Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: Roy Hibbert versus AD under Vogel
BigBallerBrand wrote:
How is it that Vogel made Hibbert an All Star but he makes AD look like a scrub?
If by scrub you mean one of the best postseasons by a Lakers Power Forward (maybe best ever for a starting PF) and finishing 2nd in the DPOTY voting, winning a title averaging 28 ppg in the playoffs, defending multiple elite players such as Jimmy Butler, Dame, Jokic etc along the way.
Yeah huge scrub.
Last edited by wolfpaclaker on Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:57 pm; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: Roy Hibbert versus AD under Vogel
BigBallerBrand wrote:
How is it that Vogel made Hibbert an All Star but he makes AD look like a scrub?
because AD dances to his own beat. you really think either LeBron or AD wait for Vogel's instructions? i think 90% of the NBA stars do not listen to their head coaches. these are the pedigrees for becoming a successful nba coach nowadays:
1. being charismatic, can deliver rah rah type of speeches when camera is on
2. in good grace with the mega stars
By asking AD to shoot more threes and play away from the rim turning him from US strongman into EU softie. Then they brought in DS/WB to further discourage him from posting up which is what NO AD was really good at. Now he doesn't have a consistent and dominant post up move and his threes are as good as WB. Gotta admit Vogel played a large role in ruining AD as well.
A better question is how in the heck was Roy Hibbert an all-star when he played less than 30 mpg, averaged less than 9 rpg, and was pretty much useless on offense? It's sort of remarkable that the center position was ever so shallow, even if this era of the NBA. _________________ Internet Argument Resolved
Joined: 02 Jan 2012 Posts: 12228 Location: The Two One Three
Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 2:17 pm Post subject:
I've been highly critical of AD - mostly for his inconsistent effort.
But he's hardly a scrub. Calling him that is just plain disingenuous.
If you look back at his first year with the Lakers, AD played hard virtually every game. He was on a mission to win the DPOY. The fact that he came in 2nd really put a damper on his overall effort since. That plus winning a chip and signing the extension made him complacent. This is not a Vogel problem. It's an AD problem. _________________ The butter's hard and the eggs are chillin' in the dark.
BBB definition of a scrub: A player who is top 16 in points, rebounds, offensive rebounds, and top 5 in blocks.
Besides that, AD has been dealing with nagging injuries and is still one of the best post offense bigs in the NBA, Threads like these need to be double checked for potential attempt at trolling.
I remember the Roy Hibbert days. I actually appreciate him for being a mentor to the youth we had, even though there was a lot of horsing around going on. I have no clue how he slipped so badly. I'm guessing injuries, which is something that causes the immediate decline of big men.
A better question is how in the heck was Roy Hibbert an all-star when he played less than 30 mpg, averaged less than 9 rpg, and was pretty much useless on offense? It's sort of remarkable that the center position was ever so shallow, even if this era of the NBA.
It's really amazing some of the centers that made the all-star team -- Chris Kaman, Mehmet Okur, Jamaal Magloire, James Donaldson. Kevin Duckworth, Theo Ratcliff, Joe Barely Cares Carroll.
Joined: 24 Dec 2007 Posts: 35812 Location: Santa Clarita, CA (Hell) ->>>>>Ithaca, NY -≥≥≥≥≥Berkeley, CA
Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2021 7:40 pm Post subject:
Vogel didn’t make Roy Hibbert anything. Hibbert was an incredible force on both sides of the floor. Imagine a 7’2 player with Olajuwon’s footwork and defense, Shaq’s athleticism, Ewing’s range, and Duncan’s IQ. That was Roy Hibbert. Hibbert was something the league had never seen before— a once in a lifetime talent.
That Vogel managed to get only two all star appearances out of him is insane to me. Hibbert is a guy who should have won ten consecutive MVPs. Imagine what Phil Jackson could have done with him. _________________ Damian Lillard shatters Dwight Coward's championship dreams:
BBB definition of a scrub: A player who is top 16 in points, rebounds, offensive rebounds, and top 5 in blocks.
ok.and this is why we are average. ad is a top 16 player.
Quite a leap there. That was no lower than 16th (which is rebounding). Moreover he's one of the best defensive players in the league. The only other guy in the league who puts up ADs type of stat line and plays great defense is Giannis.
BBB definition of a scrub: A player who is top 16 in points, rebounds, offensive rebounds, and top 5 in blocks.
ok.and this is why we are average. ad is a top 16 player.
Obviously, this is a highly subjective topic. But I've seen a bunch of lists from various places ranking NBA players this season. AD almost universally falls in the 9th or 10th spot on the lists.
Vogel didn’t make Roy Hibbert anything. Hibbert was an incredible force on both sides of the floor. Imagine a 7’2 player with Olajuwon’s footwork and defense, Shaq’s athleticism, Ewing’s range, and Duncan’s IQ. That was Roy Hibbert. Hibbert was something the league had never seen before— a once in a lifetime talent.
That Vogel managed to get only two all star appearances out of him is insane to me. Hibbert is a guy who should have won ten consecutive MVPs. Imagine what Phil Jackson could have done with him.
lol! _________________ "One thing I admire about Kuzma is his unwavering confidence. He truly has no idea that he’s not as good as he thinks." - Killer_Z
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How is it that this board can tout such awesome posters but at the same time make some others look like scrub posters? _________________ Luxury Tax/FA Spreadsheet (Save to your Google Drive to edit)
By asking AD to shoot more threes and play away from the rim turning him from US strongman into EU softie. Then they brought in DS/WB to further discourage him from posting up which is what NO AD was really good at. Now he doesn't have a consistent and dominant post up move and his threes are as good as WB. Gotta admit Vogel played a large role in ruining AD as well.
I’m go let you finish but AD leads the nba in points in the paint this year
By asking AD to shoot more threes and play away from the rim turning him from US strongman into EU softie. Then they brought in DS/WB to further discourage him from posting up which is what NO AD was really good at. Now he doesn't have a consistent and dominant post up move and his threes are as good as WB. Gotta admit Vogel played a large role in ruining AD as well.
I’m go let you finish but AD leads the nba in points in the paint this year
How did Westbrook discourage him from posting up? Like he gave Ad too many lobs and easy baskets So AD can just eat?
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