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King Randle
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 Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 5:49 am Post subject: |
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| Four Decade Bandwagon wrote: | | Judah wrote: | | LakersForever123 wrote: | | I actually agree with Inspector Gadget. |
That probably means you should think twice  JK, IG.
Not everything he says is outrageous. I wouldn't even say that this is. I just don't agree. I have to squint really, really hard to see it that way. Again, it's no coincidence that they never speak of him as part of the young core. You'd expect them to if they were relatively high on him. I don't think it's reasonable to just ignore that fact and not wonder why. |
He isn't a key member of the core so why should they put him in that group?
The young core group have expectations of a higher potential and contributions over the next couple years. In the cases of Ball and Ingram there is an expectation (whether realistic or not) of elite NBA levels at their positions.
With Zubac the expectations are more modest. If he can be a consistent contributor this year it would be a win IMO. If he can consistently play 24+mpg with defensive energy and rebounding he would be a valuable complimentary player on this roster.
They are not expecting him to be the next Embid, Ayton or Stevens. If they can get a consistent level similar to Valanciunas, Poeltl or even a Plumlee they would be thrilled.
I would be too if he can earn the mpg, play defense and give the Lakers a nightly 8pts/7 rebounds. Anything more exceeds my expectations. |
I don't see him playing 24 mpg. Not even close IMO. |
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Four Decade Bandwagon
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| King Randle wrote: | | Four Decade Bandwagon wrote: | | Judah wrote: | | LakersForever123 wrote: | | I actually agree with Inspector Gadget. |
That probably means you should think twice JK, IG.
Not everything he says is outrageous. I wouldn't even say that this is. I just don't agree. I have to squint really, really hard to see it that way. Again, it's no coincidence that they never speak of him as part of the young core. You'd expect them to if they were relatively high on him. I don't think it's reasonable to just ignore that fact and not wonder why. |
He isn't a key member of the core so why should they put him in that group?
The young core group have expectations of a higher potential and contributions over the next couple years. In the cases of Ball and Ingram there is an expectation (whether realistic or not) of elite NBA levels at their positions.
With Zubac the expectations are more modest. If he can be a consistent contributor this year it would be a win IMO. If he can consistently play 24+mpg with defensive energy and rebounding he would be a valuable complimentary player on this roster.
They are not expecting him to be the next Embid, Ayton or Stevens. If they can get a consistent level similar to Valanciunas, Poeltl or even a Plumlee they would be thrilled.
I would be too if he can earn the mpg, play defense and give the Lakers a nightly 8pts/7 rebounds. Anything more exceeds my expectations. |
I don't see him playing 24 mpg. Not even close IMO. |
That is why I added a lot of "ifs" in there.
To be a solid contributor Zubac needs to be adding at least 20-24 mpg IMO. Anything less is going to be problematic for the Lakers.
I am not expecting McGee to give more then 15 mpg. If they are relying on James, Beasley or another small ball option for 20+mpg then they will struggle IMO.
Zubac needs to earn the mpg. Lakers do not need anything but a complimentary center with this roster, but they do need a center on the floor for most of the game. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:29 am Post subject: |
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I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner.
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Eindhoven
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:35 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
JaVale hasn't played 18mpg since 2012-13. I believe he will play around 12mpg.
2013- 18.1mpg (Denver)
2014- 15.8mpg (Denver)
2015- 11.5mpg (Denver/Phila)
2016- 10.9mpg (Dallas)
2017- 9.6mpg (GSW)
2018- 9.5mpg (GSW)
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:40 am Post subject: |
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| Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
JaVale hasn't played 18mpg since 2012-13. I believe he will play around 12mpg.
2013- 18.1mpg (Denver)
2014- 15.8mpg (Denver)
2015- 11.5mpg (Denver/Phila)
2016- 10.9mpg (Dallas)
2017- 9.6mpg (GSW)
2018- 9.5mpg (GSW) |
It's b/c he wasn't a starter on those teams.
I see:
Q1/Q3: 6 min start, 12mpg right there.
I think he will get some Q2/Q4 minutes too. Maybe 18-20mpg is high, but certainly more than 12mpg.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:44 am Post subject: |
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Yeah I think Zubac is still a Laker because he's inexpensive and familiar with Luke's offense and defense. I'm expecting he's going to be limited to situational minutes where we're not playing small ball at the same time when McGee is resting.
I think Zu worked hard this summer, and it wouldn't surprise me if he's turning himself into a decent NBA center, we'll see. Nonetheless I don't see the above changing unless he extends his shooting range to the 3 point line.
I'm guessing 10 - 15 minutes range.
Last edited by TooMuchMajicBuss on Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:47 am; edited 1 time in total |
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King Randle
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:45 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
Agree with this except Zu has to earn those minutes. That's why I can see the Lakers going small without McGee in there and LeBron and Beasley getting those minutes. I really believe Beasley will have a great year. |
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Four Decade Bandwagon
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:45 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
Maybe? But only 12 suit up on game day.
I do not see Wagner suiting up unless there are injuries or Zubac disappoints. Likely an end of the bench and G-League until later in the season.
Would love to see McGee contribute that amount of mpg. Would be a huge jump for him compared to his last five years. Can he still maintain the quality of his high energy by increasing his quantity of playing time is a big unknown.
As for James or Beasley playing center for 18-20 mpg every night. Do not see that as reliable over the course of the season. Against certain teams and lineups, possibly. Just my opinion, but if they try this strategy every night they lose the physicality battle too often. Do not see James or Beasley being able to sustain the rebounding, picks and bumps and grinds on defense every night.
Do you really want James battling with the Julius Randles of the League for 82 games? I don't!
We will see what Walton thinks soon enough. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:56 am Post subject: |
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I don't see LBJ playing more than 5-6 mpg as a small ball center. Draymond doesn't even play 18-20mpg at small ball center.
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King Randle
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:00 am Post subject: |
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| Four Decade Bandwagon wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
Maybe? But only 12 suit up on game day.
I do not see Wagner suiting up unless there are injuries or Zubac disappoints. Likely an end of the bench and G-League until later in the season.
Would love to see McGee contribute that amount of mpg. Would be a huge jump for him compared to his last five years. Can he still maintain the quality of his high energy by increasing his quantity of playing time is a big unknown.
As for James or Beasley playing center for 18-20 mpg every night. Do not see that as reliable over the course of the season. Against certain teams and lineups, possibly. Just my opinion, but if they try this strategy every night they lose the physicality battle too often. Do not see James or Beasley being able to sustain the rebounding, picks and bumps and grinds on defense every night.
Do you really want James battling with the Julius Randles of the League for 82 games? I don't!
We will see what Walton thinks soon enough. |
Against guys like Embid, Boogie (when healthy) and the likes of them I completely agree. But most of the centers in this league now are not bangers so Bron and Beasley splitting 20 minutes at center IMO is doable. |
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CantStopJM
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:04 am Post subject: |
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| I don't know how anyone can watch Zubac all of last season(including summer league) and still have hope for him. I hope he proves me wrong but he's just soft, can barely jump with a questionable work ethic. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:11 am Post subject: |
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| CantStopJM wrote: | | I don't know how anyone can watch Zubac all of last season(including summer league) and still have hope for him. I hope he proves me wrong but he's just soft, can barely jump with a questionable work ethic. |
I think there will be a role in the rotation for him. Give him at least 1 more season.
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Four Decade Bandwagon
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:00 am Post subject: |
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I hope that Zubac can earn the mpg at center. It is time for him to make that step to consistent contributor. Reportedly has worked hard and looks good in the WC clips. Lets hope it translates to the NBA this season.
Lakers need some more physicality in the paint. At the moment they are too reliant on finesse for my tastes. Who on the Lakers will be doing the dirty work on both ends. Who is battling the rebounders, screeners and high energy players just about every team has. Small ball center play is inevitable but I hope only against certain lineups for a limited amount of time.
Zubac seems the most likely to find that role. Even though I agree he has not proven to be that "battler" in the past. Not sure he has it in him.
Changing this a bit to include Svi. He has looked great at WC and in SL. But will be tough for him to establish a consistent role. Another one of those options as the season progresses and injuries occur.
As the roster looks today, I would not be confident he suits up for games. going to have to be really impressive to earn a nightly role. (over Stephenson?) |
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Eindhoven
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:13 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
JaVale hasn't played 18mpg since 2012-13. I believe he will play around 12mpg.
2013- 18.1mpg (Denver)
2014- 15.8mpg (Denver)
2015- 11.5mpg (Denver/Phila)
2016- 10.9mpg (Dallas)
2017- 9.6mpg (GSW)
2018- 9.5mpg (GSW) |
It's b/c he wasn't a starter on those teams.
I see:
Q1/Q3: 6 min start, 12mpg right there.
I think he will get some Q2/Q4 minutes too. Maybe 18-20mpg is high, but certainly more than 12mpg. |
In order to average 18mpg he should play 20+ minutes several times and he hasn't played 20 minutes in a game for 4 years (Nov 1st 2014). I don't think he can handle that. He will have 18-minute games as well as 8-minute games. In average, I believe he will play around 12mpg, maybe 14mpg, tops.
Zu will have room to play enough minutes, I hope he earns them. Otherwise, I can see Magic trading for a C before February.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:17 am Post subject: |
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| Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
JaVale hasn't played 18mpg since 2012-13. I believe he will play around 12mpg.
2013- 18.1mpg (Denver)
2014- 15.8mpg (Denver)
2015- 11.5mpg (Denver/Phila)
2016- 10.9mpg (Dallas)
2017- 9.6mpg (GSW)
2018- 9.5mpg (GSW) |
It's b/c he wasn't a starter on those teams.
I see:
Q1/Q3: 6 min start, 12mpg right there.
I think he will get some Q2/Q4 minutes too. Maybe 18-20mpg is high, but certainly more than 12mpg. |
In order to average 18mpg he should play 20+ minutes several times and he hasn't played 20 minutes in a game for 4 years (Nov 1st 2014). I don't think he can handle that. He will have 18-minute games as well as 8-minute games. In average, I believe he will play around 12mpg, maybe 14mpg, tops.
Zu will have room to play enough minutes, I hope he earns them. Otherwise, I can see Magic trading for a C before February. |
Yeah my 18-20mpg is too high now that I think about it. But I think 12mpg is TOO low. I think it'll be in the 14-16mpg range.
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King Randle
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:50 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | Eindhoven wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | I think Javale plays around 18-20mpg.
That leaves 24-30 mpg at center. I think Zub gets around 12mpg, then LBJ or Beez takes the rest, with a sprinkling of Wagner. |
JaVale hasn't played 18mpg since 2012-13. I believe he will play around 12mpg.
2013- 18.1mpg (Denver)
2014- 15.8mpg (Denver)
2015- 11.5mpg (Denver/Phila)
2016- 10.9mpg (Dallas)
2017- 9.6mpg (GSW)
2018- 9.5mpg (GSW) |
It's b/c he wasn't a starter on those teams.
I see:
Q1/Q3: 6 min start, 12mpg right there.
I think he will get some Q2/Q4 minutes too. Maybe 18-20mpg is high, but certainly more than 12mpg. |
In order to average 18mpg he should play 20+ minutes several times and he hasn't played 20 minutes in a game for 4 years (Nov 1st 2014). I don't think he can handle that. He will have 18-minute games as well as 8-minute games. In average, I believe he will play around 12mpg, maybe 14mpg, tops.
Zu will have room to play enough minutes, I hope he earns them. Otherwise, I can see Magic trading for a C before February. |
Yeah my 18-20mpg is too high now that I think about it. But I think 12mpg is TOO low. I think it'll be in the 14-16mpg range. |
I don't think it is. Have you seen videos of his workouts? He's dropped a lot of weight and looks super light on his fight and more athletic. |
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Baron Von Humongous
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:06 am Post subject: |
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What if Zu starts?
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DLaker
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:07 am Post subject: |
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I will give Zubac some time to grow. He is only 21 with size, good hands and touch.
Marc Gasol entered the NBA at age 23
11.9 pts 7.4 reb 1.1blk 1.7 Ast 30.7 min
Not saying Zubac will turn to Marc, but we cant count him out too early when he has so much growth and maturity left.
Early success in his rookie year made him believe thing will be given to him and came in the season out of shape and slow. He learned last year he needed to work extra hard every day and finished the last season strong.
+/- rating the last 11 games last year is a +45 with a with a few very good games. Last 10 game he avg 6.2 pts 5.3 reb 1 blk around 16 min/game
He looks in very good shape this season and looks more explosive and agile from the fiba games. Excited what Lebron can make him look like this year, (ie mozgov, Ilgauskas). If he pans out, he and Wagner can secure out center spot for years one low post another a stretch. |
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Four Decade Bandwagon
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:36 am Post subject: |
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| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | What if Zu starts? |
I'd be thrilled?
If he can earn the time on the court it is a huge upside for the Lakers. He just needs to prove he can handle it. To this point that is a significant unknown.
I want to reiterate, I am not expecting a dominant top 10 center. If Zubac can be a nice complimentary player it would be huge for the Lakers. A Zubac that can play 24 mpg. A Zubac that can play hard on defense and absorb the physical grind in the paint and lay solid picks allows other players to do what they do best.
I have a lot of confidence in the depth at every other position but center. If they can get simply solid contributions from Zubac, McGee and potentially Wagner doing all the dirty work the Lakers will be a far more dangerous team then if they have to patchwork together center mins, especially small ball options.
The unknown of the center position may be one of the biggest factors in their success this year. If they can get average center play they are contenders. If it is sub-par they are scrambling for a 6-8 seed and likely first round exit. |
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:41 am Post subject: |
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| DLaker wrote: | I will give Zubac some time to grow. He is only 21 with size, good hands and touch.
Marc Gasol entered the NBA at age 23
11.9 pts 7.4 reb 1.1blk 1.7 Ast 30.7 min
Not saying Zubac will turn to Marc, but we cant count him out too early when he has so much growth and maturity left.
Early success in his rookie year made him believe thing will be given to him and came in the season out of shape and slow. He learned last year he needed to work extra hard every day and finished the last season strong.
+/- rating the last 11 games last year is a +45 with a with a few very good games. Last 10 game he avg 6.2 pts 5.3 reb 1 blk around 16 min/game
He looks in very good shape this season and looks more explosive and agile from the fiba games. Excited what Lebron can make him look like this year, (ie mozgov, Ilgauskas). If he pans out, he and Wagner can secure out center spot for years one low post another a stretch. |
Zubac is basically the only big that does exactly what Gasol does besides the 3pt.. it’s not like Gasol was spectacular when he came into the NBA, we have already seen Zu put up nice stats when he gets a opportunity. |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:46 am Post subject: |
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I think we will be active in the buyout market for centers come January/Feb.
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Eindhoven
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:54 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Eindhoven wrote: |
In order to average 18mpg he should play 20+ minutes several times and he hasn't played 20 minutes in a game for 4 years (Nov 1st 2014). I don't think he can handle that. He will have 18-minute games as well as 8-minute games. In average, I believe he will play around 12mpg, maybe 14mpg, tops.
Zu will have room to play enough minutes, I hope he earns them. Otherwise, I can see Magic trading for a C before February. |
Yeah my 18-20mpg is too high now that I think about it. But I think 12mpg is TOO low. I think it'll be in the 14-16mpg range. |
14.8mpg it is. Deal?
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Inspector Gadget
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:56 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | I think we will be active in the buyout market for centers come January/Feb. |
Tyson Chandler
Marcin Gortat
Joahkim Noah
Kosta Koufos
Zach Randolph
Lots of guys who can help us. |
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adkindo
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:05 am Post subject: |
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| Baron Von Humongous wrote: | | What if Zu starts? |
hell freezes over? pigs will fly? What are you looking for here? In all seriousness, it just seems questionable to start Zu on a Lebron team....just have to find a better option. |
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adkindo
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| Posted: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:06 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | I don't see LBJ playing more than 5-6 mpg as a small ball center. Draymond doesn't even play 18-20mpg at small ball center. |
I agree. |
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