Who was more clutch over the course of his career: Derek Fisher or Robert Horry?
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More clutch player?
Derek Fisher
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Robert Horry
89%
 89%  [ 26 ]
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 2:10 pm    Post subject: Who was more clutch over the course of his career: Derek Fisher or Robert Horry?

Discuss.
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 2:29 pm    Post subject:

good question.

Fisher played more, he had more moments overall.
Horry;s moments are fewer, but higher in "value".

Two of the most clutch players in history. Fisher very much under the radar in that category.
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 2:36 pm    Post subject:

For me it's a coin flip. I don't really feel one is more clutch then the other.
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 2:37 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
good question.

Fisher played more, he had more moments overall.
Horry;s moments are fewer, but higher in "value".

Two of the most clutch players in history. Fisher very much under the radar in that category.


Agree with that. Fish hit tons of "timely shots" per Snapper as well as outright clutch game-saving, life-saving shots. Horry had a lot of both as well, but it's just a hunch that Fish had more of the timely, mo-shifting brand. Then again, how could we all know what Rob did in HOU and SA? Only Dreamshake would know what he did in the meat of HOU Rockets games from the early 90s. He did have huge clutch shots in the brightest of spotlights in every one of his stops, tho. I don't think Fish could hang with him in that respect, playoff shots, Finals shots. Then again, a lot of so-called superstars couldn't hang with either of them in that respect. Tough question because you can come up with a few examples of those yuge shots from Fish too, but with Horry, you betta read a newspaper er somethin. After going 2/38 from the arc in the 03 playoffs and missing that shot at SA, we thought he was finally on empty and we came to find that he still had some fumes left in the tank. Hit another one for SA in The Finals, ugh.
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 2:40 pm    Post subject:

activeverb wrote:
For me it's a coin flip. I don't really feel one is more clutch then the other.


Fish probably better at creating them for himself as a "guard". I know it might burn some folks to praise Fish for his handle, but he could dribble up floor (within reason) and shoot or lay it in (again, within reason). He could brick layups in comical fashion, but if you gave him a gamechanging layup attempt, he could suddenly make them. Remember that one at LAC in 2012 at the buzzer. Maybe Rob could've done that 1 on 3 layup in 2010 Finals Gm 3, but it's easier picturing Fish doing that. Rob was more attached to a spot and the ball made its way to him by his teammates and opponents in some cases.
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PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 6:32 pm    Post subject:

Horry for me. Not only did he hit some huge shots, but he also would manage to come up with huge blocks or rebounds in timely moments.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 6:36 am    Post subject:

J.C. Smith wrote:
Horry for me. Not only did he hit some huge shots, but he also would manage to come up with huge blocks or rebounds in timely moments.


https://youtu.be/EmZ05KVnbq0?t=1m25s

https://youtu.be/MQpoQ06493s?t=5m55s

He was huge in game 3 against the Sixers. 12 in the fourth and a poster dunk over Mutombo!
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:56 am    Post subject:

I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 12:48 pm    Post subject:

how is this even a serious question? Horry by a long shot.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:25 pm    Post subject:

BigBallerBrand wrote:
how is this even a serious question? Horry by a long shot.
I see what you did there.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:32 pm    Post subject:

rmonkey wrote:
I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.


It's harder to come up with a rhyme to the word fish.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 3:28 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
rmonkey wrote:
I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.


It's harder to come up with a rhyme to the word fish.


Big swish fish
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 4:22 pm    Post subject:

Or if he was known for assists he could be dime dish Fish.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 7:28 pm    Post subject:

Cutheon wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
rmonkey wrote:
I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.


It's harder to come up with a rhyme to the word fish.


Big swish fish


Haha, ok you got me. Wonder how that never stuck. Derek "The Swisher" Fisher. He could also be "Big Miss Fish" when he bricked. I do think he's getting the brunt of time in this thread/poll. He done hit a ton of huge shots in his day. RS, playoffs. One of his final games with the Lakers (vs DAL) he won with a trey. Orlando Finals, running down court unfettered and hitting a trey to the announcers' dismay. Recall a game against the Hornets that he sent to OT on a trey. Big Swish Fish was in the GREAT category of clutch shooters, no BS.

My theory always was that he was so over-confident in his ability for whatever reason that he fully thought he should be taking those shots. By extension, he put them up as if he was a superstar instead of a scurred rook and he would hit them. That 0.4 shot was the ultimate Fish Swish. Only he could've done that. It didn't even look on line when he released it. Probably about as difficult as the GW by Nick at Boston in 95. The Swisher is most definitely in the Kobe and Bob echelon. A lot of fans didn't wanna credit him for anything positive so they pretend he didn't do the things that he did well, either. That's unfair.
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PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 11:19 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
Cutheon wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
rmonkey wrote:
I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.


It's harder to come up with a rhyme to the word fish.


Big swish fish


Haha, ok you got me. Wonder how that never stuck. Derek "The Swisher" Fisher. He could also be "Big Miss Fish" when he bricked. I do think he's getting the brunt of time in this thread/poll. He done hit a ton of huge shots in his day. RS, playoffs. One of his final games with the Lakers (vs DAL) he won with a trey. Orlando Finals, running down court unfettered and hitting a trey to the announcers' dismay. Recall a game against the Hornets that he sent to OT on a trey. Big Swish Fish was in the GREAT category of clutch shooters, no BS.

My theory always was that he was so over-confident in his ability for whatever reason that he fully thought he should be taking those shots. By extension, he put them up as if he was a superstar instead of a scurred rook and he would hit them. That 0.4 shot was the ultimate Fish Swish. Only he could've done that. It didn't even look on line when he released it. Probably about as difficult as the GW by Nick at Boston in 95. The Swisher is most definitely in the Kobe and Bob echelon. A lot of fans didn't wanna credit him for anything positive so they pretend he didn't do the things that he did well, either. That's unfair.


That would explain his atrocious play during his last season with us and refusal to be benched...
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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 3:49 pm    Post subject:

Actually very similar players.

Regular season underachievers for the most part, but winners in the money games and clutch players when it mattered most.

They have a couple fist fulls of rings between them and that does say something even if they weren't the lead actors.
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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 9:04 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
good question.

Fisher played more, he had more moments overall.
Horry;s moments are fewer, but higher in "value".

Two of the most clutch players in history. Fisher very much under the radar in that category.


Agree with that. Fish hit tons of "timely shots" per Snapper as well as outright clutch game-saving, life-saving shots. Horry had a lot of both as well, but it's just a hunch that Fish had more of the timely, mo-shifting brand. Then again, how could we all know what Rob did in HOU and SA? Only Dreamshake would know what he did in the meat of HOU Rockets games from the early 90s. He did have huge clutch shots in the brightest of spotlights in every one of his stops, tho. I don't think Fish could hang with him in that respect, playoff shots, Finals shots. Then again, a lot of so-called superstars couldn't hang with either of them in that respect. Tough question because you can come up with a few examples of those yuge shots from Fish too, but with Horry, you betta read a newspaper er somethin. After going 2/38 from the arc in the 03 playoffs and missing that shot at SA, we thought he was finally on empty and we came to find that he still had some fumes left in the tank. Hit another one for SA in The Finals, ugh.

That one in SA was crazy because it wasn't just one shot...it was an entire 4th quarter plus OT with the famous game winner, but also the insane horizontal clutch dunk and multiple threes I think. When I saw it at the time I couldn't help thinking "THis MFer...killing the Pistons, and SA is now going to have a ring due to HIM specifically." It was all so regrettable.
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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 9:08 pm    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
activeverb wrote:
For me it's a coin flip. I don't really feel one is more clutch then the other.


Fish probably better at creating them for himself as a "guard". I know it might burn some folks to praise Fish for his handle, but he could dribble up floor (within reason) and shoot or lay it in (again, within reason). He could brick layups in comical fashion, but if you gave him a gamechanging layup attempt, he could suddenly make them. Remember that one at LAC in 2012 at the buzzer. Maybe Rob could've done that 1 on 3 layup in 2010 Finals Gm 3, but it's easier picturing Fish doing that. Rob was more attached to a spot and the ball made its way to him by his teammates and opponents in some cases.

Fish got reamed in the forums for YEARS about all this. I find it so funny that old man fish after years of this mockery, made basically the most difficult clutch layup ever vs the Celtics.

Let me tell you something that is true and will blow your mind, go ahead and check. Anyone honest here remembers all the bashing on Fish for his layups and what not. Lebron has way worse similar plays both in quantity and quality loll. BUt shhhh we won't ever talk about that. Don't believe go ahead and check.
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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 10:45 pm    Post subject:

Robert Horry:

- 7 rings to Fisher's 5 rings

- won with multiple teams (3) vs Fisher's 1 team

- Prime vs prime Horry was the superior player. His best stuff isn't even his most famous/iconic moments. But what he did with Hakeem's Rockets. In the 1995 Finals he averaged 18 PTS, 10 TRB, 4 AST, 3 STL, 2 BLK, which are near all-star numbers. Something Fisher has never come close to sniffing before. Including a still NBA record 7 steals in an NBA finals game.

- Horry has more iconic/clutch moments that actually swung championship results. Fisher's most iconic moment (0.4 vs Spurs) didn't even happen in a championship year.

- Horry made significant contributions to all 7 of his rings, whereas Fisher's were for 3 out of his 5.

- Horry was asked to bulk up to play PF on the Lakers and was the primary defender against a deathrows of PFs in the Golden Age of PFs (Duncan, Webber, KG, Rasheed)

- Bodychecked Steve Nash into the scorer's table, causing Amare to get suspended and swinging that series.


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PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 10:49 pm    Post subject:

SuperboyReformed wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
good question.

Fisher played more, he had more moments overall.
Horry;s moments are fewer, but higher in "value".

Two of the most clutch players in history. Fisher very much under the radar in that category.


Agree with that. Fish hit tons of "timely shots" per Snapper as well as outright clutch game-saving, life-saving shots. Horry had a lot of both as well, but it's just a hunch that Fish had more of the timely, mo-shifting brand. Then again, how could we all know what Rob did in HOU and SA? Only Dreamshake would know what he did in the meat of HOU Rockets games from the early 90s. He did have huge clutch shots in the brightest of spotlights in every one of his stops, tho. I don't think Fish could hang with him in that respect, playoff shots, Finals shots. Then again, a lot of so-called superstars couldn't hang with either of them in that respect. Tough question because you can come up with a few examples of those yuge shots from Fish too, but with Horry, you betta read a newspaper er somethin. After going 2/38 from the arc in the 03 playoffs and missing that shot at SA, we thought he was finally on empty and we came to find that he still had some fumes left in the tank. Hit another one for SA in The Finals, ugh.

That one in SA was crazy because it wasn't just one shot...it was an entire 4th quarter plus OT with the famous game winner, but also the insane horizontal clutch dunk and multiple threes I think. When I saw it at the time I couldn't help thinking "THis MFer...killing the Pistons, and SA is now going to have a ring due to HIM specifically." It was all so regrettable.


Had we kept Horry we likely wouldn't have enough money for Malone/Payton and thus wouldn't have even made the 2004 Finals, though. So not so regrettable when looking at the bigger picture.
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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 8:42 am    Post subject:

non-player zealot wrote:
Cutheon wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
rmonkey wrote:
I've never heard anyone call him Big Shot Derek.


It's harder to come up with a rhyme to the word fish.


Big swish fish


Haha, ok you got me. Wonder how that never stuck. Derek "The Swisher" Fisher. He could also be "Big Miss Fish" when he bricked. I do think he's getting the brunt of time in this thread/poll. He done hit a ton of huge shots in his day. RS, playoffs. One of his final games with the Lakers (vs DAL) he won with a trey. Orlando Finals, running down court unfettered and hitting a trey to the announcers' dismay. Recall a game against the Hornets that he sent to OT on a trey. Big Swish Fish was in the GREAT category of clutch shooters, no BS.

My theory always was that he was so over-confident in his ability for whatever reason that he fully thought he should be taking those shots. By extension, he put them up as if he was a superstar instead of a scurred rook and he would hit them. That 0.4 shot was the ultimate Fish Swish. Only he could've done that. It didn't even look on line when he released it. Probably about as difficult as the GW by Nick at Boston in 95. The Swisher is most definitely in the Kobe and Bob echelon. A lot of fans didn't wanna credit him for anything positive so they pretend he didn't do the things that he did well, either. That's unfair.


I love Fish. I completely agree that some people sleep on his clutchness. If I had to argue for them, I'd say he might be the archetypal example of a player whose clutchness was only necessary due to his repeated failings earlier in the game.

I disagree, clearly. Big swish was one bad mama jama. Playoffs, close game - no problem giving it to Fisher from 08-10. So many games in those playoffs - not just boston and orlando, but big games against the Utah (game 3, 2010) and Phx (game 5, 2010). Strangely enough tho, I didn't trust him at the line. I feel like when D-fish had to think about it, he missed - like most players. Just catching a swing from Kobe and letting it fly - no problem. Dribbling himself into a conundrum and slinging it against the shot clock - count it. Having to go to the line, dribble, think about the game score . . . nah. That high arc just always seemed a bit too high, or a bit too flat, in those situations. And i swear if he missed the first, he always missed the second.
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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 10:34 am    Post subject:

Horry was "finished" with us. So we moved on and then he hits a clutch shot for the Spurs in 2005. Did he do much in 2007 for them? I'm one who doesn't glorify these guys. They don't hit shots in the first 45 minutes, and is part of the reason why the game is close to begin with. But of the two, Horry is more clutch than Fisher.
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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 12:35 pm    Post subject:

I'll go Horry too....huge shots multiple times against multiple teams. But on top of being clutch he played very good D. In fact, no way we get past Portland without Horry...Rasheed was absolutely destroying AC Green (who was well past his prime). Horry and Horace Grant was a nice PF tandem the following year and then Horry had to step up again when we had Samaki Walker, against Chris Webber.
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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 12:37 pm    Post subject:

Who is better looking: Scarlett Johnassen or Jessica Biel? Both are hot as hell. That's my answer to this question...
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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 3:15 pm    Post subject:

Batguano wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
non-player zealot wrote:
SuperboyReformed wrote:
good question.

Fisher played more, he had more moments overall.
Horry;s moments are fewer, but higher in "value".

Two of the most clutch players in history. Fisher very much under the radar in that category.


Agree with that. Fish hit tons of "timely shots" per Snapper as well as outright clutch game-saving, life-saving shots. Horry had a lot of both as well, but it's just a hunch that Fish had more of the timely, mo-shifting brand. Then again, how could we all know what Rob did in HOU and SA? Only Dreamshake would know what he did in the meat of HOU Rockets games from the early 90s. He did have huge clutch shots in the brightest of spotlights in every one of his stops, tho. I don't think Fish could hang with him in that respect, playoff shots, Finals shots. Then again, a lot of so-called superstars couldn't hang with either of them in that respect. Tough question because you can come up with a few examples of those yuge shots from Fish too, but with Horry, you betta read a newspaper er somethin. After going 2/38 from the arc in the 03 playoffs and missing that shot at SA, we thought he was finally on empty and we came to find that he still had some fumes left in the tank. Hit another one for SA in The Finals, ugh.

That one in SA was crazy because it wasn't just one shot...it was an entire 4th quarter plus OT with the famous game winner, but also the insane horizontal clutch dunk and multiple threes I think. When I saw it at the time I couldn't help thinking "THis MFer...killing the Pistons, and SA is now going to have a ring due to HIM specifically." It was all so regrettable.


Had we kept Horry we likely wouldn't have enough money for Malone/Payton and thus wouldn't have even made the 2004 Finals, though. So not so regrettable when looking at the bigger picture.


Malone signed for an exception.
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