In the Year 2021
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Japago
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: In the Year 2021

LakerMindLA wrote:
Japago wrote:
LakerMindLA wrote:
Chick's Magic Johnson wrote:
PostMalone24 wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
activeverb wrote:
yinoma2001 wrote:
In the summer of 2021, the Lakers could conceivably have 35m+ in cap space (if LBJ opts in). If he doesn't and goes the route of Tim Duncan/Dirk and takes a major paycut (not sure if he will or go full Kobe on us), we can have a max slot easily in hand.



Not sure we'll have that much. I think AD will be making $37 million by then.

When you combine him, Lebron, Kyle, Deng's payoff, and the minimum slots, that's about $97 million. Right now the NBA is forecasting the cap at $116 million for 20-21. So I think we'd have closer to $19 million.


That assumes LBJ opts in.


But you just said in your original post if LBJ opts in we'll still have 35mil in cap space


Kuz has an $8.9M cap hold and Bron, if he opts in, counts for $41M. With Deng ($5M; UGH) and AD ($36M, depends on how we extend him), we're at about $90M. I dunno what the incomplete roster charges are at that point, but that will eat up a good chunk. But, the cap should be higher than $116 (isn't that next year's?). Spotrac has it at $125. Still, unless Bron opts out, it might be tight.

I have to think Bron will be workable. He's ridiculously aware of optics. Unless he delivers 1-2 chips or still looks like a prime superstar, opting in and kneecapping the Lakers will not be good for his brand. He'll have made so much damn money by then, too, and he'll likely still be super motivated to win.


For Lakers to have a max in 2021, Lebron would need to opt-out and then take ~15m a year. That is not happening.

You'd need close to $38m in space for a max.


I think you're looking at the projected cap for 2020-2021, which is $116 million. The Lakers will be going for a max for 2021-2022, which is projected to be $125 million according to Spotrac.

Kuzma's cap hold + LeBron's contract + AD's contract + Deng's stretched dead money = about $91 million

125 - 91 = 34

So, the Lakers should have around $34 million around cap space. But, that's not counting draft picks.

I think a lot of projected future salary amounts are based off a percentage of the cap anyway. So, everybody else will be making less if the future cap is less than projected. I'm not 100% sure on that, but I think that's the case.

I think that's within range of a reasonable LeBron opt out and extension.


You aren’t counting any roster holds which will be close to $10m.

That gets them closer to $24m in space. As I said, Lebron would need to give up $25m to give the Lakers max room.


You mean $14m, right? 24 + 14 = 38

That is a bit harder though. How much longer does he want to play and how much he is he willing to give up? He'll need to have a salary starting at $27 million or lower instead $41 million.

If he's going to play longer, the easier it will be for the Lakers to make it up on the back-end.
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coldzim
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 5:21 pm    Post subject: Re: In the Year 2021

PostMalone24 wrote:
coldzim wrote:
LakerMindLA wrote:
For Lakers to have a max in 2021, Lebron would need to opt-out and then take ~15m a year. That is not happening.

You'd need close to $38m in space for a max.



I disagree.

I see him accepting something like 50/3, if he knows some star is coming.


Umm no LOL,
He says he wants to play with his kid,



Lebron can play the next 5 years with the Lakers before his son can join the league, I think.

The timing would be perfect for him.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:05 pm    Post subject:

The path to be able to sign Giannis isn't to have an empty cap when he becomes a free agent. It's about having some basic flexibility and guys under contract that other teams would be willing to take off your hands.

This empty roster and punt deal BS is just a tricky way for ownership to sell you on the cap space idea while keeping the roster cheap (can't get much over the cap if you are a cap room team).
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trablos
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:15 pm    Post subject:

The shot of Giannis coming here is longer than his wingspan. We need to start thinking about building around AD and Kuz the next 8 years. We have our pick next year and will have 2 more over the next 5 years. If we play our cards right we can find some undervalued young guys to develop or use as trade chips on value deals.
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AFireInside619
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:24 pm    Post subject:

Ben Simmons is the Klutch play. Turn down that contract, sign the QO, and become a Laker in 2021.
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 6:38 pm    Post subject:

https://youtu.be/kmzpdd4pWvM?t=77
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Bard207
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:29 pm    Post subject:

Hopefully the formulas were put in correctly.

.................................2019-20........2020-21........2021-22........2022-23........2023-24........2024-25
Salary Cap in Millions.......109.14...........116..............125..............130................135..........140
Net Change..................................$6,860,000.....$9,000,000.....$5,000,000.....$5,000,000.....$5,000,000
% Change.....................................6.2855%..........7.7586%.......4.0000%.......3.8462%.........3.7037%

Minimum Salary...........$898,310.......$954,773.......$1,028,851.....$1,070,005......$1,111,159....$1,152,313

Non-taxpayer MLE.....$9,258,000....$9,839,912....$10,603,353 ....$11,027,488....$11,451,622....$11,875,756

Taxpayer MLE...........$5,718,000....$6,077,405.....$6,548,928......$6,810,885.....$7,072,842........$7,334,799

Room Exception........$4,767,000.....$5,066,630.....$5,459,731......$5,678,120.....$5,896,509.......$6,114,898

Biannual Exception....$3,623,000......$3,850,724.....$4,149,487.....$4,315,466.....$4,481,446.......$4,647,425

Two Year Vet Min.....$1,620,564......$1,722,425......$1,856,061......$1,930,303...... $2,004,546.....$2,078,788



10+ Years Max
35%...................$38,199,000....$40,600,000....$43,750,000....$45,500,000....$47,250,000....$49,000,000

7-9 Years Max
30%...................$32,742,000....$34,800,000....$37,500,000....$39,000,000....$40,500,000....$42,000,000

0-6 Years Max
25%...................$27,285,000....$29,000,000....$31,250,000....$32,500,000....$33,750,000....$35,000,000
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toffee
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:16 pm    Post subject:

Giannis is perfect 2021 plan, but also Beal would be nice plan B.

Keep your eye on Westbrook, maybe we can trade for him next year if he ends up now on some team that's willing to deal with us down the line.

For example, Miami trades now for Westbrook and plays out this season with him and Butler, but then realizes that Russ has three more super expensive years on his contract, so Pat Riley trades him to Lakers for some of our guys on short-term deals and maybe pick or two.
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AFireInside619
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:32 pm    Post subject:

Open your eyes. Ben Simmons. Watch he signs tomorrow with Philly, but until then hahaha...
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lakersfan8
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:39 am    Post subject:

toffee wrote:
Giannis is perfect 2021 plan, but also Beal would be nice plan B.

Keep your eye on Westbrook, maybe we can trade for him next year if he ends up now on some team that's willing to deal with us down the line.

For example, Miami trades now for Westbrook and plays out this season with him and Butler, but then realizes that Russ has three more super expensive years on his contract, so Pat Riley trades him to Lakers for some of our guys on short-term deals and maybe pick or two.

I hope people learn something from this summer. There’s no plan b max free agent. You either sigh a max free agent or you are left with role players. Take Celtics for example, if they put Walker as plan b and chase other max free agents first, they probably lost Walker too. Ainge probably realised through different routes that the chance for them signing other max players were slim. Same as the Knicks, what would their lineup be if they joined the KL drama? What the Lakers should do is gathering information and target the player who wants to be here. I know it is tempting to going for Giannis but the idea of “ we are the Lakers so we must have a shot at every max free agent” is going to cost us.
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toffee
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 2:26 am    Post subject:

lakersfan8 wrote:
toffee wrote:
Giannis is perfect 2021 plan, but also Beal would be nice plan B.

Keep your eye on Westbrook, maybe we can trade for him next year if he ends up now on some team that's willing to deal with us down the line.

For example, Miami trades now for Westbrook and plays out this season with him and Butler, but then realizes that Russ has three more super expensive years on his contract, so Pat Riley trades him to Lakers for some of our guys on short-term deals and maybe pick or two.

I hope people learn something from this summer. There’s no plan b max free agent. You either sigh a max free agent or you are left with role players. Take Celtics for example, if they put Walker as plan b and chase other max free agents first, they probably lost Walker too. Ainge probably realised through different routes that the chance for them signing other max players were slim. Same as the Knicks, what would their lineup be if they joined the KL drama? What the Lakers should do is gathering information and target the player who wants to be here. I know it is tempting to going for Giannis but the idea of “ we are the Lakers so we must have a shot at every max free agent” is going to cost us.


That's why we have Jason Kidd, he can probably reach to Giannis ahead of time to see if he's interested in joining us in 2021.
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LakersChamps04
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:24 am    Post subject:

greenfrog wrote:
Vancouver Fan wrote:
Remember the days when we drafted talent, developed it and signed great FAs or made trades that benefited the now and the future? With saying that, Giannis or bust in 2021 my dude.


No, I really don't. The 90's "rebuild" was an almost complete waste of time.
yea i have no idea what you're talking about. What talent have we drafted developed outside of kobe fisher and bynum? Thats 3 players in the last 23 years?
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yinoma2001
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:27 am    Post subject:

LakersChamps04 wrote:
greenfrog wrote:
Vancouver Fan wrote:
Remember the days when we drafted talent, developed it and signed great FAs or made trades that benefited the now and the future? With saying that, Giannis or bust in 2021 my dude.


No, I really don't. The 90's "rebuild" was an almost complete waste of time.
yea i have no idea what you're talking about. What talent have we drafted developed outside of kobe fisher and bynum? Thats 3 players in the last 23 years?


Yeah. I don't think the Lakers are about developing young talent.

1. They don't know how to do it.

2. They don't invest in the necessary infrastructure to do it.

3. They don't have the patience to let them grow and make mistakes.
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epak
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:41 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Ralph Mason
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2021 FA Class as of today

Giannis Antetokounmpo
LeBron James
Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Blake Griffin
Bradley Beal
CJ McCollum
Rudy Gobert
Victor Oladipo
Mike Conley
Lamarcus Aldridge
Jrue Holiday

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Runway8
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:07 pm    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
Ben Simmons is the Klutch play. Turn down that contract, sign the QO, and become a Laker in 2021.


Didn't they extend him already?
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LakerMindLA
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:01 pm    Post subject:

epak wrote:
Quote:
Ralph Mason
@Ralph_MasonJr
2021 FA Class as of today

Giannis Antetokounmpo
LeBron James
Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Blake Griffin
Bradley Beal
CJ McCollum
Rudy Gobert
Victor Oladipo
Mike Conley
Lamarcus Aldridge
Jrue Holiday


Giannis Antetokounmpo - Yes, please not leaving.
LeBron James - If he opts out, Lakers shouldn't re-sign for max.
Kawhi Leonard - Not coming to Lakers
Paul George - Not coming to Lakers
Blake Griffin - Not a good pair with AD, age would make him a no go.
Bradley Beal - Max player - maybe.
CJ McCollum - Age would be a concern.
Rudy Gobert - Not a max for Lakers
Victor Oladipo - Doubt he leave Indiana.
Mike Conley - Age would make him a no go
Lamarcus Aldridge - Not a good pair with AD, age would make him a no go.
Jrue Holiday - Not worth the max.


Basically after the pipe-dream of Giannis, only Beal would be worth the max.
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:28 pm    Post subject:

I say no in 2021 for the 2 fuc* boys.
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LakersChamps04
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:58 pm    Post subject:

highsteppingbruin wrote:
I say no in 2021 for the 2 fuc* boys.
They can kiss our ass. That ship has sailed
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toffee
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:41 pm    Post subject:

LakerMindLA wrote:
epak wrote:
Quote:
Ralph Mason
@Ralph_MasonJr
2021 FA Class as of today

Giannis Antetokounmpo
LeBron James
Kawhi Leonard
Paul George
Blake Griffin
Bradley Beal
CJ McCollum
Rudy Gobert
Victor Oladipo
Mike Conley
Lamarcus Aldridge
Jrue Holiday


Giannis Antetokounmpo - Yes, please not leaving.
LeBron James - If he opts out, Lakers shouldn't re-sign for max.
Kawhi Leonard - Not coming to Lakers
Paul George - Not coming to Lakers
Blake Griffin - Not a good pair with AD, age would make him a no go.
Bradley Beal - Max player - maybe.
CJ McCollum - Age would be a concern.
Rudy Gobert - Not a max for Lakers
Victor Oladipo - Doubt he leave Indiana.
Mike Conley - Age would make him a no go
Lamarcus Aldridge - Not a good pair with AD, age would make him a no go.
Jrue Holiday - Not worth the max.


Basically after the pipe-dream of Giannis, only Beal would be worth the max.


Yeah something like that, only Giannis and Beal seem like good targets for us.

And i think that Lebron is opting out for sure, just so that we can give him two or three more years, and i think that he will be flexible enough to leave enough money on the table if Greek Freak is willing to come here.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:22 pm    Post subject:

Laker's Fan wrote:
The path to be able to sign Giannis isn't to have an empty cap when he becomes a free agent. It's about having some basic flexibility and guys under contract that other teams would be willing to take off your hands.

This empty roster and punt deal BS is just a tricky way for ownership to sell you on the cap space idea while keeping the roster cheap (can't get much over the cap if you are a cap room team).


Young players, draft picks, good veterans with tradable contracts, the FO has traded or even cast all of those away.

The contenders usually have a high payroll because they need to pay for a good supporting cast too. The only exception of immediate success with the cap space route-- the 2010-11 Miami Heat.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIA/2011.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/MIA/2012.html
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:23 pm    Post subject:

Would LeBron take a 1 year pay cut in 2021 to about 20-27M? With the agreement of a 2 year max contract following? "Pay Cut" to~3y120M

If so AD/LeBron/Max/KD/THT/2 1st round picks might be possible.30% maxin 2021 with a projected salary cap of 125M would be 37.5M. 35% max 43.8M

AD-37.6M
30% max-37.5M
LeBron-26.7M
Kuzma cap hold-10.7M
THT/2020 1st/2021 1st-6.3M
6 cap holds-6.2M

Edit: Yuck, forget about the Deng dead money. Would make it a lot harder.
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Last edited by dcarter4kobe on Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:26 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:24 pm    Post subject:

In the year 2021 Zo to Zion will be a thing.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:29 pm    Post subject:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6RhAU1WlOec
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:38 pm    Post subject:

Giannis, Beal, or Oladipo would be all great gets.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:45 pm    Post subject:

The Year 2021, a Space Odyssey
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