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| How do you grade the Lakers offseason? |
| A |
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47% |
[ 70 ] |
| B |
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41% |
[ 61 ] |
| C |
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10% |
[ 16 ] |
| D |
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0% |
[ 1 ] |
| F |
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0% |
[ 0 ] |
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| Total Votes : 148 |
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Message |
2019
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014
Posts: 10826
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 Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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I voted B and to be honest, much of it is based on hindsight. If we knew Kawhi was secretly having PG request a trade, we could have done better.. but when you look at it for what it is which is that we were actually in the running to put together maybe the great trio ever, I understood waiting. Part of me still really wishes we got D'lo on day 1, but the reality is that our bench would have been trash whereas now we have legit depth. I
f we get Iggy in the buyout market, I will up our summer to A. Dreaming of these units:
Boogie | McGee
AD | Kuzma | Dudley
LeBron | Iggy
Green | KCP | Daniels | THT
Bradley | Cook | Rondo | Caruso
However, I think bonus points should be given for bringing back Judy Setons, firing Nunez, putting together a stacked staff with Handy most recently. Also, credit for letting AD and LBJ pick the team. We're sending the message to AD and the league that this is where superstars belong.
Last edited by 2019 on Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:17 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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dcarter4kobe
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Joined: 30 Jul 2005
Posts: 17687
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| Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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| 2019 wrote: | I voted B and to be honest, much of it is based on hindsight. If we knew Kawhi was secretly having PG request a trade, we could have done better.. but when you look at it for what it is which is that we were actually in the running to put together maybe the great trio ever, I understood waiting. Part of me still really wishes we got D'lo on day 1, but the reality is that our bench would have been trash whereas now we have legit depth. I
f we get Iggy in the buyout market, I will up our summer to A. Dreaming of these units:
Boogie | McGee
AD | Kuzma | Dudley
LeBron | Iggy
Green | KCP | Daniels | THT
Bradley | Cook | Rondo
However, I think bonus points should be given for bringing back Judy Setons, firing Nunez, putting together a stacked staff with Handy most recently. Also, credit for letting AD and LBJ pick the team. We're sending the message to AD and the league that this is where superstars belong. |
Disagree with our bench being terrible with Dlo. We still could have signed KCP/DMC/Bradley.
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2019
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014
Posts: 10826
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| Posted: Mon Jul 15, 2019 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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| dcarter4kobe wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | I voted B and to be honest, much of it is based on hindsight. If we knew Kawhi was secretly having PG request a trade, we could have done better.. but when you look at it for what it is which is that we were actually in the running to put together maybe the great trio ever, I understood waiting. Part of me still really wishes we got D'lo on day 1, but the reality is that our bench would have been trash whereas now we have legit depth. I
f we get Iggy in the buyout market, I will up our summer to A. Dreaming of these units:
Boogie | McGee
AD | Kuzma | Dudley
LeBron | Iggy
Green | KCP | Daniels | THT
Bradley | Cook | Rondo
However, I think bonus points should be given for bringing back Judy Setons, firing Nunez, putting together a stacked staff with Handy most recently. Also, credit for letting AD and LBJ pick the team. We're sending the message to AD and the league that this is where superstars belong. |
Disagree with our bench being terrible with Dlo. We still could have signed KCP/DMC/Bradley. |
Maybe... but not all 3. Cousins and Caruso with the remaining cap space and Bradley with the RE. Which means no McGee and no KCP. Could we live without those guys? Maybe.
Again, is 2 years of the vets/depth better than D'lo? I don't know but I think it might be. But long term, D'lo was a more preferable plan. Which brings me back to the point of waiting for Kawhi-- IMO, the D'lo to LA thing wasn't just noise. I believe we had hoped D'lo would wait. He found a good situation and took it right away.This FA period, and maybe it was the June 30 versus July 1st date, really moved quickly.
Even with all that, we're at a B/B+. If we get Iggy-- A-/A |
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lakersfan8
Star Player
Joined: 27 May 2014
Posts: 2993
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:23 am Post subject: |
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Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid.
My scenario for grade A would be:
A+ - signing KL
A - signing Irving or Butler
A- - signing other “max players” such as DLO
Grade A to me is mostly about free agency unless we got AD with below market value. Grade B is about getting top quality role players such as Beverley, Brogdon etc or getting AD while keeping one of Ingram, Ball or #4.
However, I want to give another grade specifically to what they have done after missing on KL.
Grade B
Green, Cousins and Morris were the top 3 free agents left and they managed to get two of them. I still don’t like resigning Rondo and KCP. |
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lewis
Star Player
Joined: 23 Oct 2013
Posts: 1165
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:36 am Post subject: |
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They got Davis but overpaid so it's a B (maybe B+), we lost future flexibility/trade chips and young guys that can step up as LeBron ages so it's like a loan we got better this year and the next but we will pay some price in the future.
Green A I like that it's only a 2 year deal and not a 4 year deal, so he should still be decent at age 34
Cousins A - only upside with his contract
Bradley - C slight overpay
KCP - D huge overpay and also giving him that player option so we cannot trade him
Cook/Caruso - B good but flawed players
Rondo - C bad player, but guys seem to want him back??
Dudley - A
McGee - C overpay, I would have taken WCS at his salary instead
I think B overall. If we take the coaching into consideration it will be B- (hate Kidd)
I would have loved if we could have kept one of Lonzo/Ingram with this roster, that would have been an A off-season:
Lonzo/Green/Lebron/AD/Cousins with KCP/Bradley closing instead of cousins
or
Bradley/Green/Ingram/Lebron/AD |
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h2omike
Star Player
Joined: 24 Jun 2005
Posts: 2811
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 4:00 am Post subject: |
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| I think it’s a B-plus. |
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wolfpaclaker
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Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 58348
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 5:53 am Post subject: |
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Based on what anyone could evaluate an offseason on, without knowing the future and just going on the immediate past, I think it is hard for me to see anyone giving Lakers below B, or A.
This has been the best offseason the Lakers have had in a long time. Arguably, the best offseason the Lakers have had since 2003. |
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2019
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014
Posts: 10826
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:06 am Post subject: |
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| lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
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governator
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Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:08 am Post subject: |
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| 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
How would the $ match the AD salary for the trade now that we know Bullocks can't be used for S&T? Kuz makes too little, isn't still had to be Ball/BI +/- Hart or Kuz? |
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2019
Franchise Player
Joined: 03 Dec 2014
Posts: 10826
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:13 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
How would the $ match the AD salary for the trade now that we know Bullocks can't be used for S&T? Kuz makes too little, isn't still had to be Ball/BI +/- Hart or Kuz? |
Guess what I am saying, is that had we never traded JC, Nance, D'lo or Randle, and assuming the cost for AD was still Lonzo, BI, Hart, Picks, we could have held on to a couple of those young players. Which ones? I am not sure. But in theory, the 3rd Max level money could have just been used on them. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144475
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:16 am Post subject: |
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| laker50 wrote: | Has to be an A.
Going from a surefire lottery team to a contender?
And getting two superstars.
And a good supporting cast.
Danny Green, AB, KCP, Cook. Good shooters and defenders.
Add in Demarcus and McGee.
Getting some great coaches. All experienced and respected. |
Everyone is a contender in the offseason
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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wolfpaclaker
Retired Number
Joined: 29 May 2002
Posts: 58348
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:16 am Post subject: |
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| 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
People saying we do not have youth.
Kuzma is 23.
AD is 26.
KCP is 26.
Caruso is 25.
Quinn Cook is 26.
That's half of the Lakers rotation.
We do not have lottery talents who are developing anymore. Well, if you look at most championship level teams, they do not have that. It's rare. And even so, it seems we chose Kuzma over Ingram, because we valued Kuzma more. So in a way we do have that young lottery level talent developing. It's Kuzma. He's got potential to be a 20/7/3 guy in the league. He's not too far off from those numbers already. They may go down with all the new major talent coming in, but once Lebron era is over in 2 years, Kuzma has much more value to the Lakers.
I dunno what about 6 straight years in the lottery with zero all-stars to show for it made Laker fans happy or craving more of it. You would think we wound up with something like OKC back in the day with Durant/Westbrook/Harden. Or Philly with Embiid/Simmons etc. Our youth was not superstar level and they were taking the franchise no where. They can become good players, but I'd take a team with 2 great players and a shot at a title vs a team with 6 good players who give the team no shot. We got to stop acting like Julius Randle, DLO, Ingram, Ball were going to become the next dynasty in the NBA. It was similar to the late 90s/early 2000 Clippers that had Lamar Odom, Olowokandi, Corey Maggette, Jeff McInnis, Quintin Richardson. Sort of like that Clipper team where they were many good young players, the Lakers of the last 4-5 years have been like that. A lot of good in the making young players that will make a few all-star teams maybe when being featured more, but not a team or group collectively that can have any kind of playoff success.
Last edited by wolfpaclaker on Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:23 am; edited 1 time in total |
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yinoma2001
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Posts: 119487
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:19 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I dunno what about 6 straight years in the lottery with zero all-stars to show for it made Laker fans happy or craving more of it. |
We may have youth, but not YUTES. 
And DLO did make an all star game...just sayin'. 
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
Posts: 144475
Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:20 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
How would the $ match the AD salary for the trade now that we know Bullocks can't be used for S&T? Kuz makes too little, isn't still had to be Ball/BI +/- Hart or Kuz? |
That is why we shouldn’t give an A grade. The FO put us in a position where we had to trade every promising young player, not because we wanted to. Poor cap management.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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wolfpaclaker
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Posts: 58348
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:23 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | I dunno what about 6 straight years in the lottery with zero all-stars to show for it made Laker fans happy or craving more of it. |
We may have youth, but not YUTES.
And DLO did make an all star game...just sayin'. |
Sorry I'm not a Nets fan.
0 as Lakers. |
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governator
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Posts: 25092
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:33 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | governator wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
How would the $ match the AD salary for the trade now that we know Bullocks can't be used for S&T? Kuz makes too little, isn't still had to be Ball/BI +/- Hart or Kuz? |
That is why we shouldn’t give an A grade. The FO put us in a position where we had to trade every promising young player, not because we wanted to. Poor cap management. |
How did it have anything to do with cap, we were under the cap?
Are you suggesting that summer 2018 we should've sign players for 2 yrs instead of 1 yr so we can trade them for AD to match salary instead of BI/Ball/Hart? |
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:37 am Post subject: |
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The trade was somewhat predicated on the fact that since we had so many draft picks, we didn't populate the team with tradeable assets. Maybe having Deng still on the books may have provided enough salary ballast.
But in order to have a shot at a trio of KL/AD/LBJ they needed to trade everything off the books to get 3 max players.
If we had Deng on the books and the Pels didn't want him, we wouldn't have space for a 3rd FA to begin with.
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TooMuchMajicBuss
Franchise Player
Joined: 17 Sep 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:44 am Post subject: |
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B+
Iggy would push me to an A-
IF Vogel and his coaching squad get this team to play cohesive basketball by December, it becomes a solid A. |
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:51 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | Quote: | | I dunno what about 6 straight years in the lottery with zero all-stars to show for it made Laker fans happy or craving more of it. |
We may have youth, but not YUTES.
And DLO did make an all star game...just sayin'. |
In the NBA youth fades away at 25, that is where prime should start to kick in.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:52 am Post subject: |
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| governator wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | governator wrote: | | 2019 wrote: | | lakersfan8 wrote: | Overall Grade C
This front office gave away young talent to create cap space and ended up signing role players. I don’t know how can some people give them grade A. Trading for AD is not an achievement if they overpaid. |
Technically, it wasn't this front office. Magic we calling the shots then.
In reality, we could have had a roster where instead of Green, KCP, Boogie, etc we had some pieces of our youth left over. |
How would the $ match the AD salary for the trade now that we know Bullocks can't be used for S&T? Kuz makes too little, isn't still had to be Ball/BI +/- Hart or Kuz? |
That is why we shouldn’t give an A grade. The FO put us in a position where we had to trade every promising young player, not because we wanted to. Poor cap management. |
How did it have anything to do with cap, we were under the cap?
Are you suggesting that summer 2018 we should've sign players for 2 yrs instead of 1 yr so we can trade them for AD to match salary instead of BI/Ball/Hart? |
That is what teams typically do.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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venturalakersfan
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Joined: 14 Apr 2001
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:55 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | The trade was somewhat predicated on the fact that since we had so many draft picks, we didn't populate the team with tradeable assets. Maybe having Deng still on the books may have provided enough salary ballast.
But in order to have a shot at a trio of KL/AD/LBJ they needed to trade everything off the books to get 3 max players.
If we had Deng on the books and the Pels didn't want him, we wouldn't have space for a 3rd FA to begin with. |
They weren’t tradable assets because they were being paid nothing. Trades in the NBA are still numbers oriented and the only way to make the AD trade work was to add more low salaried players. The problem isn’t trading the young players, it is the lack of planning.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | The trade was somewhat predicated on the fact that since we had so many draft picks, we didn't populate the team with tradeable assets. Maybe having Deng still on the books may have provided enough salary ballast.
But in order to have a shot at a trio of KL/AD/LBJ they needed to trade everything off the books to get 3 max players.
If we had Deng on the books and the Pels didn't want him, we wouldn't have space for a 3rd FA to begin with. |
They weren’t tradable assets because they were being paid nothing. Trades in the NBA are still numbers oriented and the only way to make the AD trade work was to add more low salaried players. The problem isn’t trading the young players, it is the lack of planning. |
The goal seemed to be 3 max players (2 via FA + 1 via trade). They put themselves in a position but had bad intel on Kawhi (and so did everyone else).
But if we held onto Deng, we would not have had the cap space to get a 3rd max player b/c BI/Lonzo/4th pick would take up too much space so they would have likely gone out regardless.
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venturalakersfan
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Location: The Gold Coast
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:06 am Post subject: |
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| yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | The trade was somewhat predicated on the fact that since we had so many draft picks, we didn't populate the team with tradeable assets. Maybe having Deng still on the books may have provided enough salary ballast.
But in order to have a shot at a trio of KL/AD/LBJ they needed to trade everything off the books to get 3 max players.
If we had Deng on the books and the Pels didn't want him, we wouldn't have space for a 3rd FA to begin with. |
They weren’t tradable assets because they were being paid nothing. Trades in the NBA are still numbers oriented and the only way to make the AD trade work was to add more low salaried players. The problem isn’t trading the young players, it is the lack of planning. |
The goal seemed to be 3 max players (2 via FA + 1 via trade). They put themselves in a position but had bad intel on Kawhi (and so did everyone else).
But if we held onto Deng, we would not have had the cap space to get a 3rd max player b/c BI/Lonzo/4th pick would take up too much space so they would have likely gone out regardless. |
That has been the problem for several years now, little flexibility. Chasing a dream instead of operating as most teams do. You see other teams make moves by moving salaries around, they don’t empty the coffers every offseason and chase the latest thing. We wanted Pau, we had Kwame’s salary to trade. Clippers wanted George, they had Gallo’s salary to trade. Raptors wanted Kawhi, they had DeRozan’s salary to trade. That is where our FO could use some experienced leadership.
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yinoma2001
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:17 am Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | yinoma2001 wrote: | The trade was somewhat predicated on the fact that since we had so many draft picks, we didn't populate the team with tradeable assets. Maybe having Deng still on the books may have provided enough salary ballast.
But in order to have a shot at a trio of KL/AD/LBJ they needed to trade everything off the books to get 3 max players.
If we had Deng on the books and the Pels didn't want him, we wouldn't have space for a 3rd FA to begin with. |
They weren’t tradable assets because they were being paid nothing. Trades in the NBA are still numbers oriented and the only way to make the AD trade work was to add more low salaried players. The problem isn’t trading the young players, it is the lack of planning. |
The goal seemed to be 3 max players (2 via FA + 1 via trade). They put themselves in a position but had bad intel on Kawhi (and so did everyone else).
But if we held onto Deng, we would not have had the cap space to get a 3rd max player b/c BI/Lonzo/4th pick would take up too much space so they would have likely gone out regardless. |
That has been the problem for several years now, little flexibility. Chasing a dream instead of operating as most teams do. You see other teams make moves by moving salaries around, they don’t empty the coffers every offseason and chase the latest thing. We wanted Pau, we had Kwame’s salary to trade. Clippers wanted George, they had Gallo’s salary to trade. Raptors wanted Kawhi, they had DeRozan’s salary to trade. That is where our FO could use some experienced leadership. |
And now they have two top 7 players, and a bunch of tradeable assets on no greater than 2 year deals. I think Rob has made mistakes (and I think a lot of it is attributable to Magic), but he has really done a good job recovering from Kawhi.
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quartzcharm
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| Posted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:27 am Post subject: |
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I give them a B-
I mark off for what happened with the coaching fiasco, missing out on/being played by Kawhi, and resigning KCP for $8 million per year.
With that said, I'm mostly happy with the way they rebounded and filled out the roster. |
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