What now...Laker fans with NO faith!
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THE_SHOES
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2006 11:55 pm    Post subject:

drzucchini wrote:
Give me a break. It's not like the doubters didn't have reason to believe that the team was going to lose tonight. Not only were they going up against one of the top teams in the NBA, but they have been very erratic as of late. We went with the more likely outcome: the Pistons winning. We had legitimate reasons that the team would lose. It's not like we were hating on our own team for no apparent reason.

This is really nothing to brag about. I can go ahead and make an outlandish claim that the Colorado Rockies will win the World Series this upcoming MLB season. Is the possibility there? Sure. Is it likely? Absolutely not. If they do win, does that make me a genius and everybody else fools? No.


Geeeezzzuuusssss, the kind of guy that would probably shoot Santa Claus for coming to his house on Christmas eve, and swear he thought it was a prowler...
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 12:11 am    Post subject:

Hate to be a pessimist, but this is this team's M.O. They come out and play fantastic and then the next two games, it's as if it were a different set of players.

Either way, it's definitley a big win and will hopefully boost their egos to start playing hard throughout the rest of the season and salvage it.

I'm very happy they got the win, period. Even better feeling knowing that it was Detroit. Hopefully, when the playoffs come around, we'll be seeing more and more Laker basketball like we did tonight.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 12:13 am    Post subject:

For Detriot:
2nd night of a back to back...
Long road trip
No production from B.Wallace..we outrebound them like 44 to 30..

that spells win for us...

remember..they just lost to the nuggets...and they've also lost to the hawks this year..

I think this does show our potential...if everything goes right.
1. Odom plays well (produces offensively)
2. Kwame plays well (rebounds and plays D)
3. We play team Defense..
4. Kobe does his thing.
5. We don't go three point crazy. 4-12

If this happened more...we'd be 6th seed. instead

1. Odom goes 2-7
2. Kwame has 5 fouls in 20 minutes of play and gets 2pts and 4 boards
3. our defense is non-existent and we allow a team like portland over 100
4. Kobe is off..but still gets over 30 (9-30shooting)
5. We shoot over 20 threes

I hope this is a water shed game...and we really turn the corner here..
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 12:15 am    Post subject:

I was one of them and i admitt it. How many back to back games do we play with effort? This is probably the first.

Comeone we played detroit on back to back game. It would be logical for me to think we lose.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 1:16 am    Post subject:

Nobody could've predicted tonights game, it was definitely the most exciting Lakers game in a long time.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 1:35 am    Post subject:

I'll man up to it and say I honestly didn't see this coming based on the team's play lately. Again, glad to be wrong on this one.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 5:54 am    Post subject:

I predicted the Lakers would lose by 15.

My wife the Laker Hater said they would win by 5.

The talent on this team is not bad. The mental ability to use the talent on a game to game basis is lacking. This is something that is learned. This team is learning and has a much better core than say the Bulls.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:32 am    Post subject:

THE_SHOES wrote:
drzucchini wrote:
Give me a break. It's not like the doubters didn't have reason to believe that the team was going to lose tonight. Not only were they going up against one of the top teams in the NBA, but they have been very erratic as of late. We went with the more likely outcome: the Pistons winning. We had legitimate reasons that the team would lose. It's not like we were hating on our own team for no apparent reason.

This is really nothing to brag about. I can go ahead and make an outlandish claim that the Colorado Rockies will win the World Series this upcoming MLB season. Is the possibility there? Sure. Is it likely? Absolutely not. If they do win, does that make me a genius and everybody else fools? No.


Geeeezzzuuusssss, the kind of guy that would probably shoot Santa Claus for coming to his house on Christmas eve, and swear he thought it was a prowler...


Well, In the make believe world of Santa Clause you'd be right! unfortunatley reality is a tough pill to swallow around this place and posts like drzucchini's are usually met with such fantasy!
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:10 am    Post subject:

THE_SHOES wrote:
bounty wrote:
Not for a few more games. i felt we were due for a streak. the tougher the challenge always seems to inspire. Lets not forget, we played DTown tough earlier on after we got out the shock of being stepped on.

Is LO capable of playing this well Mon?
Can Kwame take on that BWallace role again?
Unfortunately these are the question we Have to ask EVERY GAME.


It's a young team man! A young team! Young teams have peaks, and valleys! That is a part of the process!!!!

When will you ever understand that? This is why bashing after every game on the players, and team as a whole is just stupid.

Trading players on a team like this everytime they make mistakes, and knee jerk reactions is even more stupid! They need time to learn, and grow together...

This team is nowhere near as bad talent wise as some of you have suggested. The Lakers need time, and guidance. NOT booing, not player hating, but support, and encouragement would work a lot better!

They just beat the (bleep) Detroit Pistons! Jackson now has something to excel with in those locker room talks!


Keep Lamar out of your young team analysis, he is on his 7th season and is a bust compared to what people expected of him
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:08 am    Post subject:

A young team is a young team. But Lamar Odom is a veteran. Last night, Lamar decided he wanted to be great, and he was. That's why I'm so hard on him. He doesn't have to be mediocre or give half-hearted efforts. He can be great anytime he wants to be great. People argue everyday on here trying to justify his paltry efforts or the fact that he lets little things get to him and take him out of the game. But I expect more, and last night proved he can and should be giving more. It doesn't have anything to do with Kobe, Phil, or his position on the floor. It has to do with him and only him deciding he wants to step into the light and be the player God blessed him to be.

Enjoyed the win last night, immensely. Let's see where it goes.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:10 am    Post subject: Re: What now...Laker fans with NO faith!

osj wrote:
awsmori wrote:
I posted a thread about the possibility of lakers winning the game with detroit....what did i get in reply was a bunch of worthless posts saying that i am crazy...WHAT NOW!?? I AM PRETTY SURE MOST OF THE "LAKER FANS WHO ARE HATERS " OUT THERE ARE JOINING THE BAND WAGGON. And probably all of you when the Lakers beat the spurs on Monday.....OH YES GO LAKERS!


i've never stopped supporting the lakers, but the fact is, producing this kind of performance once in a while isn't enough. it feels great to win a game like this, but it doesn't make up for the lack of effort and inconsistency that has cost us games against much worse opponents.

having said that, games like this show that (some of) our squad does have potential. question is how long we can afford to wait for them to become consistent...


BINGO! You just hit the nail squarely on the head.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:20 am    Post subject: Re: What now...Laker fans with NO faith!

osj wrote:
awsmori wrote:
I posted a thread about the possibility of lakers winning the game with detroit....what did i get in reply was a bunch of worthless posts saying that i am crazy...WHAT NOW!?? I AM PRETTY SURE MOST OF THE "LAKER FANS WHO ARE HATERS " OUT THERE ARE JOINING THE BAND WAGGON. And probably all of you when the Lakers beat the spurs on Monday.....OH YES GO LAKERS!


i've never stopped supporting the lakers, but the fact is, producing this kind of performance once in a while isn't enough. it feels great to win a game like this, but it doesn't make up for the lack of effort and inconsistency that has cost us games against much worse opponents.

having said that, games like this show that (some of) our squad does have potential. question is how long we can afford to wait for them to become consistent...


As to the question, How long do we wait? We wait at least until the 2008 season. It's at that point that we can make an accurate judgement as to just how much this current crop of players is able to contribute to making the Lakers contenders. Attempting to make that judgement now is just surrily unrealistic. Players in the tri need a year under their belt in the system, and the young players need two, before and accurate analysis can be made.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:00 am    Post subject:

Quote:
He can be great anytime he wants to be great. People argue everyday on here trying to justify his paltry efforts or the fact that he lets little things get to him and take him out of the game. But I expect more, and last night proved he can and should be giving more. It doesn't have anything to do with Kobe, Phil, or his position on the floor. It has to do with him and only him deciding he wants to step into the light and be the player God blessed him to be

Disagree

1- His jumper isn't that good (he was in rhythm yesterday and ussually isn't that type of shooter)

2- He will post up and watch as Smush, Devean and everyone else just swing the ball to the other side (ignoring him in the post mismatch)

Yes focus is a big part of it, but what he needs to work on is his jumper and what the Lakers need to work on is making sure that once he is in a post up situation - they must get him the ball.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:38 am    Post subject:

Wolf, you and I have talked about this before. If Odom plays every game with his heart and head in it, we wouldn't even need another superstar as Lamar would be that guy.

He just has so many skills and physical advantages. His midrange jumper is very good actually. ARGH!! Why can't he play like that EVERY night. So damned GREAT when he WANTS to be great.
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THE_SHOES
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:47 am    Post subject:

Laker_Dynasty wrote:
Hate to be a pessimist, but this is this team's M.O. They come out and play fantastic and then the next two games, it's as if it were a different set of players.

Either way, it's definitley a big win and will hopefully boost their egos to start playing hard throughout the rest of the season and salvage it.

I'm very happy they got the win, period. Even better feeling knowing that it was Detroit. Hopefully, when the playoffs come around, we'll be seeing more and more Laker basketball like we did tonight.


No, no, now wait a minute this is only the second time this season that the Lakers have won on the back end, of a back to back. That says something has rattled loose. Also beating even a tired or bored Detroit team speaks huge volumes. The Lakers also did not find a way to choke down the stretch which means they are learning. If they beat San Antonio there confidence may be enough to propel them to not look back. This win definitely means something...
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:59 am    Post subject:

40ptmachine wrote:
THE_SHOES wrote:
bounty wrote:
Not for a few more games. i felt we were due for a streak. the tougher the challenge always seems to inspire. Lets not forget, we played DTown tough earlier on after we got out the shock of being stepped on.

Is LO capable of playing this well Mon?
Can Kwame take on that BWallace role again?
Unfortunately these are the question we Have to ask EVERY GAME.


It's a young team man! A young team! Young teams have peaks, and valleys! That is a part of the process!!!!

When will you ever understand that? This is why bashing after every game on the players, and team as a whole is just stupid.

Trading players on a team like this everytime they make mistakes, and knee jerk reactions is even more stupid! They need time to learn, and grow together...

This team is nowhere near as bad talent wise as some of you have suggested. The Lakers need time, and guidance. NOT booing, not player hating, but support, and encouragement would work a lot better!

They just beat the (bleep) Detroit Pistons! Jackson now has something to excel with in those locker room talks!


Keep Lamar out of your young team analysis, he is on his 7th season and is a bust compared to what people expected of him


Lets go slowly for you. Have you ever played with a few guys that were below your level? Probably not huh?

Ok, how about this? If you go to war with a bunch of hardasses like yourself you've got a good chance of competing to win that battle don't you?
Now, you go into battle with one, or two other tough guys and, a few "wet behind the ears kids against another team of hardasses that are stacked from top to bottom with experience together, and most are decorated for valor from head to toe. Who do you think is going to win that fight?

It can be tough to fight the good fight when the odds are stacked against you all the time. Give this team time... We just seen what they may be capable of... Kobe, Lamar, and Devean cannot do this alone with this group of kids not just yet but, this year could end sweet enough for us to get pumped for next season...
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:00 am    Post subject:

Yea I did say they were going to loose,why wouldn't I ?
I'm willing to say that those of you so-call faitfull are the sameones who
think were going to win a championship too.I bet you guys never think we are going to loose a game.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:02 am    Post subject:

sorry dude...i only said we'd lose as an anti-jinx because everybody kept saying we'd beat them...
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 10:10 am    Post subject:

ajaxxx wrote:
Yea I did say they were going to loose,why wouldn't I ?
I'm willing to say that those of you so-call faitfull are the sameones who
think were going to win a championship too.I bet you guys never think we are going to loose a game.


Nope, most of us know expect inconsistency from a young and inexperienced team. We're realistic enough to know that we won't be contenders for at least two seasons. And most of us are ok with that, because that would mean we went from contenders - to rebuild mode - and back to contenders faster than any tem in the history of the league and most of us appreciate the fact that that's pretty damn amazing.

The difference between us is that we SUPPORT our team and are realistic enough not to get down on them when they are still learning. Just like you'd get nowhere for yelling at a first grader when he comes home from school for not being able to solve a calculus problem yet - it's equally inane to expect the Lakers to be anything other than mediocre at this stage of a rebuild. Only someone that is challenged by the rigors of realty would have a hard time understanding that simple fact. The realstic ones understand that it's all a process and it takes time.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:02 am    Post subject:


When are some people going to understand that (youth, learning the triangle and inexperience) DO NOT give this team the right to choose when they want to give FULL effort on the court?? It does not give them the right to laugh when they lose a game as if it doesn't matter. NOTHING excuses this kind of behavior. I do not care how young and inexperienced they are. I want to see full effort and focus on the court for 48 minutes from all players in EVERY game. This is not the same as wanting a "Title Contender". Why can't some of you understand this? You look at those of us who would dare question the effort of our team, and accuse us of failing to support our team. That is just ridiculous, but I guess some people simply won't see eye to eye. Ok, I've vented enough.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:10 am    Post subject:

dadliboi wrote:

When are some people going to understand that (youth, learning the triangle and inexperience) DO NOT give this team the right to choose when they want to give FULL effort on the court?? It does not give them the right to laugh when they lose a game as if it doesn't matter. NOTHING excuses this kind of behavior. I do not care how young and inexperienced they are. I want to see full effort and focus on the court for 48 minutes from all players in EVERY game. This is not the same as wanting a "Title Contender". Why can't some of you understand this? You look at those of us who would dare question the effort of our team, and accuse us of failing to support our team. That is just ridiculous, but I guess some people simply won't see eye to eye. Ok, I've vented enough.


I want my postman to deliver my mail everyday at the same time. Doesn't happen. I want potholes fixed on my street in less than a months time. Doesn't happen. I want new roads and transit built before traffic becomes a nightmare. Doesn't happen. I'd love for a young and inexpeienced team to bring the same effort game in and game out but in over 30 years of watching team sports (all sports) I've just about NEVER seen it.

Point is, there are a lot of things which would mak the world a perfect place. I then have to make a decision when I see imperfection. Do I sulk and call names like people in junior high, of do I exercise a little adult patience and expect things to occur in the very same manner in which they historically have? Some here choose the former. I choose the latter. That leaves me in the position of being able to be happy when this team EXCEEDS what most others before them have in the same type of situation. Playing .500 ball and being a playoff team every day of the seasn since wek one is something that has almost NEVER happened. Getting down on a young/inexperienced team for that fact is simply pure unrealistic hate and that's where the problem is.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:10 am    Post subject:

realists..haters....


Never seen these words aorund here before.

On LG?? what? noooooo :roll:
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:15 am    Post subject:

No shame in it man. I pick the Lakers winning the game if they're down by 20 to Detroit with 30 seconds left in the fourth with Kobe injured, and Lamar suffering from depression.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:30 am    Post subject:

Aussiesuede wrote:
dadliboi wrote:

When are some people going to understand that (youth, learning the triangle and inexperience) DO NOT give this team the right to choose when they want to give FULL effort on the court?? It does not give them the right to laugh when they lose a game as if it doesn't matter. NOTHING excuses this kind of behavior. I do not care how young and inexperienced they are. I want to see full effort and focus on the court for 48 minutes from all players in EVERY game. This is not the same as wanting a "Title Contender". Why can't some of you understand this? You look at those of us who would dare question the effort of our team, and accuse us of failing to support our team. That is just ridiculous, but I guess some people simply won't see eye to eye. Ok, I've vented enough.


I want my postman to deliver my mail everyday at the same time. Doesn't happen. I want potholes fixed on my street in less than a months time. Doesn't happen. I want new roads and transit built before traffic becomes a nightmare. Doesn't happen. I'd love for a young and inexpeienced team to bring the same effort game in and game out but in over 30 years of watching team sports (all sports) I've just about NEVER seen it.

Point is, there are a lot of things which would mak the world a perfect place. I then have to make a decision when I see imperfection. Do I sulk and call names like people in junior high, of do I exercise a little adult patience and expect things to occur in the very same manner in which they historically have? Some here choose the former. I choose the latter. That leaves me in the position of being able to be happy when this team EXCEEDS what most others before them have in the same type of situation. Playing .500 ball and being a playoff team every day of the seasn since wek one is something that has almost NEVER happened. Getting down on a young/inexperienced team for that fact is simply pure unrealistic hate and that's where the problem is.


You make very good points. However, how do feel when you hear that certain players on this team laugh after a loss? How do you feel when you hear certain players just don't seem to care when the team loses a game they should have won? I'm sorry, but my mindset does not allow me to accept this. Giving 100% in everything you do, and acting like you give a damn when you screw up, are both things that I expect from this team at all times.The results may not always be to our liking, but at least we know the effort was there. I personally find it unbelievable that some people can accept such carefree behavior. I guess it has to do with standards and mindsets. Everyone is different I guess.
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:42 am    Post subject:

dadliboi wrote:
Aussiesuede wrote:
dadliboi wrote:

When are some people going to understand that (youth, learning the triangle and inexperience) DO NOT give this team the right to choose when they want to give FULL effort on the court?? It does not give them the right to laugh when they lose a game as if it doesn't matter. NOTHING excuses this kind of behavior. I do not care how young and inexperienced they are. I want to see full effort and focus on the court for 48 minutes from all players in EVERY game. This is not the same as wanting a "Title Contender". Why can't some of you understand this? You look at those of us who would dare question the effort of our team, and accuse us of failing to support our team. That is just ridiculous, but I guess some people simply won't see eye to eye. Ok, I've vented enough.


I want my postman to deliver my mail everyday at the same time. Doesn't happen. I want potholes fixed on my street in less than a months time. Doesn't happen. I want new roads and transit built before traffic becomes a nightmare. Doesn't happen. I'd love for a young and inexpeienced team to bring the same effort game in and game out but in over 30 years of watching team sports (all sports) I've just about NEVER seen it.

Point is, there are a lot of things which would mak the world a perfect place. I then have to make a decision when I see imperfection. Do I sulk and call names like people in junior high, of do I exercise a little adult patience and expect things to occur in the very same manner in which they historically have? Some here choose the former. I choose the latter. That leaves me in the position of being able to be happy when this team EXCEEDS what most others before them have in the same type of situation. Playing .500 ball and being a playoff team every day of the seasn since wek one is something that has almost NEVER happened. Getting down on a young/inexperienced team for that fact is simply pure unrealistic hate and that's where the problem is.


You make very good points. However, how do feel when you hear that certain players on this team laugh after a loss? How do you feel when you hear certain players just don't seem to care when the team loses a game they should have won? I'm sorry, but my mindset does not allow me to accept this. Giving 100% in everything you do, and acting like you give a damn when you screw up, are both things that I expect from this team at all times.The results may not always be to our liking, but at least we know the effort was there. I personally find it unbelievable that some people can accept such carefree behavior. I guess it has to do with standards and mindsets. Everyone is different I guess.


Hey, I share a DESIRE for that mindset from everyone, but I've been around long enough not to EXPECT it. Expecting it is the surest way to be let down, no matter what part of life we're speaking of. Some people are naturally driven. Some people can be driven with a little push. And some people will never be driven no matter how hard they are pushed. It's pretty simple, as humans we all desire different things at different levels. I'm an avid golfer and am pretty intense out on the course. I often play with people who are more skilled than me but aren't nearly as driven. What it creates is an interesting round of golf. I'm able to play competitively with people I really shouldn't be on the course with. But I don't get upset with them because they don't have the same drive and passion as I have. One of them in particular is extremely passionate about gardening and plants. I could care less about that, but I see him with the same type of passion when he's speaking of gardening that I have when I'm speaking about golf, yet he chooses to makes a living as a golfer. My guess it's because his earning potential is so much higher with golf.

So some of the Lakers are extremely driven, some are marginally driven and can be pushed, and they're are probably some who will never be driven no matter how hard they are pushed. I too would like to rid the team of those players once that determination has been made. I'd be willing to give up on a player and put him in that category about Christmas of next year or so. If he's not bringing consistent effort by that point then I'd surmise he never will.

So I suspect we actually agree on more than you'd imagine we might. Our biggest difference probably lies in patience levels. I respect your opinions and definitely appreciate your passion! That's a good thing in my book!
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I'm On point, On task, On message, and Off drugs. A Streetwise Smart Bomb, Out of rehab and In denial. Over the Top, On the edge, Under the Radar, and In Control. Behind the 8 ball, Ahead of the Curve and I've got a Love Child who sends me Hate mail.
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