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ksmgf
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 05, 2018 11:49 pm    Post subject: NBA in Seattle.

Seattle needs and deserves a NBA team. I still can't believe it's been over ten years since the Sonics left the city. Isn't Seattle a bigger market than OKC? Were the Sonics losing money before moving?

Seeing KD wearing Kemp's jersey gave me goosebumps. If I were Steve Balmer I would move the Clips back to Seattle. The city is going to love and embrace them like crazy. KD might even consider signing with Seattle since he really likes it there.
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carlosLisboa
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 12:59 am    Post subject:

No NBA team should have an arena built with city funds.
Use that the money to finance Boeing (am I am an Airbus fan).
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:30 am    Post subject:

The Sonics always choked in Seattle. Then they moved and became Chokelahoma City. Durant decided to leave because of all the choking. Maybe the Sonics did them a favor by moving.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 9:50 am    Post subject:

Is Seattle considered a major American city? I visited in July and it seemed quite small. (Though the metro area is ranked the 15th largest in the US, so bigger than some other markets.)

Why doesn't San Diego have a team? I don't think a franchise in Las Vegas would work.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 12:58 pm    Post subject:

Move the Thunder back to Seattle.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:00 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
Is Seattle considered a major American city? I visited in July and it seemed quite small. (Though the metro area is ranked the 15th largest in the US, so bigger than some other markets.)

Why doesn't San Diego have a team? I don't think a franchise in Las Vegas would work.


They had 2. They both failed.
Rockets moved to Houston
Clippers moved to LA.
Anyways if there are any NBA fans in San Diego they are most likely Laker fans so it wouldn't work. The only teams that made any headway in the San Diego market are the Chargers and they moved because they couldn't get a stadium built and the Padres have sucked for most of this decade. I think San Diego is fine as a city without having an NBA team.

As far as Seattle as an NBA city, they did pretty well. Its just that the last couple of years they were awful so this coincided with their bad attendance and unfortunately with the sale of the team to outsiders it was out of the hands of the fan base. You will probably hear the calls for a return to Seattle as Amazon gets bigger since they are the driver of wealth in that city now. If we know anything about sports leagues is that they love money and that is ultimately what will cause a team to go back to the Seattle market.
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lakersken80
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:06 pm    Post subject:

Steve007 wrote:
The Sonics always choked in Seattle. Then they moved and became Chokelahoma City. Durant decided to leave because of all the choking. Maybe the Sonics did them a favor by moving.


The Sonics were never going to beat the Bulls dynasty. They got close to the mountain top and ultimately couldn't get to the top like most other NBA legends of the 90's because of MJ, Pippen, Phil, etc.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 1:14 pm    Post subject:

carlosLisboa wrote:
No NBA team should have an arena built with city funds.
Use that the money to finance Boeing (am I am an Airbus fan).


I don't live there, but from what I've heard is that the arena refurbishment is aimed at getting an NHL team. They are going to dig a bigger hole in the ground and yet somehow keep the old roof. The city loves that old roof because of the World's Fair back in 1962 so its kind of a landmark I guess. Don't forget they rebuilt it once back in 1994 but the rebuilt arena was already outdated by what the NBA was used to by the 2000's. Seeing the plans, the new Key Arena will have all the amenities the NBA wanted so it will be pretty much a brand new arena with the exception of the historical roof.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 6:17 pm    Post subject: Re: NBA in Seattle.

ksmgf wrote:
Seattle needs and deserves a NBA team. I still can't believe it's been over ten years since the Sonics left the city. Isn't Seattle a bigger market than OKC? Were the Sonics losing money before moving?

Seeing KD wearing Kemp's jersey gave me goosebumps. If I were Steve Balmer I would move the Clips back to Seattle. The city is going to love and embrace them like crazy. KD might even consider signing with Seattle since he really likes it there.


The Clippers were never in Seattle. Balmer is trying to build a new arena here, doubtful he devalues his franchise.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:49 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
Steve007 wrote:
The Sonics always choked in Seattle. Then they moved and became Chokelahoma City. Durant decided to leave because of all the choking. Maybe the Sonics did them a favor by moving.


The Sonics were never going to beat the Bulls dynasty. They got close to the mountain top and ultimately couldn't get to the top like most other NBA legends of the 90's because of MJ, Pippen, Phil, etc.


I was thinking more of the losses to Denver and the Lakers (the Lakers upset them in 95 and embarrassed them in 98). You’re right that Seattle did fine when they made the finals, but I was thinking of the other years.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:52 pm    Post subject:

lakersken80 wrote:
CandyCanes wrote:
Is Seattle considered a major American city? I visited in July and it seemed quite small. (Though the metro area is ranked the 15th largest in the US, so bigger than some other markets.)

Why doesn't San Diego have a team? I don't think a franchise in Las Vegas would work.


They had 2. They both failed.
Rockets moved to Houston
Clippers moved to LA.
Anyways if there are any NBA fans in San Diego they are most likely Laker fans so it wouldn't work. The only teams that made any headway in the San Diego market are the Chargers and they moved because they couldn't get a stadium built and the Padres have sucked for most of their existence. I think San Diego is fine as a city without having an NBA team.

As far as Seattle as an NBA city, they did pretty well. Its just that the last couple of years they were awful so this coincided with their bad attendance and unfortunately with the sale of the team to outsiders it was out of the hands of the fan base. You will probably hear the calls for a return to Seattle as Amazon gets bigger since they are the driver of wealth in that city now. If we know anything about sports leagues is that they love money and that is ultimately what will cause a team to go back to the Seattle market.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 06, 2018 11:56 pm    Post subject:

I never understood the move from Seattle to OKC, but personally I don’t care if Seattle has a team. They were a rival to the Lakers in the 90’s and I hated that team. But it was a fun rivalry.

The Clippers aren’t likely to move there but if they did, they would be tougher to beat because they would have a real home field advantage that they could never have in LA when they play the Lakers.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:05 am    Post subject:

Steve007 wrote:
The Sonics always choked in Seattle. Then they moved and became Chokelahoma City. Durant decided to leave because of all the choking. Maybe the Sonics did them a favor by moving.


I am pretty sure the Sonics did not choke in the 1979 Finals.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:12 am    Post subject:

Steve007 wrote:
I never understood the move from Seattle to OKC, but personally I don’t care if Seattle has a team. They were a rival to the Lakers in the 90’s and I hated that team. But it was a fun rivalry.

The Clippers aren’t likely to move there but if they did, they would be tougher to beat because they would have a real home field advantage that they could never have in LA when they play the Lakers.


The NBA wanted a franchise in OKC since they were successful in hosting the Hornets (now the Pelicans) for 2 seasons after Hurricane Katrina. OKC had an NBA ready arena since 2002 so they had the facilities. Howard Schultz wanted to sell the Sonics since they were losing money and were no good during that period in the 2000's. Long story short all those events led to them moving to OKC and Seattle without a team. Now with Seattle's newfound wealth and economic turnaround (largely in part due to how big Amazon has become), I wouldn't be surprised to see an NBA team back in Seattle. If you look at how much new construction is going on in that area, you can see why Adam Silver is probably taking a look at Seattle again.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 1:57 am    Post subject:

RG73 wrote:
Steve007 wrote:
The Sonics always choked in Seattle. Then they moved and became Chokelahoma City. Durant decided to leave because of all the choking. Maybe the Sonics did them a favor by moving.


I am pretty sure the Sonics did not choke in the 1979 Finals.


I remembered that too, but personally I don’t care about 1979 as I wasn’t even around to see it. The Knicks haven’t won since the 70’s either and nobody calls them winners.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:21 am    Post subject:

I think moving the Clippers to Seattle would be a good opportunity for them. By doing so and taking the Sonics name, colors, logo and uniforms, they can rebrand themselves and start to get rid of the stench of being the Clippers. I vaguely remember SI doing an article in the late 90s about how they were the worst franchise in all of sports.

Those guys think they're going to sign at least one superstar next summer just because they have cap space and Jerry West. But they still give off the auru of being the same old Clippers. If they move to Seattle, it would give the message that they've hit the reset button and are getting a divorce from their turrible past. Just like how corporations rebrand themselves when they're struggling so that the public will maybe start anew with them.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:05 am    Post subject:

The clippers moving to Seattle and rebranding themselves the Sonics would be awesome. Southern California is a Lakers market. It’s an honor to call yourself a laker fan. Calling yourself a clipper fan is on the same level as calling yourself a trump supporter.

I also think the Sacramento Kings should move to Las Vegas. Let California battle it out with the Lakers and warriors only. Warriors represent the North and Lakers represent the South. Create a location rivalry with basketball.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:51 am    Post subject:

The NBA should have found a way to get the Kings or the Pelicans to Seattle. At this point, those franchises are locked into bad markets. As it stands, Seattle will probably be a target for the next expansion.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:19 am    Post subject:

Steve007 wrote:
I never understood the move from Seattle to OKC, but personally I don’t care if Seattle has a team.


As a Laker fan that lives in eastern Washington, having a team there would be a lot more practical than travelling to Portland. I saw two Laker games in Seattle and those are the two last Laker game I saw.

The Sonics were our rival or whatever, but Seattle is a fantastic city and it has plenty of people that care about basketball. It's too bad that the Sonics left for freaking Oklahoma. Seattle is too big and vibrant not to have a team so let's hope it happens soon.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 12:55 pm    Post subject: Re: NBA in Seattle.

ksmgf wrote:
Seattle needs and deserves a NBA team. I still can't believe it's been over ten years since the Sonics left the city. Isn't Seattle a bigger market than OKC? Were the Sonics losing money before moving?

Seeing KD wearing Kemp's jersey gave me goosebumps. If I were Steve Balmer I would move the Clips back to Seattle. The city is going to love and embrace them like crazy. KD might even consider signing with Seattle since he really likes it there.



The Clippers were never in Seattle.

They were founded as the Buffalo Braves in 1970; became the San Diego Clippers in 78; and move to LA in 84. So they've been in Los Angeles for 34 years of their 58 years.

I can't see why Ballmer would move them to Seattle; the drop in franchise value would be enormous.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 4:56 pm    Post subject: Re: NBA in Seattle.

activeverb wrote:


I can't see why Ballmer would move them to Seattle; the drop in franchise value would be enormous.

Their franchise value may drop for a little while, but once people start to forget that they used to be the Clippers, they should be able to attract big free agents and keep their homegrown players from leaving. Shortly after that their franchise value should rise.

As I'm sure you know, entrepreneurship isn't really about short term gain as much as it's about long term gain. Sometimes we need to sacrifice some short term gain so that we can have much more long term gain.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:17 pm    Post subject:

Seeing that Ballmer is going full speed ahead with the Inglewood project, has support of the mayor and officials at the state level helping him with the environmental issues, the only ones standing in his way from getting his arena built is MSG. I also think him having full control of the arena in Inglewood is more enticing to him compared to whatever he may face moving the team to Seattle. They don't have another viable arena project outside of the refurbished Key Center and if he moved there he would strictly be a tenant again, the big reason why he wanted out of Staples Center in the first place. Ballmer has stated that his arena would strictly be built for basketball first and foremost. There would be no hockey rink which means the fans will be closer to the court.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:35 pm    Post subject:

Aeneas Hunter wrote:
The NBA should have found a way to get the Kings or the Pelicans to Seattle. At this point, those franchises are locked into bad markets. As it stands, Seattle will probably be a target for the next expansion.


Kings just got a brand new arena they won't be leaving for the next 30 years. It also helps that they have a tech billionaire who is from Silicon Valley, who has a personal interest in keeping them close to where he works.

As far as the Pelicans go, I don't see the NBA leaving the New Orleans market again.

I do agree with you that if the NBA does add a team(s) it will probably have to be an expansion at this point. They would probably have to partner another team with Seattle so they get an even 32 teams. Yes, talent dilution would be an issue, but if the NBA wants to gain new customers they will probably have to do it in the future.


Last edited by lakersken80 on Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:37 pm    Post subject: Re: NBA in Seattle.

slavavov wrote:
activeverb wrote:


I can't see why Ballmer would move them to Seattle; the drop in franchise value would be enormous.

Their franchise value may drop for a little while, but once people start to forget that they used to be the Clippers, they should be able to attract big free agents and keep their homegrown players from leaving. Shortly after that their franchise value should rise.

As I'm sure you know, entrepreneurship isn't really about short term gain as much as it's about long term gain. Sometimes we need to sacrifice some short term gain so that we can have much more long term gain.


Franchise value is largely dependent on markets size. My guess is if they move from Los Angeles to Seattle their franchise valuation would drop from 30 to 50%. Right now, I believe Forbes estimates they are the 8th most valuable franchise. In Seattle they probably would drop to below the league average

I don't see why their moving from Los Angeles to Seattle would make them more attractive to free agents.

Anyway, as someone else noted, Balmer is building a new stadium in Inglewood, so I'm not sure why some Laker fans are hanging on to this fancy that the Clippers are going to move.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:10 pm    Post subject: Re: NBA in Seattle.

activeverb wrote:
slavavov wrote:
activeverb wrote:


I can't see why Ballmer would move them to Seattle; the drop in franchise value would be enormous.

Their franchise value may drop for a little while, but once people start to forget that they used to be the Clippers, they should be able to attract big free agents and keep their homegrown players from leaving. Shortly after that their franchise value should rise.

As I'm sure you know, entrepreneurship isn't really about short term gain as much as it's about long term gain. Sometimes we need to sacrifice some short term gain so that we can have much more long term gain.


Franchise value is largely dependent on markets size. My guess is if they move from Los Angeles to Seattle their franchise valuation would drop from 30 to 50%. Right now, I believe Forbes estimates they are the 8th most valuable franchise. In Seattle they probably would drop to below the league average

I don't see why their moving from Los Angeles to Seattle would make them more attractive to free agents.

Anyway, as someone else noted, Balmer is building a new stadium in Inglewood, so I'm not sure why some Laker fans are hanging on to this fancy that the Clippers are going to move.

Moving to Seattle and rebranding themselves would at least give the appearance that they're serious about distancing themselves from being the Clippers and the Donald Sterling regime. If they combined that with better decisions at the top, starting with Steve Ballmer, then eventually they can be more attractive to free agents.

We went through the same thing. When Jim Buss was in charge, we were unattractive to free agents. Even when Kobe retired we were still unattractive. But when Jeanie Buss fired Jim and replaced him with Magic, it gave the message that we had distanced ourselves from Jim Buss. Now, as a result, we signed Lebron and Rondo.

That whole process will take several years for the Clippers, but like I said it's always about the long term if you're talking about ownership.

You're right when you said that franchise valuation is largely dependent on market size, but Seattle is a very attractive city to corporations. Maybe Ballmer could do some kind of deal with Amazon that would infuse lots of value into the team. Maybe being in the same city as his former company (Microsoft) would also help.

Also, if you own a sports team and are planning on holding on to it for many years, I think winning should take precedent over how much your franchise is valued, as long as you have the capital to build a winning team, which I'm guessing Ballmer does independently of the valuation of the Clippers.

With all that said, as you and others have mentioned in this thread, it looks like Ballmer is committed to that new arena in Inglewood, so everything I said here doesn't even matter since it will never happen.
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