QFTOS: Lakers Beat Houston (Again) ***Updated with Harden Trade QFTOS***
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CandyCanes
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 7:24 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man


Great Houston shooting guards: Clyde Drexler, Tracy McGrady, James Harden, Victor Oladipo.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 7:52 pm    Post subject:

CandyCanes wrote:
governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man


Great Houston shooting guards: Clyde Drexler, Tracy McGrady, James Harden, Victor Oladipo.


Kevin Martin was also great. Can't believe we didn't try to get him after the failed CP3 trade. The proposed trade was Gasol for Kev Martin, Luis Scola and fillers.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 7:57 pm    Post subject:

LOL Lavert is a much better long term piece than Dipo unless Hou wanted max cap room for this summer?
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:10 pm    Post subject:

Cousins is a g
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:40 pm    Post subject:

Houston fans surprisingly witty compared to other fan bases like say Utah.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:27 am    Post subject:

hype wrote:
Great One wrote:
remember how Houston pried away dwight from LA, tellin him and harden will be the next kobe and shaq?

guess that didnt turn out well.......


Then him and CP3 didnt..

Westbrook will though!

oops..

How about John Wall?

*makes it rain in the strip club instead of even attempting to try*

Didn't workout with Durant once but maybe playing musical chairs and ending up together again nearly a decade later will finally do it! maybe...


Rockets and Clipper fans were the worst during our darkest days...

only a few seasons later and we celebrate a ring while they are shell shocked and STILL got none.

Lets not forget our troubles came from the end of an era (kobe), and dumb and dumber (jim and dwight). Meanwhile other franchises proving they're just bad.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:16 am    Post subject:

Houston seems like they want to make the playoffs/be competitive this year.

Wall-Oladipo, that is an all-star skill level backcourt. I think from their perspective, the way Harden was playing, he was not playing any better than Dipo anyway. So now you got the same level player as the one that is going out (in terms of how he was playing this year) for a guy that will commit to the program and teammates.

I actually like John Wall a lot. Good story. Upbringing, I've read his story. Glad when guys like that make it in the league. He made it back against some horrible injuries. You can tell the Lakers players respect Wall big time. Every time he fell, they went up picked him up.

I wish Wall and Dipo success, because Harden was acting like a spoilt (bleep). How bad was Kobe's rant in 2007? Worse than anything James Harden said in the offseason. Kobe shat all over the Lakers in hopes they would trade him. But the moment the games began, the greatness in Kobe, the competitor in him, he gave 100% each night and it turned out into a good story that year. Not saying the Rockets could have done the same, but Harden came into camp 15 lbs overweight on purpose, and began dogging games the last 2 weeks on purpose. Very easy to see. He is a great all time scorer, but the competitor in him has always folded. Even in the playoffs, same thing. It all makes me respect Kobe more, for he was once in the same position (having lost faith in the FO) but came to play every night, gave 100% as a competitor and never once folded. All these years later, makes one appreciate that even more.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:39 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Houston seems like they want to make the playoffs/be competitive this year.

Wall-Oladipo, that is an all-star skill level backcourt. I think from their perspective, the way Harden was playing, he was not playing any better than Dipo anyway. So now you got the same level player as the one that is going out (in terms of how he was playing this year) for a guy that will commit to the program and teammates.

I actually like John Wall a lot. Good story. Upbringing, I've read his story. Glad when guys like that make it in the league. He made it back against some horrible injuries. You can tell the Lakers players respect Wall big time. Every time he fell, they went up picked him up.

I wish Wall and Dipo success, because Harden was acting like a spoilt (bleep). How bad was Kobe's rant in 2007? Worse than anything James Harden said in the offseason. Kobe shat all over the Lakers in hopes they would trade him. But the moment the games began, the greatness in Kobe, the competitor in him, he gave 100% each night and it turned out into a good story that year. Not saying the Rockets could have done the same, but Harden came into camp 15 lbs overweight on purpose, and began dogging games the last 2 weeks on purpose. Very easy to see. He is a great all time scorer, but the competitor in him has always folded. Even in the playoffs, same thing. It all makes me respect Kobe more, for he was once in the same position (having lost faith in the FO) but came to play every night, gave 100% as a competitor and never once folded. All these years later, makes one appreciate that even more.


Oladipo is not close to Harden, yes Harden quit but his value was still high (because he's still locked in a 3 seasons worth of contract). Oladipo would command the max this summer especially with teams planning for Giannis sweepstake looking for alternative. Wall-Oladipe at 2 max is a big drop off (better off unloading Wall and tank with wood)
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:57 am    Post subject:

Oladipo is not close to Harden pre-2020/21 season. This season Harden has been out of shape, passive and not getting back on D. The team looked awful with Harden and he quit on them. Would not shock me if the Rockets end up playing better with Dipo/Wall than they did with Harden/Wall.

Of course Harden >> Dipo, but what the Rockets had was not Harden of old. This was a version the entire team despised ... read the Cousins comments. He came to play to prove Houston can not get it done and he should be traded. That was his agenda.
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governator
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 7:17 am    Post subject:

wolfpaclaker wrote:
Oladipo is not close to Harden pre-2020/21 season. This season Harden has been out of shape, passive and not getting back on D. The team looked awful with Harden and he quit on them. Would not shock me if the Rockets end up playing better with Dipo/Wall than they did with Harden/Wall.

Of course Harden >> Dipo, but what the Rockets had was not Harden of old. This was a version the entire team despised ... read the Cousins comments. He came to play to prove Houston can not get it done and he should be traded. That was his agenda.


yeah, I just think with 3 yrs of contract, hou could've just sat Harden and get better package but in short term, hou will be better for sure
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 7:32 am    Post subject:

Houston could have had Ben Simmons. What fools!

https://sports.yahoo.com/ben-simmons-on-table-james-harden-trade-rockets-sixers-net-nba-014723216.html
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 7:35 am    Post subject:

In my head canon, we were the final block piece pulled to bring Houston's Jenga tower down.

We gave them the 'ole gentleman's sweep out of the playoffs, leading to Daryl Morey's creation being scrapped and him fired. Harden, angry over Morey being fired, had burned his bridges with Westbrook and Russ was shipped out. The team turned out to not be very good, so Harden ate himself into oblivion and decided to be lazy and not try after the first two games, leading to his ultimate trade, leaving Houston as a barren landscape.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:34 pm    Post subject:

governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:38 pm    Post subject:

DancingBarry wrote:
governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man




Tilman is a broke billionaire. I had this conversation on a twitter group DM, but I'd argue 1/3rd of the league actually cares about winning and the rest are billionaires trying to make money.

So for Tilman, 4 1st rounders on cost controlled rookie contracts and basically 40% of Harden's salary in Caris LeVert > paying Harden + improving the team generally speaking.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:36 am    Post subject:

Mike@LG wrote:
DancingBarry wrote:
governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man




Tilman is a broke billionaire. I had this conversation on a twitter group DM, but I'd argue 1/3rd of the league actually cares about winning and the rest are billionaires trying to make money.

So for Tilman, 4 1st rounders on cost controlled rookie contracts and basically 40% of Harden's salary in Caris LeVert > paying Harden + improving the team generally speaking.


Yeah, there's no doubt. As Dreamshake was saying in the Free Agency thread, their owner wanted to save money here. So getting the expiring Oladipo was preferable to him than taking LeVert, who is owed money through '23. I mean, LeVert is clearly the better value due to the fact that he has a lower AAV than Oladipo (not to mention that Oladipo is going to get a raise on his next contract) and because he isn't about to be a free agent, AND he's arguably in the same ballpark as Oladipo just in terms of how good each player is, regardless of contract status. But it's pretty clear that Fertitta has been in cost-cutting mode since he bought the team. I'm sure they would have rather kept Harden and had a contender, while cutting where they could, but he clearly has been cutting costs. His deal to buy the team was highly-leveraged in the first place, a la Frank McCourt with the Dodgers once upon a time, and the dude's businesses have been getting killed during the pandemic.

My guess is that they will end up flipping Oladipo for another expiring player or players who don't have much value, and trying to get yet another 1st Round pick out of it. Then they can say they essentially got five 1st Rounders for Harden (plus the pick swaps that they got). I doubt that Fertitta will have the appetite to pay Oladipo something like $30MM a year for 5 years. Honestly, I wouldn't either. (Of course, they could have just kept LeVert, but we already went over that.)

Also, I'll say this: there's a chance that the Nets go off the rails in the next 2-3 years. All 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie have player options after next season. If they fall short of expectations over the next 2 seasons, perhaps they lose KD and then maybe the team implodes and everyone leaves. If that happens, those picks in the latter half of the 2020's may not be so bad. But that's a best-case scenario for the Rockets. If they remain good, the picks are late 1st's, and at that point they will look like fools for not taking the 76ers' offer.
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2021 7:01 am    Post subject:

ChickenStu wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
DancingBarry wrote:
governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man




Tilman is a broke billionaire. I had this conversation on a twitter group DM, but I'd argue 1/3rd of the league actually cares about winning and the rest are billionaires trying to make money.

So for Tilman, 4 1st rounders on cost controlled rookie contracts and basically 40% of Harden's salary in Caris LeVert > paying Harden + improving the team generally speaking.


Yeah, there's no doubt. As Dreamshake was saying in the Free Agency thread, their owner wanted to save money here. So getting the expiring Oladipo was preferable to him than taking LeVert, who is owed money through '23. I mean, LeVert is clearly the better value due to the fact that he has a lower AAV than Oladipo (not to mention that Oladipo is going to get a raise on his next contract) and because he isn't about to be a free agent, AND he's arguably in the same ballpark as Oladipo just in terms of how good each player is, regardless of contract status. But it's pretty clear that Fertitta has been in cost-cutting mode since he bought the team. I'm sure they would have rather kept Harden and had a contender, while cutting where they could, but he clearly has been cutting costs. His deal to buy the team was highly-leveraged in the first place, a la Frank McCourt with the Dodgers once upon a time, and the dude's businesses have been getting killed during the pandemic.

My guess is that they will end up flipping Oladipo for another expiring player or players who don't have much value, and trying to get yet another 1st Round pick out of it. Then they can say they essentially got five 1st Rounders for Harden (plus the pick swaps that they got). I doubt that Fertitta will have the appetite to pay Oladipo something like $30MM a year for 5 years. Honestly, I wouldn't either. (Of course, they could have just kept LeVert, but we already went over that.)

Also, I'll say this: there's a chance that the Nets go off the rails in the next 2-3 years. All 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie have player options after next season. If they fall short of expectations over the next 2 seasons, perhaps they lose KD and then maybe the team implodes and everyone leaves. If that happens, those picks in the latter half of the 2020's may not be so bad. But that's a best-case scenario for the Rockets. If they remain good, the picks are late 1st's, and at that point they will look like fools for not taking the 76ers' offer.


that's just sad but prob the truth. Was it also that Frittata didn't want to deal with Morey? I still can't wrap my head how an offer for Ben Simmons is on the table and you end up with Oladipo
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2021 7:15 am    Post subject:

governator wrote:
ChickenStu wrote:
Mike@LG wrote:
DancingBarry wrote:
governator wrote:
Still can’t believe the best they can get was Oladipo and late 1st rds.

Harden-CP3 to Harden-Westbrook to Wall-Oladipo, man




Tilman is a broke billionaire. I had this conversation on a twitter group DM, but I'd argue 1/3rd of the league actually cares about winning and the rest are billionaires trying to make money.

So for Tilman, 4 1st rounders on cost controlled rookie contracts and basically 40% of Harden's salary in Caris LeVert > paying Harden + improving the team generally speaking.


Yeah, there's no doubt. As Dreamshake was saying in the Free Agency thread, their owner wanted to save money here. So getting the expiring Oladipo was preferable to him than taking LeVert, who is owed money through '23. I mean, LeVert is clearly the better value due to the fact that he has a lower AAV than Oladipo (not to mention that Oladipo is going to get a raise on his next contract) and because he isn't about to be a free agent, AND he's arguably in the same ballpark as Oladipo just in terms of how good each player is, regardless of contract status. But it's pretty clear that Fertitta has been in cost-cutting mode since he bought the team. I'm sure they would have rather kept Harden and had a contender, while cutting where they could, but he clearly has been cutting costs. His deal to buy the team was highly-leveraged in the first place, a la Frank McCourt with the Dodgers once upon a time, and the dude's businesses have been getting killed during the pandemic.

My guess is that they will end up flipping Oladipo for another expiring player or players who don't have much value, and trying to get yet another 1st Round pick out of it. Then they can say they essentially got five 1st Rounders for Harden (plus the pick swaps that they got). I doubt that Fertitta will have the appetite to pay Oladipo something like $30MM a year for 5 years. Honestly, I wouldn't either. (Of course, they could have just kept LeVert, but we already went over that.)

Also, I'll say this: there's a chance that the Nets go off the rails in the next 2-3 years. All 3 of KD, Harden, and Kyrie have player options after next season. If they fall short of expectations over the next 2 seasons, perhaps they lose KD and then maybe the team implodes and everyone leaves. If that happens, those picks in the latter half of the 2020's may not be so bad. But that's a best-case scenario for the Rockets. If they remain good, the picks are late 1st's, and at that point they will look like fools for not taking the 76ers' offer.


that's just sad but prob the truth. Was it also that Frittata didn't want to deal with Morey? I still can't wrap my head how an offer for Ben Simmons is on the table and you end up with Oladipo


I just read your post again. Pretty much, yes. Didn't want to deal with Morey.
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