Frank Vogel Official Lakers Head Coach for 3-Years
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Are you happy about Vogel becoming our coach?
No
12%
 12%  [ 47 ]
Yes
46%
 46%  [ 172 ]
Neutral
40%
 40%  [ 150 ]
Total Votes : 369

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ocho
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:56 pm    Post subject:

Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:55 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.



Ocho, exactly! What was their big obsession with Kidd (and Hollins) anyway? Are they so great that it was worth losing Lue? The answer is No. I think Lue and assistant Vogel with Handy and whoever else would have been nice!
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ocho
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:06 pm    Post subject:

HermosaJoe wrote:
ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.



Ocho, exactly! What was their big obsession with Kidd (and Hollins) anyway? Are they so great that it was worth losing Lue? The answer is No. I think Lue and assistant Vogel with Handy and whoever else would have been nice!


Yeah it would have been. They preferred Kidd and the savings, unfortunately.
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:52 pm    Post subject:

The FO has given good contracts to Vogel + Kidd + Hollins + 3 others on top of that... a sizeable bit of coin in total for the whole staff... yet there will be peeps who try to make it seem like the FO is cheap and "preferred the savings". Two lessons to be learned here... 1) It's easy for some to throw away someone else's money... and 2) you can't please everyone!

Anyway, we appear to have a good coaching staff:
- Who wants to be here...
- Who didn't achieve success by riding on LeGramps' coat-tails...
- Who don't expect us to pick up the tab from being fired but still being owed money by their previous employers as long as they don't take up another head coaching role... (btw, isn't it convenient how this is glossed over when some talk about the FO being "cheap" with their offer to Lue?).
- And we finally have a shooting coach!!
Plenty of reasons to be optimistic.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:16 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.


I wasn't happy either, but it's over and time to support Vogel. I don't view him as desperate at all. He wasn't in demand, he hasn't won a title, here is his chance to get back in the game. Not desperate, he was smart for jumping on this opportunity. Not gonna lose any sleep over Lue or any coach. I've always said that coaches get too much credit and too much blame. For me, it's no big deal in losing out on a coach. I thought the Lakers should have applied this same high and mighty, take it or leave it approach with Kawhi Leonard. They should have given him a 24 hr deadline on day 1 of free agency. Now that would have been ballsy, and in hindsight, the right thing to do.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:49 am    Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.


I wasn't happy either, but it's over and time to support Vogel. I don't view him as desperate at all. He wasn't in demand, he hasn't won a title, here is his chance to get back in the game. Not desperate, he was smart for jumping on this opportunity. Not gonna lose any sleep over Lue or any coach. I've always said that coaches get too much credit and too much blame. For me, it's no big deal in losing out on a coach. I thought the Lakers should have applied this same high and mighty, take it or leave it approach with Kawhi Leonard. They should have given him a 24 hr deadline on day 1 of free agency. Now that would have been ballsy, and in hindsight, the right thing to do.

1) Coaching is drastic. The right coach can be the difference maker in a team that's on the brink of winning and actually winning. What happened to the Bulls once Phil Jackson took over for Doug Collins? What happened to the Warriors when Steve Kerr arrived? What happened to the Bucks just last year?

2) That would've been a monumentally stupid approach to Kawhi, even in hindsight.
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ocho
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:11 am    Post subject:

Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.


I wasn't happy either, but it's over and time to support Vogel. I don't view him as desperate at all. He wasn't in demand, he hasn't won a title, here is his chance to get back in the game. Not desperate, he was smart for jumping on this opportunity. Not gonna lose any sleep over Lue or any coach. I've always said that coaches get too much credit and too much blame. For me, it's no big deal in losing out on a coach. I thought the Lakers should have applied this same high and mighty, take it or leave it approach with Kawhi Leonard. They should have given him a 24 hr deadline on day 1 of free agency. Now that would have been ballsy, and in hindsight, the right thing to do.


It's on Vogel to prove he's worthy of the job once the season starts. It's not on me to pledge fealty because Rob Pelinka decided to hire him over a championship coach to save Jeanie's money. If he does well I'll tip my cap and enjoy the wins. I much rather be wrong and he suceeds than the other way around. As for the importance of coaching, I don't understand how you could think that when there are so many examples of coaching changes having immediate, dramatic impacts on various teams. Coaching this particular team won't be easy, which is why I don't anticipate Vogel finishing his contract.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:12 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:

1) Coaching is drastic. The right coach can be the difference maker in a team that's on the brink of winning and actually winning. What happened to the Bulls once Phil Jackson took over for Doug Collins? What happened to the Warriors when Steve Kerr arrived? What happened to the Bucks just last year?

I can agree with this... however (!), Ty Lue is not an example of this type of coach, so it's sorta Chicken Little-ish to still be focussing on him instead of focussing on the good coaching staff our FO has put together. The sky isn't going to fall down just because we didn't hire Lue.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:48 pm    Post subject:

LAL1947 wrote:
Judah wrote:

1) Coaching is drastic. The right coach can be the difference maker in a team that's on the brink of winning and actually winning. What happened to the Bulls once Phil Jackson took over for Doug Collins? What happened to the Warriors when Steve Kerr arrived? What happened to the Bucks just last year?

I can agree with this... however (!), Ty Lue is not an example of this type of coach, so it's sorta Chicken Little-ish to still be focussing on him instead of focussing on the good coaching staff our FO has put together. The sky isn't going to fall down just because we didn't hire Lue.


For real people, Lol
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:13 pm    Post subject:

You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:26 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.


Please stop Overrating Lue. He’s a very average coach who road LBJ/Kyrie/Love coattails.
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ocho
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:51 pm    Post subject:

Luminous8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Jesusdelonla wrote:
ocho wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
Runway8 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
I'm happy Lue climbed up the mountain, then went back down, and wants to climb all the way back up again.


Too prideful to take a 3 yr deal coaching Bron and "soon to come" AD. But not too prideful to be an assistant? Reality sunk in hard for him.

Pride? No, the problem was the Lakers lowballing him by offering a three year deal when the standard deal is five. Even the rookie cosch for the Cavs got five years. Lue has won a championship. Not to mention that they wanted to pick his staff for him... Vogel ended up being their guy because he succumbed to those things.

Even in hindsight I'd rather take this path if I was him. The Clippers will be really good and his name will be associated with their success, rebuilding his value and adding to his resume. This next year is just a pit stop.


I don't think it was the 3 year thing as much as it was the combination of all of Rob and Kurt's lofty demands. A short deal, plus he doesn't get to pick his staff, plus he has to have Jason freaking Kidd looming over him. Only the desperate would agree to those terms.



What would make you more happy? Laker success, or Vogel failure?


Why would Vogel's failure make me happy?


Cause u been crying about hiring him before it was even official


Nah just been critical of how Rob and Kurt went about their business (letting money decide who the coach is, the weird insistence on Kidd, etc). I certainly hope he does well. The alternative would mean a lack of success for the team and we’ve all had quite enough of that.


Please stop Overrating Lue. He’s a very average coach who road LBJ/Kyrie/Love coattails.


I don't think I'm overrating him. I wouldn't put him in the top tier for the league but he's a championship coach which is more than I can say for the 3 old schoolers sitting on our bench. We'll see how easy it is for them to ride LeBron's coattails this year since it's so easy.

The guy got buy in from LeBron AND Kyrie Irving (two guys famous for really being a breeze to coach) and beat a 73 win Warriors team on the road in a Game 7 and you guys talk about him like he's trash.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:57 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.


It shouldn't be a surprise that Lue became garbage around the same time Frank Vogel, misunderstood genius, became the darling of LG. Lue has to be denigrated in order to justify how the coaching search was handled.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:07 pm    Post subject:

Judah wrote:
You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.

That's rude. I think the manner of the discussion to which you added your "general response" allows my reply from a logical point of view.

1) You made a general point about coaching being important, then proceeded to give examples of Phil Jackson and Steve Kerr... which I agree with.

2) But this discussion is related to Ty Lue... and the poster you were responding to was making a different point to other people who appear to think it was a "mistake" to pass on Lue and hire Vogel... i.e., his main point is, "Lue isn't someone to lose sleep over and it's time to support Vogel".

If you had also said that you agreed with the poster's main point instead of just adding that bit about coaching as if it could potentially apply to Ty Lue too... that's when you would have had the right to talk about interpretation... right now, you don't.

I will admit to being a tad absurd with the Chicken Little thing. I probably shouldn't have quoted you when using it... that was more directed at the absurdity of others who are still harping on not getting Lue rather than at your general point about coaching... but you would have understood that if you were better at "interpretation" too?


Last edited by LAL1947 on Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:24 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:08 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.

It shouldn't be a surprise that Lue became garbage around the same time Frank Vogel, misunderstood genius, became the darling of LG. Lue has to be denigrated in order to justify how the coaching search was handled.

I have a feeling that if we had hired Ty Lue, you are someone who would be moaning about getting Ty Lue and would be saying our FO should have got Monty Williams instead.

Anyway, I have personally never said that Lue is garbage and openly admit that I am not an X's and O's guy (like some here are, and like some others pretend to be). I've only said that that he does not appear to be a better coach than Vogel... and/or appears to be of a similar level. To be honest though, from listening to Vogel's interviews, it appears we may have lucked out when Lue declined our offer by getting what appears to be a more intelligent coach (on a better contract too!). Whether that intelligence translates in how he prepares the team and in the results obtained on the court is another matter and remains to be seen.
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 15, 2019 6:15 pm    Post subject:

LAL1947 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.


It shouldn't be a surprise that Lue became garbage around the same time Frank Vogel, misunderstood genius, became the darling of LG. Lue has to be denigrated in order to justify how the coaching search was handled.

I have personally never said that Lue is garbage and openly admit that I am not an X's and O's guy (like some here are, and like some others pretend to be). I've only said that that he does not appear to be a better coach than Vogel. TBH, from listening to Vogel's interviews, we appear to lucked out when Lue declined our offer and ended up getting a more intelligent coach on a better contract. Whether that intelligence translates in how he prepares the team and on the court is another matter though... and remains to be seen.


Lue has accomplished much more, in a much shorter career, than Vogel. Nobody here was looking for Frank as the HC before Kurt and Rob tapped him (after they screwed up their first two choices). Frankly, even those two didn't consider him a HC. He was looked at as one of Lue's assistants, and not even the top one. That was to be the other guy they really wanted: failed Bucks coach Jason Kidd. It wasn't until Vogel had the job that Laker fans started singing his praises as found gold.

The contract of the coach has no bearing on anything other than Jeanie's pocketbook. So they got their 4th choice because they didn't want to offer a fairly standard deal to their top choices and the team is worse for it. Could have had Vogel/Kidd AND Lue but they cheaped out. And you guys applaud them for it? There's a certain bit of Company Man in all fans but that's a bit much don't you think?

Vogel's interviews have been very straightforward new hire propaganda. "Hard worker. Lives in the film room. Such preparedness. That last job where it went horribly? Learned a lot." To his credit he hasn't prattled on about "building a culture" but if you're impressed by those interviews you're probably impressed quite often. It is true, it remains to be seen whether or not he will be able to carry over his "lab work" with the Magic to our team. I wish him luck.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:33 am    Post subject:

I just find it funny that Vogel was being put down because he was an assistant level coach based on what the market was for him at that point in time, and Lue was a head coach. Yet, 2 months later, Lue got no job offers, and he ends up becoming an assistant.

I do not know if Vogel will work out with the Lakers. We have had so many coaches since Phil Jackson - not one of them have worked out. Some of them are doing well other places, but sucked with us.

So I am not excited about him, I have a wait and see approach.

I certainly do not think hiring Lebrons caddy was the answer either. I am actually happy we did not go with Lue, it would have been too similar to hiring Byron for Kobe, for his last few years as a Laker. The entire team would have known that Lue was there for Lebron and primarily only Lebron. I like we have a staff here that is not just here for Lebron. Lets see how it works out though. Replacing Phil Jackson has been an immensely difficult task for the Lakers. Brown, Bickerstaff, DAntoni, Byron, Luke. 5 coaches in 8 seasons. Now on to #6.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:44 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
I just find it funny that Vogel was being put down because he was an assistant level coach based on what the market was for him at that point in time, and Lue was a head coach. Yet, 2 months later, Lue got no job offers, and he ends up becoming an assistant.

I do not know if Vogel will work out with the Lakers. We have had so many coaches since Phil Jackson - not one of them have worked out. Some of them are doing well other places, but sucked with us.

So I am not excited about him, I have a wait and see approach.

I certainly do not think hiring Lebrons caddy was the answer either. I am actually happy we did not go with Lue, it would have been too similar to hiring Byron for Kobe, for his last few years as a Laker. The entire team would have known that Lue was there for Lebron and primarily only Lebron. I like we have a staff here that is not just here for Lebron. Lets see how it works out though. Replacing Phil Jackson has been an immensely difficult task for the Lakers. Brown, Bickerstaff, DAntoni, Byron, Luke. 5 coaches in 8 seasons. Now on to #6.


Hey, don’t you Dare put the Tank Commander’s name in there with those bums 😆
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:04 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Lebrons caddy


There maybe isn't a greater signifier of ignorance on this issue than this jab. Do some reading and be better than this.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 9:16 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Quote:
Lebrons caddy


There maybe isn't a greater signifier of ignorance on this issue than this jab. Do some reading and be better than this.

Nice that you pick that one part of an entire post. It is well known that Lue is LBJs guy. Whether you see it that way or not, do not know. I know there are times Lue has gotten in LBJs face. However it is well known that Lue would be viewed as Lebrons coach. Vogel is not seen that way at all. They brought in Phil Handy from the Raps, to further develop players. Tried getting in Golden State assistant coach. The last thing anyone would think when you look at the current Lakers staff is that is a group only here to coach Lebron. Ty Lue, I had a sense he would be good for LBJ, but Anthony Davis - I do not want to see AD become what Kevin Love was in Cleveland.

What I do know is that you (and others) once claimed that Vogel was not a candidate for a HC job anywhere but with us and that Lue was a proven championship coach who would get other jobs or deserved better from LA. Guess what - Lue is now an assistant coach again. He should have taken the Laker job, if he wanted to be a HC - because no one else offered him (bleep). So this argument should be withdrawn, as Lue has not gotten any HC offers and has seen the light and gone back to being an assistant, probably looking for a HC gig next year or in 2 years.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 9:18 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Judah wrote:
You're either hilariously bad at interpretation or just being intentionally absurd. I wasn't saying that Lue is the next Phil Jackson. In fact, I didn't even have Lue in mind when I said that. I was responding to a specific, GENERAL point that severely downplayed how vital coaching is. Get out of your hot take paradigm.


It shouldn't be a surprise that Lue became garbage around the same time Frank Vogel, misunderstood genius, became the darling of LG. Lue has to be denigrated in order to justify how the coaching search was handled.


No,.. I said he was an overrated coach then too. His defense is trash. His offense is too lebron dominant.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 9:24 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
ocho wrote:
Quote:
Lebrons caddy


There maybe isn't a greater signifier of ignorance on this issue than this jab. Do some reading and be better than this.

Nice that you pick that one part of an entire post. It is well known that Lue is LBJs guy. Whether you see it that way or not, do not know. I know there are times Lue has gotten in LBJs face. However it is well known that Lue would be viewed as Lebrons coach. Vogel is not seen that way at all. They brought in Phil Handy from the Raps, to further develop players. Tried getting in Golden State assistant coach. The last thing anyone would think when you look at the current Lakers staff is that is a group only here to coach Lebron. Ty Lue, I had a sense he would be good for LBJ, but Anthony Davis - I do not want to see AD become what Kevin Love was in Cleveland.

What I do know is that you (and others) once claimed that Vogel was not a candidate for a HC job anywhere but with us and that Lue was a proven championship coach who would get other jobs or deserved better from LA. Guess what - Lue is now an assistant coach again. He should have taken the Laker job, if he wanted to be a HC - because no one else offered him (bleep). So this argument should be withdrawn, as Lue has not gotten any HC offers and has seen the light and gone back to being an assistant, probably looking for a HC gig next year or in 2 years.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 10:01 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
ocho wrote:
Quote:
Lebrons caddy


There maybe isn't a greater signifier of ignorance on this issue than this jab. Do some reading and be better than this.

Nice that you pick that one part of an entire post. It is well known that Lue is LBJs guy. Whether you see it that way or not, do not know. I know there are times Lue has gotten in LBJs face. However it is well known that Lue would be viewed as Lebrons coach. Vogel is not seen that way at all. They brought in Phil Handy from the Raps, to further develop players. Tried getting in Golden State assistant coach. The last thing anyone would think when you look at the current Lakers staff is that is a group only here to coach Lebron. Ty Lue, I had a sense he would be good for LBJ, but Anthony Davis - I do not want to see AD become what Kevin Love was in Cleveland.

What I do know is that you (and others) once claimed that Vogel was not a candidate for a HC job anywhere but with us and that Lue was a proven championship coach who would get other jobs or deserved better from LA. Guess what - Lue is now an assistant coach again. He should have taken the Laker job, if he wanted to be a HC - because no one else offered him (bleep). So this argument should be withdrawn, as Lue has not gotten any HC offers and has seen the light and gone back to being an assistant, probably looking for a HC gig next year or in 2 years.


Being someone that LeBron respects is quite different than being "LeBron's caddy". As if having buy in from your best player is a bad thing. Using that phrase simply shows a lack of knowledge about what happened in Cleveland. Full stop. What Kevin Love became in Cleveland was a champion, btw.

Vogel wasn't a candidate anywhere else and Lue is a championship coach. There was essentially one vacancy after Lue walked. I don't think he is seen as a coach for a rebuilding team full of kids, nor do I think that's what he wants. So the Memphis Grizzlies (who always do the right thing) didn't seek him out and that means he's bad? They didn't seek out Vogel either (the other teams that had vacancies while Lue was tied up with the Lakers didn't either). Or Kidd. Vogel was extremely unlikely to ever get a HC job again if not for the very unique and weird circumstances our FO made for themselves. Again, they didn't see him as HC material either. Frank Vogel is a head coach again only because the Lakers somehow found a way to screw up their first two choices and couldn't pick their third for political reasons. Im willing to bet Lue is a HC again before long.

Lue doesn't have to be trash just because you guys want to justify the embarrassing way Kurt and Rob handled things and he doesn't have to be Phil Jackson in order to lament screwing it up with him. He just had to be a cut above the rest of the field, which he clearly was. The Lakers agreed. He's who they wanted. The only thing stopping them was money. So they went to the bargain bin. Even if Vogel does a great job that's a terrible way of doing business.
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:24 pm    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
wolfpaclaker wrote:
ocho wrote:
Quote:
Lebrons caddy


There maybe isn't a greater signifier of ignorance on this issue than this jab. Do some reading and be better than this.

Nice that you pick that one part of an entire post. It is well known that Lue is LBJs guy. Whether you see it that way or not, do not know. I know there are times Lue has gotten in LBJs face. However it is well known that Lue would be viewed as Lebrons coach. Vogel is not seen that way at all. They brought in Phil Handy from the Raps, to further develop players. Tried getting in Golden State assistant coach. The last thing anyone would think when you look at the current Lakers staff is that is a group only here to coach Lebron. Ty Lue, I had a sense he would be good for LBJ, but Anthony Davis - I do not want to see AD become what Kevin Love was in Cleveland.

What I do know is that you (and others) once claimed that Vogel was not a candidate for a HC job anywhere but with us and that Lue was a proven championship coach who would get other jobs or deserved better from LA. Guess what - Lue is now an assistant coach again. He should have taken the Laker job, if he wanted to be a HC - because no one else offered him (bleep). So this argument should be withdrawn, as Lue has not gotten any HC offers and has seen the light and gone back to being an assistant, probably looking for a HC gig next year or in 2 years.


Being someone that LeBron respects is quite different than being "LeBron's caddy". As if having buy in from your best player is a bad thing. Using that phrase simply shows a lack of knowledge about what happened in Cleveland. Full stop. What Kevin Love became in Cleveland was a champion, btw.

Vogel wasn't a candidate anywhere else and Lue is a championship coach. There was essentially one vacancy after Lue walked. I don't think he is seen as a coach for a rebuilding team full of kids, nor do I think that's what he wants. So the Memphis Grizzlies (who always do the right thing) didn't seek him out and that means he's bad? They didn't seek out Vogel either (the other teams that had vacancies while Lue was tied up with the Lakers didn't either). Or Kidd. Vogel was extremely unlikely to ever get a HC job again if not for the very unique and weird circumstances our FO made for themselves. Again, they didn't see him as HC material either. Frank Vogel is a head coach again only because the Lakers somehow found a way to screw up their first two choices and couldn't pick their third for political reasons. Im willing to bet Lue is a HC again before long.

Lue doesn't have to be trash just because you guys want to justify the embarrassing way Kurt and Rob handled things and he doesn't have to be Phil Jackson in order to lament screwing it up with him. He just had to be a cut above the rest of the field, which he clearly was. The Lakers agreed. He's who they wanted. The only thing stopping them was money. So they went to the bargain bin. Even if Vogel does a great job that's a terrible way of doing business.


Tell me what he’s so good at?
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:47 pm    Post subject:

Quote:
Tell me what he’s so good at?


Why? So you can dismiss it? His resume speaks for itself.

Reminder: Ty Lue isn't the greatest coach in the league. He was just better than the other candidates. The Lakers agreed.
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