What's the best major city in California and why?
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Best city in California?
San Francisco
20%
 20%  [ 7 ]
San Diego
23%
 23%  [ 8 ]
Los Angeles
50%
 50%  [ 17 ]
San Jose
5%
 5%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 34

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:44 am    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
unleasHell wrote:
Lame Poll with no Orange County..


That’s because it’s not the worst place in California poll, although to be fair, Fresno and bakersfield could compete with Orange County.


Yeah, I see your point. I expect a mass exodus from Newport Beach to Fresno any day. In fact, now that Kobe is retired, I hear he is moving the fam up to Fresno (or was it Bakersfield — I cant remember).
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:49 am    Post subject:

Gotta say LA but the traffic and last call at 1 are strong repellent
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:11 am    Post subject:

Los Angeles isn’t just the best city in the state, it’s the best city in the country. The weather is second only to Hawaii. It’s diversity is only rivaled by NYC. The food is as diverse and good as the people. “Look at these women...ain’t noting like ‘em nowhere.” Anything can happen in Los Angeles...this is where dreams come true.

SF is a beautiful city, but has lost its once quirky charm in favor of tech company employees. Outrageously expensive...but when the fog rolls in just right it is magical.

SD is a weird mix of beach culture and military culture. It’s way too expensive for what it is.

San Jose isn’t cool in any way other than the fact that several tech titans are based there.

I will admit though that I’ve found South Orange County to be perfect for me. The bubble of Newport, HB, and Laguna (and some of Irvine too) is as close as you can get to living in Hawaii without living in Hawaii. It’s more beachy than LA...I can wear my flip flops almost anywhere.

The other place in California that intrigues me is Big Sur. Not a city in any way but I like the vibe and would kind of like to retire there with an old pickup truck, the beauty of the terrain, and my wife...but she wants to retire in Europe. What to do. First world problems.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:25 am    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:


The other place in California that intrigues me is Big Sur. Not a city in any way but I like the vibe and would kind of like to retire there with an old pickup truck, the beauty of the terrain, and my wife...but she wants to retire in Europe. What to do. First world problems.



The Northern CA coast line resembles Italy's no? Seems like a meeting point. But, I'd take Carmel by the Sea as my retirement spot.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:44 am    Post subject:

The last place I would retire would be in California. Over taxed and over regulated. Luckily I already have my retirement home in Havasu.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:54 am    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Los Angeles isn’t just the best city in the state, it’s the best city in the country. The weather is second only to Hawaii. It’s diversity is only rivaled by NYC. The food is as diverse and good as the people. “Look at these women...ain’t noting like ‘em nowhere.” Anything can happen in Los Angeles...this is where dreams come true.

SF is a beautiful city, but has lost its once quirky charm in favor of tech company employees. Outrageously expensive...but when the fog rolls in just right it is magical.

SD is a weird mix of beach culture and military culture. It’s way too expensive for what it is.

San Jose isn’t cool in any way other than the fact that several tech titans are based there.

I will admit though that I’ve found South Orange County to be perfect for me. The bubble of Newport, HB, and Laguna (and some of Irvine too) is as close as you can get to living in Hawaii without living in Hawaii. It’s more beachy than LA...I can wear my flip flops almost anywhere.

The other place in California that intrigues me is Big Sur. Not a city in any way but I like the vibe and would kind of like to retire there with an old pickup truck, the beauty of the terrain, and my wife...but she wants to retire in Europe. What to do. First world problems.


You don't find Orange County too boring and far from Los Angeles?
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:22 am    Post subject:

For everyday living, I like south OC.

For entertainment/travel, I like SD or LA. LA just has too much traffic for my liking.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 12:40 pm    Post subject:

OMG, no love for Torrance and the South bay?
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:28 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:
San Francisco would have a real chance of being the state's best major city if it weren't for all those selfish, awkward tech geeks who have made living in many of it's neighborhoods virtually impossible unless you make $100,000+ a year.

Right, it's the tech geeks and not inane zoning laws that makes building new, dense, and vertical housing impossible.

Anything beats San Jose. San Diego and LA are sprawling messes. San Francisco wins by default. Though I'd probably pick San Diego or OC if I were in my 30s.


The homeowners are selfish (bleeps) and don't want to see their home values decrease, so they elect people who enforce stupid zoning laws. I feel like at some point the state of California needs to step in or something. Homelessness is out of control.

Plus from what I understand those tech geeks are starting to lobby the govt to get rid of regulations and taxes for corporations.

I don't really get why people put the leaders of these tech companies on a pedestal and act like they're heroes. Many of them are just as self-entitled and out of touch as the billionaire executives in other industries.

I've read articles about the major disconnect between working class people in and around Palo Alto and high-paid employees of companies like Google who have buses or shuttles with the Google logo take them to and from work every day. As bad as gentrification has been here in L.A. and in NYC, one could make an argument that it's the worst up in the bay. These gentrified neighborhoods which have pretty much been taken over by these tech companies are no different from other gentrified neighborhood taken over by real estate developers, the health care industry, etc.
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Last edited by slavavov on Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 2:28 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:


You don't find Orange County too boring and far from Los Angeles?


When I was younger, probably. Now, no, I love it.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:34 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:
San Francisco would have a real chance of being the state's best major city if it weren't for all those selfish, awkward tech geeks who have made living in many of it's neighborhoods virtually impossible unless you make $100,000+ a year.

Right, it's the tech geeks and not inane zoning laws that makes building new, dense, and vertical housing impossible.

Anything beats San Jose. San Diego and LA are sprawling messes. San Francisco wins by default. Though I'd probably pick San Diego or OC if I were in my 30s.


The homeowners are selfish (bleeps) and don't want to see their home values decrease, so they elect people who enforce stupid zoning laws. I feel like at some point the state of California needs to step in or something. Homelessness is out of control.

Right, the state is going to need to preempt the municipalities since incentives are too warped on a municipal level. Check out SB-827. It died because they didn't do enough coalition building with marginalized/low-income communities (who should be the base of such a bill instead of yuppie YIMBYs like me). I'm hoping something like this gets eventually passed though.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 6:41 pm    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:

Plus from what I understand those tech geeks are starting to lobby the govt to get rid of regulations and taxes for corporations.

I don't really get why people put the leaders of these tech companies on a pedestal and act like they're heroes. Many of them are just as self-entitled and out of touch as the billionaire executives in other industries.

I've read articles about the major disconnect between working class people in and around Palo Alto and high-paid employees of companies like Google who have buses or shuttles with the Google logo take them to and from work every day. As bad as gentrification has been here in L.A. and in NYC, one could make an argument that it's the worst up in the bay. These gentrified neighborhoods which have pretty much been taken over by these tech companies are no different from other gentrified neighborhood taken over by real estate developers, the health care industry, etc.

Actually, the Google buses are conspicuously non-branded because they are a magnet of fury coming from people who blame Google as a symbol of gentrification. I sympathize with them but the reality is the issue is the lack of housing, not the tech workers per se.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:21 pm    Post subject:

markjay wrote:
Omar Little wrote:
unleasHell wrote:
Lame Poll with no Orange County..


That’s because it’s not the worst place in California poll, although to be fair, Fresno and bakersfield could compete with Orange County.


Yeah, I see your point. I expect a mass exodus from Newport Beach to Fresno any day. In fact, now that Kobe is retired, I hear he is moving the fam up to Fresno (or was it Bakersfield — I cant remember).


The fact that people don’t leave Newport Beach for Fresno is not what makes Newport Beach a (bleep) place. There are different types of (bleep). Newport Beach just happens to be the douchey variety, while Fresno is the more prosaic variety. But neither place is heavily populated with people you’d like to live next to.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:24 pm    Post subject:

Surfitall wrote:
Los Angeles isn’t just the best city in the state, it’s the best city in the country. The weather is second only to Hawaii. It’s diversity is only rivaled by NYC. The food is as diverse and good as the people. “Look at these women...ain’t noting like ‘em nowhere.” Anything can happen in Los Angeles...this is where dreams come true.

SF is a beautiful city, but has lost its once quirky charm in favor of tech company employees. Outrageously expensive...but when the fog rolls in just right it is magical.

SD is a weird mix of beach culture and military culture. It’s way too expensive for what it is.

San Jose isn’t cool in any way other than the fact that several tech titans are based there.

I will admit though that I’ve found South Orange County to be perfect for me. The bubble of Newport, HB, and Laguna (and some of Irvine too) is as close as you can get to living in Hawaii without living in Hawaii. It’s more beachy than LA...I can wear my flip flops almost anywhere.

The other place in California that intrigues me is Big Sur. Not a city in any way but I like the vibe and would kind of like to retire there with an old pickup truck, the beauty of the terrain, and my wife...but she wants to retire in Europe. What to do. First world problems.


The OC is like Hawaii in just about zero ways other than mild weather. It’s maybe the affluent vapid white idea of Hawaii.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:46 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
Surfitall wrote:
I will admit though that I’ve found South Orange County to be perfect for me. The bubble of Newport, HB, and Laguna (and some of Irvine too) is as close as you can get to living in Hawaii without living in Hawaii. It’s more beachy than LA...I can wear my flip flops almost anywhere.


The OC is like Hawaii in just about zero ways other than mild weather. It’s maybe the affluent vapid white idea of Hawaii.


I admit that I haven't been to that specific part of OC in about 30 years. However, when I went there 30 years ago, I distinctly remember thinking that it reminded me of Hawaii. All these years later, I couldn't tell you exactly why. It wasn't really a flattering thought, either. I didn't think much of Hawaii.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:19 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:

The OC is like Hawaii in just about zero ways other than mild weather. It’s maybe the affluent vapid white idea of Hawaii.

Asian immigrants love OC so I find your usage of "white" peculiar. Of course there are plenty of Mexican people in areas of OC as well. Clearly the appeal isn't limited to white people.
Maybe if you are talking the beaches alone, sure.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:23 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
Omar Little wrote:

The OC is like Hawaii in just about zero ways other than mild weather. It’s maybe the affluent vapid white idea of Hawaii.

Asian immigrants love OC so I find your usage of "white" peculiar. Of course there are plenty of Mexican people in areas of OC as well. Clearly the appeal isn't limited to white people.
Maybe if you are talking the beaches alone, sure.


I was talking the parts of the OC being referenced, which are the whitest enclaves. And the fact that the OC does not resemble Hawaii in any meaningful way outside of mild weather.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:49 pm    Post subject:

Sam Diego and Los Angeles tied. They have the best beaches in the state. I’ll take them over the rocky, cold, shark infested waters of Northern California anytime.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 8:57 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
tox wrote:
Omar Little wrote:

The OC is like Hawaii in just about zero ways other than mild weather. It’s maybe the affluent vapid white idea of Hawaii.

Asian immigrants love OC so I find your usage of "white" peculiar. Of course there are plenty of Mexican people in areas of OC as well. Clearly the appeal isn't limited to white people.
Maybe if you are talking the beaches alone, sure.


I was talking the parts of the OC being referenced, which are the whitest enclaves. And the fact that the OC does not resemble Hawaii in any meaningful way outside of mild weather.

It's not exactly clear when you just call it The OC but fair enough.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:34 pm    Post subject:

LA has easily the most to offer in the state, it would be perfect if it wasn't so overcrowded and traffic near unbearable. There's nothing lame about OC/SD also, they have great beaches, just a little slower pace than LA
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:09 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:

Plus from what I understand those tech geeks are starting to lobby the govt to get rid of regulations and taxes for corporations.

I don't really get why people put the leaders of these tech companies on a pedestal and act like they're heroes. Many of them are just as self-entitled and out of touch as the billionaire executives in other industries.

I've read articles about the major disconnect between working class people in and around Palo Alto and high-paid employees of companies like Google who have buses or shuttles with the Google logo take them to and from work every day. As bad as gentrification has been here in L.A. and in NYC, one could make an argument that it's the worst up in the bay. These gentrified neighborhoods which have pretty much been taken over by these tech companies are no different from other gentrified neighborhood taken over by real estate developers, the health care industry, etc.

Actually, the Google buses are conspicuously non-branded because they are a magnet of fury coming from people who blame Google as a symbol of gentrification. I sympathize with them but the reality is the issue is the lack of housing, not the tech workers per se.

No, it's also the tech workers. I've read these articles about the culture and behavior of some of these tech bros and their companies, and how these essentially taken over what used to be working/middle class neighborhoods and turned them into these snooty, boutique communities where a tiny cup of coffee costs $10, they've built bars that refuse to carry any name brand beers, etc.

As recently as a few years ago, the tech industry still had a great reputation. Nowadays, they're starting to become just as hated as Wall Street or the oil industry.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/nov/08/ashamed-to-work-in-silicon-valley-how-techies-became-the-new-bankers

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-people-hate-tech-people-in-the-Bay-Area
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:32 pm    Post subject:

slavavov wrote:
tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:

Plus from what I understand those tech geeks are starting to lobby the govt to get rid of regulations and taxes for corporations.

I don't really get why people put the leaders of these tech companies on a pedestal and act like they're heroes. Many of them are just as self-entitled and out of touch as the billionaire executives in other industries.

I've read articles about the major disconnect between working class people in and around Palo Alto and high-paid employees of companies like Google who have buses or shuttles with the Google logo take them to and from work every day. As bad as gentrification has been here in L.A. and in NYC, one could make an argument that it's the worst up in the bay. These gentrified neighborhoods which have pretty much been taken over by these tech companies are no different from other gentrified neighborhood taken over by real estate developers, the health care industry, etc.

Actually, the Google buses are conspicuously non-branded because they are a magnet of fury coming from people who blame Google as a symbol of gentrification. I sympathize with them but the reality is the issue is the lack of housing, not the tech workers per se.

No, it's also the tech workers. I've read these articles about the culture and behavior of some of these tech bros and their companies, and how these essentially taken over what used to be working/middle class neighborhoods and turned them into these snooty, boutique communities where a tiny cup of coffee costs $10, they've built bars that refuse to carry any name brand beers, etc.

As recently as a few years ago, the tech industry still had a great reputation. Nowadays, they're starting to become just as hated as Wall Street or the oil industry.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/nov/08/ashamed-to-work-in-silicon-valley-how-techies-became-the-new-bankers

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-people-hate-tech-people-in-the-Bay-Area

You are bemoaning $10 coffees in a country littered with Starbucks, or the fact that you can't get a Bud Lite at a bar? It seems these grievances are less of serious issues that the Bay Area is facing and more a culture war, where you dislike the hipster/yuppy brand of consumerism in the Bay. Hey I get it, I'm not much of a hipster myself, but let's not act like the issue at hand is the brand of consumerism.

I don't deny that tech workers are the proximate cause of a lot of issues for working class folk in the Bay Area. But that has to do with the nature of the capitalistic system we work in. Of course people making more money will displace those making less money, if we are not constructing more housing. And consequently, shops will cater towards the people who live there.

Which is why the solution needs to begin with having housing to accommodate the working class there. That will naturally lead to shops and such catered towards them.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:33 pm    Post subject:

That’s a pretty Pollyannaish view
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:52 pm    Post subject:

Omar Little wrote:
That’s a pretty Pollyannaish view

Maybe, I don't have a crystal ball so I couldn't say everything is solved just with housing. But certainly to some extent that would come to fruition. Anyway, you'd be hard-pressed to argue that anything besides housing is the principal issue in Bay Area gentrification right now. Certainly hipster beers and coffees don't rank very high on the list. And certainly scapegoating Big Tech seems like it is detracting from the real issue.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 11:53 pm    Post subject:

tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:
tox wrote:
slavavov wrote:

Plus from what I understand those tech geeks are starting to lobby the govt to get rid of regulations and taxes for corporations.

I don't really get why people put the leaders of these tech companies on a pedestal and act like they're heroes. Many of them are just as self-entitled and out of touch as the billionaire executives in other industries.

I've read articles about the major disconnect between working class people in and around Palo Alto and high-paid employees of companies like Google who have buses or shuttles with the Google logo take them to and from work every day. As bad as gentrification has been here in L.A. and in NYC, one could make an argument that it's the worst up in the bay. These gentrified neighborhoods which have pretty much been taken over by these tech companies are no different from other gentrified neighborhood taken over by real estate developers, the health care industry, etc.

Actually, the Google buses are conspicuously non-branded because they are a magnet of fury coming from people who blame Google as a symbol of gentrification. I sympathize with them but the reality is the issue is the lack of housing, not the tech workers per se.

No, it's also the tech workers. I've read these articles about the culture and behavior of some of these tech bros and their companies, and how these essentially taken over what used to be working/middle class neighborhoods and turned them into these snooty, boutique communities where a tiny cup of coffee costs $10, they've built bars that refuse to carry any name brand beers, etc.

As recently as a few years ago, the tech industry still had a great reputation. Nowadays, they're starting to become just as hated as Wall Street or the oil industry.

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/nov/08/ashamed-to-work-in-silicon-valley-how-techies-became-the-new-bankers

https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-people-hate-tech-people-in-the-Bay-Area

You are bemoaning $10 coffees in a country littered with Starbucks, or the fact that you can't get a Bud Lite at a bar? It seems these grievances are less of serious issues that the Bay Area is facing and more a culture war, where you dislike the hipster/yuppy brand of consumerism in the Bay. Hey I get it, I'm not much of a hipster myself, but let's not act like the issue at hand is the brand of consumerism.

I don't deny that tech workers are the proximate cause of a lot of issues for working class folk in the Bay Area. But that has to do with the nature of the capitalistic system we work in. Of course people making more money will displace those making less money, if we are not constructing more housing. And consequently, shops will cater towards the people who live there.

Which is why the solution needs to begin with having housing to accommodate the working class there. That will naturally lead to shops and such catered towards them.

My issue is not so much with consumerism, but with how the tech industry has gobbled up what used to be (somewhat) affordable housing and priced out of the reach of anyone not in that industry. Obviously they deserve the big money they're making, and there's nothing wrong with having these yuppie neighborhoods per se. These neighborhoods are a problem because they've forced out the working class people who used to live there, but they're also a symptom of the real problem, which, like you said, is the flaws of our capitalistic system and the lack of controls to make sure it doesn't devour anyone who isn't rich or well off.

I grew up in Santa Monica in a borderline upper-middle class neighborhood, so while I don't like blind and conspicuous consumerism that people engage in only as a sort of symbol of their socioeconomic class, I grew up around it so I know it's not evil and that there's a place for it. When I drink beer, I admit I do prefer Bud Lite because I'm just trying to get drunk with my friends while saving money, but if that hipster in SF wants a $10 handcrafted beer, I have no problem with that.

My beef with that industry also has to do with the attitude some of them had that was described in those articles. Some of these people tend to be socially awkward and lacking empathy, and when they become rich these qualities become obvious to the public. Money doesn't corrupt people, it makes you more of who you are.

I think some neighborhoods need to be kept off limits to these nouveau riche people so that the working class and poor can also have their own neighborhoods where they can raise their kids and live in peace without worrying about whether their new landlord will kick them out because their rent just increased 50%.

And in the interest of fairness, I do want to emphasize that there are some great things the tech industry is doing, such as philanthropy and giving their employees major perks, plus of course the technology itself.

I just think that sometimes when you solve problems, new problems may be created at the same time.
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