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MAJIC Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2005 Posts: 3320 Location: OC
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:17 am Post subject: Maybe Lamar doesn't want to be the best he can be...? |
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We all know he's capable , we have all seen games where he is just what the doctor ordered as Kobe's sidekick... 20-10-8 and no feeling whatsoever of it being a fluke...
Lamar is a shy dude especially when being interviewed, he is uncomfortable in front of a mic... It's the same thing that afflicted past Laker talent Elden Campbell (yes I said talent)!!!!
Now is it as simple as Lamar holding back so he can minimize the time a mic is stuck in his grill? Absolutely not! It's not that cut n dry...
But it's just a trait in his personality, that of someone who doesn't want the limelight at all....Screaming A is very believable when he reports Lamar doesn't want to be in Los Angeles...
If I was a talent of Lamar's caliber with the same personality traits as him, I don't think i'd want to be in the nations most talked about city either, I think i'd want to be the 2nd or 3rd option in OK City or Utah personally, wouldn't you? _________________ 16 and counting....
Last edited by MAJIC on Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:13 am; edited 2 times in total |
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KB8@LG Starting Rotation
Joined: 22 Aug 2004 Posts: 367
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:23 am Post subject: |
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doesn´t want? Believe me he would be if he would have the mental toughness. He lacks the mentality. |
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Sidious Starting Rotation
Joined: 28 Apr 2005 Posts: 586 Location: Hunting Beach, CA
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:16 am Post subject: |
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he's a coward |
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40ptmachine Starting Rotation
Joined: 13 Jan 2006 Posts: 633
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:16 am Post subject: |
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Sidious wrote: | he's a coward |
_________________ After 7 seasons I am a NON ALL STAR, in fact, I am a ROLE PLAYER making Superstar $$$
plus; I get standing ovations when I reach double digits |
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dadamookie Starting Rotation
Joined: 20 Jul 2005 Posts: 417 Location: Boston, MA
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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haha, Elden Cambell. That guy was a monster whenever Shaq was out. |
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orwell Star Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2001 Posts: 8203 Location: 90210
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe Lamar doesn't want to be the best he can be...? |
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MAJIC wrote: | Maybe Lamar doesn't want to be the best he can be...? |
Then (s)he should take a huge paycut from his $14M annual salary then! In the real world, more money means more responsibility to deliver results.
This note goes to the $8M Kwame Brown also. STOP MEOWING LIKE A GIRL! _________________ A proud member of LakersGround.net for over 10 years [since April 28, 2001]
Last edited by orwell on Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:03 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Socks Franchise Player
Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 10761 Location: Bay Area, CA
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 12:58 pm Post subject: Re: Maybe Lamar doesn't want to be the best he can be...? |
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orwell wrote: | MAJIC wrote: | Maybe Lamar doesn't want to be the best he can be...? |
Then (s)he should take a huge paycut from his $14M annual salary then! In the real world, more money means more responsibility to deliver results.
This note goes for Kwame also. STOP MEOWING! |
Argh...take a look at LO's salary as compared to other forwards in the league and I challenge you to come back and say he's overpaid. He is getting pretty much market salary for what he delivers. Overpaid forwards = Grant Hill, Jalen Rose, Carlos Boozer. |
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orwell Star Player
Joined: 28 Apr 2001 Posts: 8203 Location: 90210
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:01 pm Post subject: |
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Socks wrote: | Argh...take a look at LO's salary as compared to other forwards in the league and I challenge you to come back and say he's overpaid. He is getting pretty much market salary for what he delivers. Overpaid forwards = Grant Hill, Jalen Rose, Carlos Boozer. |
I said responsibility to deliver good results. That means that he step up and become the second legitimate offensive option for the team and NOT DISAPEAR during critical minutes. HE IS VERY INCONSISTENT. _________________ A proud member of LakersGround.net for over 10 years [since April 28, 2001] |
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Socks Franchise Player
Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 10761 Location: Bay Area, CA
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:32 pm Post subject: |
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orwell wrote: | Socks wrote: | Argh...take a look at LO's salary as compared to other forwards in the league and I challenge you to come back and say he's overpaid. He is getting pretty much market salary for what he delivers. Overpaid forwards = Grant Hill, Jalen Rose, Carlos Boozer. |
I said responsibility to deliver good results. That means that he step up and become the second legitimate offensive option for the team and NOT DISAPEAR during critical minutes. HE IS VERY INCONSISTENT. |
I agree that he is inconsistent, but it's an inaccurate statement to say he is overpaid. And as far as more pay meaning more responsibility to deliver results - more as compared to what? When you use the word "more" you are comparing two or more items - in this case players in the league. When you look at other forwards out there, LO is delivering results commensurate to what the market is paying.
Also, you're assuming that what we pay LO for is to be a second scoring option. The man has never been a big scorer, so I think it's the expectation that is out of line. What we pay LO for is for his all-around game - rebounding, passing, etc. I would love for LO to be more consistent, and I would love for him to be a second option and not make any bone-headed plays, but he's living up to what he is getting paid. |
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And 1 Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2001 Posts: 2586
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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Odom doesn't need to be in another city. He needs to be on a different kind of team. One that has a clearly defined #1 and #2 scoring option.
You see, rather than being uncomfortable with the spotlight (i.e. media), Lamar is more uncomfortable with the pressure that comes along with either being "da man" or "da man sitting next to da man."
Look at the history. When he's with the Clippers, he was "da man." He couldn't handle the pressure and so he tried to escape it by hittin' the pipe.
Currently, with the Lakers, Lamar is looked upon as the"da man sittin' next to da man." The pressure is not nearly what it was when he was with the Clipper's (and thus no pipe-smoking), but it's still significant when the team is still mired in mediocrity despite Kobe having an MVP-type of season. As a result, what do we see? Tentativeness. A lack of focus. Stupid, rookie mistakes. Inconsistancy. In essence, instead of escaping the pressure via bud, Lamar just shrinks away from it most of the time.
Contrast that with with his season in Miami. Despite Lamar being the 2nd leading scorer on that '03-'04 squad (due in part to Wade missing several games to injury), it was clear that: A) he wasn't da man (Wade was); and, B) he wasn't da man sittin' next to da man either (Eddie Jones was). With this being his first season in Miami, the Heat simply needed him to be a role-player. What was the result? Odom, free from the pressure of high expectations, played his best season of his career.
This is one of the reasons why I've maintained that Lamar is not a good fit for this team. The Lakers require another stud to help out Kobe, but Lamar can only stuff the stat sheet like most role-players do. |
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AirKobe8 Star Player
Joined: 30 Jan 2005 Posts: 8586
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:36 pm Post subject: |
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What?[/quote] _________________ www.lakersbrasil.com
Fan site made by me and others, dedicated to posting Laker news and articles in portuguese. |
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qreus-76 Starting Rotation
Joined: 21 Oct 2004 Posts: 384
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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I'm so tired of talking about Lamar. |
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lakrgurl834 Sixth Man
Joined: 14 Feb 2006 Posts: 48
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 3:56 pm Post subject: |
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Quote: | Then the Clippers committed $82.2 million to Elton Brand — smelling salts, please for Sterling, another $42 million to Corey Maggette, while making a $60-million offer to Gilbert Arenas.
At the same time they elected not to keep Lamar Odom, a move many Laker fans can understand.-LA TIMES |
i understand
_______________________
K-O-B-E-I-L-O-V-E |
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kells1220 Starting Rotation
Joined: 24 Jun 2005 Posts: 561 Location: Maryland
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Well then, he's gotta go. |
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thumpinghead Star Player
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 5657
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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40ptmachine wrote: | Sidious wrote: | he's a coward |
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_________________ Kevin Love. 2015. |
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drzucchini Franchise Player
Joined: 28 Sep 2002 Posts: 16327
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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thumpinghead wrote: | 40ptmachine wrote: | Sidious wrote: | he's a coward |
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thumpinghead Star Player
Joined: 17 Nov 2005 Posts: 5657
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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Socks wrote: | orwell wrote: | Socks wrote: | Argh...take a look at LO's salary as compared to other forwards in the league and I challenge you to come back and say he's overpaid. He is getting pretty much market salary for what he delivers. Overpaid forwards = Grant Hill, Jalen Rose, Carlos Boozer. |
I said responsibility to deliver good results. That means that he step up and become the second legitimate offensive option for the team and NOT DISAPEAR during critical minutes. HE IS VERY INCONSISTENT. |
I agree that he is inconsistent, but it's an inaccurate statement to say he is overpaid. And as far as more pay meaning more responsibility to deliver results - more as compared to what? When you use the word "more" you are comparing two or more items - in this case players in the league. When you look at other forwards out there, LO is delivering results commensurate to what the market is paying.
Also, you're assuming that what we pay LO for is to be a second scoring option. The man has never been a big scorer, so I think it's the expectation that is out of line. What we pay LO for is for his all-around game - rebounding, passing, etc. I would love for LO to be more consistent, and I would love for him to be a second option and not make any bone-headed plays, but he's living up to what he is getting paid. |
you don't really believe he's living up to what he is getting paid do you? Lamar got that contract on potential. As of today, Lamar is not reaching his potential. He could a consistent all around player, instead of an inconsistent all around player....
Don't tell me he brings it everynight....I watch him...
Standing behind the 3pt line watching Kobe shoot. Missing free-throws. Turning the ball over. Not taking it to the rack ENOUGH. Shooting too many 3s. And just not taking it to the other team but coasting.
Lamar coasts.
Smush coats.
I'm sick of it. _________________ Kevin Love. 2015. |
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Socks Franchise Player
Joined: 01 Feb 2006 Posts: 10761 Location: Bay Area, CA
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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^^^
Thumpinghead, I do believe he's living up to what he's being paid. Check out an old post of mine below looking at other forwards and what they are getting paid. LO seems to be right in line there.
I agree, he's not consistent, I agree it's frustrating and there's more he can do, I agree he makes some bone-headed mistakes - I don't agree that he's overpaid.
Quote: | Let's look at whether he is overpaid and do some analysis. Here are the salaries of the western all-star forwards:
Garnett - $18 M
Duncan - $15.8 M
McGrady - $15.6 M
Nowitzki - $13.8 M
Marion - $13.7 M
Brand - $13.2 M
Gasol - $11 M
Odom's salary is about $11.5 M this year. Safe to say, with maybe the exception of Gasol, all these guys are better than Odom and making more money. What about some of the other top forwards, not only in the west, but in the entire NBA:
J. O'Neal - $16.4 M
G. Hill - $15.7 M
Rose - $15.7 M
Pierce - $13.8 M
Jamison - $13.8 M
Kirilenko - $11 M
Z. Randolph - $10.7 M
Szczerbiak - $10.5 M
R. Jefferson - $10.2 M
Simmons - $8 M
D. Miles - $7.2 M
Maggette - $7 M
Q. Richardson - $6.9 M
Artest - $6.8 M
A. Walker - $6.5 M
Looking at this list, Odom's $11.5 M comes out looking pretty much in-line. I'd say he's definitely worth more than almost any guy below $11.5 M, with some admittedly arguable. Of those above him, Hill and Rose definitely don't deserve it and Jamison is arguable. Of those below him, there are some better values, like Artest, but you know those guys are going to cash in big time in their next contracts. I didn't include younger guys like Lebron and Carmelo because they are still on their rookie contracts but will be cashing in with max deals in their next contracts.
I used to think Odom was overpaid, but based on this admittedly high-level analysis, I've changed my mind. Odom is probably pretty close to market value. |
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MAJIC Star Player
Joined: 12 Apr 2005 Posts: 3320 Location: OC
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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Socks wrote: | ^^^
Thumpinghead, I do believe he's living up to what he's being paid. Check out an old post of mine below looking at other forwards and what they are getting paid. LO seems to be right in line there.
I agree, he's not consistent, I agree it's frustrating and there's more he can do, I agree he makes some bone-headed mistakes - I don't agree that he's overpaid.
Quote: | Let's look at whether he is overpaid and do some analysis. Here are the salaries of the western all-star forwards:
Garnett - $18 M
Duncan - $15.8 M
McGrady - $15.6 M
Nowitzki - $13.8 M
Marion - $13.7 M
Brand - $13.2 M
Gasol - $11 M
Odom's salary is about $11.5 M this year. Safe to say, with maybe the exception of Gasol, all these guys are better than Odom and making more money. What about some of the other top forwards, not only in the west, but in the entire NBA:
J. O'Neal - $16.4 M
G. Hill - $15.7 M
Rose - $15.7 M
Pierce - $13.8 M
Jamison - $13.8 M
Kirilenko - $11 M
Z. Randolph - $10.7 M
Szczerbiak - $10.5 M
R. Jefferson - $10.2 M
Simmons - $8 M
D. Miles - $7.2 M
Maggette - $7 M
Q. Richardson - $6.9 M
Artest - $6.8 M
A. Walker - $6.5 M
Looking at this list, Odom's $11.5 M comes out looking pretty much in-line. I'd say he's definitely worth more than almost any guy below $11.5 M, with some admittedly arguable. Of those above him, Hill and Rose definitely don't deserve it and Jamison is arguable. Of those below him, there are some better values, like Artest, but you know those guys are going to cash in big time in their next contracts. I didn't include younger guys like Lebron and Carmelo because they are still on their rookie contracts but will be cashing in with max deals in their next contracts.
I used to think Odom was overpaid, but based on this admittedly high-level analysis, I've changed my mind. Odom is probably pretty close to market value. |
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Nice post!
This thread was not intended to point out how much money LO makes. Blame Riles for that, not LO!
How about MJ hooking up Kwame? Now thats robbery, but Kwame isn't gonna refuse his paycheck right?
I'm just trying to understand wtf is going on in LO's psyche thats all...
His passive mentality on the court might be linked to his passive personality in general...
Some guys want the attention and some don't....
I think he'd much rather be a spoke on the wheel, but the problem is he's the initiator/qb of the team, and you can't be passive in that role!!!
You need to know how to pick your spots and assert yourself as well as setting the table for your teamates(Kobe's old job) and I'm not sure he's ever gonna be consistant in doing that.
Mentality and personality wise LO and KB are night and day! _________________ 16 and counting.... |
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slavavov Star Player
Joined: 03 Oct 2003 Posts: 8434 Location: Santa Monica
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:25 pm Post subject: |
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Lamar is a 3rd option player that's being forced to be a 2nd option here. He probably has the talent to be the 2nd option on a good team, but he has the mentality of a role player. I also think he has too small of an ego to be as good as he is talented. To be a good player in the NBA and have the desire to be the best you can be, you need to have a big ego, or at least a big enough ego, because that will drive you to be as good as you believe you are. Maybe deep down inside Lamar just doesn't realize how good he is. _________________ Lakers 49ers Chargers Dodgers |
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jmac78 Starting Rotation
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 690
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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And 1 wrote: | Odom doesn't need to be in another city. He needs to be on a different kind of team. One that has a clearly defined #1 and #2 scoring option.
You see, rather than being uncomfortable with the spotlight (i.e. media), Lamar is more uncomfortable with the pressure that comes along with either being "da man" or "da man sitting next to da man."
Look at the history. When he's with the Clippers, he was "da man." He couldn't handle the pressure and so he tried to escape it by hittin' the pipe.
Currently, with the Lakers, Lamar is looked upon as the"da man sittin' next to da man." The pressure is not nearly what it was when he was with the Clipper's (and thus no pipe-smoking), but it's still significant when the team is still mired in mediocrity despite Kobe having an MVP-type of season. As a result, what do we see? Tentativeness. A lack of focus. Stupid, rookie mistakes. Inconsistancy. In essence, instead of escaping the pressure via bud, Lamar just shrinks away from it most of the time.
Contrast that with with his season in Miami. Despite Lamar being the 2nd leading scorer on that '03-'04 squad (due in part to Wade missing several games to injury), it was clear that: A) he wasn't da man (Wade was); and, B) he wasn't da man sittin' next to da man either (Eddie Jones was). With this being his first season in Miami, the Heat simply needed him to be a role-player. What was the result? Odom, free from the pressure of high expectations, played his best season of his career.
This is one of the reasons why I've maintained that Lamar is not a good fit for this team. The Lakers require another stud to help out Kobe, but Lamar can only stuff the stat sheet like most role-players do. |
You're wrong about Lamar's time in Miami. Lamar in fact signed with Miami and was "the man" on that team. Wade wasn't "the man" his rookie season. It was Lamar all the way, then Eddie, then Wade. Wade came out of nowhere and showed his skills during the season, but Lamar was the first option. He was handling, distributing and scoring and was a BIG reason that Miami team was so successful.
Lamar also had BIG success during the Olympics where Larry Brown looked to him for consistency, when none else was found.
I think Lamar's problem is he's weak-minded and lacks maturity. He also does not fully grasp the Triangle. When he does, he'll fit in, but not as a 2nd scorer. He'd be a perfect number 3 on a Kobe led team. Question is can the management and more importantly the fans wait that long? |
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gone-daddy-gone Sixth Man
Joined: 31 Dec 2005 Posts: 69
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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Socks wrote: | ^^^
Thumpinghead, I do believe he's living up to what he's being paid. Check out an old post of mine below looking at other forwards and what they are getting paid. LO seems to be right in line there.
I agree, he's not consistent, I agree it's frustrating and there's more he can do, I agree he makes some bone-headed mistakes - I don't agree that he's overpaid.
Quote: | Let's look at whether he is overpaid and do some analysis. Here are the salaries of the western all-star forwards:
Garnett - $18 M
Duncan - $15.8 M
McGrady - $15.6 M
Nowitzki - $13.8 M
Marion - $13.7 M
Brand - $13.2 M
Gasol - $11 M
Odom's salary is about $11.5 M this year. Safe to say, with maybe the exception of Gasol, all these guys are better than Odom and making more money. What about some of the other top forwards, not only in the west, but in the entire NBA:
J. O'Neal - $16.4 M
G. Hill - $15.7 M
Rose - $15.7 M
Pierce - $13.8 M
Jamison - $13.8 M
Kirilenko - $11 M
Z. Randolph - $10.7 M
Szczerbiak - $10.5 M
R. Jefferson - $10.2 M
Simmons - $8 M
D. Miles - $7.2 M
Maggette - $7 M
Q. Richardson - $6.9 M
Artest - $6.8 M
A. Walker - $6.5 M
Looking at this list, Odom's $11.5 M comes out looking pretty much in-line. I'd say he's definitely worth more than almost any guy below $11.5 M, with some admittedly arguable. Of those above him, Hill and Rose definitely don't deserve it and Jamison is arguable. Of those below him, there are some better values, like Artest, but you know those guys are going to cash in big time in their next contracts. I didn't include younger guys like Lebron and Carmelo because they are still on their rookie contracts but will be cashing in with max deals in their next contracts.
I used to think Odom was overpaid, but based on this admittedly high-level analysis, I've changed my mind. Odom is probably pretty close to market value. |
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just for the record...
pierce, jamison, kirilinko, z. randolf, r. jefferson are all around same pay level as lamar and all are far superior in production, and more importantly competitive drive and will.
look, the nba is a league of bad contracts. we all know this. its just as fans of the lakers, when they were under the guidance of jerry west, we didn't have alot of bad contracts. now under mitch, lakers are like everyone else, plenty of bad contracts. bottom line is, we are spoiled and we want our jerry west back! kupcake must go and he should take odom and kwame with him.
hey i got an idea, how about this trade. kupcake, lamar and kwame for west and gasol! |
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Non Info Having Ho Rookie
Joined: 28 Feb 2006 Posts: 4
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:41 pm Post subject: |
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... |
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jmac78 Starting Rotation
Joined: 27 Jun 2005 Posts: 690
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 8:44 pm Post subject: |
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Non Info Having Ho wrote: | ... |
Interesting username. I wonder if you'll be required to change it. |
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THE_SHOES Retired Number
Joined: 12 Apr 2001 Posts: 29556 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 10:29 pm Post subject: |
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I think the name fits him perfectly... _________________ "According to ESPN.com's conference projections, the Lakers will finish 12th in the West, which prompted Bryant to tweet earlier this offseason, "12th I see.." |
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