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karlmalonefan Star Player
Joined: 06 Jul 2004 Posts: 2608 Location: Phoenix, AZ
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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Laker Lurker wrote: | karlmalonefan wrote: | Laker Lurker wrote: | If Lakers kept Butler instead of Odom, this years team would be better than last year's team | Really? who would do the rebounding? who would initiate the offense? LO leads the team in rebs and assists... :roll: actually if they had kept last years team intact and made minor tweaks, we would have a been better than last year's team. |
Year To Date Stats
---------------------min----- fg%-----reb---asts----to------stls--blks--ppg
Caron Butler------34.7-- 44.3%-----5.9----2.4--- 2.2---- 1.6---0.3--16.7
Lamar Odom------39.4---44.9%-----9.3----5.4---2.6-----0.9---0.9--14.0
Lakers differential is 1.3 pts. if Butlers 2.7 ppg over Odoms is added to 1.3, the laker differential would be 4.0. Only the Pistons, Mavericks, Suns, Spurs, and Heat have point differentials greater than 4.0- with the Heat having the lowest at 4.2. Lakers would be expected to be top 3 in the Western Conference with this differential behind only the Suns.
Check:
Applied specifically to the Lakers, would Butler's 2.7 points over Odoms ppg have affected the Lakers record? The Lakers lost 5 games by 3 points or less. If they had won these games, they record may have been 33W-23L or good enough for 5th place in the Western conference.
Butler on the Lakers would probably have produced better results than Odom on the Lakers. | :roll: You're missing the point entirely...I'm not arguing who is better for this team between odom and butler, I'm saying that we would be a better team with BOTH Odom and Butler and Chucky for that matter. If you want to compare numbers to prove me wrong, compare the numbers of Kwame/Butler vs Odom/Butler vs Kwame/Odom which is what we have now...tell me that the numbers for Kwame/Butler would be better than Odom/Butler. |
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Laker Lurker Star Player
Joined: 24 Oct 2002 Posts: 7652
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:21 pm Post subject: |
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karlmalonefan wrote: | Laker Lurker wrote: | karlmalonefan wrote: | Laker Lurker wrote: | If Lakers kept Butler instead of Odom, this years team would be better than last year's team | Really? who would do the rebounding? who would initiate the offense? LO leads the team in rebs and assists... :roll: actually if they had kept last years team intact and made minor tweaks, we would have a been better than last year's team. |
Year To Date Stats
---------------------min----- fg%-----reb---asts----to------stls--blks--ppg
Caron Butler------34.7-- 44.3%-----5.9----2.4--- 2.2---- 1.6---0.3--16.7
Lamar Odom------39.4---44.9%-----9.3----5.4---2.6-----0.9---0.9--14.0
Lakers differential is 1.3 pts. if Butlers 2.7 ppg over Odoms is added to 1.3, the laker differential would be 4.0. Only the Pistons, Mavericks, Suns, Spurs, and Heat have point differentials greater than 4.0- with the Heat having the lowest at 4.2. Lakers would be expected to be top 3 in the Western Conference with this differential behind only the Suns.
Check:
Applied specifically to the Lakers, would Butler's 2.7 points over Odoms ppg have affected the Lakers record? The Lakers lost 5 games by 3 points or less. If they had won these games, they record may have been 33W-23L or good enough for 5th place in the Western conference.
Butler on the Lakers would probably have produced better results than Odom on the Lakers. | :roll: You're missing the point entirely...I'm not arguing who is better for this team between odom and butler, I'm saying that we would be a better team with BOTH Odom and Butler and Chucky for that matter. If you want to compare numbers to prove me wrong, compare the numbers of Kwame/Butler vs Odom/Butler vs Kwame/Odom which is what we have now...tell me that the numbers for Kwame/Butler would be better than Odom/Butler. |
I agree with you that Odom/Butler is better than Kwame/Butler. But Kwame is hindsight and we didn't know how good Bynum would turn out to be in actual NBA play- So we needed Kwame not only to protect Mihm's back but to back him up. Taking everything into account this team and last year's team are probably on par- less than average to average. |
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sonofabuss Starting Rotation
Joined: 09 Nov 2005 Posts: 206
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:51 pm Post subject: |
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i think last year's team would've been better this season under phil for one reason... kwame.....
phil really wanted to work with the kobe-caron-lamar trio. he thought they could be a great nucleus for the triangle. he first started flirting with the idea and floating it to lakers brass around christmas of 2004. his plans were undermined by the trade for kwame. he was peaved. he contacted mj for 'the word' on kwame. mj said kwame's weak mind would be phil's biggest obstacle, not his bad hands.
as we all now know, mj was right. plus, not only has kwame turned down special training from kareem, recently he also turned down watching ben wallace videos because he feels he can be more of a scorer than big ben. phil's vexxed and wants kwame to see both a sports psychologist (in addition to the team's mental trainer).
bottom line, yeah, the lakers badly needed a big physical presence. but, not a big NEGATIVE physical presence. |
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lakersfan4life69 Star Player
Joined: 21 Nov 2003 Posts: 2327
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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i wish the lakers would have kept butler for one more year and then let him walk. they would have ended up with nothing, but in kwame borwn, they received nothing. what a horrific deal. |
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Socks Franchise Player
Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 10761 Location: Bay Area, CA
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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I know last year's collapse was mostly due to injury, but I just don't think Phil will let this team collapse. He's going to hold this team together into the playoffs. |
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slavavov Star Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 8288 Location: Santa Monica
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Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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I think this year's team is better, maybe not by much, but it's better. I know the OP downplayed the fact that Phil is back, but I think that's one of the main reasons. I think coaching is underrated in the NBA, and Phil is one of those coaches(along with Larry Brown, Riley, and maybe a couple others) that can get his teams to overachieve. Look at what he did with the 1994 Jordan-less Bulls.
This year we have less talent. Last year we weren't exactly an offensive juggernaught, but at least we had two other guys (Butler and Atkins) who not only had the talent but also the willingness to step up on offense and help Kobe a little. But our coaching situation was bad. Rudy T instituted no real offensive system, not to mention no defensive system, and the team seemed to quit on Hamblen. We also had some key injuries.
This year we turned Butler and Atkins into Kwame (great job Mitch! :roll: ), but we have the best halfcourt system in place, plus Phil actually emphasizes defense. Think about it: if we had this year's team under Rudy T or any other coach under Phil, would we be in the 8th spot now with a chance to move up to 7 or 6 if we start taking care of business? I say no.
Phil makes me a lot more confident about our long-term outlook. I get the feeling that he may pressure the FO to make a significant move this summer. I also remember Lionel saying when he returned that he had a "blueprint" for this team to be like the early 90s Bulls. And some of our role players are starting to show promise. I tell you, if we just get that one All-Star this summer (or next) and a couple veteran role players, we'll be contending for titles again in no time. _________________ Lakers 49ers Chargers Dodgers |
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