is a joke.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:14 am    Post subject:

@bscoop

Quote:
Kobe Bryant will play in @thebig3 next season according to Big 3 co-founder Jeff Kwatinetz while speaking on the league's weekly conference call.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 11:29 am    Post subject:

so yet again - someone who actually played against Kobe is giving you the real deal while the Max Kellermans and Brian Windhorsts of the world are trying to write him out of the top 10.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 2:08 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


This, my friend, is why you're the best in the business right now. I'm a big #'s guy myself but without context, you start getting cats who genuinely feel Kobe "might" barely be top 15.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:17 pm    Post subject:

jonnybravo wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


This, my friend, is why you're the best in the business right now. I'm a big #'s guy myself but without context, you start getting cats who genuinely feel Kobe "might" barely be top 15.

Such an awesome post. Man, GT is the GOAT.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 3:33 pm    Post subject:

Kobe’s done. He’s moved on to another path in his life, without basketball. ”I gave you my all”, as he so eloquently stated in his short film. He’s also a different animal than those other ex players you see on Inside The NBA and Open Court. While those guys are happily retired and loves to shot the (bleep) on TV, Kobe’s new passion is animation. I mean, dayum. The guy’s just on another level.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:00 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


While I agree with much of what you say, this last part is a stretch. We would have to imagine Kobe has a different sort of player than he was in the real world. He never became a good three point shooter. His bread and butter was the elbow two. Could he have adapted to modern spacing and made a higher percentage of shots? Maybe, but we also have to assume that he would be playing in a different system from PJ’s triangle.

I’d leave it at the proposition that players should be judged in the context of their own times. That much is certainly true.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:07 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 4:08 pm    Post subject:

GoldenThroat wrote:
jonnybravo wrote:
It's wild how his contemporaries view Kobe. He's TRULY the MJ level, basketball messiah of his generation. Media? He "might" be top 15. His TS% wasn't that great. Wild.

Oh...and...


KOBE! That one was nothing but net.


Analytics are a wonderful tool that I utilize all of the time, but they're often used irresponsibly in era comparisons. Kobe grew up in an era when being able to hit a contested, fadeaway 17-footer made you the baddest MFer on the court. The spacing was significantly different than it is today. Baseball has a stat named "OPS+", which reflects a player's OPS relative to their league that year, and that's the correct approach to evaluating a player's TS% as well, IMO.

For example, Kobe had a 55.0 TS% in 2002-03. The average TS% that season was 51.9 TS%. So he was significantly more efficient than league average and doing it at 32.9 USG%, which gives his teammates a TS% bump.

In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


Excellent post
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 7:56 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
GoldenThroat wrote:
In 2017-18, the league average was 55.6 TS%. Putting up 55.0 TS% in 2018 is very different than it was 15 years ago. Kobe was well above league average in TS% on high usage for about 15 straight years. If he grows up with "key or 3" shot-taking sensibilities and modern spacing the way that players do now, I have no doubt he'd be flirting with 60 TS%.


While I agree with much of what you say, this last part is a stretch. We would have to imagine Kobe has a different sort of player than he was in the real world. He never became a good three point shooter. His bread and butter was the elbow two. Could he have adapted to modern spacing and made a higher percentage of shots? Maybe, but we also have to assume that he would be playing in a different system from PJ’s triangle.

I’d leave it at the proposition that players should be judged in the context of their own times. That much is certainly true.


The 3pt explosion happened at the tail end of his career. I think what GT meant is that if Kobe grew up in this generation and watched players like Steph, Kawhi, Harden, Klay, KD - knowing what a basketball junky Kobe is - his game would've been influenced and molded by the current era. He would've worked obsessively on his shot, and less on his footwork in the post and fadeaway midrangers. He would've been great in any era because he was a sponge for basketball knowledge. This is why all the legends respect him so much.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:28 pm    Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:
@bscoop

Quote:
Kobe Bryant will play in @thebig3 next season according to Big 3 co-founder Jeff Kwatinetz while speaking on the league's weekly conference call.


is this real
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:30 pm    Post subject:

dont_be_a_wuss wrote:
@bscoop

Quote:
Kobe Bryant will play in @thebig3 next season according to Big 3 co-founder Jeff Kwatinetz while speaking on the league's weekly conference call.


Not happening.
https://nypost.com/2018/08/21/big3-co-founder-starts-big-kobe-bryant-rumor/

Not surprised. He got what he wanted out of his final NBA game, despite it not being for a championship. It was as big of a sendoff as possible for him, no need to ruin that.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:31 pm    Post subject:

Chronicle wrote:
dont_be_a_wuss wrote:
@bscoop

Quote:
Kobe Bryant will play in @thebig3 next season according to Big 3 co-founder Jeff Kwatinetz while speaking on the league's weekly conference call.


is this real


It was from a verified twitter account, but he misrepresented the executive from big 3. Someone from Kobe's company said its not happening. Oh well.
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 9:05 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
scooterp10 wrote:
I wish he would play


I don't.
That league is trash. IMO.
I'm really surprised it's going to be an olympic event. Sigh.
That means out of shape guys can still play and be successful. smh


If there is a market for it, who cares, I'm all for it!
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