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LakersMD
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 5:53 pm    Post subject:

Luminous8 wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
Thinking that, if we don't trade 28 and we basically keep our roster as it is, we will probably need a SF/PF that can shoot (especially if we try to sign a SF/PF 3rd string defender that can't really shoot, a la Harkless/RHJ). I've been high on Tillie as a guy that can hopefully impact soon as a shooter, solid athletically too

Needs defensive improvement, but I see him as a poor man's Gallo


He's actually one of the best defenders in the draft.

He just needs to stay healthy. He's definitely not Gallo though.


He’s not Gallo, but I can see the similarities. Tillie just has such a good IQ, unselfish, and can see the floor. He’s been a favorite of mine for the last year or so. Can’t remember, but iirc you mentioned him some time ago and got me initially interested.


He had a mid first round projection after his sophomore year. Derailed by injuries but the talent is still there. But lower extremity injuries are always dicey as far as long term projections so it’s not surprising GMs may shy away.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 7:24 pm    Post subject:

LakersMD wrote:
Luminous8 wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
Thinking that, if we don't trade 28 and we basically keep our roster as it is, we will probably need a SF/PF that can shoot (especially if we try to sign a SF/PF 3rd string defender that can't really shoot, a la Harkless/RHJ). I've been high on Tillie as a guy that can hopefully impact soon as a shooter, solid athletically too

Needs defensive improvement, but I see him as a poor man's Gallo


He's actually one of the best defenders in the draft.

He just needs to stay healthy. He's definitely not Gallo though.


He’s not Gallo, but I can see the similarities. Tillie just has such a good IQ, unselfish, and can see the floor. He’s been a favorite of mine for the last year or so. Can’t remember, but iirc you mentioned him some time ago and got me initially interested.


He had a mid first round projection after his sophomore year. Derailed by injuries but the talent is still there. But lower extremity injuries are always dicey as far as long term projections so it’s not surprising GMs may shy away.

He's more akin to skinny Marc Gasol than Gallo. Hopefully an NBA med and training staff can keep him healthy.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 9:57 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
My top 5 shooters. Factoring in 3pt, catch and shoot, off pull ups, off screens. The only rank I have is Merrill as number 1.

Sam Merrill
Immanuel Quickley
Desmond Bane
Aaron Nesmith
Saddiq Bey


No Nate Darling?


He was in the mix but I also gave some weight to their draft potential.


I guess that was part of the point for me. If he's on the list, then, he's definitely worth the shot as a UDFA.

I'm all for Nate Darling as a UDFA. Can shoot the hell out of the ball and looks to have some decent finishing ability too
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:05 pm    Post subject:

Duncan Robinson was working out in LA before the draft. Pelinka, being a Michigan guy, wanted him. The Heat’s scout, who also lives in LA, drove to see Robinson work out. He told Pat Riley that they need to get this kid. After going undrafted, Robinson chose the Heat due to their player development. Imagine how badly we would have messed up that kid’s chances in the league.
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2020 10:15 pm    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
Duncan Robinson was working out in LA before the draft. Pelinka, being a Michigan guy, wanted him. The Heat’s scout, who also lives in LA, drove to see Robinson work out. He told Pat Riley that they need to get this kid. After going undrafted, Robinson chose the Heat due to their player development. Imagine how badly we would have messed up that kid’s chances in the league.


He said he didn't want to go to the Lakers because at the time, we had too many young players so he didn't see an opportunity to break into the rotation. Don't think we ever really had a chance to get him unless Rob had offered a guaranteed deal.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 7:22 am    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
Duncan Robinson was working out in LA before the draft. Pelinka, being a Michigan guy, wanted him. The Heat’s scout, who also lives in LA, drove to see Robinson work out. He told Pat Riley that they need to get this kid. After going undrafted, Robinson chose the Heat due to their player development. Imagine how badly we would have messed up that kid’s chances in the league.


I ain't mad. MIA worked best to maximize his ability.

LAL is working best to maximize Anthony Davis's ability.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 10:32 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
LakerLogic wrote:
I would take Bolmaro, he has some Luka to his game.


Draft and stash or bring him over?

If they use 28 I am leaning towards players who could play next year but a stash would be fine.


I have him Top 25. Needs NBA strength, an idea on how to create an open look without being C&S, but for now plays like DeRozan without the shooting ability. He's like a weird, high motor, role playing version of Rubio.


Liked what I saw from him. Would bring some attacking/playmaking from the perimeter and competes defensively. I think the Lakers will be looking to trade down or out of this pick to avoid the cap hold, but if they are unsuccessful he seems like an ideal draft and stash candidate to add strength and fine tune his shooting.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 10:36 am    Post subject:

LakersMD wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
PlantedTanks wrote:
LakerLogic wrote:
I would take Bolmaro, he has some Luka to his game.


Draft and stash or bring him over?

If they use 28 I am leaning towards players who could play next year but a stash would be fine.


I have him Top 25. Needs NBA strength, an idea on how to create an open look without being C&S, but for now plays like DeRozan without the shooting ability. He's like a weird, high motor, role playing version of Rubio.


Liked what I saw from him. Would bring some attacking/playmaking from the perimeter and competes defensively. I think the Lakers will be looking to trade down or out of this pick to avoid the cap hold, but if they are unsuccessful he seems like an ideal draft and stash candidate to add strength and fine tune his shooting.


Footwork from his base is a problem.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 11:09 am    Post subject:

alohalakers wrote:
AFireInside619 wrote:
Duncan Robinson was working out in LA before the draft. Pelinka, being a Michigan guy, wanted him. The Heat’s scout, who also lives in LA, drove to see Robinson work out. He told Pat Riley that they need to get this kid. After going undrafted, Robinson chose the Heat due to their player development. Imagine how badly we would have messed up that kid’s chances in the league.


He said he didn't want to go to the Lakers because at the time, we had too many young players so he didn't see an opportunity to break into the rotation. Don't think we ever really had a chance to get him unless Rob had offered a guaranteed deal.


And the likelihood he becomes the same Duncan Robinson in a Laker uniform is questionable. The Heat have a renowned shooting coach in Rob Fodor. Meanwhile, I can't remember the last time we had a knockdown shooter. Even career 40%+ guys (Glen Rice, Radman, Gym Version of Sasha) lost their shot at Staples.
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:51 pm    Post subject:

This CBS mock has Bane falling to 28

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-knicks-trade-up-to-land-lamelo-ball-timberwolves-take-anthony-edwards-with-top-pick/

I'd be extremely happy if that were to happen, but I doubt it. It certainly gives us the flexibility to move the DG/Kuz

Bane, Tillie, Green and Riller are my guys for 28
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:23 pm    Post subject:

Bane just screams a Spurs draft pick
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:34 pm    Post subject:

dcarter4kobe wrote:
Bane just screams a Spurs draft pick

I’d be surprised if Bane goes that high, particularly when Vassell is likely on the board, but if they trade down I can definitely see it
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 7:54 am    Post subject:

Kevin O’Connor’s latest mock has us taking Jahmi’us Ramsey from Texas Tech.

Quote:
Fearless shot-maker who needs to improve his playmaking but has intriguing potential as a two-way guard.
SHADES OF: Lonnie Walker IV, Dion Waiters, J.R. Smith
LOS ANGELES LAKERS

Rajon Rondo just showed the importance of having a secondary playmaker behind LeBron James; Ramsey could be an understudy to the veteran point guard. He’s a raw playmaker who likes to shoot first and pass second, but if he can develop he could be a major steal.

PLUSES

Flashy scorer who has confidence to pull up from anywhere. He can comfortably step back or side-step into 3s.
Good shooter off the catch. Texas Tech ran him off screens and he showed upside manipulating defenders to create space before launching shots.
At his best in the open floor. He has fluidity scoring on the break, and explosiveness scoring around the rim.
Strong frame for a guard with long arms. If he’s able to improve some of his fixable weaknesses, it’s easy to see him becoming a dynamic scorer due to his ability to generate shots.
Potentially a good man-to-man defender if his fundamentals improve thanks to his length and frame.
Athletic off-ball defender who can make noise in passing lanes and disrupt shots.
MINUSES

Struggles scoring around the rim. His lack of burst is a detriment since he’s not able to shed defenders off the dribble. He rarely uses his left hand and ends up settling for too many low-percentage floaters.
Streaky shooter. While he made 43 percent of his 3-point attempts in college, he hit just 64 percent of his free throws. How real is his jumper?
Shot selection: He takes a lot of tough shots in situations when he should pass or drive to the rim. He’s presently not a primary option due to his shaky handle, but he plays like he is.
Subpar playmaker who lacks feel in the pick-and-roll and misses too many open teammates.
Loses interest on defense and lacks basic fundamentals. His NBA team will need to work extensively with him in pretty much all areas, from man-to-man defense to closing out on shooters.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 7:57 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Kevin O’Connor’s latest mock has us taking Jahmi’us Ramsey from Texas Tech.

Quote:
Fearless shot-maker who needs to improve his playmaking but has intriguing potential as a two-way guard.
SHADES OF: Lonnie Walker IV, Dion Waiters, J.R. Smith
LOS ANGELES LAKERS

Rajon Rondo just showed the importance of having a secondary playmaker behind LeBron James; Ramsey could be an understudy to the veteran point guard. He’s a raw playmaker who likes to shoot first and pass second, but if he can develop he could be a major steal.

PLUSES

Flashy scorer who has confidence to pull up from anywhere. He can comfortably step back or side-step into 3s.
Good shooter off the catch. Texas Tech ran him off screens and he showed upside manipulating defenders to create space before launching shots.
At his best in the open floor. He has fluidity scoring on the break, and explosiveness scoring around the rim.
Strong frame for a guard with long arms. If he’s able to improve some of his fixable weaknesses, it’s easy to see him becoming a dynamic scorer due to his ability to generate shots.
Potentially a good man-to-man defender if his fundamentals improve thanks to his length and frame.
Athletic off-ball defender who can make noise in passing lanes and disrupt shots.
MINUSES

Struggles scoring around the rim. His lack of burst is a detriment since he’s not able to shed defenders off the dribble. He rarely uses his left hand and ends up settling for too many low-percentage floaters.
Streaky shooter. While he made 43 percent of his 3-point attempts in college, he hit just 64 percent of his free throws. How real is his jumper?
Shot selection: He takes a lot of tough shots in situations when he should pass or drive to the rim. He’s presently not a primary option due to his shaky handle, but he plays like he is.
Subpar playmaker who lacks feel in the pick-and-roll and misses too many open teammates.
Loses interest on defense and lacks basic fundamentals. His NBA team will need to work extensively with him in pretty much all areas, from man-to-man defense to closing out on shooters.


Mike Garcia vs KOC. Let’s (bleep) Gooooo! 😝 JK. Maybe.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 8:30 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Kevin O’Connor’s latest mock has us taking Jahmi’us Ramsey from Texas Tech.

Quote:
Fearless shot-maker who needs to improve his playmaking but has intriguing potential as a two-way guard.
SHADES OF: Lonnie Walker IV, Dion Waiters, J.R. Smith
LOS ANGELES LAKERS

Rajon Rondo just showed the importance of having a secondary playmaker behind LeBron James; Ramsey could be an understudy to the veteran point guard. He’s a raw playmaker who likes to shoot first and pass second, but if he can develop he could be a major steal.

PLUSES

Flashy scorer who has confidence to pull up from anywhere. He can comfortably step back or side-step into 3s.
Good shooter off the catch. Texas Tech ran him off screens and he showed upside manipulating defenders to create space before launching shots.
At his best in the open floor. He has fluidity scoring on the break, and explosiveness scoring around the rim.
Strong frame for a guard with long arms. If he’s able to improve some of his fixable weaknesses, it’s easy to see him becoming a dynamic scorer due to his ability to generate shots.
Potentially a good man-to-man defender if his fundamentals improve thanks to his length and frame.
Athletic off-ball defender who can make noise in passing lanes and disrupt shots.
MINUSES

Struggles scoring around the rim. His lack of burst is a detriment since he’s not able to shed defenders off the dribble. He rarely uses his left hand and ends up settling for too many low-percentage floaters.
Streaky shooter. While he made 43 percent of his 3-point attempts in college, he hit just 64 percent of his free throws. How real is his jumper?
Shot selection: He takes a lot of tough shots in situations when he should pass or drive to the rim. He’s presently not a primary option due to his shaky handle, but he plays like he is.
Subpar playmaker who lacks feel in the pick-and-roll and misses too many open teammates.
Loses interest on defense and lacks basic fundamentals. His NBA team will need to work extensively with him in pretty much all areas, from man-to-man defense to closing out on shooters.

Ehh, I have Ramsey as a 2nd round prospect. Not someone we should be looking at IMO
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:04 am    Post subject:

alleyoop wrote:
dcarter4kobe wrote:
Bane just screams a Spurs draft pick

I’d be surprised if Bane goes that high, particularly when Vassell is likely on the board, but if they trade down I can definitely see it


Vassell should be lottery. I'd be surprised if Bane goes below 25.

Bolmaro screams like a Spurs draft pick.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:05 am    Post subject:

AFireInside619 wrote:
ocho wrote:
Kevin O’Connor’s latest mock has us taking Jahmi’us Ramsey from Texas Tech.

Quote:
Fearless shot-maker who needs to improve his playmaking but has intriguing potential as a two-way guard.
SHADES OF: Lonnie Walker IV, Dion Waiters, J.R. Smith
LOS ANGELES LAKERS

Rajon Rondo just showed the importance of having a secondary playmaker behind LeBron James; Ramsey could be an understudy to the veteran point guard. He’s a raw playmaker who likes to shoot first and pass second, but if he can develop he could be a major steal.

PLUSES

Flashy scorer who has confidence to pull up from anywhere. He can comfortably step back or side-step into 3s.
Good shooter off the catch. Texas Tech ran him off screens and he showed upside manipulating defenders to create space before launching shots.
At his best in the open floor. He has fluidity scoring on the break, and explosiveness scoring around the rim.
Strong frame for a guard with long arms. If he’s able to improve some of his fixable weaknesses, it’s easy to see him becoming a dynamic scorer due to his ability to generate shots.
Potentially a good man-to-man defender if his fundamentals improve thanks to his length and frame.
Athletic off-ball defender who can make noise in passing lanes and disrupt shots.
MINUSES

Struggles scoring around the rim. His lack of burst is a detriment since he’s not able to shed defenders off the dribble. He rarely uses his left hand and ends up settling for too many low-percentage floaters.
Streaky shooter. While he made 43 percent of his 3-point attempts in college, he hit just 64 percent of his free throws. How real is his jumper?
Shot selection: He takes a lot of tough shots in situations when he should pass or drive to the rim. He’s presently not a primary option due to his shaky handle, but he plays like he is.
Subpar playmaker who lacks feel in the pick-and-roll and misses too many open teammates.
Loses interest on defense and lacks basic fundamentals. His NBA team will need to work extensively with him in pretty much all areas, from man-to-man defense to closing out on shooters.


Mike Garcia vs KOC. Let’s (bleep) Gooooo! 😝 JK. Maybe.


Go look at his past mocks. I have no issue with this.

I skip the Ringer because it's great graphics, but player assessment? Nah.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:31 am    Post subject:

ocho wrote:
Kevin O’Connor’s latest mock has us taking Jahmi’us Ramsey from Texas Tech.

Quote:
Fearless shot-maker who needs to improve his playmaking but has intriguing potential as a two-way guard.
SHADES OF: Lonnie Walker IV, Dion Waiters, J.R. Smith
LOS ANGELES LAKERS

Rajon Rondo just showed the importance of having a secondary playmaker behind LeBron James; Ramsey could be an understudy to the veteran point guard. He’s a raw playmaker who likes to shoot first and pass second, but if he can develop he could be a major steal.

PLUSES

Flashy scorer who has confidence to pull up from anywhere. He can comfortably step back or side-step into 3s.
Good shooter off the catch. Texas Tech ran him off screens and he showed upside manipulating defenders to create space before launching shots.
At his best in the open floor. He has fluidity scoring on the break, and explosiveness scoring around the rim.
Strong frame for a guard with long arms. If he’s able to improve some of his fixable weaknesses, it’s easy to see him becoming a dynamic scorer due to his ability to generate shots.
Potentially a good man-to-man defender if his fundamentals improve thanks to his length and frame.
Athletic off-ball defender who can make noise in passing lanes and disrupt shots.
MINUSES

Struggles scoring around the rim. His lack of burst is a detriment since he’s not able to shed defenders off the dribble. He rarely uses his left hand and ends up settling for too many low-percentage floaters.
Streaky shooter. While he made 43 percent of his 3-point attempts in college, he hit just 64 percent of his free throws. How real is his jumper?
Shot selection: He takes a lot of tough shots in situations when he should pass or drive to the rim. He’s presently not a primary option due to his shaky handle, but he plays like he is.
Subpar playmaker who lacks feel in the pick-and-roll and misses too many open teammates.
Loses interest on defense and lacks basic fundamentals. His NBA team will need to work extensively with him in pretty much all areas, from man-to-man defense to closing out on shooters.


I mentioned him way back during the shutdown as the possible pick. Very young and athletic. If his jumper is real, he would make an excellent addition.

As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:35 am    Post subject:

Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:36 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.


Wasn't that a problem for Tony Parker before arriving on the Spurs? Not comparing Ramsey to TP but I dont think it's impossible if the player has the physical foundation and the skillet to teach him better fundamentals.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:39 am    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.


Wasn't that a problem for Tony Parker before arriving on the Spurs? Not comparing Ramsey to TP but I dont think it's impossible if the player has the physical foundation and the skillet to teach him better fundamentals.


It's different for a point guard. It was also a problem for Parker, but look how rigid the entire Spurs offense was.

Parker operated at a higher floor of awareness because he actually had to run the offense. Even in his early years, he was repeatedly benched for bad decisions and inconsistent defense.

Ramsey is having this kind of issue, as a non-playmaker/shot selection guy. For all of the development that Kuzma had to go through just this season alone to be a + player without scoring, Ramsey is operating at a lower floor of awareness than that.

There are at least 5+ players at that draft position, where you don't have to worry about this. Wait til you see his lack of first step, lack of dynamic handle, and the fact that he couldn't attack at the NCAA level like he did in HS, because the athleticism isn't there, so he had to compensate with just 3pt shooting.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 11:46 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.


Wasn't that a problem for Tony Parker before arriving on the Spurs? Not comparing Ramsey to TP but I dont think it's impossible if the player has the physical foundation and the skillet to teach him better fundamentals.


It's different for a point guard. It was also a problem for Parker, but look how rigid the entire Spurs offense was.

Parker operated at a higher floor of awareness because he actually had to run the offense. Even in his early years, he was repeatedly benched for bad decisions and inconsistent defense.

Ramsey is having this kind of issue, as a non-playmaker/shot selection guy. For all of the development that Kuzma had to go through just this season alone to be a + player without scoring, Ramsey is operating at a lower floor of awareness than that.

There are at least 5+ players at that draft position, where you don't have to worry about this. Wait til you see his lack of first step, lack of dynamic handle, and the fact that he couldn't attack at the NCAA level like he did in HS, because the athleticism isn't there, so he had to compensate with just 3pt shooting.


I trust your input so I guess that would be concerning. I guess we'll see what the Lakers value in these potential point guards.

Are we looking for a floor general guard to takeover for Rondo eventually? A athletic score first guard? Just an off ball shooting point guard for Lebron to pass too?

For me I would think a scoring first guard just because we have a good amount of ball handlers and even potentially facilitators like THT.
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Mike@LG
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 12:21 pm    Post subject:

Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Megaton wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.


Wasn't that a problem for Tony Parker before arriving on the Spurs? Not comparing Ramsey to TP but I dont think it's impossible if the player has the physical foundation and the skillet to teach him better fundamentals.


It's different for a point guard. It was also a problem for Parker, but look how rigid the entire Spurs offense was.

Parker operated at a higher floor of awareness because he actually had to run the offense. Even in his early years, he was repeatedly benched for bad decisions and inconsistent defense.

Ramsey is having this kind of issue, as a non-playmaker/shot selection guy. For all of the development that Kuzma had to go through just this season alone to be a + player without scoring, Ramsey is operating at a lower floor of awareness than that.

There are at least 5+ players at that draft position, where you don't have to worry about this. Wait til you see his lack of first step, lack of dynamic handle, and the fact that he couldn't attack at the NCAA level like he did in HS, because the athleticism isn't there, so he had to compensate with just 3pt shooting.


I trust your input so I guess that would be concerning. I guess we'll see what the Lakers value in these potential point guards.

Are we looking for a floor general guard to takeover for Rondo eventually? A athletic score first guard? Just an off ball shooting point guard for Lebron to pass too?

For me I would think a scoring first guard just because we have a good amount of ball handlers and even potentially facilitators like THT.


Legit just looking for a productive NBA player. Technically, we didn't have room for THT, but because he was a steal pick, and talented, he found his way onto the floor and flashed potential. That's what I'm looking for.
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alleyoop
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:50 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
alleyoop wrote:
dcarter4kobe wrote:
Bane just screams a Spurs draft pick

I’d be surprised if Bane goes that high, particularly when Vassell is likely on the board, but if they trade down I can definitely see it


Vassell should be lottery. I'd be surprised if Bane goes below 25.

Bolmaro screams like a Spurs draft pick.

That’s my point - why would the Spurs pick Bane at 11 when Vassell is likely there?

Bolmaro makes sense for them too if they trade down. I like him, but I don’t like him for us
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LakersMD
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 28, 2020 4:53 pm    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
Quote:
As far as those weaknesses are concerned, I think someone like Phil Handy and Frank Vogel working with him on those is perfect for his growth.


It's very difficult to work with players with awareness/decision making issues.


Yeah the lack of passing feel, bad finishing around the rim and very poor defensive footwork and awareness scared me off. He projects to me as a one-way combo guard volume chucker/ bench scorer type, who would need to be hidden defensively come playoff time.
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