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Rhazz
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 Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:35 am Post subject: |
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| They chose locker room “chemistry” over actually good proven players. I put “chemistry” in quotes because that good cheer they’re so high on will dissipate quickly once the losses start piling up and they start slipping in the standings. 5-5 in the last ten games is a pretty good indicator of where we seem to be going. Teams seem to have figured them out. Decent teams at least. Barring a magical turn-around in team philosophy, and a jump in ability and game-sense in certain players, rest of the season will be rough. |
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Nash Vegas
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| Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:45 am Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
Not a bad metaphor actually... ...
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MJST
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| Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:06 am Post subject: |
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The team doesn't have a single dog on this roster.
There's a reason why LBJ needed a Kyrie and a Wade on the team with them, they had that mentality.
AD hasn't really shown to have that mentality, and LeBron's comes and goes, but it's better if he has someone on the team that's willing to have that mentality first.
But this team as it is, doesn't have that. They needed that third star, they needed the Kawhi or the Russell the piece that had a take over the game mentality and dog in them, Ingram had been showing it too but he was moved to get AD. But without THAT, the team lacks something that every other LeBron superteam that won a chip had.
This is why a lot lamented selling the barn for AD instead of going after him in free agency to try to add to what we had. Because LBJ and AD and a bunch of mid levels + Kuzma is likely not gonna get it done when the chips are down.
So they have a good record, but they're soft, and it shows whenever they get punched in the mouth. Just like Dallas a few years ago that seemed unbeatable, but when the Lakers punched them in the mouth, they folded. it wound up telling the story for their playoff prospects as well.
Then Dallas suffered again, when Wade did it to them and they fell short (refs or otherwise), but by the time Dirk faced Miami, he'd felt that pain twice and wasn't going to let it happen again and they had players on that team that had that grit in them when things got rough.
THIS team doesn't have that, and we don't have three failures to bank on. This is an all or nothing year.
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njeezy08
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Joined: 25 Dec 2019
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| Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:35 am Post subject: |
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| MJST wrote: | The team doesn't have a single dog on this roster.
There's a reason why LBJ needed a Kyrie and a Wade on the team with them, they had that mentality.
AD hasn't really shown to have that mentality, and LeBron's comes and goes, but it's better if he has someone on the team that's willing to have that mentality first.
But this team as it is, doesn't have that. They needed that third star, they needed the Kawhi or the Russell the piece that had a take over the game mentality and dog in them, Ingram had been showing it too but he was moved to get AD. But without THAT, the team lacks something that every other LeBron superteam that won a chip had.
This is why a lot lamented selling the barn for AD instead of going after him in free agency to try to add to what we had. Because LBJ and AD and a bunch of mid levels + Kuzma is likely not gonna get it done when the chips are down.
So they have a good record, but they're soft, and it shows whenever they get punched in the mouth. Just like Dallas a few years ago that seemed unbeatable, but when the Lakers punched them in the mouth, they folded. it wound up telling the story for their playoff prospects as well.
Then Dallas suffered again, when Wade did it to them and they fell short (refs or otherwise), but by the time Dirk faced Miami, he'd felt that pain twice and wasn't going to let it happen again and they had players on that team that had that grit in them when things got rough.
THIS team doesn't have that, and we don't have three failures to bank on. This is an all or nothing year. |
Wtf has Kyrie done in this league before and after Bron? Honestly its crazy you would even put him and Wade in the same category. Besides that, Wade was a shell of his former self after the Mavs finals. He just was.. people seem to have forgotten that he wasn't but Flash was gone.
The closer for every Lebron team, has always been Lebron. Again, because you shoot the ball a lot DOES NOT MAKE YOU A CLOSER. Stop listening to media driven narratives |
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lar9149
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| Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:56 am Post subject: |
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| Rhazz wrote: | | They chose locker room “chemistry” over actually good proven players. I put “chemistry” in quotes because that good cheer they’re so high on will dissipate quickly once the losses start piling up and they start slipping in the standings. 5-5 in the last ten games is a pretty good indicator of where we seem to be going. Teams seem to have figured them out. Decent teams at least. Barring a magical turn-around in team philosophy, and a jump in ability and game-sense in certain players, rest of the season will be rough. |
It’s so hard to decide how important chemistry is.
Shaq said in an interview one time he didn’t believe much in off court chemistry.
I don’t know which is true?
I for one believe in chemistry off and on the court. The 2012 Lakers were an example of great talent and poor chemistry. But that maybe because in general we are believer in the human spirit over talent. But perhaps that is just good marketing. For example in one of the fast and furious movies Van Diesel was speaking to his enemy and his enemy was talking like he believed in talent while Diesel believed in family. In the end Van Diesel wins of course. But this is the ending everyone wants and believes in. It is hard to say if it’s realIty
It would be interesting to see as the Clippers went for talent over chemistry while the Lakers have good talent, they choose chemistry as more important (as chosen when they decided to keep Green and Kuzma over trading for Morris)
I still think in the long term especially playoffs chemistry wins. But we will see. |
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MJST
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| Posted: Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:01 am Post subject: |
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| njeezy08 wrote: | | MJST wrote: | The team doesn't have a single dog on this roster.
There's a reason why LBJ needed a Kyrie and a Wade on the team with them, they had that mentality.
AD hasn't really shown to have that mentality, and LeBron's comes and goes, but it's better if he has someone on the team that's willing to have that mentality first.
But this team as it is, doesn't have that. They needed that third star, they needed the Kawhi or the Russell the piece that had a take over the game mentality and dog in them, Ingram had been showing it too but he was moved to get AD. But without THAT, the team lacks something that every other LeBron superteam that won a chip had.
This is why a lot lamented selling the barn for AD instead of going after him in free agency to try to add to what we had. Because LBJ and AD and a bunch of mid levels + Kuzma is likely not gonna get it done when the chips are down.
So they have a good record, but they're soft, and it shows whenever they get punched in the mouth. Just like Dallas a few years ago that seemed unbeatable, but when the Lakers punched them in the mouth, they folded. it wound up telling the story for their playoff prospects as well.
Then Dallas suffered again, when Wade did it to them and they fell short (refs or otherwise), but by the time Dirk faced Miami, he'd felt that pain twice and wasn't going to let it happen again and they had players on that team that had that grit in them when things got rough.
THIS team doesn't have that, and we don't have three failures to bank on. This is an all or nothing year. |
Wtf has Kyrie done in this league before and after Bron? Honestly its crazy you would even put him and Wade in the same category. |
Congrats on missing the point entirely.
Also Wade was a shell of his former self when LeBron got there?
You obviously never watched Wade the season prior when he averaged 27/6/5 and carried the Heat to the playoffs by himself in arguably an MVP level effort.
Or are you talking about the season LeBron got there where despite playing with two other stars Wade was still the team's leader and put up 25/6/4 on 50% from the field... that the "shell of his former self" Dwyane Wade you're referencing?  There's a lot of players that would love for those numbers to be their "shell of their former selves" numbers.
But that's not the point of the post anyway, a point that you missed almost entirely. If you don't think Kyrie was a closer with a killer mentality.. then there's not much more to say.
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lakurluv
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 4:53 am Post subject: |
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As phenomenal as LBJ is, he's always lacked the killer instinct, however it's not something that should stop a team from winning a championship!
If you're the better team, then that's just it in a nutshell! If you're not, well there you have it.
I've always felt wherever a team lacked in terms of leadership, tenacity, 'Killer Instinct', that it would be the Coaches job to step up in that area and impose his will to win onto his team at any given time...
We've had these type of coaches in our league and they still exist, however I don't feel that Vogel is that type of coach. He's good and done a good job with this team, but he's no Phil Jackson, Greg Popovich, or even Doc Rivers for that matter!
When your team lacks that type of 'Closer' you have to reinforce it in their style of play! Prior to Kawhi coming over to the Clippers, look how they played without a superstar. That had everything to do with Doc Rivers tenacity and 'Killer Instinct' as a coach. If and that's a big IF; LBJ and Davis are unable to reach this type of 'MAMBA MENTALITY' that's needed to win a championship, it's going to be tough. Someone has got to step it up! |
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pio2u
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 5:48 am Post subject: |
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| Morris could have been our "Metta-Lite." We NEED a junkyard dog! |
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wolfpaclaker
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:06 am Post subject: |
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The Lakers have been through an emotional roller coaster and have had a comfortable lead a top of the West almost all season. You have to factor in how they were playing at season's start with regards to intensity on D.
The season is very long. Anyone seen former NBA players talk about this as the dog days of the season? Now add that Kobe Bean was a huge loss to the franchise and it's players. The emotional impact of that will take.
It will pick up again, their intensity and consistency. Killer instinct. They have it in them.
People talk about Morris as if he was some game changer. It was not like Metta at all. Metta led an average Houston team in the playoffs and was a major impact force in that series. He was the second best player on an EC powerhouse. Morris had zero impact for the Knicks, and he would have been a better role player for us than Kuzma in the short term. However you would have gained in one position and spot (backup 4, wing D) and lost in another (shooting at the 2, D at 2) with Danny Green going out. Not to mention that was overpaying for a role player whose bird rights you would not even have. |
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Outspoken
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:18 am Post subject: |
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| epic_ wrote: | I disagree.
I think we are not tough enough mentally and physically! |
I don't think we are tough enough neither; except Rondo. Physical is attached to their mental. They just wanna be cool with everyone. They don't want a player to look at them any type of negative way. They are the type to hit you to the ground and at some point, tell them "my bad." They don't have that dog in them where they couldn't care less about their opponents feelings. That is really why Kuz isn't that good nor consistent, because even though he is good in the post, mentally he doesn't feel comfortable backing someone down because he is too nice of a guy. He could shoot and hope that he makes it, and when his long shot isn't falling, he could get down on that elbow or block and back his player down. Draw a double, and pass it out to the open man. Do some work in the post, throw up your hand, demand the ball. Do some mid range work. He doesn't. He does that passive floater all the time. Don't get me wrong, it's good to have in your arsenal, and can be effective, Tony Parker made a career out of it, but Tony Parker was a small dude and Kuz isn't ans does it a lot to avoid contact, not because it is really effective or efficient.
Only Rondo has that consistent dog in him on this team. That is what separates the killers. That's why when people bag on Rondo, I don't because I understand what Rondo is capable of and that's why there is always a "playoff Rondo." He eases up in the regular season and then kicks it up a notch in the playoffs; like Bron and it is seeming like AD is going down that path as well, but rest a sure, Rondo is the only consistent dog on this team. He will do whatever to you and not think twice about it. If he knocks you down, slaps you in the face, elbows you, etc, he couldn't care less and won't ask if you are alright. Bron too, but a player have to really push him to that. He doesn't like nor want to be in that state of mind because his personality is of such a cool, passive dude. He doesn't separate basketball games and real life, he is the same in both. A player like Dame understands that in the game, it's nothing personal. He could turn it off, off of the court.
That is what this team lacks; mental toughness, that translate into physical toughness, outside of Rondo and a pushed Bron. I have seen a little bit in Dwight Howard this year. |
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Outspoken
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 7:41 am Post subject: |
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| Nash Vegas wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
Not a bad metaphor actually... ... |
It is a bad metaphor, considering Shaq was a dog. Even though he used to joke and play around, in the game, he couldn't care less about his opponents feelings. Remember the story Kobe told at his statue ceremony; they played the spurs and Shaq told Kobe, give it to me early, David Robinson wasn't nice to me when I was younger. Shaq just wanted to punish him. He wanted to punish everyone that he went up against. That's where hack a Shaq came from. It wasn't because he couldn't shoot free throws as they do now, it's because they couldn't handle shaq down low. |
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governator
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:07 am Post subject: |
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| hopefully we just coasting, bunch of 30+ vets... but Kuzma and Caruso should be balling |
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lakerican
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:42 am Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
There was only Kobe. |
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 9:18 am Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
I doubt that I’ve disagreed with anything more than this. We have no Shaqs.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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LakersRGolden
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| Posted: Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:26 pm Post subject: |
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| venturalakersfan wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
I doubt that I’ve disagreed with anything more than this. We have no Shaqs. |
It's always reassuring you're right when this is VLF's response. |
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Villain6Activated
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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The answer is obviously Jared Dudley but no one wants to admit it.
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venturalakersfan
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
I doubt that I’ve disagreed with anything more than this. We have no Shaqs. |
It's always reassuring you're right when this is VLF's response. |
Did you even watch Shaq play? If so that is a ridiculous statement, one that others took exception to.
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RIP mom. 11-21-1933 to 6-14-2023. |
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GTL
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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Are some of you actually implying Shaq wasn’t a dog? He posterized everyone he faced and dunked with a force that literally, LITERALLY broke NBA backboards.
How quickly some forget his dominance during our 3 peat.
There was nobody and nothing that could stop him.
We have no Shaq and there are and have not been any equals since.
Although Bynum came close........
......
.....
...
..
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I miss you Kobe. I miss you Gigi. |
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M2K
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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| ingle wrote: | | Lebron and AD ain't closers, that's not their games and not their personalities. |
Lebron and AD doesn't have that "dog in them" personalities. Lakers need a closer, someone who wants to punish their opponent in the 4th quarter, especially late in the 4th quarters.
Unfortunately, LAC has several of these type of players.
Lakers need to pick up 1-2 gritty players...starting with Dion Waiters.
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A three headed monster... Jeannie, Pelinka, and Ham... another terrible season. |
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hype
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:52 pm Post subject: |
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| GTL wrote: | Are some of you actually implying Shaq wasn’t a dog? He posterized everyone he faced and dunked with a force that literally, LITERALLY broke NBA backboards.
How quickly some forget his dominance during our 3 peat.
There was nobody and nothing that could stop him.
We have no Shaq and there are and have not been any equals since.
Although Bynum came close........
......
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...
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Yeah man, really making me question if any of these people agreeing to it even watched him as a Laker
He coasted for sure at times in the regular season but when things got serious towards the end of the season and into the Playoffs he was a ***** animal. |
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TheBlackMamba
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| Posted: Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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Agree that this latest stretch is highly concerning - Bron is starting to look his age and AD isn't as impactful on offense as he needs to be. But I also acknowledge it's a stretch in the season that's typically wonky and it's not uncommon to see a downgrade in play after teams come firing out of the gate like we did in October to December. These are the dull months of the season leading up to the ASB, after which hopefully we see the team returning to some semblance of their early season form. It's not an excuse, it's just the reality of an 82-game schedule that spans 7 months, leading up the games that actually matter and we need to be healthy/rested for.
So personally, I'm not gonna buy into this narrative that we don't have any closers until you know, they can't close something that actually means something in the postseason. |
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vasashi17+
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| Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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Maybe they got a bit of that instinct in em after all? 
Haha |
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ringfinger
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| Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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| lar9149 wrote: | | Rhazz wrote: | | They chose locker room “chemistry” over actually good proven players. I put “chemistry” in quotes because that good cheer they’re so high on will dissipate quickly once the losses start piling up and they start slipping in the standings. 5-5 in the last ten games is a pretty good indicator of where we seem to be going. Teams seem to have figured them out. Decent teams at least. Barring a magical turn-around in team philosophy, and a jump in ability and game-sense in certain players, rest of the season will be rough. |
It’s so hard to decide how important chemistry is.
Shaq said in an interview one time he didn’t believe much in off court chemistry.
I don’t know which is true?
I for one believe in chemistry off and on the court. The 2012 Lakers were an example of great talent and poor chemistry. But that maybe because in general we are believer in the human spirit over talent. But perhaps that is just good marketing. For example in one of the fast and furious movies Van Diesel was speaking to his enemy and his enemy was talking like he believed in talent while Diesel believed in family. In the end Van Diesel wins of course. But this is the ending everyone wants and believes in. It is hard to say if it’s realIty
It would be interesting to see as the Clippers went for talent over chemistry while the Lakers have good talent, they choose chemistry as more important (as chosen when they decided to keep Green and Kuzma over trading for Morris)
I still think in the long term especially playoffs chemistry wins. But we will see. |
How important chemistry is, depends on your goal.
Short term? Not that much.
Long term? It is everything.
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kwase
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| Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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| LakersRGolden wrote: | | venturalakersfan wrote: | | LakersRGolden wrote: | | There are Kobes and there are Shaqs. We seem to have 2 Shaqs. |
I doubt that I’ve disagreed with anything more than this. We have no Shaqs. |
It's always reassuring you're right when this is VLF's response. |
As much as it pains me, I have to agree with VLF. Shaq had fight in him and would take things personally to prove a point. He had some "nasty" in him. Nobody on this team equals that. |
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cencio_999
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| Posted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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Chemistry is not only about laughing and fooling around togheter.
However my belief is that we are not talented enough as a team for winning while having fun.
We need to stay focused, angry and hungry if we want to win it all. |
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