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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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 Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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| LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist?  |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does.
_________________
Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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| LAL1947 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LAL1947 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | Bottom line is Jeannie Buss is in WAY OVER HER HEAD. Magic had to deal with it and couldn't. Everyone on this team has made mistakes, Magic included. I think Magic had a vision, whether any of you agreed with it or not. It brought us Lebron and potentially another superstar. Cutting him off at the knees, right during the race to free agency is a massive mistake by Jeannie. She is going to look back at this and know, it was the beginning of her end. She is not going to recover from this. Guaranteed. I wish I was wrong, but I don't believe I am. The team is going to pay for this. You can blame it on Magic and yeah, he has some blame to share. But ultimately, Jeannie was in charge and no matter what happened she should NOT have let it get to this point. I hear rumors that she felt blind sided by the whole thing. BLIND SIDED??? If she WAS blind sided then she is either stupid or lying. I don't think she is a liar.
So, the bottom line is she lacks basketball decision making ability and it really got a good manager of people, yet she is the bottom line with this team under it's current structure. Plus, she has someone with zero experience making real decisions for an NBA franchise.
I don't see this coming out with a positive outcome.
The truth is, the Lakers have made the wrong decisions and nearly every single fork in the road.
All this, while the Clippers have been making the right decision at every fork in the road. In fact, they are dictating their own path. The ONLY forks in the road they deal with, are ones they put there on purpose.
I want the Buss family to sell the team. They have totally screwed it up and it will take them years to recover. They are now considered one of the worse ownership's in all of sports. They did this in 6 years. WOW!! |
You're reaching so hard, you don't even realize it.
If I was directing a play about the Lakers and was only using LG members as the cast, you'd be my SAS or Byron Scott. |
I disagree with all of you. There are a number of leaders of many organizations that are brought in simply to make the final calls. They don't work full time but have decades of experience. Others do the ground work and the old guys with the most experience make the calls.
I, for once, agree with SAS and Byron. You are all wrong and you will help our team pay the price of it. If you can't see the truth, then you are destined to keep making mistakes. |
Called it! Whoop whoop!
If I was actually making this hypothetical play about the Lakers' current situation, I'm leaning more towards casting you as SAS than Byron... not sure which would be a better fit.
Do you have a personal preference between either? |
You ever seen a grown man naked?
_________________
Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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venturalakersfan
Retired Number
Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144461
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Rubin wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | YSong wrote: | | Sssmush wrote: | just the Lou Williams trade alone is such a colossal screw up. I mean even if we get Kyrie we won't be getting Lou Williams level production and value out of him. It's gross, he would've been fantastic running with Lebron.
Then you throw in the vindictive trade of D'Angelo Russell, for nothing.... letting fan favorite and legit shooter Lopez walk for nothing, letting Randle walk, trading Zubac for a washed up scrub.... to say nothing of drafting Lonzo ahead of Tatum like a complete forrest gump idiot...
why do we even care what Magic thinks? Now he trashed himself on First Take boom I actually tip my hat to Stephen A, thank you that was very satisfying on a personal level to watch Magic show his *** on national TV like that and prove me right about this argument forever and for all time. I argued this for a long ****ing time on the Internet and wow it is weird but I know I won that ****ing argument.
Magic as president of basketball for the Lakers was A JOKE |
Hindsight much? |
Not for some of us |
The Lakers were tanking that year. It was pretty unanimously understood that getting a FRP for Lou was the play to make. No one criticized it on those merits at the time. What Magic rightly caught some heat for was taking Brewer back in the deal. |
Wrong comment, some of us thought that Magic would be a joke when he was hired.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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VicXLakers
Franchise Player
Joined: 08 Feb 2006
Posts: 11823
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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forget the beans..spill the wine  Friday night no game  |
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Laker's Fan
Franchise Player
Joined: 27 Jun 2002
Posts: 12850
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | Wrong comment, some of us thought that Magic would be a joke when he was hired. |
I think it might be fair to say most knew he wouldn't be good at the actual PBO job, but had the chance to be the best front man in the league. Turned out he wanted to have the hammer on other things without putting in the work. He wasn't very diplomatic about it either. Rough combo.
I keep going back to the idea that this off-season was tremendously productive, with Magic resigning and Jeanie front and center as the biggest remaining problem. She's clearly trying to bring Bryant into the fold, showing she hasn't learned a thing. |
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LandsbergerRules
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 11197
Location: The Other Perspective
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out.
_________________
"Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him |
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LAL1947
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2018
Posts: 1855
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 12:19 am Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LAL1947 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LAL1947 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | Bottom line is Jeannie Buss is in WAY OVER HER HEAD. Magic had to deal with it and couldn't. Everyone on this team has made mistakes, Magic included. I think Magic had a vision, whether any of you agreed with it or not. It brought us Lebron and potentially another superstar. Cutting him off at the knees, right during the race to free agency is a massive mistake by Jeannie. She is going to look back at this and know, it was the beginning of her end. She is not going to recover from this. Guaranteed. I wish I was wrong, but I don't believe I am. The team is going to pay for this. You can blame it on Magic and yeah, he has some blame to share. But ultimately, Jeannie was in charge and no matter what happened she should NOT have let it get to this point. I hear rumors that she felt blind sided by the whole thing. BLIND SIDED??? If she WAS blind sided then she is either stupid or lying. I don't think she is a liar.
So, the bottom line is she lacks basketball decision making ability and it really got a good manager of people, yet she is the bottom line with this team under it's current structure. Plus, she has someone with zero experience making real decisions for an NBA franchise.
I don't see this coming out with a positive outcome.
The truth is, the Lakers have made the wrong decisions and nearly every single fork in the road.
All this, while the Clippers have been making the right decision at every fork in the road. In fact, they are dictating their own path. The ONLY forks in the road they deal with, are ones they put there on purpose.
I want the Buss family to sell the team. They have totally screwed it up and it will take them years to recover. They are now considered one of the worse ownership's in all of sports. They did this in 6 years. WOW!! |
You're reaching so hard, you don't even realize it.
If I was directing a play about the Lakers and was only using LG members as the cast, you'd be my SAS or Byron Scott. |
I disagree with all of you. There are a number of leaders of many organizations that are brought in simply to make the final calls. They don't work full time but have decades of experience. Others do the ground work and the old guys with the most experience make the calls.
I, for once, agree with SAS and Byron. You are all wrong and you will help our team pay the price of it. If you can't see the truth, then you are destined to keep making mistakes. |
Called it! Whoop whoop!
If I was actually making this hypothetical play about the Lakers' current situation, I'm leaning more towards casting you as SAS than Byron... not sure which would be a better fit.
Do you have a personal preference between either? |
You ever seen a grown man naked? |
Every day..... when I look in the mirror. |
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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 12:28 am Post subject: |
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| LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller.
_________________
Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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LAL1947
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2018
Posts: 1855
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 12:38 am Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller. |
I think this take of yours has more to do with your insecurities and/or how you view the world... than it has to do with the rest of us. It seems like you're projecting your feelings about our thoughts on us, even though we do not have those thoughts. I don't think anyone is saying Magic wasn't in because he's lazy... and there definitely isn't anyone saying he's lazy because he's African-American. That's how you are interpreting it though? Everyone knows he has many other things going on in his world as a billionaire (? not sure but I think he's in the billionaire range), and he most likely assumed this job was easier than it is... and that he could do it because he's Magic Johnson, an ex-player, not just any ex-player but one of the best to have played the game. If there is any "stereo-typing" going on, I'd think it would be stereo-typing of ex-NBA players who think they know more about the game than others and who think they are more qualified to be POBOs/GMs/Coaches than others just because they were ex-NBA players... when the two things (i.e., being an ex- NBA player and being a successful POBO/GM) aren't dependant on each other. Magic's individual, unique personality is also a factor... he is known for being more of a people person, and his Twitter feed is filled with the most inane of observations. For you to think otherwise about our thoughts... seems a consequence of subscribing to the "group think" ideology instead of remembering that every individual is unique. In today's world, most people judge others by their individual actions and/or the perception they give of themselves through actions/words/results... and not according to what racial group they belong to... well, that's how I am at least... although a certain political party would love to have us all think otherwise and keeps pushing that narrative through all forms of media all the time (and they control most media that is shaping thoughts/minds in the world today).
Btw, pls don't take this wrong way... I'm simply trying to understand where you're coming from and offer an alternative point of view. 
Last edited by LAL1947 on Sat May 25, 2019 5:30 am; edited 3 times in total |
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CabinCreek44
Star Player
Joined: 16 Apr 2001
Posts: 3855
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | Stumpy25 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | Bottom line is Jeannie Buss is in WAY OVER HER HEAD. Magic had to deal with it and couldn't. Everyone on this team has made mistakes, Magic included. I think Magic had a vision, whether any of you agreed with it or not. It brought us Lebron and potentially another superstar. Cutting him off at the knees, right during the race to free agency is a massive mistake by Jeannie. She is going to look back at this and know, it was the beginning of her end. She is not going to recover from this. Guaranteed. I wish I was wrong, but I don't believe I am. The team is going to pay for this. You can blame it on Magic and yeah, he has some blame to share. But ultimately, Jeannie was in charge and no matter what happened she should NOT have let it get to this point. I hear rumors that she felt blind sided by the whole thing. BLIND SIDED??? If she WAS blind sided then she is either stupid or lying. I don't think she is a liar.
So, the bottom line is she lacks basketball decision making ability and it really got a good manager of people, yet she is the bottom line with this team under it's current structure. Plus, she has someone with zero experience making real decisions for an NBA franchise.
I don't see this coming out with a positive outcome.
The truth is, the Lakers have made the wrong decisions and nearly every single fork in the road.
All this, while the Clippers have been making the right decision at every fork in the road. In fact, they are dictating their own path. The ONLY forks in the road they deal with, are ones they put there on purpose.
I want the Buss family to sell the team. They have totally screwed it up and it will take them years to recover. They are now considered one of the worse ownership's in all of sports. They did this in 6 years. WOW!! |
Magic didn't know what the hell he was doing and didn't have the time to put in the work. He should have never taken the position because he was just not ready for it, and probably not made for it either. Great talker, great charismatic individual but that's where it ends. In that position you needed someone with tactfulness and quiet demeanor.
As for the Clippers they will always be the Clippers. The team that never really gets the gold, because they will always be competing against the most popular team in the world with 16 rings. |
If you haven't noticed, there has been a paradigm shift in the relationship of Clippers vs Lakers. The VERY LEAST that is going to come out of this is that the Clippers are now a viable destination for players who want to have a solid FO around them. In contrast, the Lakers are a small, penny pinching, interfering, family run business without much knowledge of the sport. It's huge man. It has NEVER happened in all the days of the Lakers, even Jack Kent Cooke was unable to screw it up this badly.
Blame it on the guy who dropped the bag and left, but the people left behind are the real problem and the sooner you realize it, the sooner they realize it, the better off the team will be. |
I agree with much of what you're saying re. Jeanie and Co., but Magic screwed the pooch by not confronting people when he saw something going on that was not to his liking. If he didn't like what Pelinka was saying behind his back, he should have just walked into his office unannounced one morning and said "What's up bro? I hear you've got some problems with me. So here I am, how about telling me your problems to my face?"
Had Magic handled it that way, instead of childishly taking his ball and going home, he would have exerted the power his position in the org bestowed upon him, and the ground would have shifted under Pelinka's feet, and probably under everyone else's too.
That said, I agree with the notion that Jeanie is now on the clock BIG TIME. The ship is taking on water and I'll skip the Michael Ray Richardson quote this time.  She needs to take control of the situation and start producing results. Instead she's hiding in her bunker. Not the right move. AT ALL.
One quibble, Jack Kent Cooke didn't screw up much. Yes, he was a nightmare to work for, but during his tenure he built The Forum, brought Wilt Chamberlain to the Lakers (4 trips to the Finals and one title in his 5 seasons with the club), hired the great Bill Sharman (a move that paid dividends for the team until Mr. Sharman passed some 40 years later), had the dream season of 1971-72, brought Kareem Abdul-Jabbar to the Lakers (5 titles in 8 trips to the Finals with he and Magic), and during the last draft of Cooke's ownership, they wound up with the good fortune of drafting Mr. Johnson. Not too shabby. |
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Day
Star Player
Joined: 12 Mar 2012
Posts: 1715
Location: San Francisco, CA
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 5:49 am Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller. |
Really reaching for that race bait huh
Take your pick, Magic was either lazy or grossly incompetent - unless you're arguing on behalf of his "expert" decisions.
You're gonna have a hard time considering he admitted to it being too much work and not fun. Unfortunately Magic was lazy, unprepared, petty, ignorant, and incompetent. The fact he's black has nothing to do with that. On a board where we openly called for Jimbo's head and actively call for Jeanie to resign, for you to invoke the race card when people give Magic the same level of accountability is really transparent. |
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epak
Retired Number
Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 34147
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 6:55 am Post subject: |
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This again?
Sheesh. |
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Sentient Meat
Franchise Player
Joined: 04 Jul 2014
Posts: 12978
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 7:01 am Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller. |
Why do I feel like Trump is lazy (golfing all the time) and stupid... but Obama was hardworking and intelligent... yet I feel Magic was half ass and showed poor judgment?
Not everything is a race thing... and you weaken the cause of the real issues of income inequality and institutionalized racism when you apply your paranoia to people who mostly never said anything beyond expressing their unhappiness with Magic.
I was happy with Magic until the Godfather offer. Does this mean I started out tolerant and then became racist when he made the trade offer?
Think about it before you throw out such terrible accusations. |
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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 2:31 pm Post subject: |
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| LAL1947 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LakersFanESS wrote: | I just have to say how disappointed I am in Magic Johnson for actively trying to sabotage our free agency so Rob Pelinka will fail. He even has Byron Scott doing his dirty work...it is the same thing he was doing to Jim Buss years ago. Magic was my favorite player growing up but I just want him to go away for a while and let the Lakers succeed.
As much as I love Magic he is the one that is the snake. Everything that has gone wrong has been because of his decisions. Trading D'Angelo because of the snitching thing, not bringing back Brook Lopez because you were afraid that he wanted too many minutes and you wanted to go with more small lineups. Trading Zubac and justifying it by belittling him, The lack of shooters because Magic wanted playmakers. The ridiculous A. Davis negotiations, the quilting before the last game and the spectacle of it all, the first take bs. I think the whole organization was one one side and Magic was on the other. Now everyone is one the same side so I am happy moving forward, Magic, please go away for now...
And if the team is ever for sale, I don't want Magic anywhere near the ownership group. Magic would try to run things again and screw it all up again. |
Yeah I could handle everything until he started quilting before the last game!!! Next thing he will be sewing girls cloths!!!
Haters gonna hate!! |
So do the quilting accusations make LakersFanESS a racist or a sexist? |
No, but saying Magic is lazy and Jeannie is a bimbo does. |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller. |
I think this take of yours has more to do with your insecurities and/or how you view the world... than it has to do with the rest of us. It seems like you're projecting your feelings about our thoughts on us, even though we do not have those thoughts. I don't think anyone is saying Magic wasn't in because he's lazy... and there definitely isn't anyone saying he's lazy because he's African-American. That's how you are interpreting it though? Everyone knows he has many other things going on in his world as a billionaire (? not sure but I think he's in the billionaire range), and he most likely assumed this job was easier than it is... and that he could do it because he's Magic Johnson, an ex-player, not just any ex-player but one of the best to have played the game. If there is any "stereo-typing" going on, I'd think it would be stereo-typing of ex-NBA players who think they know more about the game than others and who think they are more qualified to be POBOs/GMs/Coaches than others just because they were ex-NBA players... when the two things (i.e., being an ex- NBA player and being a successful POBO/GM) aren't dependant on each other. Magic's individual, unique personality is also a factor... he is known for being more of a people person, and his Twitter feed is filled with the most inane of observations. For you to think otherwise about our thoughts... seems a consequence of subscribing to the "group think" ideology instead of remembering that every individual is unique. In today's world, most people judge others by their individual actions and/or the perception they give of themselves through actions/words/results... and not according to what racial group they belong to... well, that's how I am at least... although a certain political party would love to have us all think otherwise and keeps pushing that narrative through all forms of media all the time (and they control most media that is shaping thoughts/minds in the world today).
Btw, pls don't take this wrong way... I'm simply trying to understand where you're coming from and offer an alternative point of view. |
BS, I have no insecurities about it, just calling it the way I see it. I'm projecting my feelings, NOT IDEAS?, on YOU, but none of you are projecting your feelings on me?? You got your head where the sun don't shine. While YOU may not be saying that Magic was lazy, plenty of people have and ARE saying exactly that. And it's funny how people can say that, deny it, and then say it isn't because they have pre-conceived notions about the people involved. Great for you!!
And then you go and make it political, while, I assume , bashing conservatives. What a joke.
_________________
Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain
Last edited by Wino on Sat May 25, 2019 2:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Wino
Star Player
Joined: 07 Jun 2002
Posts: 9674
Location: San Diego
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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| CabinCreek44 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | Stumpy25 wrote: | | Wino wrote: | Bottom line is Jeannie Buss is in WAY OVER HER HEAD. Magic had to deal with it and couldn't. Everyone on this team has made mistakes, Magic included. I think Magic had a vision, whether any of you agreed with it or not. It brought us Lebron and potentially another superstar. Cutting him off at the knees, right during the race to free agency is a massive mistake by Jeannie. She is going to look back at this and know, it was the beginning of her end. She is not going to recover from this. Guaranteed. I wish I was wrong, but I don't believe I am. The team is going to pay for this. You can blame it on Magic and yeah, he has some blame to share. But ultimately, Jeannie was in charge and no matter what happened she should NOT have let it get to this point. I hear rumors that she felt blind sided by the whole thing. BLIND SIDED??? If she WAS blind sided then she is either stupid or lying. I don't think she is a liar.
So, the bottom line is she lacks basketball decision making ability and it really got a good manager of people, yet she is the bottom line with this team under it's current structure. Plus, she has someone with zero experience making real decisions for an NBA franchise.
I don't see this coming out with a positive outcome.
The truth is, the Lakers have made the wrong decisions and nearly every single fork in the road.
All this, while the Clippers have been making the right decision at every fork in the road. In fact, they are dictating their own path. The ONLY forks in the road they deal with, are ones they put there on purpose.
I want the Buss family to sell the team. They have totally screwed it up and it will take them years to recover. They are now considered one of the worse ownership's in all of sports. They did this in 6 years. WOW!! |
Magic didn't know what the hell he was doing and didn't have the time to put in the work. He should have never taken the position because he was just not ready for it, and probably not made for it either. Great talker, great charismatic individual but that's where it ends. In that position you needed someone with tactfulness and quiet demeanor.
As for the Clippers they will always be the Clippers. The team that never really gets the gold, because they will always be competing against the most popular team in the world with 16 rings. |
If you haven't noticed, there has been a paradigm shift in the relationship of Clippers vs Lakers. The VERY LEAST that is going to come out of this is that the Clippers are now a viable destination for players who want to have a solid FO around them. In contrast, the Lakers are a small, penny pinching, interfering, family run business without much knowledge of the sport. It's huge man. It has NEVER happened in all the days of the Lakers, even Jack Kent Cooke was unable to screw it up this badly.
Blame it on the guy who dropped the bag and left, but the people left behind are the real problem and the sooner you realize it, the sooner they realize it, the better off the team will be. |
I agree with much of what you're saying re. Jeanie and Co., but Magic screwed the pooch by not confronting people when he saw something going on that was not to his liking. If he didn't like what Pelinka was saying behind his back, he should have just walked into his office unannounced one morning and said "What's up bro? I hear you've got some problems with me. So here I am, how about telling me your problems to my face?"
Had Magic handled it that way, instead of childishly taking his ball and going home, he would have exerted the power his position in the org bestowed upon him, and the ground would have shifted under Pelinka's feet, and probably under everyone else's too.
That said, I agree with the notion that Jeanie is now on the clock BIG TIME. The ship is taking on water and I'll skip the Michael Ray Richardson quote this time. She needs to take control of the situation and start producing results. Instead she's hiding in her bunker. Not the right move. AT ALL.
One quibble, Jack Kent Cooke didn't screw up much. Yes, he was a nightmare to work for, but during his tenure he built The Forum, brought Wilt Chamberlain to the Lakers (4 trips to the Finals and one title in his 5 seasons with the club), hired the great Bill Sharman (a move that paid dividends for the team until Mr. Sharman passed some 40 years later), had the dream season of 1971-72, brought Kareem Abdul-Jabbar to the Lakers (5 titles in 8 trips to the Finals with he and Magic), and during the last draft of Cooke's ownership, they wound up with the good fortune of drafting Mr. Johnson. Not too shabby. |
Yep, this I agree with. I do think Magic could have handled it better. Even if he was going to quit anyhow. Honestly, if I was Magic and Jeannie did that to me, I would quit too. I would simply go in and tell her and then walk. It would still amount to the same thing, but the perception of it would have been better.
FWIW, have you ever had someone at work do that to you? I have, and confronting them didn't really solve anything. People can be real douche bags and thinking you can solve things by confronting directly, is often times hopeful thinking. But in the end, you have to try, if it doesn't work, you can at least take the high ground. All that said, I don't think Rob was the largest reason why Magic quit, I think it was his lack of control, power over the situation and that is 100% on Jeannie, Rob just rubbed him the wrong way and made it not fun for him. In Magic's perfect world, he would have fired Rob too and been done with it. Jeannie was not going to let him. She took sides and it wasn't with Magic. Personally, I still think she took the wrong side, but not by much. I still think she could have had a more honest approach with him from the get go, but likely she did the best she could. She is winging it and has no idea what she is doing.
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Never argue with stupid people! They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience!! - Twain |
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LAL1947
Star Player
Joined: 26 Dec 2018
Posts: 1855
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 2:42 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: |
BS, I have no insecurities about it, just calling it the way I see it. I'm projecting my feelings, NOT IDEAS?, on YOU, but none of you are projecting your feelings on me?? You got your head where the sun don't shine. While YOU may not be saying that Magic wasn't lazy, plenty of people have and ARE saying exactly that. And it's funny how people can say that, deny it, and then say it isn't because they have pre-conceived notions about the people involved. Great for you!!
And then you go and make it political, while, I assume , bashing conservatives. What a joke. |
I'm kinda done with you, not worth my time or my being polite either. Wish there was a way to block/mute posters like yourself so I wouldn't have to read your tripe.
PS: Not only are you wrong about everything else... you were also wrong in assuming I was bashing conservatives. How many times are you going to strike out before you ask yourself whether it is you who has his head up where the sun doesn't shine?
Last edited by LAL1947 on Sat May 25, 2019 3:03 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Rubin
Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Aug 2017
Posts: 632
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 2:52 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | Rubin wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | YSong wrote: | | Sssmush wrote: | just the Lou Williams trade alone is such a colossal screw up. I mean even if we get Kyrie we won't be getting Lou Williams level production and value out of him. It's gross, he would've been fantastic running with Lebron.
Then you throw in the vindictive trade of D'Angelo Russell, for nothing.... letting fan favorite and legit shooter Lopez walk for nothing, letting Randle walk, trading Zubac for a washed up scrub.... to say nothing of drafting Lonzo ahead of Tatum like a complete forrest gump idiot...
why do we even care what Magic thinks? Now he trashed himself on First Take boom I actually tip my hat to Stephen A, thank you that was very satisfying on a personal level to watch Magic show his *** on national TV like that and prove me right about this argument forever and for all time. I argued this for a long ****ing time on the Internet and wow it is weird but I know I won that ****ing argument.
Magic as president of basketball for the Lakers was A JOKE |
Hindsight much? |
Not for some of us |
The Lakers were tanking that year. It was pretty unanimously understood that getting a FRP for Lou was the play to make. No one criticized it on those merits at the time. What Magic rightly caught some heat for was taking Brewer back in the deal. |
Wrong comment, some of us thought that Magic would be a joke when he was hired. |
Why are you conflating the common sentiment that getting a FRP for Lou during a tanking year was good with thinking Magic would be a good PBO? |
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LandsbergerRules
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 11197
Location: The Other Perspective
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LandsbergerRules wrote: |
Gonna haveta disagree about calling someone lazy. I don't give a (bleep) if someone is black, white, asian, hispanic, or whatever, if there's evidence that they aren't working hard, then it ain't got a damn thing to do with racism to call it out. |
Funny how when the man is white, everything is ok, he is being used for his expertise and his time is not of importance, but when he is black he couldn't possibly be enough of an expert to simply be the shot caller. |
Lol are you assuming this is how I think? If not, who supposedly has this perspective? Pelinka?
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"Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him |
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LandsbergerRules
Franchise Player
Joined: 29 Aug 2004
Posts: 11197
Location: The Other Perspective
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Wino wrote: | | LAL1947 wrote: | | In today's world, most people judge others by their individual actions and/or the perception they give of themselves through actions/words/results... and not according to what racial group they belong to... well, that's how I am at least... although a certain political party would love to have us all think otherwise and keeps pushing that narrative through all forms of media all the time (and they control most media that is shaping thoughts/minds in the world today). |
BS, I have no insecurities about it, just calling it the way I see it. I'm projecting my feelings, NOT IDEAS?, on YOU, but none of you are projecting your feelings on me?? You got your head where the sun don't shine. While YOU may not be saying that Magic was lazy, plenty of people have and ARE saying exactly that. And it's funny how people can say that, deny it, and then say it isn't because they have pre-conceived notions about the people involved. Great for you!!
And then you go and make it political, while, I assume , bashing conservatives. What a joke. |
It's completely obvious he's not bashing conservatives.
_________________
"Chick lived and breathed Lakers basketball…but he was also fair and objective and called every game the way it was played."
-from Chick: His Unpublished Memoirs and the Memories of Those Who Knew Him |
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nickuku
Star Player
Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 7844
Location: Orange County
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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Seriously accusing people of racism because they dont like the job magic did? Lol. Am I a racist because I hate Ben Carson? Or Trump? Duterte? May? Bolsanaro? Do I have all the bases covered yet?
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Don't let perfect be the enemy of good |
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SD2Hollyweird
Starting Rotation
Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Posts: 247
Location: 92115
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 4:21 pm Post subject: |
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| LandsbergerRules wrote: | | Wino wrote: | | LAL1947 wrote: | | In today's world, most people judge others by their individual actions and/or the perception they give of themselves through actions/words/results... and not according to what racial group they belong to... well, that's how I am at least... although a certain political party would love to have us all think otherwise and keeps pushing that narrative through all forms of media all the time (and they control most media that is shaping thoughts/minds in the world today). |
BS, I have no insecurities about it, just calling it the way I see it. I'm projecting my feelings, NOT IDEAS?, on YOU, but none of you are projecting your feelings on me?? You got your head where the sun don't shine. While YOU may not be saying that Magic was lazy, plenty of people have and ARE saying exactly that. And it's funny how people can say that, deny it, and then say it isn't because they have pre-conceived notions about the people involved. Great for you!!
And then you go and make it political, while, I assume , bashing conservatives. What a joke. |
It's completely obvious he's not bashing conservatives. |
Yeah, dude just clearly demonstrated he has zero interest in any intellectually honest dialogue with that.
_________________
I believe that a triangle, if it could speak, would say that God is eminently triangular, and a circle that the divine nature is eminently circular; and thus would every one ascribe his own attributes to God. - Baruch Spinoza |
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Beir32
Star Player
Joined: 16 Feb 2016
Posts: 1710
Location: Western PA
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Magic Johnson was my basketball hero as a player. As a front office employee he was objectively horrible at his job. It doesn't really have to be about more than that. |
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Sssmush
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Joined: 24 Oct 2017
Posts: 133
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | Sssmush wrote: | | DancingBarry wrote: |
Then we started to get the Rob "snake" narrative appearing (bogus Nance story, etc....to me some of that Rob stuff has always felt like underhanded pushback by other teams to get a jumpstart on the free agency battle this summer, but that's just me.)
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the "Rob's a snake" narrative was clearly 100% Magic leaking to Stephen A. It now clearly has Magic's fingerprints all over it. We can forensically trace that narrative to see that the friction and Magic's insecurity started around December, and surmise that Magic had wanted to fire Luke early on in the season but then the team got a little hot and then Lebron got injured, which put things on hold. Then Magic, who obviously lacks the necessary patience, started trying to make moves etc and ran up against it, started complaining to Stephen A and so on. He probably thought Pelinka would be quickly blown out but when he wasn't the countdown to his quitting drama had begun |
So Indy filing and proving tampering charges against Pelinka indicates that he wasn’t considered a snake? |
When I say the Rob's a snake narrative I mean the reports that Stephen A Smith started floating around January or February along the lines of "I'm HEARING from some folks around the Lakers that ROB Pelinka is walking around the training facility during practice saying 'where's Magic?' drawing attention to the fact that Magic's not there."
When Magic showed up on First Take he gave us the full fleshed out version of that narrative and since it had originated on First Take with Stephen A we can now clearly see who the source/leaker was all along.
This tells us a lot about the "I'm HEARING from people close to the Lakers" reports and narratives that Stephen A persistently floated about Jim Buss for years, which ultimately became full fledged bashing of Jim Buss, a low key low profile POBO who won two rings this decade, and by extension Mitch Kupchak, a hall of fame executive with handfuls of rings. In hindsight it all came from Magic. Those recordings I'd really like to hear.
Actually put Magic back on the air on First Take live. Do it he's a open book. Just like I say about Trump, give that fool a microphone and let him go. |
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PlantedTanks
Star Player
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 3156
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Beir32 wrote: | | Magic Johnson was my basketball hero as a player. As a front office employee he was objectively horrible at his job. It doesn't really have to be about more than that. |
So you give no consideration to the character bashing he has done on Pelinka, Dlo, and essentially the whole Lakler organization and in the manner (First Take) he aired out his grievances?
That narrative is fair game imo since it was Magic himself who opened this can of worms. |
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Beir32
Star Player
Joined: 16 Feb 2016
Posts: 1710
Location: Western PA
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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I'm not sure how you read into my post that he shouldn't be crushed for everything he's done. He has been and he should be. I said he was horrible at his job.  |
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