Twitter is an "echo chamber" that doesn’t reflect how most Americans think
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 6, 7, 8 ... 12, 13, 14  Next
 
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> Off Topic Reply to topic
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
kikanga
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29150
Location: La La Land

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:26 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
And anybody pro-life hates women. These issues are extremely complex but reasonable debate is shut down and replaced with calling the conservative a bigot.


"Reasonable debate"
Quote:
Donald Trump: “The baby is born. The mother meets with the doctor. They take care of the baby. They wrap the baby beautifully. And then the doctor and the mother determine whether or not they will execute the baby.”

_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:41 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


I oppose illegal immigration, and I'm as liberal as it gets. No one in their right mind wants our borders to be open. But as you observe the debate, you notice tendencies by people on the right vs people on the left. Liberals don't oppose it from the point of view that Mexicans are rapists and murderers, that illegal immigrants are infecting and invading this country, that demographic changes are somehow bad for this country, that certain people come from sh*thole countries, etc. Those are all accepted and widespread viewpoints on the right. Do they describe all people on the right that oppose illegal immigration? No, but when you vote for a candidate and continue to support a president that spreads those views and also argues that chain migration and other forms of legal migration should also be limited and that an entire religion should be banned from entering this country, then one is inclined to conclude that there's a racial factor.


A large portion of the left is out if their right mind then. There are a huge chunk of people who believe in open borders and vote Democrat because of it while believing they know what they are talking about.

A horrible thing that the left has done is see those tendencies in some and apply them to people who don’t oppose their issues for that reason. That proves my earlier point. There are right leaning people who don’t support and didn’t vote for the president who get called racist because they oppose illegal immigration for economic and other legitimate reasons. That happened to me on this very site. Maybe don’t pull the racist card at first opportunity all the time and try to have a constructive debate/conversation. Not saying you just left leaning people in general.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:46 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
And anybody pro-life hates women. These issues are extremely complex but reasonable debate is shut down and replaced with calling the conservative a bigot.


"Reasonable debate"
Quote:
Donald Trump: “The baby is born. The mother meets with the doctor. They take care of the baby. They wrap the baby beautifully. And then the doctor and the mother determine whether or not they will execute the baby.”


This is my entire point. I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him and I sure as hell cant control what he says. But you attempt to paint me in a light where I’m doing those things and am incapable of having a reasonable debate regarding the topic because something the president said. Soon you won’t be able to site that jackass in order to shut down reasonable debate. I feel like I’m repeating myself.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
vanexelent
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:52 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


I oppose illegal immigration, and I'm as liberal as it gets. No one in their right mind wants our borders to be open. But as you observe the debate, you notice tendencies by people on the right vs people on the left. Liberals don't oppose it from the point of view that Mexicans are rapists and murderers, that illegal immigrants are infecting and invading this country, that demographic changes are somehow bad for this country, that certain people come from sh*thole countries, etc. Those are all accepted and widespread viewpoints on the right. Do they describe all people on the right that oppose illegal immigration? No, but when you vote for a candidate and continue to support a president that spreads those views and also argues that chain migration and other forms of legal migration should also be limited and that an entire religion should be banned from entering this country, then one is inclined to conclude that there's a racial factor.


A large portion of the left is out if their right mind then. There are a huge chunk of people who believe in open borders and vote Democrat because of it while believing they know what they are talking about.

A horrible thing that the left has done is see those tendencies in some and apply them to people who don’t oppose their issues for that reason. That proves my earlier point. There are right leaning people who don’t support and didn’t vote for the president who get called racist because they oppose illegal immigration for economic and other legitimate reasons. That happened to me on this very site. Maybe don’t pull the racist card at first opportunity all the time and try to have a constructive debate/conversation. Not saying you just left leaning people in general.



You have to acknowledge that Republicans have been acting in bad faith for years on immigration though. Under Obama, more illegals were deported than under any other president in history. Yet, throughout his entire 8 year term, Republicans made you think the exact opposite.

And that includes the "economic" reasons for opposing undocumented migration. Statistics show that undocumented immigrants are a boost to our economy, not a drag. There are entire industries that rely on their existence. The Republican President hires them in all of his hotels and golf courses. Again, bad faith.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
kikanga
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29150
Location: La La Land

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:57 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
kikanga wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
And anybody pro-life hates women. These issues are extremely complex but reasonable debate is shut down and replaced with calling the conservative a bigot.


"Reasonable debate"
Quote:
Donald Trump: “The baby is born. The mother meets with the doctor. They take care of the baby. They wrap the baby beautifully. And then the doctor and the mother determine whether or not they will execute the baby.”


This is my entire point. I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him and I sure as hell cant control what he says. But you attempt to paint me in a light where I’m doing those things and am incapable of having a reasonable debate regarding the topic because something the president said. Soon you won’t be able to site that jackass in order to shut down reasonable debate. I feel like I’m repeating myself.


I'm as sorry as you are that Trump is the face of 2019 conservatism in the United States. Bad news is. I don't think it ends with Trump. GOP found a winning formula with his ideology.
But hearing conservatives say Trump is not ok. This is not ok. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/495045090029338643/569981666924429312/unknown.png
Goes a long way towards giving me hope.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”


Last edited by kikanga on Wed May 08, 2019 6:01 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Wilt
LG Contributor
LG Contributor


Joined: 29 Dec 2002
Posts: 13711

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 5:57 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


I oppose illegal immigration, and I'm as liberal as it gets. No one in their right mind wants our borders to be open. But as you observe the debate, you notice tendencies by people on the right vs people on the left. Liberals don't oppose it from the point of view that Mexicans are rapists and murderers, that illegal immigrants are infecting and invading this country, that demographic changes are somehow bad for this country, that certain people come from sh*thole countries, etc. Those are all accepted and widespread viewpoints on the right. Do they describe all people on the right that oppose illegal immigration? No, but when you vote for a candidate and continue to support a president that spreads those views and also argues that chain migration and other forms of legal migration should also be limited and that an entire religion should be banned from entering this country, then one is inclined to conclude that there's a racial factor.


A large portion of the left is out if their right mind then. There are a huge chunk of people who believe in open borders and vote Democrat because of it while believing they know what they are talking about.

A horrible thing that the left has done is see those tendencies in some and apply them to people who don’t oppose their issues for that reason. That proves my earlier point. There are right leaning people who don’t support and didn’t vote for the president who get called racist because they oppose illegal immigration for economic and other legitimate reasons. That happened to me on this very site. Maybe don’t pull the racist card at first opportunity all the time and try to have a constructive debate/conversation. Not saying you just left leaning people in general.


There aren't a huge chunk of people on the left that believe in open borders. So if you want to have a reasonable conversation, maybe you should stop spreading that nonsense. Believing that undocumented immigrants shouldn't be dehumanized isn't a support for open borders. Those people are dehumanized every single day on the right. And most right leaning people voted for him as evidenced by the fact that he got 60 million votes and was elected president, most of them support him now, even after his ugly rhetoric and bigoted policies. Yes, I do acknowledge that not all right people believe in that crap, but if you vote for him and if you continue to support him, then you either support those policies or you are okay with them.
_________________
¡Hala Madrid!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52624
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 6:05 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
adkindo wrote:

Like I originally said....claiming hate primarily only exists on the other side only works when you or someone of a similar agenda is keeping score. There are mountains of deranged hate on the left right now....and it is far worse than I have seen in my lifetime.


You're confusing hate with contempt. The two concepts are completely different.

Look at this way. The Right hates based on preconceptions derived solely on trace, sexual orientation and religion. The Left doesn't doesn't start with such preconceptions. They simply become contemptuous of specific people on the Right who perpetuate long held "conservative" positions that attack race, orientation, women's rights and a whole.

If you want to be taken seriously, you need to acknowledge that undeniable difference in philosophies between the two ends of the spectrum.


That’s a bit of a semantical argument don’t you think?


Not at all. As I said, Hate comes from a starting point of dislike and distrust on a broad basis based on nothing but blanket characterizations. Contempt is an earned position based on assessing the words and actions of others.

Quote:
There’s a large portion of the left that accuses conservative views as racist, homophobic, masogynist etc even if their reasonings have nothing to do with that stuff.


Because conservatives perpetuate those things while feigning innocence and doing nothing to end them.

Quote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration


Come on man, the only name calling in regards to illegal immigration stems from conservatives and Donald Trump's whole "Bad hombres . . ." characterization of them as drug dealers, rapists and murderers. Guess what happened . . . conservatives sat back and ignored it.

Quote:
when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


Thank you for exemplifying another reason why conservatives are held in contemp. Blatant intellectual dishonesty such as this. No one on the Left supports illegal immigration. They simply support asylum seeking individuals. It's the conservatives who meld the two things into one because they don't want brown people coming to the country, even if it is legal. Not to mention. that they sit back and say nothing when children are put in cages even when their parents come seeking asylum.

Quote:
And anybody pro-life hates women.


Another piece of conservative BS. First of all, the whole "Pro-life" (bleep) is based on the completely false premise that those who support choice are anti-life. Secondly, when you put your own personal religious beliefs ahead of a whole entire gender's right to determine what should happen to their body regardless of the situation behind what is happening to their body, you are by definition anti-woman.

Quote:
These issues are extremely complex but reasonable debate is shut down and replaced with calling the conservative a bigot.


Reasonable debate is shut down by the Right. Just like everything else they don't agree with, such as asylum seeking from people who aren't white, women having the audacity to have a say in what happens to their own bodies, gay people being denied the right to marry. The Left wants conversation and debate. It's conservatives who run from that . . . and the they ironically and ridiculously come up with name calling tactics like "libtard" and "snowflake".

Look, I have no problem with conservatives. But if you are one, either call out the horrible actions taken in the name of conservatism, or own them and understand that the contempt you get is earned.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames


Jason Isbell

Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52624
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 6:10 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him


Yet you perpetuate his (bleep).
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames


Jason Isbell

Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Aeneas Hunter
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 7:26 pm    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
I'm as sorry as you are that Trump is the face of 2019 conservatism in the United States. Bad news is. I don't think it ends with Trump. GOP found a winning formula with his ideology.
But hearing conservatives say Trump is not ok. This is not ok. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/495045090029338643/569981666924429312/unknown.png
Goes a long way towards giving me hope.


It will be interesting to see what happens. So far, the GOP candidates who have tried to channel Trump have had mixed success in GOP primaries. I live in a solidly GOP congressional district that picks up parts of suburban Houston and extends into east Texas. It was an open seat last year. The GOP had one candidate who all but wrapped herself in Trump posters. She finished third behind two traditional conservatives.

I give Trump.a 50/50 chance of getting re-elected next year, but it is not clear whether the formula will work for anyone other than Trump.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 9:17 pm    Post subject:

Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


I oppose illegal immigration, and I'm as liberal as it gets. No one in their right mind wants our borders to be open. But as you observe the debate, you notice tendencies by people on the right vs people on the left. Liberals don't oppose it from the point of view that Mexicans are rapists and murderers, that illegal immigrants are infecting and invading this country, that demographic changes are somehow bad for this country, that certain people come from sh*thole countries, etc. Those are all accepted and widespread viewpoints on the right. Do they describe all people on the right that oppose illegal immigration? No, but when you vote for a candidate and continue to support a president that spreads those views and also argues that chain migration and other forms of legal migration should also be limited and that an entire religion should be banned from entering this country, then one is inclined to conclude that there's a racial factor.


A large portion of the left is out if their right mind then. There are a huge chunk of people who believe in open borders and vote Democrat because of it while believing they know what they are talking about.

A horrible thing that the left has done is see those tendencies in some and apply them to people who don’t oppose their issues for that reason. That proves my earlier point. There are right leaning people who don’t support and didn’t vote for the president who get called racist because they oppose illegal immigration for economic and other legitimate reasons. That happened to me on this very site. Maybe don’t pull the racist card at first opportunity all the time and try to have a constructive debate/conversation. Not saying you just left leaning people in general.


There aren't a huge chunk of people on the left that believe in open borders. So if you want to have a reasonable conversation, maybe you should stop spreading that nonsense. Believing that undocumented immigrants shouldn't be dehumanized isn't a support for open borders. Those people are dehumanized every single day on the right. And most right leaning people voted for him as evidenced by the fact that he got 60 million votes and was elected president, most of them support him now, even after his ugly rhetoric and bigoted policies. Yes, I do acknowledge that not all right people believe in that crap, but if you vote for him and if you continue to support him, then you either support those policies or you are okay with them.


It’s not nonsense. You should start having more discussions with the younger generation of your party.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
BigGameHames
Star Player
Star Player


Joined: 24 May 2015
Posts: 7982

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 9:21 pm    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him


Yet you perpetuate his (bleep).


That’s a complete lie.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
VicXLakers
Franchise Player
Franchise Player


Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823

PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2019 11:39 pm    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him


Yet you perpetuate his (bleep).


That’s a complete lie.


Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52624
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 5:41 am    Post subject:

BigGameHames wrote:
DaMuleRules wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I didn’t vote for Trump, I don’t support him


Yet you perpetuate his (bleep).


That’s a complete lie.


The words are right here on the page.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames


Jason Isbell

Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ringfinger
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 6:55 am    Post subject:

Another example of how hate speech cannot come from the left even though if the shoe were on the other foot, it would be considered hate speech.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.

The two who picked Harris stated as their first reason that skin color was the reason with one saying Harris because she’s “not just another white woman.”

Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. But the other statements are perfectly fine. Hence, echo chambers are born.

We really need to decide if factoring in the color of ones skin is ok or not. It’s problematic, for me as a minority, because if we allow this, how can we say it’s wrong for someone else to say “he/she just got the job because they are _______” if them being _______ was a primary factor to begin with??
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
vanexelent
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 17 May 2005
Posts: 30081

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 7:27 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Another example of how hate speech cannot come from the left even though if the shoe were on the other foot, it would be considered hate speech.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.

The two who picked Harris stated as their first reason that skin color was the reason with one saying Harris because she’s “not just another white woman.”

Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. But the other statements are perfectly fine. Hence, echo chambers are born.

We really need to decide if factoring in the color of ones skin is ok or not. It’s problematic, for me as a minority, because if we allow this, how can we say it’s wrong for someone else to say “he/she just got the job because they are _______” if them being _______ was a primary factor to begin with??



What if the woman were to have phrased it like this, "Being a woman of color, I think it's important that I vote for someone who has had similar experiences to me because of the color of our skin..."?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Aeneas Hunter
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 7:36 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.?


Isn't it a sad statement about our politics that the media is doing focus groups in Pennsylvania a full year in advance? I saw a headline the other day that said something like "Ohio voter says he would still vote for Trump." I kid you not.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ringfinger
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 7:50 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Another example of how hate speech cannot come from the left even though if the shoe were on the other foot, it would be considered hate speech.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.

The two who picked Harris stated as their first reason that skin color was the reason with one saying Harris because she’s “not just another white woman.”

Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. But the other statements are perfectly fine. Hence, echo chambers are born.

We really need to decide if factoring in the color of ones skin is ok or not. It’s problematic, for me as a minority, because if we allow this, how can we say it’s wrong for someone else to say “he/she just got the job because they are _______” if them being _______ was a primary factor to begin with??



What if the woman were to have phrased it like this, "Being a woman of color, I think it's important that I vote for someone who has had similar experiences to me because of the color of our skin..."?


Ok, here's my real take on this. I think the reality is, no matter who you are, seeing someone that looks like you, at certain positions, can be inspiring. Whether you're white or a person of color, woman, man, LGBTQ, doesn't matter, I think that is reality and it doesn't necessarily mean that you have a disdain for people who don't look like you, it just means you have an incremental and particular affinity for those that do.

But I also think then, we need to make a decision. We need to either make it acceptable for everyone to say this, or, we collectively accept that that is reality but agree it's just not something we speak openly about. Kind of like how ... maybe you prefer to date or marry a certain type of person.

I think that is generally ok, but if you say you prefer to date/marry a certain kind of person because they are not this other kind of person, that's when it's like ok, you just shouldn't say that. Somehow, we have made that acceptable in certain situations and not others, and I have been saying for a long time that that is not only rude but divisive.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
DaMuleRules
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 10 Dec 2006
Posts: 52624
Location: Making a safety stop at 15 feet.

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 7:59 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Another example of how hate speech cannot come from the left even though if the shoe were on the other foot, it would be considered hate speech.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.

The two who picked Harris stated as their first reason that skin color was the reason with one saying Harris because she’s “not just another white woman.”

Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. But the other statements are perfectly fine. Hence, echo chambers are born.

We really need to decide if factoring in the color of ones skin is ok or not. It’s problematic, for me as a minority, because if we allow this, how can we say it’s wrong for someone else to say “he/she just got the job because they are _______” if them being _______ was a primary factor to begin with??



What if the woman were to have phrased it like this, "Being a woman of color, I think it's important that I vote for someone who has had similar experiences to me because of the color of our skin..."?


Exactly what her point was. Attempting to paint that comment as hate speech is laughable. She didn't say she hates white people. She didn't say white people are bad. She was making a statement about wanting to vote for a representative who understands what her life has been like and the issues that are important to her. Nothing hate related at all.
_________________
You thought God was an architect, now you know
He’s something like a pipe bomb ready to blow
And everything you built that’s all for show
goes up in flames
In 24 frames


Jason Isbell

Man, do those lyrics resonate right now
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ringfinger
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 8:13 am    Post subject:

DaMuleRules wrote:
vanexelent wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Another example of how hate speech cannot come from the left even though if the shoe were on the other foot, it would be considered hate speech.

https://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2019/05/09/pennsylvania-voter-panel-2020-race-newday-vpx.cnn

CNN interviewed 6 people on who they would vote for right now. If you want to save your time, two picked Biden, two picked Warren, and two picked Harris.

The two who picked Harris stated as their first reason that skin color was the reason with one saying Harris because she’s “not just another white woman.”

Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. But the other statements are perfectly fine. Hence, echo chambers are born.

We really need to decide if factoring in the color of ones skin is ok or not. It’s problematic, for me as a minority, because if we allow this, how can we say it’s wrong for someone else to say “he/she just got the job because they are _______” if them being _______ was a primary factor to begin with??



What if the woman were to have phrased it like this, "Being a woman of color, I think it's important that I vote for someone who has had similar experiences to me because of the color of our skin..."?


Exactly what her point was. Attempting to paint that comment as hate speech is laughable. She didn't say she hates white people. She didn't say white people are bad. She was making a statement about wanting to vote for a representative who understands what her life has been like and the issues that are important to her. Nothing hate related at all.


You may not consider that hate speech, but if it was a white person who said that as a white person they want to vote for a candidate that is also white, you would consider that ... acceptable? I've seen more innocuous statements than that declared as white supremacy.

There was also a guy who says he wants Harris for the specific reason that she isn't white.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
kikanga
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29150
Location: La La Land

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 8:45 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. .


No they wouldn't. Trump's tweeted much worse than that. Still didn't get banned.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
ringfinger
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 08 Oct 2013
Posts: 29418

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 9:00 am    Post subject:

kikanga wrote:
ringfinger wrote:
Twitter would likely ban the white woman who picked Biden if she said it was because of his skin color. .


No they wouldn't. Trump's tweeted much worse than that. Still didn't get banned.


I don’t agree but ok. Do you find the statement perfectly acceptable?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
kikanga
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29150
Location: La La Land

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 9:20 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:

I don’t agree but ok. Do you find the statement perfectly acceptable?


You don't agree?! WTF?!
Quote:
Last fall, he retweeted a graphic with fictitious crime statistics claiming that 81 percent of white homicide victims in 2015 were killed by blacks. (No such statistic was available for 2015 at the time; the actual figure for 2014 was 15 percent, according to the F.B.I.)

In January and February he retweeted messages from a user with the handle @WhiteGenocideTM, whose profile picture is of George Lincoln Rockwell, the founder of the American Nazi Party.


https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/jul/02/donald-trump-star-of-david-tweet-hillary-clinton#img-1

Quote:
Donald J. Trump
‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump

I hope the Mexican judge is more honest than the Mexican businessmen who used the court system to avoid paying me the money they owe me.


I find it as acceptable as the "is America ready for a black President" polls conducted before 2008. And it was alot more than 2 people polled who said no.
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Aeneas Hunter
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 31763

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 9:37 am    Post subject:

ringfinger wrote:
if it was a white person who said that as a white person they want to vote for a candidate that is also white, you would consider that ... acceptable?


That's the nub of the problem. Whether you agree with it or not, white men and white people in general perceive the PC culture as telling them how to think. If I said, "I'm not going to vote for Candidate X because I don't want to see a black woman in the White House," that comment will be treated very differently from a minority voter saying "I'm not going to vote for Candidate Y because I don't want to see another white man in the White House." There are people who will defend the distinction, but one of the core components of Trumpism consists of people who are giving this stuff the middle finger.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
adkindo
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 16 Jun 2005
Posts: 40345
Location: Dirty South

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 10:00 am    Post subject:

vanexelent wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
Wilt wrote:
BigGameHames wrote:
I mean, the entire border security debate has turned into calling anybody racist who opposes illegal immigration when a lot of people who believe it aren’t even approaching it as a racial issue.


I oppose illegal immigration, and I'm as liberal as it gets. No one in their right mind wants our borders to be open. But as you observe the debate, you notice tendencies by people on the right vs people on the left. Liberals don't oppose it from the point of view that Mexicans are rapists and murderers, that illegal immigrants are infecting and invading this country, that demographic changes are somehow bad for this country, that certain people come from sh*thole countries, etc. Those are all accepted and widespread viewpoints on the right. Do they describe all people on the right that oppose illegal immigration? No, but when you vote for a candidate and continue to support a president that spreads those views and also argues that chain migration and other forms of legal migration should also be limited and that an entire religion should be banned from entering this country, then one is inclined to conclude that there's a racial factor.


A large portion of the left is out if their right mind then. There are a huge chunk of people who believe in open borders and vote Democrat because of it while believing they know what they are talking about.

A horrible thing that the left has done is see those tendencies in some and apply them to people who don’t oppose their issues for that reason. That proves my earlier point. There are right leaning people who don’t support and didn’t vote for the president who get called racist because they oppose illegal immigration for economic and other legitimate reasons. That happened to me on this very site. Maybe don’t pull the racist card at first opportunity all the time and try to have a constructive debate/conversation. Not saying you just left leaning people in general.



You have to acknowledge that Republicans have been acting in bad faith for years on immigration though. Under Obama, more illegals were deported than under any other president in history. Yet, throughout his entire 8 year term, Republicans made you think the exact opposite.

And that includes the "economic" reasons for opposing undocumented migration. Statistics show that undocumented immigrants are a boost to our economy, not a drag. There are entire industries that rely on their existence. The Republican President hires them in all of his hotels and golf courses. Again, bad faith.


and you should admit that the left has acted in bad faith on immigration for decades, and continue to use it as a political issue just as much as anyone of the right. It was GW Bush that fought hard for real immigration reform, and it was the Democrats that refused to negotiate because they felt if passed under a Republican administration, it could have long term effects in elections. It was the Democrats and big labor that long opposed immigration...for decades. Only recently the strategy has changed when the Democrats decided the demographics have changed enough where they could use it as a potential winning political issue.

I will be clear....if you actually think that Mitch McConnell or Chuck Schumer (as representatives of the two parties) give two craps about poor immigrants trying to enter the US.....then you are very foolish.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
kikanga
Retired Number
Retired Number


Joined: 15 Sep 2012
Posts: 29150
Location: La La Land

PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2019 10:03 am    Post subject:

adkindo wrote:


and you should admit that the left has acted in bad faith on immigration for decades, and continue to use it as a political issue just as much as anyone of the right. It was GW Bush that fought hard for real immigration reform, and it was the Democrats that refused to negotiate because they felt if passed under a Republican administration, it could have long term effects in elections. It was the Democrats and big labor that long opposed immigration...for decades. Only recently the strategy has changed when the Democrats decided the demographics have changed enough where they could use it as a potential winning political issue.

I will be clear....if you actually think that Mitch McConnell or Chuck Schumer (as representatives of the two parties) give two craps about poor immigrants trying to enter the US.....then you are very foolish.


Where did you read the bolded? Cause this is what I just found.

Quote:
The bill was the fruit of months of negotiations by a group of Republican and Democratic senators and the White House.

But the president was unable to overcome fierce opposition from fellow Republicans who said it was an amnesty that rewarded illegal immigrants. A majority of Republicans in the House of Representatives also opposed the Senate bill.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-immigration/senate-kills-bush-immigration-reform-bill-idUSN2742643820070629
_________________
"Every hurt is a lesson, and every lesson makes you better”
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Reply with quote
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic    LakersGround.net Forum Index -> Off Topic All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... 6, 7, 8 ... 12, 13, 14  Next
Page 7 of 14
Jump to:  

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum






Graphics by uberzev
© 1995-2018 LakersGround.net. All Rights Reserved. Privacy Policy. Terms of Use.
LakersGround is an unofficial news source serving the fan community since 1995.
We are in no way associated with the Los Angeles Lakers or the National Basketball Association.


Powered by phpBB