Vogel - Great Job
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Ziggy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:17 pm    Post subject:

awntawn wrote:
Scoffs wrote:
A coach that makes in-game adjustments; we haven't seen that in years.

It's so weird to see timeouts called and actually see something happen on the other end. When the other team goes on a run and we call a timeout, we've been so conditioned to think "Ah (bleep), here we go". Now we're coming out of the timeouts and going on counter runs and it's like, oh (bleep), we can do that?

Vogel doesn't have to be Doc Rivers or Phil Jackson. We don't need the most efficient motion flow offense. We just needed a competent coach who can not flat out lose us games that we should be winning. Vogel is at the very least a competent NBA head coach. Luke wasn't.


I agree the coaching looks better, but at the same time we went from one of the youngest teams in the league to one of the oldest . The young core hadn't really learned how to play winning basketball yet.
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awntawn
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:31 pm    Post subject:

Ziggy wrote:
awntawn wrote:
Scoffs wrote:
A coach that makes in-game adjustments; we haven't seen that in years.

It's so weird to see timeouts called and actually see something happen on the other end. When the other team goes on a run and we call a timeout, we've been so conditioned to think "Ah (bleep), here we go". Now we're coming out of the timeouts and going on counter runs and it's like, oh (bleep), we can do that?

Vogel doesn't have to be Doc Rivers or Phil Jackson. We don't need the most efficient motion flow offense. We just needed a competent coach who can not flat out lose us games that we should be winning. Vogel is at the very least a competent NBA head coach. Luke wasn't.


I agree the coaching looks better, but at the same time we went from one of the youngest teams in the league to one of the oldest . The young core hadn't really learned how to play winning basketball yet.

That's fair. I'd contend that Luke's poor decision making was so poor you could actually see it, but that may be subjective. The ultimate litmus test is the Kings. I'd predicted that they'd take a step back this year despite an improved roster. The season's early, but Kings fans already seem to hate him.
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PHILosophize
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 12:49 pm    Post subject:

credit where credit is due
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Ziggy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 2:02 pm    Post subject:

awntawn wrote:
Ziggy wrote:
awntawn wrote:
Scoffs wrote:
A coach that makes in-game adjustments; we haven't seen that in years.

It's so weird to see timeouts called and actually see something happen on the other end. When the other team goes on a run and we call a timeout, we've been so conditioned to think "Ah (bleep), here we go". Now we're coming out of the timeouts and going on counter runs and it's like, oh (bleep), we can do that?

Vogel doesn't have to be Doc Rivers or Phil Jackson. We don't need the most efficient motion flow offense. We just needed a competent coach who can not flat out lose us games that we should be winning. Vogel is at the very least a competent NBA head coach. Luke wasn't.


I agree the coaching looks better, but at the same time we went from one of the youngest teams in the league to one of the oldest . The young core hadn't really learned how to play winning basketball yet.

That's fair. I'd contend that Luke's poor decision making was so poor you could actually see it, but that may be subjective. The ultimate litmus test is the Kings. I'd predicted that they'd take a step back this year despite an improved roster. The season's early, but Kings fans already seem to hate him.


It was definitely visible . Like you said, we were awful with ATO's. That was one area I remember D'Antoni actually being really good at with us. If I recall Brad Stevens actually had the highest PPP on ATO's his first year in Boston. With Luke I just looked at timeouts as a chance for the players to get a breather.
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Car54
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 2:35 pm    Post subject:

The Nightbringer wrote:
All he needs to do is stop playing KCP.


I think people are overreacting because of the Clippers game. KCP stayed with Kawhi he’s just not big enough to bother his shot. Danny isn’t bulky but he knows what Kawhi likes so he uses that to take away his comfort and forces him into turning the ball over or giving it up. KCP should be ok guys like Lou Williams and Conley. Avery I believe is stronger than KCP so he has success defending bigger players
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wolfpaclaker
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:32 pm    Post subject:

Car54 wrote:
The Nightbringer wrote:
All he needs to do is stop playing KCP.


I think people are overreacting because of the Clippers game. KCP stayed with Kawhi he’s just not big enough to bother his shot. Danny isn’t bulky but he knows what Kawhi likes so he uses that to take away his comfort and forces him into turning the ball over or giving it up. KCP should be ok guys like Lou Williams and Conley. Avery I believe is stronger than KCP so he has success defending bigger players

Once Kuzma is back, I do not see Vogel giving KCP minutes at 3. KCP will get the backup 2 role if he is able to outplay Daniels, Which currently he is not.

So I do not see a reason to overreact to this until Kuzma is back.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:43 pm    Post subject:

I don't like the idea of LeBron always bringing the ball upcourt. It's going to wear him out at his age. Let Bradley do it as much as reasonably possible to keep LeBron fresh.

I also wonder about the pace. Does Vogel want us to play at such a slow pace and always win ugly? There a clip they keep showing on Spectrum Sportsnet where he says "if we aren't a great defensive rebounding team we can't be a great running team."
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StoicChalice392
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:04 pm    Post subject:

LakerLanny wrote:
Meanwhile Kings 0-2 under Lucas Walton and not guarding anyone.

Frankie V for Life!


Luke has the potential to become a very good volleyball coach.
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oaktown_dimond
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:44 pm    Post subject:

Man, brutal loss for Luke tonight. 0-3. 32 point loss to the jazz. Not saying the kings with Vogel at the helm would have gone scorched earth but I feel bad for the guy.
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kobe8One
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:00 pm    Post subject:

oaktown_dimond wrote:
Man, brutal loss for Luke tonight. 0-3. 32 point loss to the jazz. Not saying the kings with Vogel at the helm would have gone scorched earth but I feel bad for the guy.


Luke won't last long....
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noahp45
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:05 pm    Post subject:

Lakers need a Point Guard. They will do better with Rondo but they need to get rid of KCP and d get a real POint guard
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:06 pm    Post subject:

StoicChalice392 wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Meanwhile Kings 0-2 under Lucas Walton and not guarding anyone.

Frankie V for Life!


Luke has the potential to become a very good volleyball coach.


He sucks,dude is a assistant coach that's it.
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Nonamehero
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 9:57 pm    Post subject:

noahp45 wrote:
StoicChalice392 wrote:
LakerLanny wrote:
Meanwhile Kings 0-2 under Lucas Walton and not guarding anyone.

Frankie V for Life!


Luke has the potential to become a very good volleyball coach.


He sucks,dude is a assistant coach that's it.


Luke is a straight up idiot, I am not sure if he even knows basketball seeing how he coach, it almost seem like he does thing to keep his team from winning.

Any team that hire him is stupid as well, gg to the kings.
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AFireInside619
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 10:00 pm    Post subject:

Thanks Mitch and Jim for Byron, Luke, MozDeng, and the Kobe legacy contract. Ruined our rebuild.
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wolfpaclaker
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:34 am    Post subject:

Luke was hired by Jim and Mitch, but Jeanie also supported him big time. Magic and Rob wanted Luke gone a long time ago, but Jeanie seemed to resist. From what I understand even last season going into the first year of LBJ, they wanted Luke gone. I don't fault Jim/Mitch for Luke, that was on Jeanie as well as when Magic/Rob came in 2017, during the first full year there they wanted to change from Luke, and Jeanie resisted.

I am surprised he has not turned out to be a decent head coach. Things could turn around in Sacto, it is early. I think Luke's problem has not been his Xs and Os. I feel he doesn't outline roles for players on the team, and doesn't have a longterm vision for how he wants the team to play. Because he had elite taletn in LA as a player and Phil took it is easy (or so Luke thought) and then again as a coach in Golden State things just went so smoothly, I think he didn't figure out all the little plans and assignments you have to give each player. I feel a lot of the players on Luke's teams didn't know what their role was on the team and eventually it seemed that Luke himself didn't know what sort of team he was trying to build.

Still I think it is way too early in Sacto to dump on him.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:53 am    Post subject:

Frank did a nice job, especially going to small ball (and super small ball when LJ was on the bench), putting Daniels in the lineup and giving him run, and keeping the minutes down for our studs (he realized the game was really never in doubt). He is still playing KCP too much (playing him at all may be too much). He obviously needs to make some adjustments, but so far so good.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 6:01 am    Post subject:

I like Vogel's defensive mindset & toughness. A team without these two things will never win an NBA championship. He is instilling that and it will take us a long way towards our ultimate goal.

After two games we are averaging 9 steals and 8 blocks per game which shows that the players are actually buying into the defensive mindset. So far, so good.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 6:21 am    Post subject:

pio2u wrote:
I like Vogel's defensive mindset & toughness. A team without these two things will never win an NBA championship. He is instilling that and it will take us a long way towards our ultimate goal.

After two games we are averaging 9 steals and 8 blocks per game which shows that the players are actually buying into the defensive mindset. So far, so good.


Yup, our defense is looking solid. If we only had a better offensive mind than Kidd as an assistant.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:25 am    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
Thanks Mitch and Jim for Byron, Luke, MozDeng, and the Kobe legacy contract. Ruined our rebuild.


Can't complain on the Kobe contract
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LakerLanny
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 8:44 am    Post subject:

kobe8One wrote:
oaktown_dimond wrote:
Man, brutal loss for Luke tonight. 0-3. 32 point loss to the jazz. Not saying the kings with Vogel at the helm would have gone scorched earth but I feel bad for the guy.


Luke won't last long....


He was a terrible hire and a downgrade from Joeger.
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LandsbergerRules
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:00 am    Post subject:

oaktown_dimond wrote:
Man, brutal loss for Luke tonight. 0-3. 32 point loss to the jazz. Not saying the kings with Vogel at the helm would have gone scorched earth but I feel bad for the guy.


Damn. Did Luke bring his frat bros to Sac to be his assistants?
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LakerLogic
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:29 am    Post subject:

He did what most fans were screaming for. Nothing special.
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Lakeshow323
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:33 pm    Post subject:

oaktown_dimond wrote:
Man, brutal loss for Luke tonight. 0-3. 32 point loss to the jazz. Not saying the kings with Vogel at the helm would have gone scorched earth but I feel bad for the guy.


Feel bad?! He's stolen like 40+ million dollars from the Lakers as a player and coach. Dude can go F off.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 5:13 am    Post subject:

Have to agree with the other posters, one of Lukes biggest flaws was failing to adjust in game, especially at the half...Vogel is obviously seeing what roster shuffling he can do in game to maximize the opportunity to win...players and coaches have all been bringing it
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 6:53 am    Post subject:

Vogie has us at 2-1 and the Clippers played out of their minds in the opener.

Nice to see a Lakers team that will actually defend, I had forgotten what that looks like.

It will be interesting to see if they can keep the defensive intensity up on the road.
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